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Dugtrio @ Focus Sash
Trait: Arena Trap
EVs: 4 HP / 252 Atk / 252 Spd
Jolly Nature
- Earthquake
- Stone Edge
- Reversal
- Memento
I didn't see any rainstall so I went for it. It's quite classic but with a few perks. Dugtrio serves as my electric immunity and trapper against Sun, also works against tyrannitar. Memento is a nice perk against setup sweepers i couldn't handle.
Gyarados walls an impressive number of things. Even though it is the defensive version, it still walls keldeo or lando-I.
I'm not entirely conviced on gyroball+volt switch on forry. Maybe toxic instead of volt-switch and thunder wave on chansey?
Toxicroak is fantastic behind a sub and fighting/ice coverage is just great.
I prefer chansey over blissey but that's just me. If it wasn't a rain team, flamethrower blissey could have been nice.
Standard toe is standard.
I see two big threat for my team and those are defensive. Skarmory and Ferro. I can wall them but not kill them. I guess I can still PP stall but one mistake and the enemy might take the upper hand.
I think that overall and with good prediction, this team can take a number of threats head on.
I like this a lot, it looks like it'd handle most offensive teams comfortably. Really the only thing I'd be worried about is Jellicent, which seems to really do a number on your team with its stallbreaking set (and is even worse when paired with Ferro / Skarm, because there's really no way you can break through if they have a solid Toxicroak counter). Since you can't change any Pokémon, maybe think about a bulky Taunt set without RestTalk on Gyarados to limit set up opportunities? Even 252 HP / 252 SAtk SpecsToed might be an idea, since Gyarados already covers the physically defensive water niche for you, just to give you another potential way of breaking through defensive teams.
This is a cool team, but there are a few things that seem rather annoying. Stall in general is just problematic due to the fact you lack an actual stallbreaker.. relying on Thundurus-T isn't the best bet since good stall carries Amoonguss, Latias, Gastrodon, etc. Your Breloom set is redundant with Thundurus-T as well. The point of using Bulk Up Breloom is to check Calm Mind + Water Pulse Jirachi and VoltTurn simultaneously which is why it was so good in BW1. You have two Scizor counters and Thundurus-T for Calm Mind Jirachi, so it isn't needed. You're essentially just using a redundant set for no reason.. Making Breloom a SubPunch set or a Bulky Technician set would help against stall in general and it is much more threatening. The lack of Spikes on Forretress is upsetting as well since the passive damage helps you break through stall cores with smart double switching and spin prevention. Spikes > Stealth Rock on Forretress and Stealth Rock > Protect on Jirachi is really your best shot. For the Gyarados EV's, 88 HP / 168 Atk / 252 Spe is really the best spread. Your Substitute will live a Jirachi Body Slam. SpDef Jirachi with Body Slam is a HUGE nuisance for your team since your primary check is Thundurus-T, so this is very important. Lastly, your team lacks an answer to Sun which I personally cannot fix without adding more problems. It's just the way the team was built. The best suggestion I have is to use Thunderbolt on Thundurus-T so you can still hit stuff in Sun, but that isn't solving the problem of Venusaur straight up 6-0'ing you.. Using Body Slam on Jirachi would give you some leeway vs Venusaur and Sun in general too, but you're still weak as fuck to it. Anyways, this team caught my eye so I just wanted to help you out since you said you're in a slump, Lavos x)
If any other teams intrigue me, I'll talk about them too.
I like this a lot, it looks like it'd handle most offensive teams comfortably. Really the only thing I'd be worried about is Jellicent, which seems to really do a number on your team with its stallbreaking set (and is even worse when paired with Ferro / Skarm, because there's really no way you can break through if they have a solid Toxicroak counter). Since you can't change any Pokémon, maybe think about a bulky Taunt set without RestTalk on Gyarados to limit set up opportunities? Even 252 HP / 252 SAtk SpecsToed might be an idea, since Gyarados already covers the physically defensive water niche for you, just to give you another potential way of breaking through defensive teams.
I agree with you, this team gave me so many dilemmas.
I'd love to use wish on chansey but then I'll have to run protect. I should help forry right? Actually forcing me to run SR on Foretress will probably overburden it. Spinning, SR, Spiking, dragon absorbing (even though chansey can wall all special dragons barring hydreigon -that one require heavy prediction or low rolls).
I'd like some insight on that.
Changing the Gyarados set would leave me open to dangerous things like breloom (all his sets can be handled right now bar some 5 hit shennanigans). However I can still convinced if you show me that the pros outweight the cons.
I'll need to think about this, for now the plan is to PP stall it with toxicroak behind a sub.
About Ferro, I guess toxicrak should do fine. Skarm on the other hand... I'll have to keep phasing it or it will whittle my team down just by spamming whirlwind.
