Gen VII: Pokémon Sun and Moon (New info Post #5834)

[peaswar]

Has anyone tried darkening the pics from the corocoro april issue to try to get the lines under the whited out part?

Unrelated to the previous post, please forgive me for posting twice in a row, but DOes anyone else hope that sun and moon are the last games?

posts merged - CRoll

 

[Lady Vader]

Unrelated to the previous post, please forgive me for posting twice in a row, but DOes anyone else hope that sun and moon are the last games?

Why would we? That would mean the death of the franchise that we love.

 

[JES]

Something can actually be perceived from 'Solgaleo'. 'Sol' obviously being 'solar' for the sun, and 'leo' obviously being 'lion'. It's not much at all, but it does give a vague idea as to the aesthetics of the sun legendary.

That would actually be pretty cool. I can picture it now: a lion with a big mane made out of fire and coronal emissions, and wings of fire (because let's face it, Palkia wouldn't be anywhere near as cool without those wings, nor Dialga without that spoiler I mistook for a pair of wings for so long, but that's besides the point...)!

And this time, it's not going to be a pushover like Pyroar, or just decent like Luxray. It's going to be big, it's going to be bulky, and it's gonna tear and burn some $*** apart!

 

[Kurona]

Why would we? That would mean the death of the franchise that we love.

There are many legitimate reasons.
One of them being that the develops would be much more inclined to adopt a "this is the last game in the franchise, let's go all out and make this the best we possibly can" attitude rather than "alright, let's make another one." Such an attitude has been used by Sakurai to create all the Super Smash Bros games, and was used in the creation of Fire Emblem Awakening because the development team legitimately did think it was their last one - and as a result it turned out to be the best selling game in the franchise to the point of the series getting renewed.
To give a much more cynical reason, Game Freak does the exact same thing every gen so it'd be nice if this was the last time we had to spend money on the exact same thing.

Not necessarily opinions I embody - though while I was typing the former it does incline me towards the idea - but just possibilities.

 

[HelenTheHero]

I just realized something that further points to the two main legendaries being a lion and a horse.


So, classically lions and unicorns were enemies. I'm quoting this article here when it says;

biggish

In Western unicorn lore, the Lion and the Unicorn have traditionally been considered rivals and natural enemies destined to fight. But in all of the tales of this rivalry, there is no suggestion that they represent good and evil. At best they are complimentary, at worst they are incompatible. At times both have been called the lord of all beasts, but their styles of sovereignty are totally different. The extrovert and the introvert, one fiery and one cool, they represent opposite principles which are fine in and of them so long as they are not in competition.

There is a tale common throughout the ancient Middle East which tells how the Lion and the Unicorn chased each other across the heavens at the dawn of time. For fourteen years the Lion chased after the Unicorn through the stars, but it pulled away and circled round. Then for the next fourteen years it was the Unicorn who chased the Lion, slowly but steadily gaining, closing the distance between them with its horn growing ever more sharp and deadly. In despair the Lion came to earth and plunged into a forest with the Unicorn close behind, its horn lowered for the kill. Suddenly an enormous tree stood in their path. The Unicorn, seeing the danger too late, charged straight on and buried its horn to the hilt in the tree's trunk. While the Unicorn was thus pinned, the Lion crept up from behind and devoured him.

Along with the above, the lion is a major part of, you guessed it, astrology. There's constellations, a sign, etc. The unicorn is sometimes the moon.

This, at least to me, points to the two legendaries being a lion and a unicorn. It fits perfectly as they oppose and compliment each other, both have real world mythology which involves them both, and the creatures work well in the Pokemon universe. A Pokemon design could work well, the lion could easily have a fire mane as JES said, and I wouldn't oppose a unicorn constellation Pokemon.

 

[Lady Vader]

There are many legitimate reasons.
One of them being that the develops would be much more inclined to adopt a "this is the last game in the franchise, let's go all out and make this the best we possibly can" attitude rather than "alright, let's make another one." Such an attitude has been used by Sakurai to create all the Super Smash Bros games, and was used in the creation of Fire Emblem Awakening because the development team legitimately did think it was their last one - and as a result it turned out to be the best selling game in the franchise to the point of the series getting renewed.
To give a much more cynical reason, Game Freak does the exact same thing every gen so it'd be nice if this was the last time we had to spend money on the exact same thing.

