Well, ideally you should be Mega-ing as soon as you can since regular Pinsir isn't that good, its predictable but predictablity isn't an issue when your goal is to blast through nearly everything with brute force, and setting up on super effective attacks is generally a poor decision on the users part. Also, Mega Pinsir isn't weak lol, try taking a +2 Aerialate Return with something that isn't Skarmory and tell me how it goes.
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Other XY OU Viability Ranking Thread (B- and C+ Pokemon discussion)
- Thread starter ginganinja
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The thing I'm trying to get at is that Salamence at the very least has the choice of getting past something that not even one other DD-er (minus Kingdra) can get past while still retaining the option to run Fire Blast to get past its usual checks if it wants to. This means that Landorus-T(which can switch into every single other Dragon type sweeper with relative impunity and end a sweep prematurely) cannot simply switch in until it is sure that Salamence does not have Hydro Pump.
As a matter of fact, it is not losing to as many Pokemons without Fire Blast as it seems, only missing out on Scizor who you shouldn't be staying in on, and Ferrothorn (Skarmory doesn't get OHKO-ed by Fire Blast even after SR, and Hydro Pump hits hard enough anyway; Forretress is like nowhere to be seen; Scizor priority-kills you even if you have Fire Blast). Compared to other dragons in term of coverage, Hydro Pump is just the icing on the cake for Salamence, allowing him to defeat the likes of Gliscor, Landorus-T, Hippowdon, Balloon-tran, which are just dead complete stops to other dragon sweepers.
Salamence is also the only Dragon type that can run both a viable Mixed set, and a viable DD set. While Salamence may be somewhat outclassed in either role, but there is nothing that can run both set better than Salamence. There is practically no definite counter to both sets simultaneously, which allows Salamence to punish wrong switches better than any other dragon.
tldr;
I'm certainly not arguing Salamence for A, perhaps somewhere from B ~ A-, but certainly not as unviable as C as what people have been saying for the last couple of pages.
I acknowledged the differences between Greninja and Keldeo, but they're both specially (I haven't fought a single physical Keldeo, and with the power behind specs hydro pumps, I don't expect to) offensive fast water types who's goal is to hit hard and fast. Keldeo hits harder, but Greninja hits faster, and it hits more. As a wall breaker, Keldeo's clearly better, but Greninja's more useful in general and there's only so many instances that Keldeo will do something that Greninja couldn't do as well.
Anyway, I don't really want to waste time comparing Keldeo to anyone because that's not why I don't think he's A+. If you look at post #1653, I list 12 pokemon that pretty much completely wall specs Keldeo, and most of them have no trouble KOing it, so its usually forced to switch. for a wall breaker that's not good. That alone makes it unviable for A+ imo.
You can't use Charizard, Mawile, Absol, or a lot of other megas in OU without mega evolving either. As for being predictable, who cares? Anything it outspeeds is hugely threatened by Return or Earthquake (with a few exceptions like Skarmory), and if you let it get an SD off, good luck. I think you've just fought too many people using it wrong, because in the right hands, it can pretty consistently put a dent in most teams.
That seems pretty shallow when the majority of Dragon Dance sweepers also have access to Aqua Tail. Hydro Pump only 2HKOes max HP Landorus-T anyway as does Aqua Tail Dragonite / Haxorus. And both can easily afford to use Aqua Tail if Salamence suddenly can.
4 SpA Salamence Hydro Pump vs. 252 HP / 0 SpD Skarmory: 115-136 (34.4 - 40.7%) -- guaranteed 3HKO after Stealth Rock and Leftovers recovery
4 SpA Life Orb Salamence Hydro Pump vs. 252 HP / 0 SpD Skarmory: 149-177 (44.6 - 52.9%) -- 85.9% chance to 2HKO after Stealth Rock and Leftovers recovery
That's actually kind of pitiful since needing Life Orb sacrifices Lum Berry too.
