Viva LA Vida!! Ranked Top 5 / WC Unbeaten

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It feels like forever since I last posted here! And there is not a better way to return to the RMT section than with my best team until now. The team is pretty simple; yet so effective. I hate to use the term semi stall because I think sprinkles came up with it, so I call it stall-based-balance. The premise is to set up multiple hazards with my powerful, sturdy Pokémon. The story of this team begins a few years ago, during the first round of Smogon´s World Cup. It was my first time participating in one, so I was nervous because I was not sure if I could glorify or shame Latin America. I made a pretty cool team, similar to the final version, which ended up 2-1 in the first round and peaked in the top 10, which is pretty good in my opinion, but I knew that it could be better!

One day I was laddering on my new alt, trying to find out a core to use for WC play. After some games won, and some games lost, I encountered one of the best games I have ever had, against Espada Ulquiorra. I was intrigued by one of his Pokémon, Jirachi. It had a peculiarity that made me love it instantly; it was different, a Substitute + Toxic set. I had no way to know its spread or nature.
A few hours later I realized I had just played my Latin partner, reyscarface. He agreed to share the set with me, and with my newly acquired Dragonite / Jirachi core, I decided to make my team. I finished the team, but changed some details to improve it, like Lucario over Jirachi throughout my run with this team.

The result ended up being a huge surprise! My most successful team has just been made. I managed to peak 4th on Smogon´s Standard Leaderboard under my alt, “living on a prayer” (my personal highest) and also made a good run in World Cup (3-2), which is my biggest success. Now that LA has been eliminated, I feel that it is time to retire this team, although I can still use it for casual laddering, so rates are pretty much appreciated. I am happy that we made it to semis, and I am glad that my first participation in a World Cup was this fun. OK, enough hassle!

Now I present Viva LA Vida!

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i_heatran.gif


Heatran (M) @ Shuca Berry
Flash Fire
240 HP / 228 Spe / 40 SpAtk
Modest

- Stealth Rock
- Flamethrower
- Will-o-Wisp
- Earth Power

Heatran is currently my favorite lead. I like him because it is very hard to KO; he is capable of taking even super effective hits with this spread. I decided to use this particular set because its ability to cripple Gyarados and Tyranitar, as well as getting Flygon on the switch-in, which is pretty benefitial for my team. Heatran is bulky enough to last until midgame, unlike many leads, and its typing and ability makes switches from my opponent very likely, which adds Stealth Rock and Spikes damage. He is a very important member of the team because Spikes aren’t that problematic without Stealth Rock, and if I lose Heatran early game, winning will become much more difficult.

The moveset is pretty simple, Stealth Rock is the best move in the game, and probably the reason why I win games; Fire and Ground provide excellent coverage except on a few threats that Will-o-Wisp covers anyway, such as Gyarados, Dragonite and Flygon. I am using Flamethrower over Fire Blast because the Modest nature compensates for the loss in power from using a Naïve nature. I am using Shuca Berry despite not beating opposing Heatran so that I can set up Stealth Rock turn one without worrying about getting OHKOd.

The EVs allow him to outspeed 40 Speed Jirachi, and therefore, Jolly Tyranitar. Near max HP is used to maximize his lasting power, although I am considering using more Special Attack to help with my Machamp weakness. I try to play conservatively with it because he is my only reliable resist to Outrage and Draco Meteor, and because it is a cool Pokémon to have around later in the game.
(I chose Heatran because it is hot ^^)

Azelf: I flamethrower as they use Stealth Rock, then set up while they use Explosion. Hopefully, DS Azelf has dropped greatly in the last days.

Metagross: Use Flamethrower on the first turn to scout for his item. If it is Lum Berry, it is likely going down, if it is Occa I use Stealth Rock next turn on a likely switch.

Aerodactyl: I switch to Suicune. If I am playing carelessly I will just use Stealth Rock.

Gliscor: They usually never Taunt Heatran, so I can set up Stealth Rock as he does the same, then WoW as he uses Earthquake.

Swampert: Tricky lead, I use WoW on the first turn as they set up Stealth Rock, then set up myself while taking less than 50% from his STAB Earthquake and play around from there.

Starmie: Switch to Roserade; she can take a LO Hydro Pump followed by an Ice Beam and proceed to OHKO back.

