Yeah, this. It's another "50% chance to beat Imposter" set.
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Creative and Underrated Sets Balanced Hackmons Edition (NO SHITTY GIMMICKS, POSTS WILL BE DELETED)
- Thread starter Ranger Mike
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The funny thing is that most of the people i've fought on the ladder today have gone for Judgment. Your point still stands, though. It works better as a cleaner.
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My Personal Favourite Hackmons lead, the soon-to-become infamous Fuzzy Washing Machine!
Rotom-Wash @ Leftovers
Ability: Fur Coat
EVs: 252 HP / 4 SpA / 252 SpD
Calm Nature
- Stealth Rock
- Steam Eruption
- Volt Switch
- Super Fang
Fur coat allows for max investment in HP and special defense. Steam eruption is basically a more powerful scald, volt switch is volt switch, and stealth rocks for strudy shedninja. Super Fang is great for breaking walls or other bulky mons.
Rotom-Wash @ Leftovers
Ability: Fur Coat
EVs: 252 HP / 4 SpA / 252 SpD
Calm Nature
- Stealth Rock
- Steam Eruption
- Volt Switch
- Super Fang
Fur coat allows for max investment in HP and special defense. Steam eruption is basically a more powerful scald, volt switch is volt switch, and stealth rocks for strudy shedninja. Super Fang is great for breaking walls or other bulky mons.
Err, this is Balanced Hackmons, not Hackmons, and you just posted it in reg Hackmons, no need to post it here. And I'd honestly prefer Scald because a.) perfect acc and b.) more PP for a stally set. Also, I'd recommend adding recovery somewhere.
i meant to type balanced, my bad. i posted it in the wrong place before, wasn't paying attention. about steam eruption VS scald, rotom needs the more powerful move as it has no real investment in speacial attack. it isn't much of a stall, more of a helpful tank/utility.
black sludge>leftovers on venu. you know, for trick users
black sludge>leftovers on venu. you know, for trick users
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Kyogre @ Assault Vest
Ability: Regenerator
EVs: 252 HP / 176 Def / 80 SpD
Relaxed Nature
IVs: 0 Spe
- Volt Switch
- Scald
- Blue Flare
- Moonblast
A pretty nice Regenvest. Resists the common Kube and has tons of special bulk.
Ability: Regenerator
EVs: 252 HP / 176 Def / 80 SpD
Relaxed Nature
IVs: 0 Spe
- Volt Switch
- Scald
- Blue Flare
- Moonblast
A pretty nice Regenvest. Resists the common Kube and has tons of special bulk.
Yeah, you're not really taking advantage of one of the main benefits of using Regenvest, which is to use "attacks" like Nuzzle, Rapid Spin, Clear Smog, Dragon Tail, etc. Might be good to fit one or two of those in.
Welp, since the title of this is 'Creative and Underrated' sets in BH, the following Magic Bounce Giratina is old (like gen 5 BH), not used very much it still works well for me:
I got ma eyes on you (Giratina) @ Sitrus Berry
Ability: Magic Bounce
Shiny: Yes
EVs: 248 HP / 8 Def / 252 SpD
Calm Nature
- Curse
- Block
- Heal Order
- Substitute/parting shot
This hasn't liked gen 6 so much with the introduction of fairies and the ever-increasing popularity of the -ates. It's also completely taunt-bait (the mold-breaker kind), which is why i'm(crying for help) thinking of swapping block with thousand arrows so it doesn't get walled by other MBers. You could also change things around and make it a prankster mon with curse/heal order/parting shot/spore(or dark void). Is there any suggestions anyone can make for this set?
I got ma eyes on you (Giratina) @ Sitrus Berry
Ability: Magic Bounce
Shiny: Yes
EVs: 248 HP / 8 Def / 252 SpD
Calm Nature
- Curse
- Block
- Heal Order
- Substitute/parting shot
This hasn't liked gen 6 so much with the introduction of fairies and the ever-increasing popularity of the -ates. It's also completely taunt-bait (the mold-breaker kind), which is why i'm
Not to be rude, but if so many things are wrong with it, why are you using it? I really don't think this can succeed very much with the current meta being dominated by -ate spam. Also, a few other things: 1) Block is outclassed by Spider Web, which has more PP, 2) Thousand Arrows from Giratina will do absolutely nothing to other Magic Bouncers, and 3) The Prankster set you mentioned is probably better. I'd also recommend Leftovers over Sitrus Berry so it's easier to do this more than once.
i would like to contribute with a set i just came up with that actually works pretty well.