You're actually missing out a big Pokemon that can stop DD Salamence without Fire Blasts's sweep - Genesect. +1 EQ from Salamence fails to OHKO Hasty Genesect unless Salamence is carrying a Life Orb.
Misisng Fire Blast also means you miss out on a lesser threat - Escavalier, too. But Ferrothorn, Scizor, and Genesect are three huge threats that Fire Blast hits.
Hahahaha, I object.
Ever heard of Dragonite?
No?
It does both better than Salamence can.
Can't disagree with this, running HP Ground just for Heatran would be far too niche and the only answer it has to Talonflame is hitting it on the switch, as Brave Bird means it needs to switch or die. HOWEVER, Volcarona doesn't even need spatk investment to potentially OHKO anything but the specially defensive bulk up set on the switch.
252+ Atk Life Orb Adaptability Crawdaunt Aqua Jet vs. 248 HP / 252 Def Volcarona: 244-291 (65.4 - 78%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Leftovers recovery
8+ SpA Volcarona Giga Drain vs. 4 HP / 0 SpD Crawdaunt: 248-294 (92.5 - 109.7%) -- 56.3% chance to OHKO
At minimum Volcarona's healing back about 33% HP from that as well, and Life Orb recoil ensures the KO in the above scenario; Choice Banded is scarier as a bad damage roll forces Volcarona out the next turn, but by the same token Flame Body can burn Crawdaunt in return and finish it off anyway. At any rate I only see Volcarona on the bad end of the matchup if it's against a Banded one, and even then it's a coinflip that can be swayed in Volc's favor with more spatk investment than I'm running.
Volcarona doesn't win against Azumarill in a neutral scenario, I will concede that. It has no business switching in after a Quiver Dance or two, is the point I was attempting to make before. Against a Volcarona that hasn't set up it's definitely a check.
Yeah, Dragonite's just a bad matchup overall. For what it's worth Dragon Claw hits harder than EQ (41 - 48.2% vs 33.7 - 39.9% at +0). As an aside it can't switch in on +2 HP Rock through stealth rock, but I'm aware of how shaky the argument of magical free setup turns and convenient hazards are.
I'm not well-versed on what Deo-S does beyond hazards, taunt, and psycho boost, so I assume you're suggesting it either revenges or prevents setup and then places rocks. Every time I've run into this matchup it's usually been in a lead situation where I bug buzz in response to the predicted taunt then finish off with fiery dance if it was sashed while they place rocks, though I will concede that no speed/spdef boosts does mean I'm usually forced out by the next 'mon. Looking at the December usage stats I'm not seeing anything more threatening it could do.
What purpose does Rotom-W have running HP Rock when both of its STABs already hit Talonflame SE? Ancientpower is really low on usage for Heatran as well (
6.771%), though we've already established Volcarona's not winning that matchup anyway.
The irony is, specially-based Goodra is one of the things that gives Volcarona the opportunity to set up in the first place, thanks to Volcarona being naturally faster and Quiver Dance boosting spdef to the point where leftovers are enough to sustain it against STAB dragon pulses. Physical Goodra destroys it though.
There's certainly threats that need to be removed before Volcarona can do its job, but overall I don't think it has as hard a time getting going as you think. Physically defensive sets let it set up on plenty of 'mons and it takes non-rock/flying hits like a champ. I'm still thinking A-/B+.
Agreeing with Colonel on Dragonite (Bulky Rain attacker seems to ring A bell), and as is Char X is perfectly able to run a mixed set with Dual 130 offenses. Do most go physical? Sure, but just cause most do doesn't mean its not viable. I'm sure I might be forgetting someone else too, but eh, the point is made.
Keldeo has mixed coverage, as Secret Sword uses its SpA, but uses the opponents defense to calculate the hit. Many of the listed counters are not often seen in OU, and for a wall breaker, it doesn't need to stay in all the time, it just needs to dish out massive damage and eventually overwhelm some counters (such as Azuramil) during the match. Its typing makes it especially easy to switch in and out as it resists stealth rock.
