What was the hardest part of the metagame for you to understand?

Learning how to distribute your EVs correctly is hardly metagame-related. I suppose when a new design is created, you need to memorize the EV spread; the same applies for team-building. Finding difficulties within the metagame would be like, "Heatran runs rampant around the current metagame. I just can't handle all of them and the unexpected sets it is capable of using".

The point of the topic is asking what was the hardest part of the competitive scene for you? It could be from any where from typing to not being able to predict, and everything in between
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I guess this redirects the aim of the topic, at least differently from your misleading title.

Interesting topic, nonetheless.

Building a team to account for every threat is a task that isn't worth attempting, mainly because it's impossible to do. But I will agree that it was difficult when I did try.
 
EV's in things like little cup, due to the differances in effects
keeping up with the changes, a few changes means forced changes to me in things being banished (UU team, or just keeping track with main threats (i usualy end up facing things that are not the metagame normal)
 
Getting dissed for wanting to be entertained when I play competitively, which doesn't happen through repetition.


... Oh, and prediction.
 
prediction for me probably. when I first started playing, I would often be frightened to predict, in case I overpredicted and it all went wrong. I play a lot more agressively now (you have to with baton pass really) and it pays off more.
 
The right level of prediction is key, especially at the start of a match. When you don't know your opponent/their team at all, how do you proceed? Let's say they lead with Bronzong, and I lead with Deoxys-S. I switch to Heatran, anticipating a Gyro Ball because he's anticipating a taunt. But is he anticipating all of that, and does he have EQ, or maybe he's heatproof just so he can screw Heatran switch-ins? Or do I get my Heatran in safely, and then Earth Power to hit his Heatran that he's switching in for the Flash Fire boost?

Prediction is simple, but with so little information it's very difficult figuring out exactly "to what level" prediction should be made. Heck, for all I know, I could just Taunt/Trick and he'd try to lay down SR first turn.
 
Remembering common speed stats so I know how many EVs to put into speed for certain Pokemon. Thats probably the only thing I really don't understand though.
 
At the beginning of competitive playing, I had problem with IVs (especially hidden power and how the IVs pass). Also, I have some trouble adjusting to different tiers (I play OU mostly) as well as the shifting metagame.
 
I really only play OU, so I don't really know that much about the other tiers. However, I wouldn't say that's the hardest thing. I hate prediction. I still suck at it.
 
^^ Nice Aldaron.

For me the hardest part of playing pomemon is getting over the concept of roles. For example. Everyone stats playingt hinking, alright, I have a Physical wall, a special wall, a physical sweeper and a special sweeper. the if you want to play offensive you will add 2 more sweeper and if you want to play defensively you chuck in another 2 walls, and then balanced you chuck in another sweeper and another wall. That's a simple model that works right.

This of it like our discovery of the atom. At first we learn that Atoms are made of protons neutrons and electrons, then we learn that protons are made of smaller particales called quarks and then we don't actually know what those are either. SO the original model of Protons, Neutrons and Electrons if a good model for learning the subject of atoms but they are a model that you must eventually discard to discover the heart of it. I liken this to pokemon battling in the sense that roles are a good model for learning how to play and are a good model for a beginner, but as you progress you realise that really It's all about executing your strategy, and finding the pokemon that are going to help you exectute that stratgey, not just "role based" teams. I am still getting over that Idea :/
 
I guess this redirects the aim of the topic, at least differently from your misleading title.

Interesting topic, nonetheless.
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Sorry for the "misleading title" but I really saw no other way to keep it less vague. Ev's are part of the metagame for people who don't copy paste, having to try out different spreads until they find one that works. In that sense it actually it part of the metagame.
 
Why all my teams died to the same threat(s). Had problems with Baton passing teams and pretty much every Breloom, until I learned how to abuse Sleep clause and have moves that either haze or Phaze the opponent.

Also that Supprise and prediction and having fun is the key to success.
 
EVs were hard at first. When I first came to Smogon and started competitive battling I was so brash and thought my in-game team could dominate everything. (Infernape, Torterra, Empoleon, Staraptor, Luxray, Garchomp) lulz

I think it helps understanding and making EV spreads if you lurk in the RMT forum a lot, and if you have a handy damage calculator with which to throw numbers around (like CardsOfTheHeart's amazing Excel one).
 