Sceptile-Mega @ Draco Plate
Ability: Lightning Rod
EVs: 4 HP / 252 SpA / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
- Electrify
- Judgment
- Giga Drain/Seed Flare
- Earth Power
this set is semi-imposter proof, resisting 2/3 moves, immunity to electrify, and hitting back with a 180 base power super effective judgement. since electrify has no priority, you need high speed to make this work, which mega sceptile has. mega alakazam and gengar were also options, but if the imposter runs a spooky plate, you are in a sudden death speed tie. basically you electrify spam, which makes all enemy attacks electric, activating your lightning rod. do until you have your sp atk at a desired level, then you start sweeping. you can run giga drain if you want some recovery, or you can opt for seed flare to get that extramiss power. earth power is for covering heatran or other steel types that will probably wall you early on. the things you need to watch out for are all -ate users, who will most likely 1hko you. prankster topsy turvy is also something to be aware of. i hope you enjoy
[edit: apparently i didnt make this set because 1 minute ago i faced a guy with the exact same thing. god dammit]
Sceptile-Mega @ Draco Plate
Ability: Lightning Rod
EVs: 4 HP / 252 SpA / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
- Electrify
- Judgment
- Giga Drain/Seed Flare
- Earth Power
this set is semi-imposter proof, resisting 2/3 moves, immunity to electrify, and hitting back with a 180 base power super effective judgement. since electrify has no priority, you need high speed to make this work, which mega sceptile has. mega alakazam and gengar were also options, but if the imposter runs a spooky plate, you are in a sudden death speed tie. basically you electrify spam, which makes all enemy attacks electric, activating your lightning rod. do until you have your sp atk at a desired level, then you start sweeping. you can run giga drain if you want some recovery, or you can opt for seed flare to get that extra
[edit: apparently i didnt make this set because 1 minute ago i faced a guy with the exact same thing. god dammit]
Kit Kasai
Love colored magic
Seems nice in theory, but being weak to all forms of -iate make it practically unusable.
Well it could be used as a late game sweeper i guess with all the -iate users gone, but there are probably better pokes for it.
Having doubts about how broken Shadow Tag is? Let me clear those right up.
Gengar-Mega @ Gengarite
Ability: Illusion
EVs: 4 Def / 252 SpA / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Oblivion Wing
- Encore
- Quiver Dance
- Substitute
Here it is, the most potent set I've used in any metagame ever. It comes out of nowhere, takes a Pokémon out of the game and leaves your opponent to deal with a Gengar with 6 Quiver Dances and a substitute. The idea is to use Illusion to bait a Normal/Fighting/otherwise non-damaging move, then mega evolve and Encore immediately before they can switch out. Set up a bit to boost your Speed and chain Encores until you're at +6 and subbed, then sweep. At this point, you're Imposter-proof, priority-proof, Prankster-proof, Boomburst-proof, special-proof, faster than everything and hitting really hard. Oblivion Wing has no immunities and keeps you healthy, but if you're a fan of dying and being walled, you can use a different attack.
Doesn't like Unaware or teams with multiple priority users. Obviously this loses if you trap the wrong Pokémon.
Gengar-Mega @ Gengarite
Ability: Illusion
EVs: 4 Def / 252 SpA / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Oblivion Wing
- Encore
- Quiver Dance
- Substitute
Here it is, the most potent set I've used in any metagame ever. It comes out of nowhere, takes a Pokémon out of the game and leaves your opponent to deal with a Gengar with 6 Quiver Dances and a substitute. The idea is to use Illusion to bait a Normal/Fighting/otherwise non-damaging move, then mega evolve and Encore immediately before they can switch out. Set up a bit to boost your Speed and chain Encores until you're at +6 and subbed, then sweep. At this point, you're Imposter-proof, priority-proof, Prankster-proof, Boomburst-proof, special-proof, faster than everything and hitting really hard. Oblivion Wing has no immunities and keeps you healthy, but if you're a fan of dying and being walled, you can use a different attack.