-1 252+ Atk Mold Breaker Haxorus Aqua Tail vs. 248 HP / 244 Def Landorus-T: 136-160 (35.6 - 41.9%) -- 86.5% chance to 3HKO after Leftovers recovery
-1 252+ Atk Life Orb Mold Breaker Haxorus Aqua Tail vs. 248 HP / 244 Def Landorus-T: 177-208 (46.4 - 54.5%) -- 6.6% chance to 2HKO after Leftovers recovery
4 SpA Salamence Hydro Pump vs. 248 HP / 4 SpD Landorus-T: 206-244 (54 - 64%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Leftovers recovery
4 SpA Life Orb Salamence Hydro Pump vs. 248 HP / 4 SpD Landorus-T: 268-317 (70.3 - 83.2%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Leftovers recovery
-1 252 Atk Life Orb Salamence Dragon Claw vs. 248 HP / 244 Def Landorus-T: 99-118 (25.9 - 30.9%) -- 8.7% chance to 4HKO after Leftovers recovery
LO Salamence defeats Lando-T with Dragon Claw + Hydro Pump, which then restores him back to +0 if Moxie. Haxorus fails to get the 2HKO even with Aqua Tail.
The thing I'm trying to say is that, the opportunity cost for Salamence to defeat Lando-T is lower than the opportunity cost incurred for any other dragon sweeper trying to defeat it.
Except any other dragon sweeper minus Charizard X cannot get past Genesect either, since it outspeeds +1 Dragonite and Garchomp.
Ferrothorn and Scizor, I give it to you, but again, other dragons minus Charizard X have the same problem. But the key point lies in Salamence's versatility in running those moves. Lando-T, Hippowdon and the likes can switch into just about any dragon with impunity, but Ferrothorn and Scizor cannot do the same for Salamence, because of the possibility of Fire Blast, considering you won't know which of the 2 it is running until you get nailed by it, which usually means it already took something down using it.
The thing about Salamence is that you won't know if it is running the mixed attacker set or DD until you scout for at least 2 special attacks considering the standard DD set runs either one of the 3 special attack as well. Charizard X and Dragonite's mixed set are way easier to tell apart from their regular DD set that it is easier to have a certain answer for them.
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Hydro Pump and Moxie is not illegal this gen, IIRC, the breeding mechanics were changed, if it wasn't able to get it last gen.
Just a minor nitpick, using Honchkrow because it is the only thing that came to my mind with equal defenses and neutrality to all 3
252 Atk Adaptability Mega Lucario Bullet Punch vs. 252 HP / 0 Def Honchkrow: 160-190 (39.6 - 47%) -- guaranteed 3HKO
252 SpA Adaptability Mega Lucario Vacuum Wave vs. 252 HP / 4 SpD Honchkrow: 156-184 (38.6 - 45.5%) -- guaranteed 3HKO
252 Atk Aerilate Mega Pinsir Quick Attack vs. 252 HP / 0 Def Honchkrow: 163-193 (40.3 - 47.7%) -- guaranteed 3HKO
That Quick Attack is stronger and also,
Not to mention that +2 Return practically 2HKOs anything that does not 4x resist it
Right, my bad on the sacred sword. Now it doesn't have to worry about getting walled by Blissey and Tyranitar. Its still got 12 pokemon that it can't even hope to get past without rain support, and while none of them are top 10 common, between the lot, there's a decent chance your opponent has a counter for Keldeo without even trying, or at least a check or two. Its a great wall breaker, as evidenced by its current A ranking, but when you compare it to other A+ pokes it doesn't match up. Charizard for instance has similar damage outputs, but only has 2 pokemon that wall its STABs, and it at least has decent coverage moves. I realize that Charizard is a set up sweeper, and not a wall breaker, and it takes that mega slot, but he's clearly in a different tier. Keldeo lost a lot between generations, and didn't get much of anything to show for it. I think it should feel lucky its still A.
