That was PU, this is NU and golduck was outclassed in NU last gen and it is largely outclassed this gen outside of PU (might be outclassed this gen too but i dont play dun deals pu tier since I'm not really a fan of how he handles suspects, bans, and tiering).
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Metagame NP: NU (beta): Welcome to the NU Age (Combusken Banned)
- Thread starter Raseri
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I never said it was good, I said it was fun. two completly different things.
also. SCARF DURANT IS THE NEW GOD.
Qwilphish
when everything you touch turns to gold
I agree that Scarf Durant is really good. However, please don't run Hustle with it. Durant hits such a nice speed tier that it outspeeds basically everything and it sucks when a sweep comes to an end thanks to an unfortunate miss.
Personally I run X-Scissor/Iron Head/Stone Edge/Thunder Fang @ Swarm
Personally I run X-Scissor/Iron Head/Stone Edge/Thunder Fang @ Swarm
Liepard @ Black Glasses
Ability: Prankster
EVs: 252 Spd / 252 Atk / 4 SDef
Jolly Nature
- Sucker Punch
- Knock Off
- U-turn
- Encore
Hi guys, remember pivotcat? It's now even _more_ annoying because Toxic Spikes are essentially nonexistent right now and STAB Knock Off is amazing in NU due to all the good Psychic- / Ghost-type Pokemon in the tier. It also hits a really neat speed tier, which puts it above Cryogonal and Mismagius. It's especially good since there's an incredible dearth of Dark-type Pokemon in the tier (Shiftry, Pangoro, Spiritomb, Cacturne, and I guess lol Mightyena / Malamar), and the only one of those that can learn Knock Off is Shiftry.
Also Qwilphish Hustle is _the_ reason to use Durant, yes you miss 20% of the time but if you don't use it, it becomes a generic frail physical Pokemon.
Qwilphish
when everything you touch turns to gold
Normally I would agree with you 100% Tennisace, but personally I've never found the extra power from Hustle necessary for type of play that Scarf Durant gets, which is late-game / revenge killing. With these jobs I ALWAYS want the reliability that non-Hustle gives especially if Durant is the only Scarfer on my team. Durant also isn't really frail on the physical side compared to other Scarf users which allows it to live some weaker STAB hits (e.g. Feraligatr Waterfall) although yeah it can't take ANY special hits. Besides Scarf though, yes, definitely Hustle all the way.
252 Atk Hustle Durant X-Scissor vs. 252 HP / 0 Def Lanturn: 270-318 (59.4 - 70%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Leftovers recovery
252 Atk Durant X-Scissor vs. 252 HP / 0 Def Lanturn: 180-213 (39.6 - 46.9%) -- guaranteed 3HKO after Leftovers recovery
It's significantly weaker vs neutral threats without Hustle. I'm sure there are other calcs like this (Bouffalant and Carracosta are two others), but yeah you'll have to play a lot more conservatively and make absolutely sure you wear down your opponent's bulky Pokemon before cleaning up with Durant, which is taking away Durant's best quality imo (which is: come in, click move, hit shit stupidly hard).
252 Atk Durant X-Scissor vs. 252 HP / 0 Def Lanturn: 180-213 (39.6 - 46.9%) -- guaranteed 3HKO after Leftovers recovery
It's significantly weaker vs neutral threats without Hustle. I'm sure there are other calcs like this (Bouffalant and Carracosta are two others), but yeah you'll have to play a lot more conservatively and make absolutely sure you wear down your opponent's bulky Pokemon before cleaning up with Durant, which is taking away Durant's best quality imo (which is: come in, click move, hit shit stupidly hard).
Seismitoad @ Leftovers
Ability: Water Absorb
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Def / 4 SAtk
Relaxed Nature
- Scald
- Earth Power
- Stealth Rock
- Knock Off
use the FCK out of this guy. 10/10 poke. consistent in every single match, gets rocks up all the time. great doublade check, also beats boosting waters. probably my favorite SR user currently.
use him.
Everyone should also give good ol rest talk poliwrath a whirl as it is a great counter to durant and check venomoth two of the most dangerous mons in the tier. Nu has so many frogs in it.
Seismitoad @ Leftovers
Ability: Water Absorb
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Def / 4 SAtk
Relaxed Nature
- Scald
- Earth Power
- Stealth Rock
- Knock Off
use the FCK out of this guy. 10/10 poke. consistent in every single match, gets rocks up all the time. great doublade check, also beats boosting waters. probably my favorite SR user currently.
use him.
damn it i've been using this since the tier started and now people will think i'm just copying you :P
Seismitoad @ Leftovers
Ability: Water Absorb
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Def / 4 SAtk
Relaxed Nature
- Scald
- Earth Power
- Stealth Rock
- Knock Off
use the FCK out of this guy. 10/10 poke. consistent in every single match, gets rocks up all the time. great doublade check, also beats boosting waters. probably my favorite SR user currently.
use him.
but yeah, unbelievably good set. one of the best, most consistent i've ever used in any tier.