Not necessarily opinions I embody - though while I was typing the former it does incline me towards the idea - but just possibilities.

I don't mind the creative mindset of it (it is similar to the idea of "Live every day as if it would be your last"), but not as a literal idea.

I just realized something that further points to the two main legendaries being a lion and a horse.


So, classically lions and unicorns were enemies. I'm quoting this article here when it says;

biggish

In Western unicorn lore, the Lion and the Unicorn have traditionally been considered rivals and natural enemies destined to fight. But in all of the tales of this rivalry, there is no suggestion that they represent good and evil. At best they are complimentary, at worst they are incompatible. At times both have been called the lord of all beasts, but their styles of sovereignty are totally different. The extrovert and the introvert, one fiery and one cool, they represent opposite principles which are fine in and of them so long as they are not in competition.

There is a tale common throughout the ancient Middle East which tells how the Lion and the Unicorn chased each other across the heavens at the dawn of time. For fourteen years the Lion chased after the Unicorn through the stars, but it pulled away and circled round. Then for the next fourteen years it was the Unicorn who chased the Lion, slowly but steadily gaining, closing the distance between them with its horn growing ever more sharp and deadly. In despair the Lion came to earth and plunged into a forest with the Unicorn close behind, its horn lowered for the kill. Suddenly an enormous tree stood in their path. The Unicorn, seeing the danger too late, charged straight on and buried its horn to the hilt in the tree's trunk. While the Unicorn was thus pinned, the Lion crept up from behind and devoured him.

Along with the above, the lion is a major part of, you guessed it, astrology. There's constellations, a sign, etc. The unicorn is sometimes the moon.

This, at least to me, points to the two legendaries being a lion and a unicorn. It fits perfectly as they oppose and compliment each other, both have real world mythology which involves them both, and the creatures work well in the Pokemon universe. A Pokemon design could work well, the lion could easily have a fire mane as JES said, and I wouldn't oppose a unicorn constellation Pokemon.

I would absolutely love a lion and unicorn as it would be nice to have non-Draconic and non-winged (or pseudo-winged in the case of Kyogre) mascots for the both paired versions.

 

[JES]

On another topic, while I digest the notion above (last game? I don't think Nintendo would be too excited about the notion, unless they are willing to move onto other ways to milk their cash Miltank): anyone else hoping that maybe Marshadow could be that Megalodon Pokémon I've been wanting for a long time? I mean, think of it: a Water/Dark type seems obvious. And there are few phantoms of the sea more terrifying that the Megalodon, who is said to still stalk the seas to this day, not extinct like science accepts. That, or a Giant Squid could be cool. Either would be consider the "Last Shadow" of the sea, since there is nothing above the food chain when it comes to the Megalodon, while only Sperm Whales attempt to eat the Giant Squid (and not without lasting scars, testaments to these fights between these mighty beasts of the sea).

 

[ssjjynx]

There are many legitimate reasons.
One of them being that the develops would be much more inclined to adopt a "this is the last game in the franchise, let's go all out and make this the best we possibly can" attitude rather than "alright, let's make another one." Such an attitude has been used by Sakurai to create all the Super Smash Bros games, and was used in the creation of Fire Emblem Awakening because the development team legitimately did think it was their last one - and as a result it turned out to be the best selling game in the franchise to the point of the series getting renewed.
To give a much more cynical reason, Game Freak does the exact same thing every gen so it'd be nice if this was the last time we had to spend money on the exact same thing.

Not necessarily opinions I embody - though while I was typing the former it does incline me towards the idea - but just possibilities.

Not to mention that after creating 721 pokemon, there's only so many more original ideas you can have in terms of design, names, gimmicks, and so on until every new mon is stale and repetitive. I doubt game freak will continue pokemon until it reaches that point, and instead end it on a high note - whenever that may be. A lot of people when talking about the future of the franchise say 'in 10 years this will happen' or '15 years down the line we'll get unova remakes'. As much as I'd love pokemon to be an immortal game, I'd honestly be pleasantly surprised if it had more than 5 years left in it.