Unless there's something that hasn't been discussed that I'm unaware of, this discussion is about to hit the point where we go in circles, and I would really like to avoid that. I don't think there's been enough evidence to warrant a change in Keldeo's rank, but if a moderator feels differently, I can't really say anything that I haven't already said. Happy Discussing!
I agree here on Mega Abomasnow (I have never tried WishMence tho), Ice Shard coming off 130 Atk is just amazing, the ability to spam STAB Blizzard like nothing is very very graceful, then comes the powerful Focus Blast and Energy Ball, I also have seen blizzardless Physical PuP Abomasnows that worked out pretty well (Nothing likes to take +1 Wood Hammer/Ice Shard), yes it is heavily weak to Fire, but fire types can't switch in if he packs EQ, which just destroys them, he also has access to Rock Slide which is pretty interesting. Sub 3Attacks is also very amazing, as Mega Abomasnow forces many switches. Mega Abomasnow suffers from heavy 4MSS, but is very versatile. I have seen SubSeed + Grass Whistle/Toxic to stall out the opponent, but Mega Abomasnow doesn't stop there, he further supports by breaking screens with Brick Break (While rarely carrying it, I have seen it before). That base 30 speed is very annoying though, but it's also quite amazing in TR, I only use him in TR, but Ice Shard still does a lot.
Its also worth noting that MPinsir's neutral coverage is useless even to things that resist it. Take the Rotom-W example:
+2 252 Atk Mega Pinsir Close Combat vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Rotom-W: 204-241 (67.1 - 79.2%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Stealth Rock and Leftovers recovery
Not bad damage for a full investent on a pokemon with those sta--
+2 252 Atk Aerilate Mega Pinsir Return vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Rotom-W: 169-200 (55.5 - 65.7%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Stealth Rock and Leftovers recovery
A clean 2HKO on a resisted hit shows how powerful MPinsir is, if anyone was doubting that, and due to that massive strength, great priority, I feel MPinsir deserves its spot in A+.
Also...
Dat priority tho.
WishMence'S only niche over Wish Latias is Intimidate, which does help, but otherwise the SR weakness and lack of raw bulk (so that the Wishes aren't spent more in healing yourself) is a bit of a deterent. We'll have to face the facts here: Salmence may have some perks over its fellow Dragons, but other Dragons are a tad more consistent in their roles. Notice how it is always Salamence trying to differentiate itself from other Dragons in almost any role it performs, not the other way around. Still B- in my eyes.
Abomasnow has good STABs, but its typing and speed leave quite a bit to be desired. It may be difficult to wall what with its powerful mixed offenses, but when something manages to survive its attack(s), Aboma is in trouble. Whether the opponent resisted an attack on the switch or the opponent is simply too bulky to OHKO, Aboma's 7 weaknesses, inability to recover itself effectively, and the fact it is outslowed by nearly everything if it Mega-evolves does not bode well for it. Snow Warning is nice for chip damage or weather disruption though, but its extreme hazard weakness keeps it from abusing the Hail for long. It is highly susceptible to offensive teams and too slow /weak to plow through defensive teams. Probably a C+, or B- is someone is willing to push for it.
Had to move to a computer for this:
I would agree to most of what you are saying but with the 3 weaknesses (1 being 4x weak to ice) and being weak to SR, Mence is borderline C/B and not in the upper B (after lurking in the post more and having a more solid opinion on this situation). He's going to need RS support for SR and a pokemon to wall those said 3 weaknesses, especially walling ice, despite the bulk. Stated by others, Mence's roles are outperformed by other dragons. DNite has similar weaknesses but can be replaced with bulk -waves to multiscale- and actually using the weakness to an advantage -waves to weakness policy-. Mence doesn't have either of that and has a weaker bulk compared to DNite (95/80/80 vs 91/95/100). Chomp is much faster than Mence and can perform better with a Scarf compared to Mence. MixMence is alright but it's not "OU" worthy after looking at the previous comments. .-.