It also acts as a decent check to Archeops. I know you said that Toad works pretty similar to BW NU, and it does. The plus side is that there are even more Pokemon it can check now (Feraligatr, Barbaracle, Poliwrath, Lanturn just to name a few). <3 Froggie
I do run Hustle because of the Power, which is really nice because it lets you act like both a wallbreaker and a revenge killer. I usually have X-Scissor/Iron Head/Superpower/Thunder fang or Aerial Ace
EDIT: Also, Tennisace
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cool stuff:
Omastar @ Focus Sash
Ability: Weak Armor
EVs: 4 Def / 252 SAtk / 252 Spd
Timid Nature
- Scald
- Ice Beam
- Spikes
- Stealth Rock
usually gets up multiple layers in a match. weak armor is a cool ability since it lets it set up against stuff like cb sawk. cryo is a (BAN ME PLEASE) so just burn it or something. mantine is even worse just kill it first
Combusken @ Eviolite
Ability: Speed Boost
EVs: 252 HP / 136 Def / 120 Spd
Impish / Bold Nature
- Bulk Up
- Flare Blitz / Fire Blast
- Protect
- Baton Pass
the evs let it outspeed archeops at +2 but could probably be improved depending on what your team needs. def investment might seem weird but it lets combusken set up +2 easily on durant and doublade and grass-types which are everywhere. spdef is probably good too. fire blast is even weirder but flare blitz only does like 35% to doublade lol. every physical sweeper is a good recipitent
Omastar @ Focus Sash
Ability: Weak Armor
EVs: 4 Def / 252 SAtk / 252 Spd
Timid Nature
- Scald
- Ice Beam
- Spikes
- Stealth Rock
usually gets up multiple layers in a match. weak armor is a cool ability since it lets it set up against stuff like cb sawk. cryo is a (BAN ME PLEASE) so just burn it or something. mantine is even worse just kill it first
Combusken @ Eviolite
Ability: Speed Boost
EVs: 252 HP / 136 Def / 120 Spd
Impish / Bold Nature
- Bulk Up
- Flare Blitz / Fire Blast
- Protect
- Baton Pass
the evs let it outspeed archeops at +2 but could probably be improved depending on what your team needs. def investment might seem weird but it lets combusken set up +2 easily on durant and doublade and grass-types which are everywhere. spdef is probably good too. fire blast is even weirder but flare blitz only does like 35% to doublade lol. every physical sweeper is a good recipitent
Time to evaluate some pokemon I've used so far:
6/10. Everyone seems to not have noticed this pokemon. Two good abilities, decent bulk. Stops most fire types (especially Magmortar with volt absorb stopping Tbolt), also has volt switch, which is nice. No reliable recovery sucks though.
7/10. Clearly a good pokemon. Hard to counter, easy to check. I think Sawk shines more against defensive teams, while atm NU is rather offensive.
9/10. Amazing SR setter. I use air balloon, which works very well. It is a good answer to Archeops as well, as Sucker Punch brings it into defeatist range and Golem can take every attack Archeops throws at it except for the rare hp grass.
6/10. Good revenge killer with a scarf (+access to trick and memento), but lacks real power without LO (Modest scarf fails to OHKO 4/0 Archeops with Thunderbolt). Haven't tried Nasty Plot yet, but there's quite a lot that outspeeds it atm.
10/10. Amazing to use. So many options, good bulk, stops so many things in their tracks. Have noticed some pursuiters appearing to trap it, but still a great option for any team. 4mms sucks tho.
8/10. Good pokemon, nice speed tier and power, but the occasional miss sucks and everything carries random hp fires to deal with it. I've been using Occa Berry, but sometimes I still get OHKO'd by them, which sucks. I'll try Lum next, which should fix another problem which is status.
Im just going to note few things for youTime to evaluate some pokemon I've used so far:
6/10. Everyone seems to not have noticed this pokemon. Two good abilities, decent bulk. Stops most fire types (especially Magmortar with volt absorb stopping Tbolt), also has volt switch, which is nice. No reliable recovery sucks though.
7/10. Clearly a good pokemon. Hard to counter, easy to check. I think Sawk shines more against defensive teams, while atm NU is rather offensive.
9/10. Amazing SR setter. I use air balloon, which works very well. It is a good answer to Archeops as well, as Sucker Punch brings it into defeatist range and Golem can take every attack Archeops throws at it except for the rare hp grass.
6/10. Good revenge killer with a scarf (+access to trick and memento), but lacks real power without LO (Modest scarf fails to OHKO 4/0 Archeops with Thunderbolt). Haven't tried Nasty Plot yet, but there's quite a lot that outspeeds it atm.
10/10. Amazing to use. So many options, good bulk, stops so many things in their tracks. Have noticed some pursuiters appearing to trap it, but still a great option for any team. 4mms sucks tho.