Jirachi: I use Stealth Rock; at worse I get a Choice Scarf or get paralyzed.

Heatran: I use Stealth Rock. Go to Suicune / Dragonite (depends if rocks are up or not) and then switch back to Heatran on the Explosion / switch in to Grass type.

Machamp: I lose badly.

Hippowdon: See Swampert.

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i_roserade.gif


Roserade (F) @ Leftovers
Natural Cure
252 HP / 80 Def / 56 SpD / 120 Spe
Calm

- Spikes
- Energy Ball
- Stun Spore
- Hidden Power Fire

In my opinion, Roserade is the best user of Spikes in OU. This is because Roserade is capable of handling every common Rapid Spin user between her STAB Energy Ball and Hidden Power. Roserade is the most defensive Pokémon on my team, and is the only member which I didn’t invest EVs in offense. She works pretty well with her great Special Defense and decent HP and Defense.

Roserade is a pretty good lure to Gliscor, CS Heatran, CS Tyranitar and Scizor. Crippling this Pokémon will make a sweep late game more than likely. The spread allows her to always survive a Choice Band Bullet Punch from Scizor, as well as a Stone Edge from Jolly Tyranitar, while still being able to take on Special Attackers like Rotom-A and Suicune.

Spikes is a given on the set, and it is probably the second most important move on the team, after Stealth Rock. Energy Ball couple with Hidden Power Fire have nice coverage and deals with what Roserade should be dealing with, I am using EB over Grass Knot to break Rotom-As Substitutes. Stun Spore is to cripple, as mentioned before, many dangerous threats that love to switch-in on Roserade.

Being the most supportive member of the team, she is also one of the most important parts of this system called Viva LA Vida! Roserade RULES, period.

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i_suicune.gif


Suicune @ Leftovers
Pressure
236 HP / 44 SpAtk / 228 Spe
Timid (+Spe -Atk)

- Calm Mind
- Hydro Pump
- Ice Beam
- Roar

Suicune finishes my Fire / Water / Grass combo (yeah… I know) and is a very unique sweeper. Unlike more powerful sweepers like Infernape and Dragonite, this set does not rely on hitting hard while having coverage. The point of this set is to pseudo haze up to the point where it can sweep even with one Calm Mind. On times, I can CM war against Crocune just to leave him helpless against my +4-5 Suicune. This set is my favorite Suicune set! It still gets the surprise OHKO on Breloom after a Calm Mind and hits as hard as the offensive version, but it is bulkier.

The only difference from the standard offensive Suicune is Roar over Hidden Power Electric. I am using it because Roar is usually my most dangerous move on Suicune, capable of forcing a switch, and using Roar on it; it can get up to 75% damage against my opponent in one turn. The EVs help me beat Gyarados, Mamoswine, Lucario and most variants of Rotom-A. The HP investment reaches a Leftovers number, which is very important on a Pokémon like Cune, while the small investment in Special Attack makes Hydro Pump as strong as a max SpAtk Surf. Suicune checks CS Flygon, CB Dragonite and many pesky treats. I love Suicune!

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i_rotom.gif


Rotom-W @ Choice Scarf
Levitate
108 HP / 252 Spe / 148 SpAtk
Timid

- Thunderbolt
- Shadow Ball
- Trick
- Hydro Pump

Rotom-A is the Pokémon that holds my team together, since it prevents my hazards from being spun and revenges many dangerous treats for me. Rotom is a brilliant Pokemon, not only helps the team by revenge killing, against stall teams I can cripple one of their Pokemon (I am really careful of Tyranitar) and aside that, he is the ultimate lure to Choice Scarf Heatran and Tyranitar, as well as Gliscor; Pokemon who would otherwise stop Lucario´s sweep.

Thunderbolt along Shadow Ball give me almost unresisted coverage, as well as potent STAB moves to fire off a pretty decent 105 base Special Attack. Hydro Pump 2HKOs Heatran and Tyranitar switch-ins if I have Spikes on the field, which is pretty nice. I dislike using Trick sometimes, because I am not sure if I will need the Speed against Agility Empoleon or Dragon Dance Gyarados late-game, so I play cautiously with it.