That said, it doesn't mean that Salamence should be looked down upon and not be ranked! Salamence has a decent speed and power to make some dents to the pokemon, despite other dragons performing that role better (ScarfChomp or DD DNite). Mence needs support but doesn't need too much support in order to perform well in OU. That's why he is borderline C+/B- (well, that's how I feel about him). I may not have much experience nor too much of a voice since I am considered "new" but there has to be a place in the rankings for Mence because I have a feeling this will not stop. >.>
EDIT: And to just to let people know:
In a tl;dr version (because I got back from work and my brain is in "Shutdown" mode): Mence needs support but not too much support. It can perform but it needs the threats taken out.... That's why B- (at best, B. At worse, C+) sounds about right. With the proof of the counters that I've seen in previous posts, it kinda makes sense now that Mence is there. :b
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Megaboma looks to me like something more intended for trick room teams in a doubles setting than something that can carry itself one-on-one. Its speed combined with its typing really put a damper on what it can do, despite what the rest of its stats look like.
Somewhere in C sounds like a good home for it.
My favorite pokemon ever, Kingdra, looks like it's getting an analysis and hasn't been discussed, so I'll go ahead:)
"B Rank: Reserved for Pokemon who cannot sweep through or wall significant portions of the metagame, but can properly fulfill a given offensive/defensive niche. Support Pokemon in this category have flaws that prevent them from doing their job or are setup bait for dangerous sweepers. Pokemon who are partially outclassed by a Pokemon in A or S Rank, but are otherwise very dangerous, may also fall into this category."
This I think sums up Kingdra nicely. It has 3 usable sets:
- Critdra, which uses Focus Energy and Scope Lens to get a 100% crit ratio, which then works with Sniper for massive damage. As a nice bonus, Draco Meteor's Sp.Atk drops don't matter anymore, and you can fire them off over and over again. Dangerous for anyone slower than fully invested 95 speed..
- Rain Dance, which with swift swim basically acts as agility and a +1 to your water moves. You can run rain dance yourself or use a Politoed..
- DD/Waterfall/Outrage/filler, where the filler can be sub, disable, even iron head (for fairies). Typically outclassed by other physical DDers, but if you're expecting one of the other sets this could ruin your day. It also doesn't need to run coverage to beat Heatran, which is something most dragon dancers would die for.
No matter which set it runs, certain pokemon make for excellent switch ins, such as Azumarill and Ferrothorn. However, it fulfills an offensive niche with the above sets, and while it is partially outclassed by other dragons with higher stats and fire moves, it is dangerous if it is allowed 1 free turn. Kingdra should be B/B- Rank.
"B Rank: Reserved for Pokemon who cannot sweep through or wall significant portions of the metagame, but can properly fulfill a given offensive/defensive niche. Support Pokemon in this category have flaws that prevent them from doing their job or are setup bait for dangerous sweepers. Pokemon who are partially outclassed by a Pokemon in A or S Rank, but are otherwise very dangerous, may also fall into this category."
This I think sums up Kingdra nicely. It has 3 usable sets:
- Critdra, which uses Focus Energy and Scope Lens to get a 100% crit ratio, which then works with Sniper for massive damage. As a nice bonus, Draco Meteor's Sp.Atk drops don't matter anymore, and you can fire them off over and over again. Dangerous for anyone slower than fully invested 95 speed..
- Rain Dance, which with swift swim basically acts as agility and a +1 to your water moves. You can run rain dance yourself or use a Politoed..
- DD/Waterfall/Outrage/filler, where the filler can be sub, disable, even iron head (for fairies). Typically outclassed by other physical DDers, but if you're expecting one of the other sets this could ruin your day. It also doesn't need to run coverage to beat Heatran, which is something most dragon dancers would die for.
No matter which set it runs, certain pokemon make for excellent switch ins, such as Azumarill and Ferrothorn. However, it fulfills an offensive niche with the above sets, and while it is partially outclassed by other dragons with higher stats and fire moves, it is dangerous if it is allowed 1 free turn. Kingdra should be B/B- Rank.