Doesn't like Unaware or teams with multiple priority users. Obviously this loses if you trap the wrong Pokémon.
The issue with this is that Shadow Tag doesn't take effect on the turn you mega evolve. If I see that my Secret Sword or Boomburst isn't working on, like, Kyurem-Black, I'm not staying in. And I've played long enough to guess that a Ghost-type Illusion user is Gengar. Also, you mention being Imposter-proof, but Chansey can come in, take non-STAB Oblivion Wing well, and Skill Swap Imposter through your Substitute. I think Shadow Tag Mega Gengar is great, but I don't really know about using it in an offensive role.Having doubts about how broken Shadow Tag is? Let me clear those right up.
Gengar-Mega @ Gengarite
Ability: Illusion
EVs: 4 Def / 252 SpA / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Oblivion Wing
- Encore
- Quiver Dance
- Substitute
Here it is, the most potent set I've used in any metagame ever. It comes out of nowhere, takes a Pokémon out of the game and leaves your opponent to deal with a Gengar with 6 Quiver Dances and a substitute. The idea is to use Illusion to bait a Normal/Fighting/otherwise non-damaging move, then mega evolve and Encore immediately before they can switch out. Set up a bit to boost your Speed and chain Encores until you're at +6 and subbed, then sweep. At this point, you're Imposter-proof, priority-proof, Prankster-proof, Boomburst-proof, special-proof, faster than everything and hitting really hard. Oblivion Wing has no immunities and keeps you healthy, but if you're a fan of dying and being walled, you can use a different attack.
Doesn't like Unaware or teams with multiple priority users. Obviously this loses if you trap the wrong Pokémon.
You mega evolve and Encore on the same turn as you predict the move, which prevents any chance of escape. Sorry, that wasn't really clear.
Correct, sadly.
Uh, the last part is so obvious.Having doubts about how broken Shadow Tag is? Let me clear those right up.
Gengar-Mega @ Gengarite
Ability: Illusion
EVs: 4 Def / 252 SpA / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Oblivion Wing
- Encore
- Quiver Dance
- Substitute
Here it is, the most potent set I've used in any metagame ever. It comes out of nowhere, takes a Pokémon out of the game and leaves your opponent to deal with a Gengar with 6 Quiver Dances and a substitute. The idea is to use Illusion to bait a Normal/Fighting/otherwise non-damaging move, then mega evolve and Encore immediately before they can switch out. Set up a bit to boost your Speed and chain Encores until you're at +6 and subbed, then sweep. At this point, you're Imposter-proof, priority-proof, Prankster-proof, Boomburst-proof, special-proof, faster than everything and hitting really hard. Oblivion Wing has no immunities and keeps you healthy, but if you're a fan of dying and being walled, you can use a different attack.
Doesn't like Unaware or teams with multiple priority users. Obviously this loses if you trap the wrong Pokémon.
Anyways, I think it is about time I released Mixed Mega Mewtwo X to the public. The set is:
Mewtwo-Mega-X @ Life Orb
Ability: Sheer Force
EVs: 4 Atk / 252 SpA / 252 Spe
Naive Nature
- Psychic
- Diamond Storm/Ice Beam
- Bolt Strike
- Earth Power
Mixed Mega Mewtwo X is honestly one of my older sets; I've just been too lazy to share it to be honest. I created it around when my ladder ranking in BH was beginning to drop from #69 to off the top 500. It was originally named "help me imma n00b" because I was really upset, as that ladder ranking was my pride and joy.
Enough about its history, let's get on with why this works. It works because you never see mixed Mega Mewtwo X except if it is using Contrary, which to be honest isn't that good with Imposter Chansey all over the place. Speaking of Imposter Chansey, this also has the ability of dealing with Chansey's a bit easier than most Mega Mewtwo X sets, and if it falls to it, you can more easily counter it so it doesn't become too problematic.