I chose to run max Speed to at least tie with opposing Rotom-A post-Trick and to beat offensive Suicune; I still wanted some bulk, so I gave it some HP EVs to take better on Waterfall, Pursuit and Fire Blast when needed! Rotom-W is my favorite form because it looks pretty cool and thats good enough for me =D


i_dragonite


Dragonite @ Life Orb
Inner Focus
144 HP / 132 Atk / 232 Spe
Jolly

- Dragon Dance
- Dragon Claw
- Earthquake
- Roost

Dragonite is usually my opening sweeper, and it is very good at it. I really like its synergy with Lucario, because many people rely on Choiced Pokemon to revenge kill this treats, such as Flygon and Jirachi; with good offensive timing, I can use this in my favor. With the aid of Stealth Rock and Spikes, it is very hard to stop from sweeping. My first move is most likely Roost or Earthquake to scout for counters, so by the time I actually set up, they are weakened enough to be beaten.

What I love the most about Dragonite is his ability to set up and beat most W/F/G cores, which is pretty good since they are pretty common. Dragonite acts as a secondary lure to Choice Scarf Heatran as well. Heatran is most likely expecting to outspeed me and fire a powerful Dragon Pulse, but my Dragonite is not standard, as it beats even Jolly Jolteon after a boost, along every Heatran.

I play Dragonite carefully (pretty much like every other Pokemon), but I have a special care for him because he can turn the game into my power!!1
I chose a DClaw over Outrage because I dont fear being revenge killed as easy as being locked in a resisted move, and because confusion sucks; SS, Stealth Rock and Life Orb are enough damage! I have considered using Waterfall over Earthquake and Extremespeed over Roost at times, since it still OHKOs Tyranitar and Heatran after a boost, but doesnt leave me helpless against Skarmory, and Extremspeed to have more safety against Infernape, help Dragonite is my second favorite son of the team, and with a good reason, long live DNITE!



i_lucario.gif


Lucario @ Life Orb
Inner Focus
252 Spe / 252 Atk / 4 Def / 2 SpAtk
Jolly

Swords Dance
Close Combat
Extremespeed
Crunch

I chose Lucario because it is very cool1!

Aside from being "very cool", I consider Lucario the best Pokémon in OU. With its amazing typing, it can find opportunities to set up pretty easily, and with the aid of Trick from Rotom, I will end up setting up either Luke or Nite, both work for me, although Lucario is the most potent out of that combo.

Lucario have it all, great typing, ability (often underrated, but without it Jirachi would have an easier time stopping Luke) and movepool. I like that he only needs one turn of set up to basically destroy most teams after its partner are done weakening the enemy. The moveset is pretty standard, except that Jolly over Adamant to have an easier time against opposing Lucario and Rotom-A. It doesnt hit as hard without a positive nature, but Spikes make up for it so I am fine most of the time. I usually start firing a powerful Close Combat to weaken its counters, following the same logic as Dragonite, so a sweep lategame become most likely. The difference is that Lucario can come in at any stage of the game and attack, because he resists Stealth Rock x4, which is pretty useful if I need to revege kill something with Extremspeed without having to show Rotom.

I am amazed that I originally did not intend to make a team based around Lucario, but in the end it ended up working way better than Jirachi, so he has its spot earned! Lucario is my favorite Pokemon, and the final member of Viva LA Vida. Goodbye!


Thanks for taking the time to read this, I really appreciate that my work is being appreciated T.T
So feel free to rate it, steal it, buy it whatever! I am happy with whatever your choice is, because it has been a fun way until I got here, and it was worth all the hassle =)


Latin America: Mizuno, hanke, reyscarface, EnZ0, Scimjara, _Rewer_ and fucking tito.

It has been a pleasure to work with you, guys! I enjoyed spending time chatting about everything that was not Pokemon related (mice, isketch lol)
And I hope we can work together again next year. I feel happy that we broke LAs history making it to semis, and I am sure that we can do it better next time, thanks for being so awesome and for giving me the chance to play my first WC. Thanks!

CAL: El Blecko, Kir, apologies, Delta 2777, Mechazawa, Firesong!

I just love you guys! And you too Kir. -__-


ViVA LA ViDA !!

-legendary_07​
 
Damn brilliant team.

Love the Dragonite / Lucario combination. It is too true that Dragonite is mostly only capable of being revenged by Scarfers.

There really isn't much to change at all and I can only sugggest nitpicks.