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Um. No. Just no. Mega Abomasnow's typing is VERY mediocre. 4 Resistences compared to the 7 Weakness' it has dosen't make it worth it, especially when you consider what it's weakness's are:
x2: Flying, Fire, Poison, Rock, Bug, Steel
x4: Fire
Given how freaking common these types are in OU at the moment and how piss-slow Mega Abomasnow is I struggle to see why to use it now that Hail Stall is pretty much dead. Seriously, it's slower then CONKELDURR.
What did you want to see? Work with me, you given me absolutely nothing so far, what would make this Pokemon better?
I'm not denying WishMence cannot work (in fact most Salamence arguments are about how it is slightly outclassed, not that it is bad). Yes, it can set up better on physical Pokemon on Latias (who should work on setting up on special Pokemon anyway), but when your cleric has an SR weakness it can be notably harder to do its job, meaning Latias has the very slight edge once again. Still, Mence isn't really bad.
Aboma, on the other hand, faces direct competition from one other Pokemon: Kyurem-B. Kyurem-B has the same Water, Grass, and Electric resistance + Ice neutrality that Aboma has, has much of the same tools to threaten the stuff Aboma does (and more), and most of all, Kyurem-B has superior bulk and speed, meaning its wallbreaking abilities far exceed Aboma since it outspeeds a huge variety of walls and can actually survive shit like Scizor's Bullet Punch / Aegislash's Sacred Sword or even unboosted Genesect's Iron Head or whatever. Kyurem-B also has Roost. Mega-Aboma costs the Mega-slot on the team and cannot wield Leftovers. Sure it can reactivate Snow Warning upon Mega-evolving without needing to switch out, but unlike Tyranitar, whose Mega-form does Dragon Dance better due to higher base speed, Abomasnow trades its speed for better mixed offenses, which doesn't seem like a worthy trade when almost every wall can now outspeed you, so it doesn't wallbreak more effectively than its base form. Most offensive Pokemon can kill you dead anyway provided they aren't weak to Ice Shard.
Alright, let's come at this from a different angle; why would I want to use Mega Abomasnow over, say, Mega Venusaur? The latter is tankier, has reliable recovery in Synthesis as well as secondary recovery through Giga Drain and Leech Seed, has far less weaknesses, is nowhere near as slow, and still can (and should) go mixed with EQ. "Ice STAB and higher offensive potential" is all I'm seeing, and that comes at the cost of ice's weaknesses. Megaboma can do damage, and while it can take neutral hits nearly everything relevant is going to have some form of coverage that will make it cry.
Also, I don't really see Greninja being threatened much by it. HP Fire OHKOs, U-Turn takes off around half its health and lets something that can finish the job come in, and I'd expect every Greninja to have at least one of the two.
Let's see how these 12 Pokemon actually do against Specs Keldeo:
Dragonite: 2HKOed by Hydro Pump after Stealth Rock and 2HKOed by Icy Wind even without it
Azumarill: 252 SpA Choice Specs Keldeo Hydro Pump vs. 252 HP / 4 SpD Azumarill: 160-189 (39.6 - 46.7%) -- 34% chance to 2HKO after Stealth Rock
Slowbro: Really rare in OU, but: 252 SpA Choice Specs Keldeo Hydro Pump vs. 252 HP / 0 SpD Slowbro: 161-190 (40.8 - 48.2%) -- 8.2% chance to 2HKO after Stealth Rock and Leftovers recovery
Mega Venusaur: 252 SpA Choice Specs Keldeo Hydro Pump vs. 252 HP / 4 SpD Mega Venusaur: 114-135 (31.3 - 37%) -- 79.2% chance to 3HKO- Fair enough
Tangrowth: So rare in OU right now it's not even funny, but Assault Vest is 2HKOed by Secret Sword with a bit of prior damage and physically defensive is easily 2HKOed by Hydro Pump
Toxicroak: Absolutely awful in OU without perma-rain, so there's no need to even mention it
Celebi: 2HKOed by Specs or Ebelt HP Bug, but otherwise takes between 30 and 40%. Is currently UU.