A few years back I would do stuff like "always have a phaser, always have a counter for X Y Z A B C L M N O P, always have a status move, always have blah blah blah" which obviously imposed unnecessary limitations on my team building.
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This. One day I decided to try new shit, stop using a Gliscor / Blissey / Cresselia in all my teams, and try new shit like stall, offensive, and gimmick teams, this pretty much opened my mind and I realized a lot of things that can be done with different synrengys, in example mono-rock team, which is fun
 
For me, it's the extremely versatile Pokemon that give me trouble. Not being experienced with the DPP metagame, I find myself panicking when a versatile Pokemon such as Salamence, Lucario, Dragonite, Gengar, Celebi, etc. come out. I don't know the moveset for sure, and can't predict right.
 
Thorns said:
For me, it's the extremely versatile Pokemon that give me trouble. Not being experienced with the DPP metagame, I find myself panicking when a versatile Pokemon such as Salamence, Lucario, Dragonite, Gengar, Celebi, etc. come out. I don't know the moveset for sure, and can't predict right.
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That's something I forgot to mention in my post. I despise seeing Pokémon like Lucario, Infernape, Gengar, Sceptile, Salamence, Azelf, and such: fast, versatile things with powerful offenses. They always make me twinge, even now. In particular, when I have a Poke with a double weakness out (Scizor, Dragons, Heracross, Swampert, Gyrados, etc.) then I get all paranoid about a surprise Hidden Power. Defensive but versatile Pokémon like Blissey or Bronzong don't have that same effect for some reason. Probably because, although you don't know what they're going to do, you know they aren't going to faint your Pokémon.

Again, though, this kind of works it's way back to prediction.
 
I've just started playing recently; EV's I'm only OK with, though I have started with moving mine around a little bit. I'm fairly good at attack prediction, but I find I have a lot of trouble with switch-in prediction, especially against teams that run walls (especially stall teams). Like, I'll be up against a Blissey and will go for the Fighting move, only to bounce ineffectively off of a Rotom-X. So I'll switch in something with a Ghost move, and go to use that, and find it bounced ineffectively off that same damn Blissey. So obviously I need my Fighting-attacker again, so I switch him in, only to find myself up against Rotom again. Etc etc. And all this time I'm taking switch-in damage and probably some Toxic damage, plus whatever moves the Blissey and Rotom are throwing out, so my guys get worn down and then I lose.
 
Switching was fr n00bs. I thought that swtching was stupid because it takes away the point that you've brought a charizard to kill lucario but they just switch it out.

Also, it just gave them a free hit on me.
 
Team building was/is quite hard. You need something that is different than the standard so the foe isn't prepared, and you're not considered "stealing" the team.

The whole concept is just strange to me. For example, you start out with what you want the team to do. Some people may say to set up loads of spikes and stealth rocks... others may say to stall the foe out with status moves and hax. Yet I simply say to beat all the opponents Pokemon into the dust, isn't that the real goal?

Then there's the working together part, and synergy.
 
At the risk of sounding noobish, the one aspect of the metagame I still don't fully understand is counters. How is a pokemon supposed to withstand any of the opponent's attacks and OHKO back, or is a counter something else?
 
Afaik, a counter is a Pokemon that can switch in on another pokemons attack(s) without taking any ( or not much ) damage.
 
Aldaron said:
I was a pretty average player until I saw MoP bitching at some people about a very significant point.
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interestingly enough, I was pretty suckish myself before I saw aldaron bitching to a few people =/

for me, the biggest problem was the way I used "walls." like, I'd overtax any defensive pokemon on my team way too much (still do, but I've gotten a bit better I guess). like I'd try and switch crocune into every fucking threat in existence and each time I'd get holes ripped open in my team. after I got over the "you can wall everything" mentality, which is completely bogus, I started to not suck anymore.
 
Teambuilding was always hardest for me to get because i always wanted to cover everything or just use walls which ended up sitting there and having no signifigant way to kill the opponents pokemon. Then i learned synergy within a team and my teams got much more solid and they havent really dipped down since
 
I had (still do to some degree) have trouble with everything to some degree...

"Team Synergy" is a concept I have yet to understand fully... That's probably my biggest thing.
 
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