His Eminence Lord Poppington II
proverb:the fish who eats most dies still too
[Overview]
<p>Much has changed with the shift to BW, but Forretress is still Forretress. It remains exceptionally good at what it does, namely providing entry hazard and Rapid Spin support, but outside of that role, it is extremely limited. BW brought it a few buffs in Volt Switch and the improvement to Sturdy, which now acts as a psuedo-Focus Sash. Sadly, threats such as Reshiram and Magic Bounce Xatu have also come into play, making life a bit harder. All in all, play safe, support Forretress well, and watch as your opponent is shredded and poisoned at every turn by layer after layer of entry hazards. Be a bit careless and predict wrongly, though, and shudder as your bagworm is wiped out every match without fail.</p>
[SET]
name: Support
move 1: Spikes
move 2: Rapid Spin
move 3: Toxic Spikes
move 4: Pain Split / Toxic / Volt Switch
item: Leftovers
nature : Careful
evs : 252 HP / 4 Def / 252 SpD
[SET COMMENTS]
<p>Forretress's amazing Bug / Steel typing, great overall bulk, and access to Rapid Spin, as well as all three entry hazards, make it a great choice for a support role on nearly any team. Due to the lack of Pokemon able to reliably set them up, Spikes is a massively useful move on Forretress in Ubers. Furthermore, there are a wide range of grounded Pokemon immune to Toxic Spikes, but affected by Spikes, such as Steel Arceus, Excadrill, Ferrothorn, and Dialga; this makes Spikes a great move to use on Forretress. Toxic Spikes are the second hazard that Forretress will often use; they can be incredibly dangerous in Ubers due to very threatening Pokemon such as Darkrai, Mewtwo, Blaziken, Palkia, and the majority of Calm Mind Arceus formes (most notably Ghost) being put on a timer once poisoned; note, however, that Calm Mind Arceus inflicted with only regular poison can still pull off a sweep. All weather starters are also vulnerable to Toxic Spikes, making them an effective weapon in winning the weather war. With the prevalence of Choice items and Draco Meteor users, Forretress will find plenty of opportunities to set up its hazards. Rapid Spin is where Forretress carves out its biggest niche. Thanks to its great resistances to common Ghost-, Dark-, Ice-, and Dragon-type attacks, it is able to consistently switch in and remove entry hazards, allowing Pokemon such as Ho-Oh, Lugia, and Reshiram to come into play without losing huge chunks of their health. Bulky grounded Pokemon such as Groudon, Palkia, most Arceus formes, and Chansey also appreciate Forretress's ability to remove the Toxic Spikes that greatly reduce their staying power.</p>
<p>Pain Split, Toxic, and Volt Switch are mainly filler options, but they have their uses. The first allows Forretress to switch into Choice-locked resisted moves more recklessly; and, perhaps more importantly, makes Forretress one of the best Ferrothorn counters in the game. Ferrothorn can only significantly damage Forretress with Iron Barbs and Leech Seed, but with Pain Split Forretress can set up hazards and Rapid Spin on Ferrothorn to its heart's content. Toxic allows Forretress to cripple spinblockers and walls such as Lugia and Ho-Oh, which are immune to Toxic Spikes, and also punishes Arceus formes that might try to set up on Forretress. Finally, Volt Switch lets Forretress act as a scout after it has laid a few entry hazards, and can be useful for maintaining offensive momentum, or even setting up a Pursuit trap on a careless spinblocker.</p>
[ADDITIONAL COMMENTS]
<p>Max HP and Special Defense along with a Special Defense-boosting nature is necessary to make the most of Forretress's relatively low special bulk, as it needs all it can get to take the Draco Meteors and Ice Beams thrown around in Ubers. Leftovers is the item of choice, as the passive recovery helps Forretress to shrug off weak or resisted attacks. Keep in mind, however, that even with full investment, neutral special attacks still take a fair chunk out of Forretress's health, so ensure that you play off of its numerous resistances.</p>
<p>A more physically defensive spread (252 HP / 36 Def / 220 SpD with a Bold or a Relaxed nature) can be used with Toxic to check certain physical attackers. This spread ensures that Forretress is never 2HKOed by +1 Outrage from Dragon Dance Rayquaza. However, Forretress will still struggle against even non-Life Orb Extreme Killer Arceus packing Earthquake; as such, a spread of 252 HP / 136 Def / 120 SpD can be used to always avoid the 2HKO from a +2 Adamant Arceus using Earthquake. Life Orb Extreme Killer Arceus still possesses the ability to 2HKO after Stealth Rock with Earthquake almost all the time (guaranteed for Adamant, even without Stealth Rock); at this point, one should just use a fully physically defensive spread. Forretress also struggles with Lum Berry variants of Extreme Killer Arceus, which can absorb one Toxic and will beat Forretress more often than not, even if the Forretress is packing Pain Split.</p>