Trevenant: Only avoids the 2HKO if it's specially defensive and/or has a sitrus berry, but it's usually specially defensive, so fair enough Latias: Fair enough
Jellicent: Fair enough, but it's currently UU
Tentacruel: Avoids getting 2HKOed, but can do nothing back except hope to burn it with Scald
Sylveon: 252 SpA Choice Specs Keldeo Hydro Pump vs. 252 HP / 0 SpD Sylveon: 214-253 (54.3 - 64.2%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Leftovers recovery (specially defensive can avoid a 2HKO if it has taken no prior damage and Stealth Rock is not up)
Only half of these Pokemon even avoid a 2HKO from Specs Keldeo without any prior damage whatsoever. Only 3 of the 6 Pokemon you mentioned that are never 2HKOed are even OU, while none of them are in the top 25 in usage and of these only Mega Venusaur is particularly good. Considering you said Keldeo "can't hope to get past any of these Pokemon without rain", I don't think you've actually investigated how well these Pokemon actually deal with Keldeo and instead just listed off a bunch of bulky Pokemon that resist one or both of its STABs.
tl;dr: One does not simply switch into Choice Specs Keldeo.
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Just felt that calc was overkeel tho, u sure want to go all out to wreck it :x
If it were to be my team, id give up man. No way all 6 of my pokes can break through that thing
Exactly because of Multiscale, Dnite needs RS even more than Salamence. Dragonite is extremely reliant on weakness policy. With multiscale broken, Intimidate makes Salamence easier to set up than Dnite can. The significant difference between Mence and other dragons is that it is the only dragon sweeper that can beat Genesect after a single turn of set-up. Garchomp is certainly not much faster than Salamence, with Lando-I and Garchomp being the only ones in the speed range. Not to mention Garchomp has no way to boost its speed. Mix mence is certainly viable especially because it is so damn hard to tell it apart from a DD one until it kills something on your team and heavily dent another, especially when it has one of the best mix attacking stats in OU with 135/110/100.
Garchomp might be a better scarfer, but you cannot consider Dnite to be a better DDer than Salamence because being better as a sweeper is highly reliant on the opponent. Haxorus may be a better sweepers against teams with Fairies; DDnite may be a better sweeper against less offensive teams; Charizard X may be a better sweeper against teams with Steels; Salamence is a better sweeper against Bulky Grounds or Balloon Tran. Haxorus is harder to wall outright; DDnite gets a easier time to set up; Charizard X has better STABS; Salamence is less predictable. Charizard does not do Haxorus's job better, nor Dragonite's nor Salamence's; Haxorus does not do Dragonite's job better, nor Charizard's, nor Salamence's, and etcetera. In this sense, neither is outclassing either of the others, so I don't see how Salamence is so mediocre to the extent of being so significantly less viable than the others it is competing against.
Mence literally needs the same threats taken out than Dnite, or practically any other DD sweeper, if not less, its just that DDnite might be better if the specific support is given. Salamence is certainly not completely eclipsed by Pokemons in the above ranks because it has the advantages as mentioned. Being completely eclipsed means that even against a team of 6 Lando-T, its competitors are still better, which is obviously not the case.
Now lets look at some of the conditions of the upper ranks and demonstrate how it fits in
It can sweep with some support, but not through it, having flaws in not getting past Fairies. It has the offensive niche of being the only DD sweeper that can bypass Landorus-T and the likes. It is partially outclassed by DDnite and Charizard X in certain areas which have been mentioned.
It pretty much fulfils everything in B, while meeting several expectations of the A rank, hence it fits somewhere in between, so around B ~ A-.
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Not to mention Hydro Pump misses 1/5 of the time, yeah.
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