(M) @ Leftovers
Trait: Intimidate
EVs: 108 HP / 252 Atk / 148 Spd
Jolly Nature (+Spd, -SAtk)
- U-turn
- Earthquake
- Smack Down
- Stealth Rock
@ Choice Scarf
Trait: Serene Grace
EVs: 4 HP / 252 Atk / 252 Spd
Jolly Nature (+Spd, -SAtk)
- U-turn
- Iron Head
- Ice Punch
- Healing wish / Zen Headbutt
So, the team is based around Subgyarados sweeping, i asked myself "what would be the best way of using gyarados ?" I immediatly thoughr of Rainteam, boosting his stabb waterfall to an awesome amount, and granting him a x4 resistance against fire moves that can save his substitutes.
since it's for a competition, i tried to use some gimmicky sets because i don't want to have everybody's team. I'm gonna explain mons after mons, i don't want the team's explanation to be messy lol.
is the obvious spinner, he is very important for the team since it's a rain, and it's very weak to the entry hazards that ferrothorn can use. Gyarados's set-up (you'll see later) can cause a lot of switches so spikes / SR will help a lot of taking out his counters, hp ice is to take out nite / landorus-t / gliscor and Garchomp easily, Volt switch helps me to not break the momentum and it's just an excellent move.
is the rain user, a very useful thing to boost Gyara's stabb. Specstoed is way more useful for the team, as it can bait out Jellicent / Rotom and toxic them on the switch (hp grass can be healed out pretty easily, and subtoxicstall them to death with gyarados is a very awesome thing ) , Hydropumping under the rain is very dangerous for the opponent, making holes in his defenses.
is the last pokemon to be on the team, virizion was my weakest link and i needed something to check effectively Keldeo, Rotom, Starmie and Thundurus, the physically defensive set can counter all of those, the toxic / burn from Scald and Toxic helps Gyarados a lot to set-up a sub more easily of toxic stall a annoying mon like Jellicent to death
can be really weird but this set is just awesome, a lot of people will ask me "why not gravity ? :o" and i'll tell you why : Smack down+EQ will kill Skarmory 252/252+ and Rotom No-matter-what. And that's a big thing when your late-game sweeper can't taunt him. The spread is maximizing his attack to do as much damage as possible, the speed investement helps me to outspeed +Speed Heatran, Adamant Luke / Croak, and Neutral Rotom. Forretress and Jirachi can already deal with Rakion / Chomp etc so i don't really need to put a lot of bulk on Landorus.
is the glue of the team, helping revenge killing a lot of pokemons such as non-rp Landorus, Dragonite, Gengar, Starmie, Latios etc...U-turn helps me to keep the momentum of the team, the 4th move can be weird but it's very useful for me, Healing is very useful is one of my pokemons is nearly dead or if Jirachi is useless for the rest of the match, sometimes i need to bring Gyarados for the rescue and Healing wish helps me comeback for a sweep in the late-game. Zen headbutt can be use to RK keldeo, breloom and Conkeldurr since they can be butthurting.
is the star of the team ! His Set-up is easier with Jirachi's Trick, Forre / Landorus entry hazards, Scizor baited by Virizion, and Jellicent / Rotom toxiced by Politoed, the ev's helps me take a Sacred Sword from SpecsKeldeo without breaking the sub, i choosed Intimidate > Moxie because it makes the set-up way easier against things like Garchomp, you can still try moxie if you want.
Any changes ?
=> Maybe using a restalkdd gyarados > subgyarados, for a bulkier version that can wreck havoc after rotom / jellicent are gone.
=> CM or spD jirachi > Scarfjirachi, CM jirachi will benefit a lot from the entry hazards and stuff but i'm gonna be destroyed by something like a Specstios locked on surf without any options of RKing it.
I really like this topic but sadly I don't really like Gyara nor Forre so I'll stay away from this round. Some really interesting and fun teams have been made as well, even some hail teams.
This is a cool team, but there are a few things that seem rather annoying. Stall in general is just problematic due to the fact you lack an actual stallbreaker.. relying on Thundurus-T isn't the best bet since good stall carries Amoonguss, Latias, Gastrodon, etc. Your Breloom set is redundant with Thundurus-T as well. The point of using Bulk Up Breloom is to check Calm Mind + Water Pulse Jirachi and VoltTurn simultaneously which is why it was so good in BW1. You have two Scizor counters and Thundurus-T for Calm Mind Jirachi, so it isn't needed. You're essentially just using a redundant set for no reason.. Making Breloom a SubPunch set or a Bulky Technician set would help against stall in general and it is much more threatening. The lack of Spikes on Forretress is upsetting as well since the passive damage helps you break through stall cores with smart double switching and spin prevention. Spikes > Stealth Rock on Forretress and Stealth Rock > Protect on Jirachi is really your best shot. For the Gyarados EV's, 88 HP / 168 Atk / 252 Spe is really the best spread. Your Substitute will live a Jirachi Body Slam. SpDef Jirachi with Body Slam is a HUGE nuisance for your team since your primary check is Thundurus-T, so this is very important. Lastly, your team lacks an answer to Sun which I personally cannot fix without adding more problems. It's just the way the team was built. The best suggestion I have is to use Thunderbolt on Thundurus-T so you can still hit stuff in Sun, but that isn't solving the problem of Venusaur straight up 6-0'ing you.. Using Body Slam on Jirachi would give you some leeway vs Venusaur and Sun in general too, but you're still weak as fuck to it. Anyways, this team caught my eye so I just wanted to help you out since you said you're in a slump, Lavos x)
If any other teams intrigue me, I'll talk about them too.