8/10. Good pokemon, nice speed tier and power, but the occasional miss sucks and everything carries random hp fires to deal with it. I've been using Occa Berry, but sometimes I still get OHKO'd by them, which sucks. I'll try Lum next, which should fix another problem which is status.
Lanturn
Fantastic typing, Volt switch immunity,
Sawk
Might just be the hardest pokemon to swith into in the current meta. It can bypass Sturdy and Levitate with mold Breaker, making it a good Anti-lead. Choice Band Destroys just about everything, Scarf+Sturdy makes it a good revenge killer if Hazards are not up. Not to mention the fantastic coverage with options like Close combat, Knock off, Ice punch, EQ, Stone edge and even support options like Taunt! because of Sturdy it can prove very difficult to check. 9/10 fits better imo.
Golem
This guy is good, but you're overating him. He is so slow that he proves as taunt bait, it is weak to a bunch of common top treaths (like Durant, Sceptile, Sawk and Samurott) I cannot really take on Archeops if its banded:
252 Atk Choice Band Archeops Earthquake vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Golem: 208-246 (57.1 - 67.5%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
0 Atk Golem Sucker Punch vs. 0 HP / 0 Def Archeops: 96-113 (32.9 - 38.8%) -- 99.8% chance to 3HKO
Weakness policy + Rock polish is easy to take care of with most scarfers and Aqua jet destroys it (there is a good bunch of that in NU atm) 6/10 is more fitting.
Mismagius
Possibly the best special set up sweeper in the tier. Sub Nasty Plot/Calm Mind with Shadow ball and Dazzling gleam is only resisted by Pyroar, which has a fair chance of being 2HKOed if switched on SR. High speed, and only a handful of pokemon outspeeds. It also has nice special bulk. Sadly it has problems with Knock off spam and can be taken care off by Most scarfers if not behind a sub. 8.5-9/10
I agree with Xatu but it is not metagame defining enough to be 10 It also has a massive 4MMS and Psychic is a shitty defensive type with Knock off everywhere. 8/10 fits it better.
Durant
Scariest offensive pokemon in the tier imo. Fantastic STAB, massive attack with Huslte, alot of viable sets (Hone claws, Band, Scarf, SubSalac and probably more) it sits in a fantasic speed tier making it outspeed almost every non-scarf pokemon in the tier. It has a movepull full of good options, like X-Scissor, Iron head, Crunch, Thunder fang, Rock slide, Aerial ace and Superpower. Sadly Hustle is a bitch and The fragile sp.def makes it easily taken out by special attackers like Raichu (best Check to non-scarf durant). The pokemon is truly metagame defining however, and is probably worth 9.5/10.
So idk if it's been brought up yet but Meowstic-M is a cool dual screener that I've been using to success recently. Prankster is an always amazing ability that makes pretty much everything that gets it useful, and Meowstic is no exception--really consistent in nearly all the matches I had with it. Prankster TWave makes it a great panic button against scary sweepers like Shell Smashers, Durant, etc provided they don't have Lum which lets it serve as a great pseudo-revenge killer and in general the support it can provide HO is really awesome.
The set I used was:
Meowstic @ Light Clay
Ability: Prankster
EVs: 248 HP / 44 Def / 216 Spd
Timid Nature
- Reflect
- Light Screen
- Thunder Wave
- Yawn
EV spread outspeeds Adamant +2 Costa's Aqua Jet, rest in bulk. Yawn looks kind of weird but since it doesn't get U-turn(!) Yawn is a good option for shutting down bulky sweepers like Doublade and stuff. You could use an attacking move over it I guess but Meowstic is weak as fuck so it won't be doing much.
The set I used was:
Meowstic @ Light Clay
Ability: Prankster
EVs: 248 HP / 44 Def / 216 Spd
Timid Nature
- Reflect
- Light Screen
- Thunder Wave
- Yawn
EV spread outspeeds Adamant +2 Costa's Aqua Jet, rest in bulk. Yawn looks kind of weird but since it doesn't get U-turn(!) Yawn is a good option for shutting down bulky sweepers like Doublade and stuff. You could use an attacking move over it I guess but Meowstic is weak as fuck so it won't be doing much.
Whirlipede seems to have flown under everyone's radar, despite being more than capable of filling his poppa's shoes as a spiker.
Whirlipede @ Eviolite
Ability: Speed Boost
EVs: 248 HP / 252 Def / 8 SDef
Impish Nature
- Spikes/Toxic Spikes
- Endeavor
- Substitute
- Poison Jab/Toxic
Whirlipede's appeal comes from a combination of bulk, speed and damage-dealing potential that no other spiker can boast. The set listed is capable of taking most physical hits rather easily, avoiding the 3HKO from Virizion's stone edge and the 2HKO from scarf Sawk. The EVs can be tweaked to your liking to outspeed certain threats after x amount of boosts, but I find the provided set is usually bulky enough to get enough speed boosts to do the job. The idea of the set is to come in early, lay down as many spikes as you can, then sub down as low as possible to deal maximum damage with endeavor. Speed Boost ensures you'll have an easy time stacking spikes and subbing down to lower your health in front of fast opponents, while poison jab/toxic can turn one endeavor'd opponent into two if you play it right. Whirlipede can get past certain defoggers and spinners with the combination of poison and endeavor, though it has a tough time with Torkoal and Drifblim and can't do anything to Skuntank/Xatu besides endeavor so a teammate can come in and revenge it.