Roserade's speed needs to be bumped up to 124 EVs because you are using HP Fire. They can come from Def so you keep your jump point in SpD. I would also suggest Rest > Stun Spore as it is your only electric resist and primary water switchin from the looks of it.

Final nitpick is to drop Suicune speed to 216 EVs as you can't really do much to JollyDos anyway are better off simply roaring it out. This way you still outspeed the base 80's. Chuck them in Def or SpA, up to you.

Once again, brilliant team and I'll probably try the Dragonite+Luke combo soon^^

Viva la Vida I guess.
 
Hey legendary,

Great team, and congrats on your success with it. I think you made a typo, I presume Rotom is supposed to be holding a Choice Scarf. I've actually seen this team in action on Shoddy plenty of times, and battled you quite a bit too.

I feel that the lack of recovery on Suicune really hurts it, as you rely on it to check a lot of powerful threats like Flygon, Infernape and Lucario. So, repeated hits from them will easily wear it down, and with Rotom-w potentially being trapped by Scarftar or Scizor, it opens up a sweep for another poke. I feel that Suicune's slot should go to a more dedicated phazer, one with recovery, and who can heal the team as well. Vaporeon is one of the best Nape counters around, and supports the team excellently with Wish. The lack of Rapid Spin support means your team is worn down by all kinds of hazards, and Wish helps out a lot. Vaporeon also helps out with your slight SubSplit Gengar weakness, as practically nothing on your team can switch into it whil it uses Substitute and not be defeated.

Once again, excellent team and gl!
 
Did you mean to place Choice Specs (or Choice Scarf) on Rotom instead of Leftovers? I don't see much of a point of Tricking Leftovers onto something. :P

Also, why do you have 2 SpA EVs on Lucario?

Very nice team, though. You have a bit of an issue with Dragon Dancers, though, and since not many Pokemon on your team have reliable recovery, they are likely low on health by the end of the game, making them unlikely to be able to take many hits (Suicune may not even be able to Roar out a DD Gyarados if it has Taunt). I see that you try not to allow these Pokemon from setting up (Stun Spore on Roserade, Will-O-Wisp on Heatran), but this is not enough due to the low accuracy of those moves and the fact that some Dragon Dancers have Lum Berry.

A solid revenge killer for these Pokemon is Choice Scarf Flygon. I suggest you place him over Dragonite.

Flygon @ Choice Scarf
Adamant Nature
EVs: 252 Atk/252 Spe/4 SpD
-Outrage
-U-Turn
-Earthquake
-ThunderPunch

Second, I suggest a Wish Vaporeon over Suicune to keep all of your Pokemon in good health, seeing as none have reliable recovery (assuming you adopt Flygon).

Vaporeon @ Leftovers
Bold Nature
EVs: 252 HP/220 Def/24 SpD/12 Spe
-Wish
-Protect
-Surf
-Roar

Now, everything seems in check. Jolly SD Lucario can be an issue if it wins the speed tie with your Lucario, but other than that, you seem fine.
 
One more nitpick from me too ^_^ I'd really try to put HP [ice] somewhere on Rotom-W.....This is simply because Dragonite has free reign over basically your whole team after a DD and you have to hope you can lock into Outrage or pray Suicune is at decent health and Dragonite low enough health for the OHKO.

The move that seems the most replacable is Shadow Ball in terms of coverage and still being able to hurt Tyranitar/Heatran switches.

Hope this helped a bit.

EDIT: I actually thought someone else would suggest this by now so I didn't...but why not use a Vaporeon > Suicune. I feel it would perform better than your hybrid Suicune. Valuable wish passing to both your Heatran and Roserade can prove invaluable against opposing stall.

The standard set would do:

Vaporeon @ Leftovers
Water Absorb | Bold
188HP / 252Def / 56SpD / 12Spe
-Surf
-Wish
-Protect
-Ice Beam / Roar

If you make this change and the Rest on Roserade change, you gain some much needed staying power on the team.
 
This teams has huge problems with special defensive zapdos (omg sub zapdos is a huge pain) and mainly stall teams in general and machamp at full health late game can really cap this team. I would suggest a recovery move somewhere on this team like wish. I would suggest Cm wish jirachi over maybe lucario or roserade. I would use a rest-talk rotom to stop starmie from koing you with hydro pump.Roserade is useless becasue you lack the method of letting things switch in safely and forcing a switch.
 