bri striking away at the opposition...yeah i know it loses vs sun and stall but i made it for vinc so i didnt care cos i figured he would likely use rain or sand offense! and he did z_z
that said yeah maybe my team isnt the best all around. i like yours though
This set is arguably Gyarados' best set right now, and it's very effective under sun. It serves as a solid Rain check, also. Because of Moxie and Dragon Dance, Waterfall's nerf is almost unnoticeable after +1. Gyarados forms a fantastic FWG core between Ninetales, Venusaur, and itself, including Venusaur being able to take electric attacks aimed at Gyarados (as well as Dugtrio). Gyarados' main job here is to threaten the Fire, Ice, and Flying types that threaten Venusaur out.
Venusaur:
Venusaur is the ideal sun abuser here, forming a FWG core with Gyarados and Ninetales to boot. Growth brings his attacking stats to sky-high levels, and his coverage is impeccable. Giga Drain takes care of waters, rocks, and ground types, Sludge bomb takes care of grass types that would otherwise wall it, and Earthquake takes care of the electric types that go after Gyarados, as well as hitting those pesky Grass/Poison types. Chlorophyll also allows for Venusaur to be a pseudo-scarfer should he need to be.
Ninetales:
Ninetales is obviously the weather starter here. I gave her max bulk to be able to deal with Politoed effectively. Ninetales also is able to beat common Hyper Offensive leads bar physical Azelf variants. Ninetales forms the final part of the FWG core, and her main function is to sponge ice moves aimed at Venusaur and Dugtrio. Toxic spam is used to add on residual damage to help support Gyarados and Venusaur. Sunny Day helps in beating Politoed, as it makes Solarbeam usable if Politoed switches in.
Forretress:
Forretress is terrible, I'm just saying that now. Anyways, Forretress takes on the Donphan-like role here, setting hazards and also being able to spin. U-Turn prevents magnezone from crapping on it, and having Special Defense bulk makes Forretress actually usable. I've switched out Earthquake to Spikes, because sun loves hazard support, especially this team.
Dugtrio:
Everyone knows what Dugtrio does, so I'll skip it. Hone Claws is once again used to set-up, and Aerial Ace was chosen over Revenge or Sucker Punch because I've realized I need all the help I can get against Keldeo/Landorus/Tyranitar cores, starting with Keldeo.
Terrakion:
Choice Scarf user, can pick off some annoying threats that stop Gyarados and Venusaur like Steel, Electric (Thundy-T), Fire, Flying, and Ice types. Last slot has Rock Slide in case I can't afford to miss.
For the team building competition could I post my team in the rate my team section to get feedback and then post it in the competition thread
Also are common sets like gyardos sub ddance considered copying
For the team building competition could I post my team in the rate my team section to get feedback and then post it in the competition thread
Also are common sets like gyardos sub ddance considered copying
By the time you post it in Rate My Team, get rates, and then post your team here, the thread will already move to the voting stage or to another week of team posting. If you're that uncomfortable with the legitimacy of your team, I'd recommend lurking more and become more comfortable with the OU metagame. Standard sets aren't considered stealing; they're standard for a reason since they're the best sets that a Pokemon can run. I hope I helped! :)
Jirachi @ Choice Scarf
Trait: Serene Grace
EVs: 148 Spd / 252 HP / 108 Def
Jolly Nature
- Wish
- Trick
- Iron Head
- Ice Punch
I hate Gyarados, and I don't like Forretress either. Begrudgingly, I made this team, it's stall that just beats the slower paced offensive teams of now, while still being able to beat opposing stall teams with correct play. I'll highlight main points of interest and how you would play stuff:
Landorus: Celebi and Gyarados shit on it, Jirachi can revenge with Ice Punch Salamence: Adamant DD Mence or Adamant Scarf Mence is why I run that Speed on Jirachi Keldeo: Celebi/Gyarados again Heatran: I would just spam Earthquake with Forretress everytime I'm in for free. Say Forretress vs Slowbro or some crazy shit, I'd just Earthquake for sure. Jellicent: One of few things Trick is for on Jirachi, if Celebi is dead and can't Perish Song force it. If I get Toxic Spikes up with Forretress, spoilers, I will, then I can beat it too but if they have Tentacruel, well now you understand Trick Jirachi. Kyurem-B: Literally why Jirachi is the best
Speaking of Trick Jirachi + Perish Song Celebi, Trick is the biggest momentum shifter in Stall v Stall which fits into why it's there. Perish Song is another one, you can make them do horrible moves if they fuck around for even a turn with it. Throw Sableye into that mix, it is good vs Stall too. Specifically Jirachi, I like that it becomes a Wish mon after Tricking its scarf, just making it way better for Stall match-ups. Trick also fucks up offensive teams too, if I switch in on a DD Dragonite +1ed at 100%, I'd Trick that shit and probably win if I somehow allowed a DD Dragonite to get to +1 (which means I got a hazard up, only real way this is happening). Cuz either they're DDing again like a retard, or at worst I might have Sacced Jirachi (but probably didn't) and now go to Gyarados, gg. I shouldn't have to go into the other set-up mons you want it for.