Still, I find Whirlipede to be very capable of doing its job in NU. Give it a try if you're looking for a well-rounded spiker.
Whirlipede @ Eviolite
Ability: Speed Boost
EVs: 248 HP / 252 Def / 8 SDef
Impish Nature
- Spikes/Toxic Spikes
- Endeavor
- Substitute
- Poison Jab/Toxic
Whirlipede's appeal comes from a combination of bulk, speed and damage-dealing potential that no other spiker can boast. The set listed is capable of taking most physical hits rather easily, avoiding the 3HKO from Virizion's stone edge and the 2HKO from scarf Sawk. The EVs can be tweaked to your liking to outspeed certain threats after x amount of boosts, but I find the provided set is usually bulky enough to get enough speed boosts to do the job. The idea of the set is to come in early, lay down as many spikes as you can, then sub down as low as possible to deal maximum damage with endeavor. Speed Boost ensures you'll have an easy time stacking spikes and subbing down to lower your health in front of fast opponents, while poison jab/toxic can turn one endeavor'd opponent into two if you play it right. Whirlipede can get past certain defoggers and spinners with the combination of poison and endeavor, though it has a tough time with Torkoal and Drifblim and can't do anything to Skuntank/Xatu besides endeavor so a teammate can come in and revenge it.
Still, I find Whirlipede to be very capable of doing its job in NU. Give it a try if you're looking for a well-rounded spiker.
First of all, these scores may not be the exact viability of the pokemon, it's just how useful I thought they were for me. That means the sets I used. My rating for Durant is based on its hone claws set, not on some kind of banded or scarf set. And of course, Durant is metagame defining, but it's not a reliable win condition when you always have the risk of missing. Add the fact that many teams I've faced are prepared for it, and I don't think it deserves a 9.5.
Xatu's 4mss is compensated by the fantastic utility it brings. It has not disappointed me once, so I think it deserved a 10.
I agree that Sawk is extremely hard to switch into, but it is really easy to check. As I said, it is a fantastic pokemon, but maybe my team is not built around it well enough, or as I said, the metagame is too offensive for it to be the best pokemon in the tier. Also, in practice, Sawk often uses Mold Breaker or is not at full hp, so Sturdy isn't something really useful imo.
I have no opinion on CM/NP Mismagius, since I have to try it first. As I said, my rating was based on the Scarf set.
Same goes for Golem, I clearly stated mine was an Air Balloon version. Choice Band Archeops is not a problem at all if you use AB. Also, I run max attack Adamant so the calc is largely irrelevant as well. In the matches I've played so far, Golem often pulled his weight.
Thank you for the feedback though :)
Vryheid
fudge jelly
Spiritomb @ Leftovers
Ability: Infiltrator
EVs: 252 HP / 72 SDef / 184 Def
Calm Nature
- Calm Mind
- Rest
- Dark Pulse
- Will-O-Wisp
An incredibly useful spinblocker, defensive check, and bulky sweeper, this bugger has been my win condition in many games. Once you've crippled the few Pokemon that can actually power through it (hard hitting fire types being the main culprit), it's borderline unstoppable. It has enough bulk to land a Willowisp on just about anything and will Calm Mind up on any special attackers that try to switch in. Common physical attackers like Sawk and Duoblade don't stand a chance against it, it wins 1v1 even against some of the devastating mixxed attackers in the tier (think Feraligatr and Shiftry) and with some Heal Bell support you can use it to shut down common sweepers over and over again.
A friend of mine and I have been trying out different NU team styles from weather to SmashPass, and so I decided to fool around with random Fire spam in Sun. This is what I came up with:
Obviously, the team isn't perfect (again, really Rock-weak), but it's been a lot of fun to use. I haven't had the chance to play a lot of matches with it, but I'm probably 10-2 or so with it thus far. It's pretty much just set up Sunny Day and attack things, keeping hazards off the field as much as possible so that Typhlosion bust things up with Eruption. Give Sun a try, it's pretty cool!
Magmortar @ Expert Belt
Ability: Vital Spirit
EVs: 4 Atk / 252 SAtk / 252 Spd
Mild Nature
- Fire Blast
- Thunderbolt
- Focus Blast
- Earthquake
One of the more unnecessary members of the team, but it does have a powerful Fire Blast in Sun, and it pounds a lot of Waters into the ground with Thunderbolt. I had HP Grass here, but I changed it to Earthquake to lure in and beat Dragalge. Otherwise, it just walls the entire team. I'll probably replace Magmortar with something else to handle stuff like Dragalge more effectively and actually take Rock moves, but its a cool Pokemon.