 

[Kurona]

Well realistically I don't think Pokémon will end any time soon. The problems you've mentioned are legitimate but since it's a ridiculously effective moneymaker they'd look into other methods; at worst a reboot before ending the series altogether.

 

[sadoldpoygon22]

I bet Solrock and Lunatone will get Mega Evolutions, and most Pokemon such as Deoxys, Metagross and Clefairy will get an explaination as to their origins aside from "they're from space".

 

[Karxrida]

I bet Solrock and Lunatone will get Mega Evolutions, and most Pokemon such as Deoxys, Metagross and Clefairy will get an explaination as to their origins aside from "they're from space".

Giving Solrock and Lunatone Megas would be too obvious, plus they suck so bad that Megas probably wouldn't help them be usable. Probably.

Deoxys is space bacteria (which is a thing in real life, I think?) that was brought to life thanks to the magic of space lasers. Or something.

 

[Pikachu315111]

Not to mention that after creating 721 pokemon, there's only so many more original ideas you can have in terms of design, names, gimmicks, and so on until every new mon is stale and repetitive. I doubt game freak will continue pokemon until it reaches that point, and instead end it on a high note - whenever that may be. A lot of people when talking about the future of the franchise say 'in 10 years this will happen' or '15 years down the line we'll get unova remakes'. As much as I'd love pokemon to be an immortal game, I'd honestly be pleasantly surprised if it had more than 5 years left in it.

As for original ideas, I think there's plenty original ideas left.

But going further with your point, what would be the "end" of Pokemon? How many Pokemon would that be? How many types would there be? Would all type combinations be done by that point? It's a tough question, especially for a Pokemon fan. As you said its better to end on a high note than keep going but I think as long as the games keep selling that time isn't close (though with the way GF keeps teasing up they might). I'd also think the creators would try to do something to revitalize the franchise before that point as well, infact one could say them jumping to 3D, adding Fairy-type, and introducing Mega Evolutions was one of those attempts.

But there is one major problem that is keeping Pokemon from being able to continue indefinitely like Mario or Legend of Zelda: number of Pokemon. Mario and Legend of Zelda has the same characters but just placed in different settings and introducing characters specific to the game. But Pokemon's main draw is the Pokemon and so they just can't leave any Pokemon out as there's the adage of "every Pokemon is someone's favorite Pokemon". Also with technology improving every generation, including storage space, they so far have been able to keep every Pokemon while adding new ones. However, as we skip our way to 1,000, I do think if they want the franchise to continue major changes need to be done not only to Pokemon but also the philosophy behind the concept. I can go on and on with ideas on how I would do it, but already this post is long so I'll just give the main point of them and let you make your own opinion:

Saving Pokemon

1. Get rid of the need to complete the National Dex. Only have it so you need to complete the Regional Dex, than when you get the National Dex it just shows all the Pokemon from the start. There can be a mark if you own that Pokemon, but its just to let you know you have that Pokemon and isn't a permanent fixture.
2. A culling and/or fusing of Pokemon. Yes, every Pokemon is someone's favorite but you can't make an omelette without breaking a few eggs. Also this is just a discussion point about stirring up the status quo. While I would argue against getting rid of any evolution family, maybe combining them and/or getting rid of certain members would help ease the mass amount of Pokemon.
3. With so many Pokemon, do we really need all of them in one game? Maybe if the numbers start getting big its time to exclude certain Pokemon, in other words have no National Dex. This would upset a lot of players, especially when they're favorite Pokemon are left out, but for each game they would constantly keep swapping out which old Pokemon would appear so it's not a permanent thing and when your favorite Pokemon that as absent from a previous game does make a reappearance it might give them a sort of new feeling again (plus they would be better able to improve on a select group of Pokemon instead of them all). This would also let the new Pokemon stand out and even give third versions a reason to exist as they can boast about having a bigger Regional Dex thus bringing back old Pokemon.
4. Finally, just release the MMORPG everyone wants. Maybe using it in conjunction with the 3rd option, while the main series games focus on adding new Pokemon, mechanics, and story have a MMORPG which does include all the Pokemon but ultimately what goes on in the world is left up to the players. Like of course they'll have events and challenges within the game, it would have to compete with games like WoW and FFXIV, but it'll mainly focus on the social aspects of Pokemon and the Pokemon themselves rather than the setting that you're in.