SD Terrakion: Would have shit on me before I added the final 2, Sableye + Scarf Jirachi is once again saving the day, it can't break that ever. Alakazam: This is why Jirachi and Sableye are sooo good trust me Tyranitar: Forretress can set up hazards, but late-game, Jirachi all the way, my team hates CB Stone Edges so another reason why I added Jirachi. Scizor: You remember I got Gyarados rite?
For Sun Teams I went with the idea of just using Shed Shell Heatran. I think Dugtrio would normally poop on me, so the idea is never let it get a chance to do anything and then they can't do anything. If they're not using Dugtrio, EQ Venusaur, kind of an asshole but nothing Celebi can't handle if it absolutely have to while Heatran deals with their other mons. HENCE PSYCHIC ALSO GOOD FOR CONKELDURR AND GENGAR SWITCH-INS BUT JIRACHI AGAIN!
I think stuff like Thundurus-T gives me the most trouble, I debate on Jirachi or Scarf Latias, but went Rachi because of the Stone Edge resist / TTar answer lol. This team beats Rain fine (Jirachi handled Tornadus-I/Toxicroak now anyway) imo, but if you wanted the Politoed fuker, add Latias.
All in all, I don't think it has too many weaknesses. I kind of just played off the fact that Gyarados with Spin Support beats Volcarona and U-Turn Landorus, so why not go that route and just cover everything. I know "stall sucks" but fuck that, I basically only use stall on ladder these days and I like this team. Everyone already went Hail (which I hate), Rain (which is so damn boring and obvious), Heavy Offense (I think Gyarados is terrible in that, even though my first idea was using Custap Forry. Any good player using Rotom-W will never let Rotom die and Gyarados will literally not do anything but be a liability). I prefer this kind of team just because I can still play offensively with Jirachi + Sableye + Hazards (yeah that's pretty offensive to me just saying) but I can lie back on shit like Rotom-W with Celebi or a Trick from Jirachi. Flexibility a good thang ya know
Late EDIT:
I didn't really go into enough detail of how I made this so I thought I should. Obviously, the lameass restriction of Forry/Gyarados limited me to those two, but it did make it easier because Heatran Celebi was a logical jump. Not only could I get hazards up but I could cover plenty of different spectrum of types/sets/variables and feel safe. So I originally had those 4 and said "alright, I'll just throw on 2 bulky Stall Pokemon, Jellicent and Blissey". It took me a minute to do that and then I told myself, I must be stupid because I started analyzing the team more. I couldn't hope to possibly ever win with this team with those 2 anchoring. Yeah, I would beat some teams just because they couldn't break through, but IRL Pokemon, you're going to lose to Salamence, Landorus, Keldeo, CB TTar in stupid fashion because nothing is ever at 100% like you predict, and a good opponent will just prevent you from getting hazards. So right away, I realized Jellicent wasn't a good choice as a Ghost-type. It blocks spin, sure, but it just left me feeling even more unprotected against Terrakion and Dragons. I realized right away I would need my mons to handle those, and so I went with my old favorite Ghost-type, Sableye. I think this thing is sooo underrated it's ridiculous. It solves problems of Alakazam, of Terrakion, etc but it didn't leave me feeling "safe". I felt like I could still be easily swept by Dragonite or Salamence. I really wanted Wish, so I kept Blissey and gave it a pretty pitiful set of Ice Beam/Wish/Seismic Toss/Protect and that just isn't actual protection at all. It also left me really vulnerable in Stall vs Stall. Then I looked closer at specific weaknesses and realized that I couldn't play a ridiculous safety net game with Blissey. Rather, I wanted Wish in the form of offense, something that could kill threats before they even realized they're dead while still supporting the team. Like I said, it came down to Jirachi and Latias. I was noticing a weakness to Kyurem-B which swayed me more towards Jirachi. But the final piece was Tyranitar. Stone Edge was a bitch and I hate being trapped. Jirachi could come in and do something about it. Also, FWIW - Jirachi's Iron Head is still the best shit in the game. While I now definitely lose to Magnezone (reason why Forretress has EQ by the way you clowns!), I gain another Dragon-resist, and something more likely to get off Tricks. While Latias might be able to Trick on Blissey/Ferrothorn more easily, I can still get the job done with Jirachi (ESPECIALLY ON FERROTHORN, THEY LOVE COMING IN ON JIRACHI). With Ice Punch/Iron Head, I felt protected (especially vs threats like Gengar and Alakazam "the quiet stall killers"), went with Wish and never looked back.