Pyroar @ Life Orb
Ability: Unnerve
EVs: 4 Def / 252 SAtk / 252 Spd
Timid Nature
- Sunny Day
- Solar Beam
- Fire Blast
- Hyper Voice
Pyroar is incredible. It's as strong as Charizard from BW NU while also having a fantastic Spe stat. SunnyBeam Pyroar is more of a standalone sweeper/wallbreaker, but occasionally the rest of the team can abuse its Sun. It's not like I'm missing much coverage with this set seeing as how the rest of Pyroar's usable offensive movepool pretty much consists of Dark Pulse and Hidden Power. Really cool set, pretty hard to wall, and it checks Mismagius pretty well as a bonus.
Typhlosion @ Choice Scarf
Ability: Blaze
EVs: 252 SAtk / 4 SDef / 252 Spd
Timid Nature
- Eruption
- Flamethrower
- Focus Blast
- Hidden Power [Grass]
Scarf Typhlosion is pretty deadly. Eruption is strong in neutral weather, but it becomes insane in Sun. This is probably one of the easiest and most brainless win conditions I've ever used. Half of the time, I literally just set up Sunny Day with Uxie or Shiftry and clean up in a few turns with Typhlosion's Eruption. It also smashes stupid QD moths and butterflies, whom I hate.
Uxie @ Heat Rock
Ability: Levitate
EVs: 252 HP / 4 Def / 252 SDef
Calm Nature
- Sunny Day
- Stealth Rock
- U-turn
- Thunder Wave
Once I had my random Fire-type core, I needed a reliable Sun setter. Uxie is one of the best at the job there is. It has great bulk, it's deceptively quick, it sets Sun and Stealth Rock, it has U-turn for getting teammates in safely, and it paralyzes stuff. I might run Meowstic-M here if only it could get Stealth Rock and/or U-turn. Specially defensive because...well, I don't know. I might change to physically defensive to better take hits from things like Archeops and whatnot.
Shiftry @ Heat Rock
Ability: Chlorophyll
EVs: 252 SAtk / 4 SDef / 252 Spd
Modest Nature
- Sunny Day
- SolarBeam
- Dark Pulse
- Defog
A friend of mine recommended this when I was making the team, and it's been a great team player. It sets up Sun, Defogs away hazards for fire dawg, and occasionally kills things with its insane speed and decent power. It's especially good at stopping hazards since it threatens so many hazard users with its STABs. Sometimes it feels like Shiftry is trying to do too many things at once, but it does its job well enough.
Rotom-Fan @ Leftovers
Ability: Levitate
EVs: 248 HP / 252 Def / 8 SDef
Bold Nature
- Volt Switch
- Air Slash
- Will-O-Wisp
- Pain Split
Rotom-S is sort of a filler Pokemon. I tossed it on originally to stop Flying spam, but I haven't run into much of that since. It tanks hits really well, checks a lot of stuff with its good typing and bulk, and offers a slow Volt Switch, but it also makes my team really Rock-weak. I might just replace it with Golem or Rhydon or something for Stealth Rock and replace Uxie with Meowstic-M. Not a bad Pokemon, though.
Ability: Vital Spirit
EVs: 4 Atk / 252 SAtk / 252 Spd
Mild Nature
- Fire Blast
- Thunderbolt
- Focus Blast
- Earthquake
One of the more unnecessary members of the team, but it does have a powerful Fire Blast in Sun, and it pounds a lot of Waters into the ground with Thunderbolt. I had HP Grass here, but I changed it to Earthquake to lure in and beat Dragalge. Otherwise, it just walls the entire team. I'll probably replace Magmortar with something else to handle stuff like Dragalge more effectively and actually take Rock moves, but its a cool Pokemon.
Pyroar @ Life Orb
Ability: Unnerve
EVs: 4 Def / 252 SAtk / 252 Spd
Timid Nature
- Sunny Day
- Solar Beam
- Fire Blast
- Hyper Voice
Pyroar is incredible. It's as strong as Charizard from BW NU while also having a fantastic Spe stat. SunnyBeam Pyroar is more of a standalone sweeper/wallbreaker, but occasionally the rest of the team can abuse its Sun. It's not like I'm missing much coverage with this set seeing as how the rest of Pyroar's usable offensive movepool pretty much consists of Dark Pulse and Hidden Power. Really cool set, pretty hard to wall, and it checks Mismagius pretty well as a bonus.
Typhlosion @ Choice Scarf
Ability: Blaze
EVs: 252 SAtk / 4 SDef / 252 Spd
Timid Nature
- Eruption
- Flamethrower
- Focus Blast
- Hidden Power [Grass]
Scarf Typhlosion is pretty deadly. Eruption is strong in neutral weather, but it becomes insane in Sun. This is probably one of the easiest and most brainless win conditions I've ever used. Half of the time, I literally just set up Sunny Day with Uxie or Shiftry and clean up in a few turns with Typhlosion's Eruption. It also smashes stupid QD moths and butterflies, whom I hate.