Very solid team. I may have to steal that Suicune set. :P

You have a pretty big Machamp weakness as a well played one can cause you lots of trouble. I think a Specs Heatran would be better over your current one. It OHKOs Machamp, Occa Metagross, and a number of other leads as well. The loss of Will-O-Wisp shouldn't be a big problem since Gyarados and Dragonite take about 50% and Flygon takes ~75% min if they switch in to Modest Overheat. If you play conservatively with it, it can come back later and punch holes in your opponent's team with Overheat.

Heatran (M) @ Choice Specs
Flash Fire
40 HP / 252 SpA / 216 Spe
Modest / Timid

- Overheat
- Earth Power
- Hidden Power Grass
- Stealth Rock

216 Speed let it outrun Jolly Tyranitar. Alternatively, you can use Timid and max Speed to try and tie opposing Heatran. Timid Specs Earth Power does 96% - 113.3% to Naive Shuca Tran.
 
Obviously a great team, but I could see a DDing Kingdra being a total kick in the balls for this team. I see from the description that you love Roserade, but replacing her with Skarmory would still allow to keep the Spikes and you gain a decent Kingdra counter and a phazer, potentially opening up a slot on Suicune. It's been said before, but you rely on Suicune to check many threats yet it only has Lefties to recover, so a CroCune might work better. Good luck.
 
Wow, Legend! It seems that your team is so invincible right now... Hahaha.

Anyway, I will rate later. :D
 
Final nitpick I swear :(

Move 4 EVs to speed on Dragonite. This lets you outspeed Adamant Lucario...I mean you do have it checked but 4 EVs to outspeed something like Adamant Lucario is well worth it.
 
can't say much, but i'd like to extend an alternative to the heatran lead, similar to that which bribery suggested. you could change your heatran to a more offensive set, although this really does hurt your goal of taking outrages and draco meteors (as it can't take as many). though i am reluctant to suggest this, it may be a good idea just to test it.

the evs could change to 80 HP / 212 SpA / 216 Spe, or whatever outpaces 40 Spe Jirachi (i'm sure that spread comes close, but not certain). you could pair that with life orb, a modest nature, and overheat > flamethrower. this deals with machamp, deals more damage to opposing pokémon, allows heatran to act more like a sweeper with spikes support and means you won't have to change your set completely so you don't have to get rid of will-o-wisp or changed to a choiced set. it still does 93.7% - 110.2% to machamp which isn't bad at all.

as i said to you in shoddy pm, this team is excellent and is probably the best team i have seen this year in the rmt forum. an easy 5*. well done.
 
why does rotom have trick with leftovers? i think you typed something wrong...
Thanks, fixed it.

Ghost. said:
Damn brilliant team.

Love the Dragonite / Lucario combination. It is too true that Dragonite is mostly only capable of being revenged by Scarfers.

There really isn't much to change at all and I can only sugggest nitpicks.

Roserade's speed needs to be bumped up to 124 EVs because you are using HP Fire. They can come from Def so you keep your jump point in SpD. I would also suggest Rest > Stun Spore as it is your only electric resist and primary water switchin from the looks of it.

Final nitpick is to drop Suicune speed to 216 EVs as you can't really do much to JollyDos anyway are better off simply roaring it out. This way you still outspeed the base 80's. Chuck them in Def or SpA, up to you.

Once again, brilliant team and I'll probably try the Dragonite+Luke combo soon^^

Viva LA Vida I guess.

Thanks for the rate ^^ I am considering using less Speed and more bulk on Roserade, since I have Stun Spore anyway, but otherwise I will take 4 EVs from HP and place them in Speed. For Suicune, I think I will keep the spread because it beats 188 Speed Rotom-A, which is pretty important I forgot to mention it, I guess.

Thanks, good luck!

IronBullet said:
Hey legendary,

Great team, and congrats on your success with it. I think you made a typo, I presume Rotom is supposed to be holding a Choice Scarf. I've actually seen this team in action on Shoddy plenty of times, and battled you quite a bit too.