Thinking about it, it's not that Pokemon is limited in ideas, but that its creators are purposely keeping it from expanding out to new possibilities. Well, in the past, with Pokemon GO maybe that MMO idea isn't too far off plus more and more they've been experimenting with what kind of games Pokemon can fit in (and unsurprisingly, they're pretty adaptable into many genres (when implemented right)). And of course you don't want it expanding too fast it thins itself out or becomes out of control, but maybe it's time to let it branch out and see what it does.

I bet Solrock and Lunatone will get Mega Evolutions, and most Pokemon such as Deoxys, Metagross and Clefairy will get an explaination as to their origins aside from "they're from space".

Mega Solrock & Lunatone: Yes. I don't see why not. Heck, maybe even have the Mega Evos relate (but still be their own thing) to the mascots (like having the same signature Ability which majorly buffs them).

Space Origins: I think "from space" is all the origin we're getting on most of the space Pokemon unless we actually start exploring outer space.

 

[Antihaxxer]

Giving Solrock and Lunatone Megas would be too obvious, plus they suck so bad that Megas probably wouldn't help them be usable. Probably..

Say that to Mawile, Kanghaskan or Blaziken for example

 

[Codraroll]

Oh, not the "these games will be the last ever" crud again. I've seen it pop up in every generation since Gen III.

Listen, Pokémon is one ridiculous cash cow. An unparallelled golden goose. It sells games by the million, plushies by the boatload, the championships keep drawing more attention every year, and has a very big and very active fanbase online, which serve as nearly-free marketing. The franchise is also a major "hardware seller", that is, people will buy Nintendo's hardware just to play the Pokémon games on it.

Stopping now would be a tremendously stupid business decision. The people in charge would rather have the golden goose laying eggs for a long, long time than slay it. That means that even if the game designers begin to struggle with the quality, they're not the ones who can decide whether to continue or not. The higher-ups will keep ordering Pokémon games until the franchise is no longer profitable. Knowing some video game franchises (Sonic the Hedgehog in particular), that won't happen for a long, long time.

 

[Gokuzbu]

If there ever was a culling of Pokémon hopefully babies would be the first to go. Pichu is extremely cute and all but it is essentially worthless, and just there to show off the breeding mechanics in gen 2 (which everybody knows by now)

 

[Darth Manaphy]

The sheer size of this community by itself is enough to prove that Pokemon will not be dead anytime soon. I can see, if Pokemon was losing popularity left and right and had only a pittance of fans left, then we might see the last of the Pokemons - or at least a game that tries to be a last hurrah. Then, of course it will sell well and Pokemon will continue plopping out games. (Just like Fire Emblem with Awakening)

 

[LightningLord2]

Marvel and DC also have massive rosters, settings and alternate timelines, alternate dimensions and are, most notably, way older than Pokémon, but their comic series still keep going just fine. I'm not just saying that S&M won't be the last games, but also that we're very far from an ending point in the series.

 

[Pyritie]

If there ever was a culling of Pokémon hopefully babies would be the first to go. Pichu is extremely cute and all but it is essentially worthless, and just there to show off the breeding mechanics in gen 2 (which everybody knows by now)

I don't think they would ever cull any pokemon, but I wouldn't be surprised if they cleaned up the list of moves. There's a lot of terrible moves that I don't think anyone would miss if they were removed.

 

[EJ190]

Why are these new trademarks getting the attention now? Did GF buy them from that dude or was it discovered, but why now and how are people sure it's the names of the Cover legends?

 

[Codraroll]

Why are these new trademarks getting the attention now? Did GF buy them from that dude or was it discovered, but why now and how are people sure it's the names of the Cover legends?

To my knowledge, they weren't found until now. They were only made public by a Twitter bot announcing the registration of possibly hundreds of trademarks per week, whose company had very little connection to Nintendo or Game Freak. There must have been some fan who stumbled across it and decided to take a closer look. As for why we think they are cover legends, the names appear to be made to work in a variety of languages, which is the usual style for legendaries. The names also reflect on Sol (sun) and Luna (moon). It's not confirmation, but the clues all point in the same direction.