Uxie @ Heat Rock
Ability: Levitate
EVs: 252 HP / 4 Def / 252 SDef
Calm Nature
- Sunny Day
- Stealth Rock
- U-turn
- Thunder Wave
Once I had my random Fire-type core, I needed a reliable Sun setter. Uxie is one of the best at the job there is. It has great bulk, it's deceptively quick, it sets Sun and Stealth Rock, it has U-turn for getting teammates in safely, and it paralyzes stuff. I might run Meowstic-M here if only it could get Stealth Rock and/or U-turn. Specially defensive because...well, I don't know. I might change to physically defensive to better take hits from things like Archeops and whatnot.
Shiftry @ Heat Rock
Ability: Chlorophyll
EVs: 252 SAtk / 4 SDef / 252 Spd
Modest Nature
- Sunny Day
- SolarBeam
- Dark Pulse
- Defog
A friend of mine recommended this when I was making the team, and it's been a great team player. It sets up Sun, Defogs away hazards for fire dawg, and occasionally kills things with its insane speed and decent power. It's especially good at stopping hazards since it threatens so many hazard users with its STABs. Sometimes it feels like Shiftry is trying to do too many things at once, but it does its job well enough.
Rotom-Fan @ Leftovers
Ability: Levitate
EVs: 248 HP / 252 Def / 8 SDef
Bold Nature
- Volt Switch
- Air Slash
- Will-O-Wisp
- Pain Split
Rotom-S is sort of a filler Pokemon. I tossed it on originally to stop Flying spam, but I haven't run into much of that since. It tanks hits really well, checks a lot of stuff with its good typing and bulk, and offers a slow Volt Switch, but it also makes my team really Rock-weak. I might just replace it with Golem or Rhydon or something for Stealth Rock and replace Uxie with Meowstic-M. Not a bad Pokemon, though.
Obviously, the team isn't perfect (again, really Rock-weak), but it's been a lot of fun to use. I haven't had the chance to play a lot of matches with it, but I'm probably 10-2 or so with it thus far. It's pretty much just set up Sunny Day and attack things, keeping hazards off the field as much as possible so that Typhlosion bust things up with Eruption. Give Sun a try, it's pretty cool!
some cool stuff no one has mentioned yet
Flareon @ Leftovers
Ability: Flash Fire
EVs: 252 SDef / 252 HP / 4 Atk
Careful Nature
- Wish
- Protect
- Flare Blitz
- Heal Bell / Toxic
Awesome defensive pokemon with all the Fire Spam happening atm. It has a lot of special bulk and its typing gives it good resistances to grass, ice, and fire which are common offensive types and it can take neutral hits like a champ.
It has a reliable recovery move in wish which can also heal its teammates and with Toxic it can also beat stuff like Lanturn (does ~27% with scald) which is amazing imo.
Also it has FLARE BLITZ that makes Flareon hit incredibly hard for a defensive pokemon and can help your team wearing down walls like Weezing.
you can run lava plume if youare a pussy want an higher burn chance and to take less from random foul plays
Gourgeist-Super @ Leftovers
Ability: Frisk
EVs: 252 Def / 252 HP / 4 SDef
Bold Nature
- Leech Seed
- Will-O-Wisp
- Seed Bomb
- Protect / Rock Slide / Fire Blast
This thing checks or outright counters a lot of physical attackers like Rhydon, Virizion, Durant, Feraligatr, Stoutland and stuff i can't remember atm.
Moves are there to annoy the opponent. In the last slot the moves other than protect hit specific targets. Rock Slide OHKOes Fletchinder and does big domaaage to the fire types trying to switch into Will-o-Wisp and Fire Blast destroys durant because fuck that ant.
Shiftry @ Life Orb
Ability: Early Bird
EVs: 252 Spd / 252 Atk / 4 SDef
Adamant / Jolly Nature
- Knock Off
- Defog
- Sucker Punch
- Seed Bomb / Low Kick (???)
also there is this which is an amazing offensive hazards cleaner nothing to say
Flareon @ Leftovers
Ability: Flash Fire
EVs: 252 SDef / 252 HP / 4 Atk
Careful Nature
- Wish
- Protect
- Flare Blitz
- Heal Bell / Toxic
Awesome defensive pokemon with all the Fire Spam happening atm. It has a lot of special bulk and its typing gives it good resistances to grass, ice, and fire which are common offensive types and it can take neutral hits like a champ.
It has a reliable recovery move in wish which can also heal its teammates and with Toxic it can also beat stuff like Lanturn (does ~27% with scald) which is amazing imo.