I feel that the lack of recovery on Suicune really hurts it, as you rely on it to check a lot of powerful threats like Flygon, Infernape and Lucario. So, repeated hits from them will easily wear it down, and with Rotom-w potentially being trapped by Scarftar or Scizor, it opens up a sweep for another poke. I feel that Suicune's slot should go to a more dedicated phazer, one with recovery, and who can heal the team as well. Vaporeon is one of the best Nape counters around, and supports the team excellently with Wish. The lack of Rapid Spin support means your team is worn down by all kinds of hazards, and Wish helps out a lot. Vaporeon also helps out with your slight SubSplit Gengar weakness, as practically nothing on your team can switch into it whil it uses Substitute and not be defeated.

Once again, excellent team and gl!

Thanks, Vaporeon over Suicune sounds promising, so I will be testing it soon. I just have to decide between using Roar and Ice Beam, though. Yeah Suicune has too much to handle that sometimes it is funny, and Vappy is more durable so it might work better, and Lucario is handled by my own Luke anyway. Thanks!

Super Mario Bro said:
Did you mean to place Choice Specs (or Choice Scarf) on Rotom instead of Leftovers? I don't see much of a point of Tricking Leftovers onto something. :P

Also, why do you have 2 SpA EVs on Lucario?

Very nice team, though. You have a bit of an issue with Dragon Dancers, though, and since not many Pokemon on your team have reliable recovery, they are likely low on health by the end of the game, making them unlikely to be able to take many hits (Suicune may not even be able to Roar out a DD Gyarados if it has Taunt). I see that you try not to allow these Pokemon from setting up (Stun Spore on Roserade, Will-O-Wisp on Heatran), but this is not enough due to the low accuracy of those moves and the fact that some Dragon Dancers have Lum Berry.

A solid revenge killer for these Pokemon is Choice Scarf Flygon. I suggest you place him over Dragonite.

Flygon @ Choice Scarf
Adamant Nature
EVs: 252 Atk/252 Spe/4 SpD
-Outrage
-U-Turn
-Earthquake
-ThunderPunch

Second, I suggest a Wish Vaporeon over Suicune to keep all of your Pokemon in good health, seeing as none have reliable recovery (assuming you adopt Flygon).

Vaporeon @ Leftovers
Bold Nature
EVs: 252 HP/220 Def/24 SpD/12 Spe
-Wish
-Protect
-Surf
-Roar

Now, everything seems in check. Jolly SD Lucario can be an issue if it wins the speed tie with your Lucario, but other than that, you seem fine.

Haha yeah, it was a typo; I meant Choice Scarf. The SpAtk EVs are some kind of inside joke for the team so Ill keep them xd. About the Dragon Dance weakness, I think I wont be using Flygon because it will ruin the DD + SD combo; also I suck at prediction so I dislike many Choice users -_-

Darxide said:
one more nitpick, why the fuck does lucario have 2 sp. atk evs

You can PM me this kind of things; they do not affect Lucario at all (it was meant to be an inside joke) so I will just keep them.

Ghost. said:
One more nitpick from me too ^_^ I'd really try to put HP [ice] somewhere on Rotom-W.....This is simply because Dragonite has free reign over basically your whole team after a DD and you have to hope you can lock into Outrage or pray Suicune is at decent health and Dragonite low enough health for the OHKO.

The move that seems the most replacable is Shadow Ball in terms of coverage and still being able to hurt Tyranitar/Heatran switches.

Hope this helped a bit.

EDIT: I actually thought someone else would suggest this by now so I didn't...but why not use a Vaporeon > Suicune. I feel it would perform better than your hybrid Suicune. Valuable wish passing to both your Heatran and Roserade can prove invaluable against opposing stall.

The standard set would do:

Vaporeon @ Leftovers
Water Absorb | Bold
188HP / 252Def / 56SpD / 12Spe
-Surf
-Wish
-Protect
-Ice Beam / Roar

If you make this change and the Rest on Roserade change, you gain some much needed staying power on the team.

Thank you very much again for the help, Ghost! After testing Vaporeon, I noticed two things: She never dies, and I missed the ability to use an Ice move along a phazing move, I alternated Ice Beam and Roar and I couldnt decide which move I should keep, so I am thinking to run some type of Milotic in its place, with Recover and Ice Beam, probably with Haze as its last move; I will test Rest on Roserade as well and post back how well it does.. thanks!