I guess take from this that even though this team might have some flaws (I am pretty confident I can play around many of them, Ferrothorn is like the worst one and people play that thing so badly and let Jirachi Trick it LOL), it's a good lesson on looking closely at how your team actually would do in the field of play, rather than through theorymon of 100% and I'll never let this mon die if they have this! Won't work.
Jirachi @ Leftovers
Trait: Serene Grace
EVs: 252 HP / 236 SDef / 20 Spd
Careful Nature
- Iron Head
- Body Slam
- Wish
- Protect
Amoonguss @ Black Sludge
Trait: Regenerator
EVs: 248 HP / 28 SAtk / 232 SDef
Calm Nature
- Giga Drain
- Spore
- Clear Smog
- Hidden Power [Ice]
Heatran (F) @ Leftovers
Trait: Flash Fire
EVs: 252 HP / 4 SAtk / 252 SDef
Calm Nature
- Lava Plume
- Toxic
- Roar
- Stealth Rock
Slowbro @ Leftovers
Trait: Regenerator
EVs: 252 HP / 248 Def / 8 Spd
Bold Nature
- Scald
- Psychic
- Ice Beam
- Slack Off
A little bit of my thought process:
1. Jirachi: Jirachi is a solid partner for Gyarados, healing it with Wish and taking Stone Edges for it, and in return sponging fire moves and Ground-type attacks. Thanks to wish I can also run Dragon Dance Gyarados, Forretress also appreciated Wish support.
2. Grass type: A bit vague, but general grass types such as Celebi, Amoonguss, and Roserade are all solid Pokemon taking Keldeo, Breloom, and your run of the mill water type, which one depends on the team. Since this team doesn't need Perish Song because of Jirachi and Gyarados offense, and Spikes thanks to Forretress, Amoonguss is a solid choice.
3. Heatran: Nicely patches up the sun weakness and is a solid setter of rocks, but more importantly Heatran is a nice offensive approach to combating Skarmory, Forretress, and Ferrothorn, scaring them all out nicely, giving the team the upper hand in stall matches.
4. Slowbro: the last slot was a hard choice, Slowbro, Hippowdon, and Gliscor all stood out as solid defensive walls which nicely covered the remaining weaknesses Hippowdon sets up sand and can phaze nicely, which Gliscor combats Scizor more effectively and it's higher speed allow it to KO certain threats. If I playtested this team I might be better prepared to choose one, but from scanning this teams threats, Slowbro stood out more combating a ton of physical threats, most notably Terrakion, and offering a nice check to opposing Heatrans which currently I only have Gyarados its self for.
@scarfwynaut
your team is very susceptible to bulky waters with toxic and scald, your water resists really hates to be statused and this means you are very weak to rain stall teams imo. two things you can do are put sub over taunt on gyarados to setup on those bulky waters or try celebi over among, at least you have a switch in that is not ruined by scald.
ps. am i allowed to post two teams? i builded another one lol
@scarfwynaut
your team is very susceptible to bulky waters with toxic and scald, your water resists really hates to be statused and this means you are very weak to rain stall teams imo. two things you can do are put sub over taunt on gyarados to setup on those bulky waters or try celebi over among, at least you have a switch in that is not ruined by scald.
While this is true to a certain extent, in it's currently form both Amoonguss and Slowbro can effectively wall out said Pokemon thanks to Regenerator, so its not to much of a problem. Now if I were to play test this team, I would definitely use Celebi if I used Gliscor or Hippowdon over Slowbro.
I'm going to participate in the next round because this rounds is just too away.
My favourites team and the teams that i like only are:
Princess bri's team:
I found this team very original really, with overcoat forre3, gyarados restalker and double intimidate core which is really sexy. The only things to improve this team are U-turn > Fire Punch on Jirachi and Scald > Waterfall on Gyarados.
Fire Punch isnt necessary since you're running Scald Gyarados now with a double intimidate core, Forre3 + hail damage enough for Scizor variants, mostly SD.
Also, u-turn makes a good volturn core on the team with Forre3 / Jirachi / Landorus-t, which makes easier to switch and makes wishes for the rest of the team. Scald help to luring stuff like Ferrothorn and i found Scald better than Waterfall on gyarados resttalker (scald / rest / roar / sleep talk). Very nice, original and interesting team, be careful with spinblokers since you have 3 mons on a defensive team weak to SR.
