I don't see how this is not perfect simulation, in a shoddy battle where there is no host we can make the host be whoever we want can't we
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Glitched Weather in English Platinum [Part 2, Clearer Video] (Update March 18, 2009)
- Thread starter EeveeTrainer
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What are you trying to accomplish here? Changing its status from a side effect to a move is futile as it is a false replication of the actual thing.
Only logical option to prevent this glitch imo is to ban Pursuit, being the only thing to cause this. Let's say that Dragon Dance is supposed to boost Atk and Spd by +1, but a game glitch gives unintentionally gives the user +6 Special Attack alongside with the boosts, with no notification. Would you ban Dragon Dance? Or would you make a new move with the +6 SA and ban it?
As long as we don't change the mechanics, then sure, absolutely we can. Your suggestion conflicts with the existing mechanics. We can't do that. "The code is the final arbiter."
Can someone PLEASE explain to me why we would ever want this glitch to be instituted into Shoddy? Please? I haven't seen a single explanation of what this brings to the metagame besides people arguing "it reflects the game" So what?! So does Missingno and level 200+ pokemon and my hacks and everything. I made them in game, and therefore can do what I want with them. Why not emulate that on shoddy too then?
We don't because they are broken. The reasoning "well you can chose to do it" is stupid. I can chose to start this glitch too. So why not allow anything else?
No, I would keep dragon dance the way it is meant to be. It's been in the game as working as +1 Speed +1 Satk. So we use it that way. Why take away a viable move because the game's creators skrewed up? Honestly, how can you see banning Puruit as the best solution to getting rid of a glitch? I have an idea. Don't implement the glitch.
We don't because they are broken. The reasoning "well you can chose to do it" is stupid. I can chose to start this glitch too. So why not allow anything else?
Jibaku said:
No, I would keep dragon dance the way it is meant to be. It's been in the game as working as +1 Speed +1 Satk. So we use it that way. Why take away a viable move because the game's creators skrewed up? Honestly, how can you see banning Puruit as the best solution to getting rid of a glitch? I have an idea. Don't implement the glitch.
So if Smogon decides that the physcial/special split was "a mistake" and "not how the game is supposed to be" then we remove that?
It's the same thing. You think Smogon makes these decision that this is in the game. Regardless of how it's "supposed to be," it is what it is. I could make a pie and say it's meant to be a cake. Is it a cake? No, it's a pie and I don't get any cake. So, this "isn't meant to be in the game." Is it? Yes. You don't have a choice on the matter.
Syberia, you play wifi. You should know that now you'll have the problem of facing this on wifi. Why should shoddy be any different?
It's the same thing. You think Smogon makes these decision that this is in the game. Regardless of how it's "supposed to be," it is what it is. I could make a pie and say it's meant to be a cake. Is it a cake? No, it's a pie and I don't get any cake. So, this "isn't meant to be in the game." Is it? Yes. You don't have a choice on the matter.
Syberia, you play wifi. You should know that now you'll have the problem of facing this on wifi. Why should shoddy be any different?
No, the moves are labeled as Physical and Special. They couldn't have possibly skrewed up every move in the game. In this case there is are steps one can take to activate a false string of coding (like... Missingno? O_O) and do something not intended. The split was intended.
If you can show me proof of this being an intended side effect, I will withdraw all statements, and support adding it. Good luck.
Also, could someone explain why instead of not implementing the glitch, we should ban a move so the glitch doesn't get implemented? I just fail to see any reasoning behind this.
Because our rules have to apply to wifi as well as Shoddy.
We can control what you bring into battle. We can't change what happens when we get there.
Also, to those who are bringing up the "Hax Formula", I would like to say to you that when you battle on Wi-fi, you already have added "win conditions" that are not counted by the game. If some uses an Evasion move, OHKO move, or breaks sleep clause on wi-fi, we would consider the person who broke the clause to have lost, despite whatever the game says. It is within our boundaries to alter what we deem as what causes someone to win. It is not within acceptable boundaries to change what happens during the battle.
Now hopefully, Nintendo will do what they did with both Super Mario 64: DS and Diamond/Pearl Japanese edition, that is fix the glitches in the later versions of the cartridge that are used. I do not doubt that this will happen. In fact, for all we know, it has been fixed on the latest cartridges that have been made in Japan.
But that is besides the point. The Point is, we can not alter the programming of what happens in the battle. But we can alter what we view as winning.
What if the creators hated Cherrim/Castform horribly? Why would they keep the glitch in the English version? What if they just couldn't remove it. In that case, why haven't they made any mention of it, unlike the not so gamebreaking Shaymin/Darkrai glitch? There are things we don't know. Some may sound horribly illogical, but there's a slight possibility that this game breaking glitch could be intentional based on the factor that it was out early and they never bothered to fix it. Don't ask me why they'd want a make a glitch to destroy competitive battling, maybe they just want to because they can.