Curtains said:
This teams has huge problems with special defensive zapdos (omg sub zapdos is a huge pain) and mainly stall teams in general and machamp at full health late game can really cap this team. I would suggest a recovery move somewhere on this team like wish. I would suggest Cm wish jirachi over maybe lucario or roserade. I would use a rest-talk rotom to stop starmie from koing you with hydro pump.Roserade is useless becasue you lack the method of letting things switch in safely and forcing a switch.

If I use Jirachi over Roserade, then I lose my Spikes, and gain a Swampert / bulky ground weakness, I might use it over Lucario though, one of my favorite sets is Expert Belt so I will test it over Lucario. Restalk Rotom-A and CS Rotom are both 2HKOd by Starmie, with the difference that my set can attack before he can finish me, so I will keep my set.

Bribery said:
Very solid team. I may have to steal that Suicune set. :P

You have a pretty big Machamp weakness as a well played one can cause you lots of trouble. I think a Specs Heatran would be better over your current one. It OHKOs Machamp, Occa Metagross, and a number of other leads as well. The loss of Will-O-Wisp shouldn't be a big problem since Gyarados and Dragonite take about 50% and Flygon takes ~75% min if they switch in to Modest Overheat. If you play conservatively with it, it can come back later and punch holes in your opponent's team with Overheat.

Heatran (M) @ Choice Specs
Flash Fire
40 HP / 252 SpA / 216 Spe
Modest / Timid

- Overheat
- Earth Power
- Hidden Power Grass
- Stealth Rock

216 Speed let it outrun Jolly Tyranitar. Alternatively, you can use Timid and max Speed to try and tie opposing Heatran. Timid Specs Earth Power does 96% - 113.3% to Naive Shuca Tran.

I will definitely have to test this thing, I know that it is a beast with Spikes, and although it is not as durable, the offensive gain compensates for the defensive drop. Like I said earlier though, I suck with teams with many Choice Users so I will try out the set suggested by VASHTA. Thanks Bribery!

gritane said:
Nice team !
But I think that you are a bit rest talk gyara weak if you've lost rotom ( pursuit or wtrfall+SR's )

Yeah, it is problem if they have Thunderwave or Stone Edge, but it is manageable with Suicune and Dragonite if it lacks those moves, I can always use Roserade to set up Spikes and Suicune beats him on the Roar so it it not that hard too handle.

Starbuck said:
Obviously a great team, but I could see a DDing Kingdra being a total kick in the balls for this team. I see from the description that you love Roserade, but replacing her with Skarmory would still allow to keep the Spikes and you gain a decent Kingdra counter and a phazer, potentially opening up a slot on Suicune. It's been said before, but you rely on Suicune to check many threats yet it only has Lefties to recover, so a CroCune might work better. Good luck.

Indeed, my best hope is to Roar him out, but that is just a temporary solution; Rotoms Thunderbolt followed by an Extremspeed can take him out, but Chesto DD versions are really annoying, that is another reason to consider Milotic over Suicune, although I am not sure. Crocune will slow down my momentum and it is easier to set up on with things like Skarmory / Gyarados and Dragonite, so I think I will pass on that suggestion, thanks!

Clarion said:
Wow, Legend! It seems that your team is so invincible right now... Hahaha.

Anyway, I will rate later. :D

lol thanks!

Ghost. said:
Final nitpick I swear :(

Move 4 EVs to speed on Dragonite. This lets you outspeed Adamant Lucario...I mean you do have it checked but 4 EVs to outspeed something like Adamant Lucario is well worth it.

Haha, dont worry. Post as many useful posts here as you wish : ) I appreciate them a lot! Thanks for the tip, I will remove them from Attack and place them in Speed; f*ck you Lucario!


VASHTA said:
can't say much, but i'd like to extend an alternative to the heatran lead, similar to that which bribery suggested. you could change your heatran to a more offensive set, although this really does hurt your goal of taking outrages and draco meteors (as it can't take as many). though i am reluctant to suggest this, it may be a good idea just to test it.

the evs could change to 80 HP / 212 SpA / 216 Spe, or whatever outpaces 40 Spe Jirachi (i'm sure that spread comes close, but not certain). you could pair that with life orb, a modest nature, and overheat > flamethrower. this deals with machamp, deals more damage to opposing pokémon, allows heatran to act more like a sweeper with spikes support and means you won't have to change your set completely so you don't have to get rid of will-o-wisp or changed to a choiced set. it still does 93.7% - 110.2% to machamp which isn't bad at all.

as i said to you in shoddy pm, this team is excellent and is probably the best team i have seen this year in the rmt forum. an easy 5*. well done.