Lavos team:
This team is right so far, with Gyarados + Thundurus-T core, Breloom BU like glue, Forre3 spinning and hazard and finally Jirachi a support mon, nothing to comment a in depth. Maybe lavos you should to try SR > Protect Rachi, Spikes > SR Forre3 and Thunderbolt over Thunder in Thundurus-T to be more consistent against Sun / SS teams. I found this team weak against LO Starmie / Specs Keldeo, be careful with Garchomp and dragmags team, good team in overall.
Gyardos is the star of this team with its subddance set. Its job is simple come in on something that cant touch and sweep. This set prevents status and is the sub is very useful to sometimes scout out what moves the oppenent has. The dual stab of gyardos is enough to take out mostly everything with a couple of boost.
Forretress @ Custap Berry
Trait: Sturdy
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Atk / 4 SDef
Brave Nature
IVs: 0 Spd
- Stealth Rock
- Spikes
- Explosion
- Gyro Ball
Imo Forretress is a poor spinner due to his lack of speed and failure to beat spin blockers. not to mention that he is setup fodder for almost everything. For this reason decided to use some sort of suicide custap lead. His goal is to set up one or two layers of rocks and then explode doing tremendous damage to whatevers in which will either kill it or make it easily revenged killed. Furthermore max attack gyroball means that i can beat espeon which would otherwise bounce back my rocks.
I needed something to tank electric and water hits and rotom w is one of the best. however, because i do not have any weather inducers i need to keep the pressure on the opponent therefore max special attack. Will o wisp and pain split are for support and also provide some healing for rotom. This pok is extremely effective in the rain as its water stab is boosted and its electric stab hits many rain pokes. I use voltswitch instead of thunderbolt or thunder cause i need rotom to be a pivot and dont have an extra move slot. Only investment in hp gives rotom an efficient defensive investments as its hp has low base while its defense and special defense are alright ( I read some article about this but forgot what it was called).
Arcanine @ Life Orb
Trait: Flash Fire
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SDef / 252 Spd
Adamant Nature
IVs: 30 Atk / 30 Def
- Close Combat
- ExtremeSpeed
- Flare Blitz
- Wild Charge
I needed a fire type and tran was too slow and volcorona required spin support which i thought fortress couldnt do well in weatheless ho(see above)
i have played against other players who had arcanine and always thought it was a joke, but many times it caught me by suprise so i decided to try it out. This pok checks sun teams pretty damn well. If no damage prior, he can easily beat many chlorophyll sweepers and heatran. His life orb is one of the more versatile sets which could also counteract some rain poks with wildcharge if they arnt careful. extreme speed also gives me some revenge killing potential which is always useful.
Landorus-Therian (M) @ Leftovers
Trait: Intimidate
EVs: 152 Atk / 104 SAtk / 252 Spd
Naughty Nature
- Earthquake
- Stone Edge
- U-turn
- Hidden Power [Ice]
LandoT composes of my physical wall. intimidate as an ability makes it an efficient and effective semi-wall even without ev investment. HP ice is for strong pokes with times 4 weakness and the special evs help out for the ohko. Uturn for pivot and edgequake for coverage.
Breloom @ Focus Sash
Trait: Technician
EVs: 252 Spd / 252 Atk / 4 HP
Jolly Nature
IVs: 30 Atk / 30 Def
- Spore
- Swords Dance
- Mach Punch
- Bullet Seed
I needed another keldeo check as the ebelt set in rain or sand would wreck my team if not careful. The sash is solely to make up for brelooms fraility and also insures a useful spore which cripples my opponent. Swords dance for the extra power which also makes breloom a semi sweeper. I usually use him to get rid of key threats such as keldeo, any electric type
Overall Strategy
With the forretress cutsap lead I provide rocks and/or kill another pok with explode and/or more spikes depending on the situation. Then with lando/rotom i apply offensive pressure with arcanine as revenge killer and breloom as last resort if anyone sets up. Gyardos is the late game sweeper and usually wrecks any weakened team or i could use him early if i find an oppurtunity against stall stuff like jellicent or ferrothorn(a littler more tricky) which sub would render useless
Heres some common pokemon and how i would beat it Landorus: Gyardos and rotom Salamence: Lando lowers his attack and can hp ice, along with rocks from tress lower his survibility Keldeo: Rotom/Gyardos/Breloom with arcanine to revenge with espeed if needed Heatran: Arcnine and lando t, plus gyardos can beat him Jellicent: rotom, and gyardos can somewhat set up with sub Kyurem-B: breloom sometimes lando for intimidate SD Terrakion: Lando and breloom combo again the intimidate is useful Alakazam: exspeed from arcanine plus anything can kill him really Tyranitar: Forretress can set up hazards lando and arcanine easily outspeed can kill, rotom can do some damage. Scizor gyardos and lando for intimidate rotom checks him to
I started with the required Gyarados and Forretress. For a surprise factor I used a defensive Gyarados set and an offensive Forretress set (Espeon bait in the lead slot).