Also it has FLARE BLITZ that makes Flareon hit incredibly hard for a defensive pokemon and can help your team wearing down walls like Weezing.
you can run lava plume if you
Gourgeist-Super @ Leftovers
Ability: Frisk
EVs: 252 Def / 252 HP / 4 SDef
Bold Nature
- Leech Seed
- Will-O-Wisp
- Seed Bomb
- Protect / Rock Slide / Fire Blast
This thing checks or outright counters a lot of physical attackers like Rhydon, Virizion, Durant, Feraligatr, Stoutland and stuff i can't remember atm.
Moves are there to annoy the opponent. In the last slot the moves other than protect hit specific targets. Rock Slide OHKOes Fletchinder and does big domaaage to the fire types trying to switch into Will-o-Wisp and Fire Blast destroys durant because fuck that ant.
Shiftry @ Life Orb
Ability: Early Bird
EVs: 252 Spd / 252 Atk / 4 SDef
Adamant / Jolly Nature
- Knock Off
- Defog
- Sucker Punch
- Seed Bomb / Low Kick (???)
also there is this which is an amazing offensive hazards cleaner nothing to say
Cased
Banned deucer.
A lot more people should use offensive Spiritomb. With Xatu being in the tier, it can be a cold stop to a lot of the Pokemon that set hazards in the tier. (Mainly the offensive set due to GK/Giga Drain etc) and offensive Spiritomb can get rid of Xatu very easily. As well as other annoying Psychics like Sigilyph. Even helps out a fair amount with things like Zangoose.
Spiritomb @ Blackglasses
Ability: Infiltrator
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Atk (I like to Speed Creep a fair amount to outpace Base 40 Pokemon (116 I believe?) and the annoying Doublade that might occasionally speed creep)
Adamant Nature (+Atk, -SpA)
- Sucker Punch
- Pursuit
- Shadow Sneak
- Will-O-Wisp
Infiltrator Wisp is awesome, I wonder how the tier will progress. It'll be really interesting to see the drop-downs from the first cycle of RU.
Spiritomb @ Blackglasses
Ability: Infiltrator
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Atk (I like to Speed Creep a fair amount to outpace Base 40 Pokemon (116 I believe?) and the annoying Doublade that might occasionally speed creep)
Adamant Nature (+Atk, -SpA)
- Sucker Punch
- Pursuit
- Shadow Sneak
- Will-O-Wisp
Infiltrator Wisp is awesome, I wonder how the tier will progress. It'll be really interesting to see the drop-downs from the first cycle of RU.
If you are looking to stall in NU, I can honestly say this is one of your best allies:
Gourgeist-Small @ Leftovers
Ability: Frisk
EVs: 152 HP / 116 Def / 240 Spd
Jolly Nature
- Substitute
- Leech Seed
- Will-O-Wisp
- Rock Slide
You can build your entire team around this, and it can do some serious work. Contrary to popular belief, which is 'what do SubSeeders even do / stall out?', it is more 'what can it not stall out?' in the case of Gourgeist-Small (which I will refer to as SmallGeist from now on). Sure it isn't unstoppable, but if your opponents lack the right responses and gives it a free turn it can very well near be. You get that free Substitute, and you are set to harass the shit out of your opponent; I have swung entire games around with this dude alone. It even spinblocks hazards, how cool is that shit?
The Speed investment allows SmallGeist to outrun Sigilyph, the next fastest Pokemon immune to its shenanigans, while also outspeeding Xatu. The HP and Defense investment are arranged so that SmallGeist can make 5 Substitutes (without Leech Seed recovery) while granting it the best overall physical bulk, such that Virizion's Stone Edges have only a miniscule chance of breaking its Sub. SubSeed + Wisp are standard fare for SmallGeist, and what makes it unique is that as a SubSeeder, it can annoy Grass-types with Will-O-Wisp; as a Wisp user, it can plant Leech Seed on Fire-types to give it and its teammates an easier time. My attacking move of choice is, surprisingly, unSTABed Rock Slide, but it is ridiculously perfect in covering problematic threats, such as Xatu, Sigilyph, Fire-types, Cryogonal, and Chatot.
SmallGeist does have its share of problems though, as Toxic Spikes and Sticky Web can really mess it up, and opponents such as Chatter Chatot and Infiltrator Spiritomb can target it behind its Sub, Grass-type Aromatherapy users can be really annoying (especially those that can strike back, so Vileplume > Meganium to combat SmallGeist), and of course you'll want a good Fire-type switch-in considering their ubiquity. Other benefits to SmallGeist include cleric and hazard support. That said, SmallGeist is a truly effective staller, and is one of stall's main edges over other playstyles: I'd even go to say it is the cornerstone of stall (may or may not be exaggeration).
Gourgeist-Small @ Leftovers
Ability: Frisk
EVs: 152 HP / 116 Def / 240 Spd
Jolly Nature
- Substitute
- Leech Seed
- Will-O-Wisp
- Rock Slide
You can build your entire team around this, and it can do some serious work. Contrary to popular belief, which is 'what do SubSeeders even do / stall out?', it is more 'what can it not stall out?' in the case of Gourgeist-Small (which I will refer to as SmallGeist from now on). Sure it isn't unstoppable, but if your opponents lack the right responses and gives it a free turn it can very well near be. You get that free Substitute, and you are set to harass the shit out of your opponent; I have swung entire games around with this dude alone. It even spinblocks hazards, how cool is that shit?