However, since this set is dedicated upon the element of surprise, if your opponent is prepared, it is incredibly easy to stop. Also, this is meant to be a wallbreaker, not your main attacker. It also hates -ate spam beyond all telling. However, if you can handle this by having a solution to those threats, this thing will destroy.
Yveltal @ Safety Goggles
Ability: Fur Coat
EVs: 64 Atk / 252 Def / 192 SpD
Impish Nature
- Knock Off
- Circle Throw
- Heal Order
- Play Rough
I thought of this earlier, while building my first "real" BH team. I was looking at Adrian's PH Stall Yveltal earlier, and I decided to build a physically defensive wall.
252+ Atk Life Orb Refrigerate Kyurem-B Extreme Speed vs. 0 HP / 252+ Def Fur Coat Yveltal on a critical hit: 331-391 (84.2 - 99.4%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
Just circle throw it out. :^)
252+ Atk Choice Band Mega Mewtwo X V-create vs. 0 HP / 252+ Def Fur Coat Yveltal: 240-283 (61 - 72%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
Another example of the sheer power Yveltal can withstand.
Ability: Fur Coat
EVs: 64 Atk / 252 Def / 192 SpD
Impish Nature
- Knock Off
- Circle Throw
- Heal Order
- Play Rough
I thought of this earlier, while building my first "real" BH team. I was looking at Adrian's PH Stall Yveltal earlier, and I decided to build a physically defensive wall.
252+ Atk Life Orb Refrigerate Kyurem-B Extreme Speed vs. 0 HP / 252+ Def Fur Coat Yveltal on a critical hit: 331-391 (84.2 - 99.4%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
Just circle throw it out. :^)
252+ Atk Choice Band Mega Mewtwo X V-create vs. 0 HP / 252+ Def Fur Coat Yveltal: 240-283 (61 - 72%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
Another example of the sheer power Yveltal can withstand.
252+ SpA Turboblaze Kyurem-W Ice Beam vs. 0 HP / 192 SpD Yveltal: 336-396 (85.4 - 100.7%) -- 6.3% chance to OHKO
252+ SpA Mega Mewtwo Y Draco Meteor vs. 0 HP / 192 SpD Yveltal: 267-315 (67.9 - 80.1%) -- guaranteed 2HKO (With Protean)
252+ Atk Choice Band Terrakion Stone Edge vs. 0 HP / 252+ Def Fur Coat Yveltal: 199-235 (50.6 - 59.7%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
252+ Atk Mega Mewtwo X Avalanche vs. 0 HP / 252+ Def Fur Coat Yveltal: 214-253 (54.4 - 64.3%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Stealth Rock
252+ SpA Mega Mewtwo Y Draco Meteor vs. 0 HP / 192 SpD Yveltal: 267-315 (67.9 - 80.1%) -- guaranteed 2HKO (With Protean)
252+ Atk Choice Band Terrakion Stone Edge vs. 0 HP / 252+ Def Fur Coat Yveltal: 199-235 (50.6 - 59.7%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
252+ Atk Mega Mewtwo X Avalanche vs. 0 HP / 252+ Def Fur Coat Yveltal: 214-253 (54.4 - 64.3%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Stealth Rock
What about 2HKO don't you understand? Maybe the part of which if you get 2HKOed, you can't switch in? Besides, Kyurem-B is unseen in BH. You see things like Mega Rayquaza, which can, oh I don't know, easily 2HKO your Yveltal with a combination of Fake Out and ExtremeSpeed when rocks are out.
The calcs:
252 Atk Sharp Beak Aerilate Mega-Rayquaza Fake Out vs. 0 HP / 252+ Def Yveltal: 97-115 (24.6 - 29.2%) -- 0.2% chance to 3HKO after Stealth Rock and Leftovers recovery
252 Atk Sharp Beak Aerilate Mega-Rayquaza Extreme Speed vs. 0 HP / 252+ Def Yveltal: 195-231 (49.6 - 58.7%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Stealth Rock and Leftovers recovery
This is your Yveltal. Taken down so easily by the most common threat in the metagame. Not to mention that some people use Refrigerate or Pixilate. Your Yveltal can't switch in on the most common threat in the metagame. Yet you call it a physical wall. Seriously?