Physically defensive Breloom was added, helping the team with slow, tanky Pokemon such as Hippowodon, as well as other Pokemon such as SubToxic Gliscor.
Heatran was added to give hazards, coverage, and a FWG core that serves as a sun check, especially to Ninetales that gives Forretress a lot of trouble.
I needed a spinner and a Pokemon to counteract offensive Rain teams, so I chose the best Swift Swim abuser that could spin, Kabutops (sorry Armaldo).
Salamence was added as a cleaner and revenge killer, with a moveset that was flexible for the weather, sun boosting Fire Blast and rain boosting Hydro Pump.
Blissey replaced Heatran because I needed a cleric, and Salamence, Gyarados, and Kabutops could all counteract different pieces of sun teams anyway. Now the fact that Gyrados used Rest but not Sleep Talk was resolved.
Kabutops had very little use outside of combatting Rain teams, and its offensives weren't acceptable without Swords Dance, which introduced 4MSS. So I removed Kabutops in favor of Kingdra, who could counter-sweep Politoed teams and had better offensive moves. It could also viably go mixed, unlike Kabutops. This is where the team is at today.
Also props to GeorgeEliot for starting this challenge!
Hooray for AmoonBro! Anyway I was wondering why you chose that EV spread for Amoonguss. Also, I might substitute Fire Punch over Protect on Jirachi so it can actually hurt Ferrothorn, Forretress, and Scizor.
Hooray for AmoonBro! Anyway I was wondering why you chose that EV spread for Amoonguss. Also, I might substitute Fire Punch over Protect on Jirachi so it can actually hurt Ferrothorn, Forretress, and Scizor.
The spread is almost standard, 28 special attack evs allow Amoonguss to break Keldeo's sub at +2 with giga drain. As for the 248 HP, at 252 HP Amoonguss has HP divisible by 8, making it take more damage from sand, burns, and hazards, running one less HP ev avoids all that. (in real life I also toss on a few speed evs to speed creep ;)
Jirachi really doesn't need to hurt any of those Pokemon, Gyarados covers Scizor nicely, Forretress spins out hazards of opposing Forretress and Ferrothorn while Heatran can threaten to 1HKO them. If anything though, Fire Punch or U-urn should be considered as an option to attack Magnezone, which can break this team's core otherwise.
Seems like a really cool idea for a thread, so I thought I'd give it a go as well.
The Team
Forming:
Looking at Gyara and Forre together to me instantly highlights a few solid possibilities; Stall/Semi-Stall/Balance for your primary team strategy, and either a Sand or Rain team to fill out the other members. Of course theres heaps of other ways to make the core work, but those were the things that jumped out at me. I first decided to try a Rain stall team, but unless its Sun stall, I just can't bring myself to play such a slow tempo. So I decided to speed up the tempo and thats whats lead to this slightly more balanced Rain team.
Forretress:
One of the best spinners to have a secondary function in OU at the moment in my opinion. He can set up hazards, take hits and be a nice addition to a Volt-Turn core. I decided to basically take all of his best assets and chuck them onto this set. Nothing creative, just effective.
Gyarados:
The main win condition of this team, and basically what I built around. I was using a few different sets when I was trying to play this team as stall such as a Shuffler set, a RestTalk set and just a general utility set. None of them really satisfied me, along with the whole process of playing rain stall so I decided to just swap his role to that of a sweeper, and then rebuilt the team around that. I don't really know what I was doing with the EVs, but they certainly work. I choose to run Intimidate over Moxie as it gives Gyara a useful secondary function, and gives it a few more switch in opportunities that it might not otherwise have eg Breloom/Scizor. Basically this thing is just a beast, and if given the chance to set up a Sub and DD its pretty much GG.
As far as the other team members:
Politoed:
Here for the rain and to act as a somewhat decent check to certain physical attackers, your basic Physically Defensive Toed here. Encore is something I love on the set as it really screws with BP teams and set up sweepers, often giving me a great opportunity to set up with Gyara. Perish Song is another option over Encore, but I find Perish song to be a more passive route of stopping chains/set ups, where as Encore gives me a free turn or more to make my play.
Celebi:
Celebi was originally a Jellicent back when I was trying to play a slower pace, but really that meant that if my opponent had an Electric type I'd generally lose unless I outplayed the shit of them, which didn't happen enough for it to be a viable mon. All 4 of the losses I had with the team were due to Electric types just hurting me once Duggy was gone. Celebi also works nicely as a check to Breloom and Keldeo, who can otherwise be serious pains. Currently running Earth Power for coverage, but could very easily be persuaded to switch that to Psychic to hit things such as Toxicroak harder.