The Speed investment allows SmallGeist to outrun Sigilyph, the next fastest Pokemon immune to its shenanigans, while also outspeeding Xatu. The HP and Defense investment are arranged so that SmallGeist can make 5 Substitutes (without Leech Seed recovery) while granting it the best overall physical bulk, such that Virizion's Stone Edges have only a miniscule chance of breaking its Sub. SubSeed + Wisp are standard fare for SmallGeist, and what makes it unique is that as a SubSeeder, it can annoy Grass-types with Will-O-Wisp; as a Wisp user, it can plant Leech Seed on Fire-types to give it and its teammates an easier time. My attacking move of choice is, surprisingly, unSTABed Rock Slide, but it is ridiculously perfect in covering problematic threats, such as Xatu, Sigilyph, Fire-types, Cryogonal, and Chatot.
SmallGeist does have its share of problems though, as Toxic Spikes and Sticky Web can really mess it up, and opponents such as Chatter Chatot and Infiltrator Spiritomb can target it behind its Sub, Grass-type Aromatherapy users can be really annoying (especially those that can strike back, so Vileplume > Meganium to combat SmallGeist), and of course you'll want a good Fire-type switch-in considering their ubiquity. Other benefits to SmallGeist include cleric and hazard support. That said, SmallGeist is a truly effective staller, and is one of stall's main edges over other playstyles: I'd even go to say it is the cornerstone of stall (may or may not be exaggeration).
Darn, I was hoping that I was the only one using this set. :/ I used Gourgeist-Super though and surprised a Moltres user with Rock Slide while I was behind a Substitute. I do think that Super does this slightly better because of the extra attack power, but the speed on Small makes up for it I guess. This was my set.If you are looking to stall in NU, I can honestly say this is one of your best allies:
Gourgeist-Small @ Leftovers
Ability: Frisk
EVs: 152 HP / 116 Def / 240 Spd
Jolly Nature
- Substitute
- Leech Seed
- Will-O-Wisp
- Rock Slide
You can build your entire team around this, and it can do some serious work. Contrary to popular belief, which is 'what do SubSeeders even do / stall out?', it is more 'what can it not stall out?' in the case of Gourgeist-Small (which I will refer to as SmallGeist from now on). Sure it isn't unstoppable, but if your opponents lack the right responses and gives it a free turn it can very well near be. You get that free Substitute, and you are set to harass the shit out of your opponent; I have swung entire games around with this dude alone. It even spinblocks hazards, how cool is that shit?
The Speed investment allows SmallGeist to outrun Sigilyph, the next fastest Pokemon immune to its shenanigans, while also outspeeding Xatu. The HP and Defense investment are arranged so that SmallGeist can make 5 Substitutes (without Leech Seed recovery) while granting it the best overall physical bulk, such that Virizion's Stone Edges have only a miniscule chance of breaking its Sub. SubSeed + Wisp are standard fare for SmallGeist, and what makes it unique is that as a SubSeeder, it can annoy Grass-types with Will-O-Wisp; as a Wisp user, it can plant Leech Seed on Fire-types to give it and its teammates an easier time. My attacking move of choice is, surprisingly, unSTABed Rock Slide, but it is ridiculously perfect in covering problematic threats, such as Xatu, Sigilyph, Fire-types, Cryogonal, and Chatot.
SmallGeist does have its share of problems though, as Toxic Spikes and Sticky Web can really mess it up, and opponents such as Chatter Chatot and Infiltrator Spiritomb can target it behind its Sub, Grass-type Aromatherapy users can be really annoying (especially those that can strike back, so Vileplume > Meganium to combat SmallGeist), and of course you'll want a good Fire-type switch-in considering their ubiquity. Other benefits to SmallGeist include cleric and hazard support. That said, SmallGeist is a truly effective staller, and is one of stall's main edges over other playstyles: I'd even go to say it is the cornerstone of stall (may or may not be exaggeration).
Gourgeist-Super @ Leftovers
Ability: Frisk
EVs: 248 HP / 136 Atk / 124 SDef
Adamant Nature
- Will-O-Wisp
- Rock Slide
- Leech Seed
- Substitute
The EVs have a 50% chance to OHKO Moltres, but I may need to change them to something more optimal. Your post basically explains the purpose of Rock Slide on this set, so there's not much else to say.
Moltres is RU so I don't get half of what your post meant. That said, while SuperGeist has a stronger Rock Slide, SmallGeist is faster than its targets (the Psychic birds + Chatot), which is super important if you manage to catch them on the switch or just want to finish them off before they Roost. Rock Slide also has a chance to flinch, meaning SmallGeist is leagues better at using Rock Slide than SuperGeist is.
- Status