This is the change that I have liked the most until now, I am using 228 Spe / 252 SpAtk / 28 HP iirc and it does pretty well with Spikes; the only different thing is that I am using Taunt over Will-o-Wisp to prevent Tyranitar from setting up at all and because it works amazing with Spikes against stall (specially against Flamethrower Blissey)
Thank you very much for the rate and the stars!
 
Yo legend!

Great team u got there, i saw you testing it and it worked wonderfully, just some nitpicks

You should add Rest > Stun Spore on Roserade to outstall some shit and get healed, you will be awake when you switch out anyway and your team have a great synergy to support it.

Now i see a problem of Machamp just being a bitch especially if he got ice punch. A mix jirachi could help you, prolly over Lucario, it helps you covering annoying threats like Dragonite and sweeps alot just like him, thats just an option. And yeah Modest Vaporeon over Suicune will give you alot more help with a recovering move, yeah it will be weaker since Vaporeon lacks Calm Mind, but modest allow you to hit hard shit like Swampert and Skarmory on the switch, modest gives enough to 3hko it and outspeed with standart speed evs, so it cant setup that free on you with some damage taken before.

Anyway, its a great team, gj

VIVA LA VIDA
 
_Rewer_ said:
Yo legend!

Great team u got there, i saw you testing it and it worked wonderfully, just some nitpicks

You should add Rest > Stun Spore on Roserade to outstall some shit and get healed, you will be awake when you switch out anyway and your team have a great synergy to support it.

Now i see a problem of Machamp just being a bitch especially if he got ice punch. A mix jirachi could help you, prolly over Lucario, it helps you covering annoying threats like Dragonite and sweeps alot just like him, thats just an option. And yeah Modest Vaporeon over Suicune will give you alot more help with a recovering move, yeah it will be weaker since Vaporeon lacks Calm Mind, but modest allow you to hit hard shit like Swampert and Skarmory on the switch, modest gives enough to 3hko it and outspeed with standart speed evs, so it cant setup that free on you with some damage taken before.

Anyway, its a great team, gj


VIVA LA VIDA

I will be testing Jirachi over Lucario although I doubt it will work better; time is on my side though so I will give it a shot! I am considering to use Milotic over Suicune because it has reliable recovery in one move / one turn and is able to use Ice Beam effectively; Thanks for the rate, buddy! Indeed, VIVA LA VIDA!!

Edit*

I want to give special thanks to everyone who has star-ed my RMT; I really appreciate them, thanks : )
 
hey legend,
this is definitely a very solid team, congrats. i cant really find any huge weaknesses but there are a few special attackers that could definitely give you trouble. lo shaymin with a move set of hp ice/seed flare/earth power/rest or synthesis could really give you trouble if heatran is weakened or loses its shuca, or if roserade is weakened/gets spD drops. because i know youre a solid player im confident you can play around it with lucario's espeed, etc but its definitely something to watch out for. its hard to find something to change without disrupting your synergy but one thing i might try is changing rotom's final move. hydro pump doesnt really seem that necessary. i would either change it to rotom-h and use overheat, which lets you knock quite a lot of hp off shaymin, as well as checking lucario better, or change it to hp ice. this lets you finish a weakened shaymin or at least damage it on the switch in, especially with spikes, while still allowing you to hit gliscor and giving you another check to dragonite, who could be trouble if cune is weakened.
powerful electric types like jolteon, raikou and zapdos look problematic as well. roserade does pretty well against jolteon and lucarios espeed does a lot, so you shouldnt run into too much trouble with that. raikou, however, will set up on roserade and takes much less from espeed. zapdos is potentially even more problematic since it isnt damaged by spikes and has roost to continue being a threat and preventing you from switching around on resistances and wearing it down. this weakness is definitely hard to patch up as well. one option would be to run a more specially defensive dragonite, however i dont like that because it really just doesnt work as well with the team. since youre an excellent player im sure youll be able to play around these threats and you may just have to rely on that since i dont want to destroy your teams synergy.
hope i helped, i rated this 5 stars
 
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