Dugtrio:
God I love this thing whenever I run weather. Pair it with U-Turn on Tornadus, Volt-Switch on Forry and BP on Celebi and you just get so many opportunities to trap things. Even with its seriously abysmal attack stat I often find Duggy getting more than 1 KO per match, and sometimes as many as 3 against Sun teams. Duggy sets up my rocks when I need them, and obviously traps when necessary. Before adding Celebi he was also my answer to Electric types, but really that just wasn't working all that well seeing as he's frailer than a dandelion.
Tornadus-Incarnate:
Not as good as his Therian form in my opinion, but still a serious threat and great utility mon. I added Tornadus onto the team when I decided I wanted to speed up the tempo, I've found that he compliments Gyara and Forre quite well, and offers another check to a few threats to the team. I've got Rain Dance there primarily as a bail out button. If something goes horribly wrong and I lose Politoed and the weather war, and as a result of opposing weather theres a sweeper I have no answer to, I send in Tornadus to give me a few turns to try and fix the mistake. Taunt is there because Prankster Taunt is just legit. U-Turn is used as my general go-to move, and Hurricane is there to, well to put it bluntly, fuck shit up.
Thats how the team was made as such, this isn't an RMT so I won't go into the details of who checks what, how each mon is supposed to be played etc, but the basic idea is facilitating a Gyarados sweep.
(Celebi & Gyara EVs are probably quite dumb, I haven't really given them much though, they just appealed to me at the time and seem to work quite well)
Currently sitting on 22-4 with this team, although I'd say a solid third or so of those wins have come against questionable opponents. Still not too bad i guess.
Here we are ladies and gents, my attempt at a team with the Gyarados/Forretress core. So far, i've blown through teams that I've faced, only losing to some major hacks. Even beat a sun team after I made a huge misplay and lost Politoed early. Here's a the importable info and the breakdown of how I built the team:
Importable Version:
Gyarados @ Choice Band
Trait: Intimidate
EVs: 88 HP / 252 Atk / 168 Spd
Adamant Nature
- Waterfall
- Stone Edge
- Ice Fang
- Earthquake
Forretress @ Leftovers
Trait: Sturdy
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Def / 4 SDef
Relaxed Nature
IVs: 0 Spd
- Rapid Spin
- Spikes
- Volt Switch
- Gyro Ball
Jirachi @ Choice Scarf
Trait: Serene Grace
EVs: 152 Atk / 228 SAtk / 128 Spd
Naive Nature
- Iron Head
- Fire Punch
- Hidden Power [Ice]
- Thunder
Politoed @ Choice Specs
Trait: Drizzle
EVs: 252 HP / 252 SAtk / 4 Spd
Modest Nature
- Hydro Pump
- Focus Blast
- Ice Beam
- Hidden Power [Grass]
Garchomp @ Leftovers
Trait: Rough Skin
EVs: 252 HP / 196 Def / 60 Spd
Jolly Nature
- Stealth Rock
- Dragon Tail
- Earthquake
- Aqua Tail
So obviously I had to start with Gyarados and Forretress. After thinking about their strengths, I decided I wanted to go rain team to maximize Gyarados' high attack. Standard defensive set for Forretress, nothing to really explain. Decided to go with the Choice Band Gyarados to do as much damage as possible once it's threats are removed.
Now I had to add Politoed because it's pointless to have a rain team without this little guy. I decided to roll with a Choice Specs set to do as much damage as I could on people predicting a defensive set. This has nabbed me a nice chunk of KOs, especially if I predict a switch to start off.
Noticing I have Spikes with Forretress and quite the weakness to Electric right now, I decided to run a Support Garchomp to stop the Electric attacks that would plague my team so far, set up rocks, and still dish out some, as Shofu would say, BIG DOMMAGE. Running Dragon Tail instead of Dragon Claw as helped me big time with phazing opponents that try to setup when they see I'm running support, plus it helps rack up hazard damage.
Still not satisfied with my Electric weakness, I decided to run the good ol' Double Powder Amoonguss. Spore the first pokemon that pops in, predict a switch and Stun Spore the next pokemon. With Regenerator + Giga Drain + Black Sludge, Amoonguss just keeps coming back for more.
EDIT Note: Amoonguss is also my counter to most Terrakion and Keldeo sets.
Last but not least, I wanted a pokemon to help deal with Dragons if Forretress is down, and help out with Rock type attacks. Jirachi came to mind so I went with it. The spread is where it gets fun. I combined the Choice Scraf set and the Expert Belt set into a deadly force. Speed EVs are to make sure I can still outspeed +1 Jolly Haxorus and the extra SAtk EVs are to make sure I can 2HKO (OHKO if all my hazards are up).
So there it is. I was surprised when I threw this team together and saw the synergy they all had together. Let me know what you guys think!
Okay everyone, submissions are now closed for the first round, and we've had a fantastic number of entries. Here's how the voting is going to work. You can vote for a maximum of three teams, in bold please, which will all be given equal weighting. Also, if you have time I'd encourage you to read back through the thread to see individual movesets and the great justifications given for the teams.