 

[Lady Vader]

I don't think they would ever cull any pokemon, but I wouldn't be surprised if they cleaned up the list of moves. There's a lot of terrible moves that I don't think anyone would miss if they were removed.

Or at least moves that are the same thing and even thematically don't make sense.

 

[JES]

The franchise is also a major "hardware seller", that is, people will buy Nintendo's hardware just to play the Pokémon games on it.

Guilty as charged.

 

[3heartschall]

I expect that Nintendo introduce new contents in pokemon via DLC, in pokemon Sun and Moon.

What I've looked at some posts was the insatisfation with pokemon series cause the "same role story", "the evil team chasing the legendaries", "the gym after gym pathway". I don't think Nintendo will change the formula of Pokemon series (like they almost did at Pokemon Colosseum/XD) or do the MMORPG (like they promised to do with Zelda WiiU). They could add new contents once a month or periodically; a new pokemon, a new ability for and old' mon, new region or island or even a new side-story!

Everytime you beat the pokemon league there are some contents, like the Battle Tower, frontier, or Delta Episode. But those are minors and with a couple hours you can finish it. After that, you get stuck with breeding, shiny hunt, battle spot. The metagame will always have the same threats, the same pokemon roles. It gets predictable (Yes, IT DOES, the rank S and A of any metagame will be the almost the same until the next generation).

Now imagine this situation: You are like at 6th Gym and then (POW!) nintendo introduces a new pokemon to be found in the wild and no one was knowing it. The expected reaction from most players is: stop the common story and let's hunt that new pokemon! I would do that, of course. Then the smogon community will start to discuss the potential roles of this new pokemon, to OU? to VGC? to UU? defensive, offense? Mixed? Nintendo then, would accomplish what they wanted: using the same pokemon formula, but taking it attention because of the introduction of new contents (the introduction of Volcanion, Hoopa and Diance are examples of this). Now, imagine the potential with a new city, or a new side-story? It would make the game more versatile, flexible. Not the same tedious path.

Of course, I'm not taking account if all this will have a price. Nintendo could estipulate a price the new region dlc, with a couple dollars. 0,99$ for the new pokemon? I don't know. Or even this is possible (laughs). Otherwise, I would be very happy. It will make the game more playable in a lively mood.

 

[EsurioXY]

I'm not for this whole, incremental game business. (well actually I am but that was a concept for my mobile/pokemon-esque game :) )

But honestly, I think the target audience of Pokémon does it well to release in iterations. That new group of young children always are getting a fresh, but straight forward, experience. Introducing a pokemon mid generation seems like an Event thing, and definitely they should have more 'side-quest' events than what the normal mystery gift is. Idk. I think you guys are just anxious for something new. We'll get it and it really wont take that long.

 

[Codraroll]

My stance on "DLC Pokémon" at the moment is just about the same as it was when Gen VI was new. They'll go all out on it, or keep the current model (moves/'mons coded in, but unavailable). Since they're limited to the same hardware solutions as they were for Gen VI, my guess is that they'll pre-pack all the content for this generation too. It's easier logistically to have everything coded in and ready at release, then distributing their unlock keys, than to patch in new models, textures and animations from scratch every time they release an event 'mon - at least for the moment. Come the next console generation, maybe they will do things differently, and manage to keep us in the dark about the existence of event Pokémon until the time is ready to distribute them.

As for charging money for event Pokémon, that doesn't sound plausible. Players hack in stuff all the time, and it'd be a matter of days at the most before everybody could find the new 'mons for free at the GTS. Doing it some other way would raise compatibility issues between the players who paid and the ones that didn't. Entirely new DLC areas, maybe, but it goes against what we've heard them say about the main series games so far. Besides, Game Freak would rather sell us an entirely new adventure than extending our previous one. The progressing story part of the game is what provides the best experience after all, and it might as well be better to start anew than sweeping through new content with your postgame-trained teams of lvl. 100 Pokémon. As such, they rather sell us "third versions" for the price of a full game, than updating the base games for pocket change. That's been the model since Crystal.