Also, you also skip around the fact that the combination of Fake Out+ExtremeSpeed. If you use anything with -ate, you use Fake Out+ExtremeSpeed. If that thing gets you into the top 100 (believe me, I've done it. Not easy at all), it would be by either hax or via extreme luck. None of the mons you did calcs for are common, nor are they going to be using those sets.
Edit: Okay, there is an exception to that: Mega Mewtwo X. But it isn't going to use Avalanche. If it uses an ice type move, it'll use Icicle Crash. It'll more often run Bolt Strike though, so even that won't mean much.
Pikachuun
the entire waruda machine
Confirming that Ranger Mike runs Icicle Crash MMX.
My 6 Ray-M team was devastated and I had to switch to Physically Defensive Fur Coat from Specially defensive, so it can definitely take down 1 if it can sweep my entire team.
Edit: As for fur coat yvel, I believe Bolt Strike is the superior option. If you run Icicle Crash you barely get the 2hko with rocks (head-calc, correct if wrong)
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This requires getting a safe switch in. And Gengar is pretty frail, so if you mis-predict and take anything else, you probably lost Gengar. Also, I don't know about other players, but for myself, when in doubt, I tend to go for Knock Off, U-Turn, or Volt Switch. Not saying it's useless, but I don't think it's really the most potent thing out there. Especially since you're completely open to a Unaware/Prankster Heart Swap + Baton Pass counter sweep.
Wrong. This is his Yveltal.
252+ Atk Sharp Beak Aerilate Rayquaza Extreme Speed vs. 0 HP / 252+ Def Fur Coat Yveltal: 106-126 (26.9 - 32%) -- guaranteed 4HKO
252+ Atk Choice Band Aerilate Rayquaza Extreme Speed vs. 0 HP / 252+ Def Fur Coat Yveltal: 133-157 (33.8 - 39.9%) -- guaranteed 3HKO
+6 252+ Atk Aerilate Rayquaza Extreme Speed vs. 0 HP / 252+ Def Fur Coat Yveltal: 354-417 (90 - 106.1%) -- 37.5% chance to OHKO
Not to be rude, but, if you're going to blast someone's set as useless, at least make sure you're running the correct calculations first and not missing anything obvious like, say, the ability.
Oops yeah forgot Fur Coat. But yeah, I did talk with someone who did use that set, i.e. Adrian Marin, and he said it was flawed. That is saying a lot. Just let that sink in.
Also due to Fur Coat it would hate to be against a certain ability called "Mold Breaker." This means that almost anything with Mold Breaker and the appropriate attack stops it cold.
One last thing: You failed to combat any other arguments. His Yveltal can easily be stopped via Kyu-B. I also said that some people, although few, may use Refrigerate or Pixilate Mega Rayquaza. To be honest, if you are going to argue with someone, at least touch on everything you can about that persons argument. It can easily stop your argument from going through the roof.
Like you, I hope I don't seem to rude. You were right to tell me about my error. I did make that error. I apologize for that error. I hope you forgive me for saying too much negative.
Also, about that set, I also feel uncomfortable seeing it without HP investment. I can't stand seeing a wall without HP investment. Also, as Adrian said, you don't have physical or special walls in BH, you have dedicated counters. That last point doesn't matter that much, but hey, it is always nice to know that. I forget that at times, and I am a real stall boner.
I wasn't really defending the set, just correcting the calculations, hence why I didn't argue beyond that. Looking at it again, it seems like one of those "nice on paper" sets, but it's weak to a lot of physical attacking types, namely Electric, Rock, Fairy, and Ice, and only neutral to the others, Fire, Fighting, Normal, 1k Arrows, Bug, Steel, occasionally Dragon, and Gyrados. Resists Dark, but even Giratina, Cress, and Lugia can take repeated Knock Offs after they've lost their item. So yeah, not really a set I'd defend beyond incorrect calcs.
Yeah, so true. I knew I shouldn't have wasted breathe like that....
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