Does Nintendo know about this glitch?
If so, is it possible if they find out about it they could release a patch on Wifi that would edit it? Because Nintendo saying "Oops, lets fix this..." would just solve this entire mess.
If so, is it possible if they find out about it they could release a patch on Wifi that would edit it? Because Nintendo saying "Oops, lets fix this..." would just solve this entire mess.
I can somewhat understand the argument that the philosophy is to emulate the game as accurately as possible, but that's somewhat destructive in this situation. Is competitive battling no longer viable because there's a glitch in the game, which clearly was unintended?
There's also no way to fairly add it, because a host must be determined and allowing one person to be a host wouldn't be competitively viable since it would now give them a distinct advantage.
Not to mention, we don't know the true mechanics of it. Some people said it isn't only on Water-types. So are we just going to program it to activate whenever he Pursuits? Because that makes a number of Pokemon completely nonviable for a team that has either a) Tyranitar with Pursuit, or b) something likely to be Pursuited.
There's also no way to fairly add it, because a host must be determined and allowing one person to be a host wouldn't be competitively viable since it would now give them a distinct advantage.
Not to mention, we don't know the true mechanics of it. Some people said it isn't only on Water-types. So are we just going to program it to activate whenever he Pursuits? Because that makes a number of Pokemon completely nonviable for a team that has either a) Tyranitar with Pursuit, or b) something likely to be Pursuited.
I forgot they did that with the glitches. (Fixing it on later cartridges) They are very likely to do that imo, so why don't we just wait for that to hopefully happen. If it doesn't we decide what to do with the glitch. If it does, we can easily say that this is the way to play, and forget about it?
Artic- I don't see why Shoddy can't serve as our un-glitched version of the cartridges then. I see why the rules should reflect both, but what's the harm of having a minorly differing ruleset for Shoddy and the cartridge if it means saving the metagame from being drastically changed because of a mistake?
Did anyone ever answer the question of wether or not Nintendo could just implement a Wi-Fi fix for this since technically we are running it through their servers? Couldn't they just spot it on Wi-Fi and be like "Nope!" and stop it from happening? Or am I completly ignorant of the way this works?
So why can't we just disagree with them and enjoy it the way we want to instead of trying to be true to the game? No one will play with the glitch on shoddy. I can't see anyone enjoying it. I mean, talk about over centralizing the metagame...
EDIT: Not the way we want to enjoy it, but the way it was meant to be played on the most recent installment of DP before the Creators flipped their nut and decided to kill everything we believe in.
Artic- I don't see why Shoddy can't serve as our un-glitched version of the cartridges then. I see why the rules should reflect both, but what's the harm of having a minorly differing ruleset for Shoddy and the cartridge if it means saving the metagame from being drastically changed because of a mistake?
Did anyone ever answer the question of wether or not Nintendo could just implement a Wi-Fi fix for this since technically we are running it through their servers? Couldn't they just spot it on Wi-Fi and be like "Nope!" and stop it from happening? Or am I completly ignorant of the way this works?
So why can't we just disagree with them and enjoy it the way we want to instead of trying to be true to the game? No one will play with the glitch on shoddy. I can't see anyone enjoying it. I mean, talk about over centralizing the metagame...
EDIT: Not the way we want to enjoy it, but the way it was meant to be played on the most recent installment of DP before the Creators flipped their nut and decided to kill everything we believe in.
I'm guessing they simply don't know about it. After all, we only knew about it a couple months ago at most, and it's still not all that terribly well-known. If Nintendo learned about it, most likely they didn't fix it because they had a deadline to keep with releasing Platinum, and other more important stuff to do.
I don't think anyone except Nintendo knows the answer to this.
Someone just needs to write to Game Freak regarding this situation. And when they do, they need to post the response they get from them here. That's the quickest way to solve the problem.
How would that "solve" the problem of whether or not to implement it into ShoddyBattle?
An online patch might be able to be made that would rid the game of the glitch, inadvertently solving the problem with shoddy by ridding us of the original problem.
Not sure if such a thing would be possible, or in all honesty if Nintendo would give a flying f***, but it might be worth a shot.
No, it was only host in the Japanese cart too. The glitch hasn't changed.
Banning pursuit is likely to have an incredibly massive effect on the metagame. Not implementing this glitch will have /no/ effect on our metagame.
This glitch favours one player over the other - one person can activate it, the other can't. We're not playing competitive pokemon either way - if we implement the glitch, it's not competitive. We may as well go for the least harmful option and just not implement it.
I'm honestly surprised Game Freak didn't fix it for the US release. They just don't care, I suppose.
This glitch favours one player over the other - one person can activate it, the other can't. We're not playing competitive pokemon either way - if we implement the glitch, it's not competitive. We may as well go for the least harmful option and just not implement it.
I'm honestly surprised Game Freak didn't fix it for the US release. They just don't care, I suppose.
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