<p>A Ghost-type is a mandatory teammate to block Rapid Spin, which can otherwise waste all of Forretress's hard work; the Giratina formes are probably the best, and both have good synergy with Forretress, though Ghost Arceus makes a great choice as well. Blissey and Chansey can take most neutral or super effective special attacks directed at Forretress in stride, while supporting the team with Wish or Stealth Rock. In return, Forretress can easily set up on many of the physical attackers that threaten Chansey or Blissey, such as Garchomp and Groudon that lack a Fire-type move. Palkia can switch into many Pokemon that often come in on Forretress, such as Choice Specs Kyogre, Reshiram, Giratina-O, opposing Palkia, and Mewtwo, and threaten them with Thunder or its STAB Dragon-type attacks, and thus makes a great teammate. Sweepers such as most Calm Mind Arceus and Kyogre love having Forretress as a partner to both set up and remove Toxic Spikes. Ho-Oh and Reshiram enjoy Rapid Spin support, and can easily switch into most Fire-type attacks for Forretress; in return, it can tank Dragon-type moves for Reshiram and come in on defensive Groudon without a Fire-type move, which is a constant threat to Ho-Oh. Groudon also forms a potent physically defensive core with Forretress, and can set up Stealth Rock, phaze with Roar or Dragon Tail to rack up entry hazard damage, and scare Dialga off with STAB Earthquake. Kyogre can lessen Forretress's Fire-type weakness thanks to Drizzle and destroy Fire Punch Groudon, Ho-Oh, and select Arceus formes. Zekrom can stop defensive Kyogre and Ho-Oh with its STAB Bolt Strike. Dialga is also a great teammate, as it can come in after Forretress uses Volt Switch on the Giratina formes looking to spinblock, scaring them off and setting up Stealth Rock.</p>
<p>Despite the third slot being dedicated to a secondary hazard most of the time, Forretress can employ an additional utility move for fourth slot. Pain Split + Volt Switch allows Forretress to stay healthy and gain momentum. Pain Split + Toxic allows it to check Extreme Killer Arceus. Gyro Ball, Hidden Power Ice, and Payback also have their uses. Gyro Ball provides Forretress with a usably meaty STAB attack, and can hit common switch-ins such as Mewtwo, Darkrai, and Giratina-O for reasonable damage. It also gets a super effective hit on Kyurem-W, 2HKOing it even without Stealth Rock, although a Choice Specs-boosted Draco Meteor 2HKOs Forretress in return. Hidden Power Ice gives Forretress the ability to counter Gliscor, provided that Forretress is healthy, and a strong attack against Rayquaza and Shaymin-S. Payback can be used to check Latias and Latios, but Forretress can only switch into sets with Dragon Pulse and Grass Knot, as Thunder, Surf or Hidden Power Fire will maul it. However, a +1 Dragon Pulse will 3HKO Forretress from either of the twins, making Forretress a shaky check at best.</p>
<p>Stealth Rock can be used over Spikes or Toxic Spikes on more offensive teams lacking another entry hazard supporter. However, in most cases, it's a waste of Forretress's potential, especially considering the range of other Pokemon that can also set up Stealth Rock.</p>
[Other Options]
<p>As previously mentioned, Forretress is fairly limited outside of the listed options. Shed Shell is an option to escape from Magnezone, but Forretress will greatly miss the Leftovers recovery. Forretress learns Reflect and Light Screen, and can thus make decent use of a dual screens set, but it should usually opt to Volt Switch out or simply lay more entry hazards rather than use a screen. Under Light Screen and rain, however, Forretress can be a tough nut to crack with even Fire-type attacks. Protect can be used in the last slot to scout for foes carrying a surprise Fire-type attack, such as Espeon and Groudon, and also eases prediction when dealing with Choice item users, but the listed moves are generally more useful, and Forretress already has many move options as it is. Earthquake can be used to catch Heatran, Magnezone, and Reshiram on the switch. A Custap Berry in conjunction with Sturdy can allow Forretress to function as a sort of suicide lead, but that is usually a waste of its defensive potential.</p>
[Checks and Counters]
<p>Magic Bounce Espeon and Xatu with Hidden Power Fire are probably Forretress's biggest counters; they reflect its attempts to set up entry hazards and can OHKO with a 4x super effective Hidden Power. Tentacruel can also be annoying, as it absorbs Toxic Spikes, has access to Rapid Spin, and can scare Forretress off with a potentially rain-boosted Scald, while Forretress can do little back bar Earthquake. Forretress has trouble with any Pokemon carrying a Fire-type move as well, as most of them will OHKO if rain is not present; Reshiram, Dialga, Palkia, Giratina-O, and Mewtwo are the most common users. Although Groudon is normally setup fodder for Forretress, it will sometimes run Fire Punch or Overheat to fry the bug. Both Ho-Oh and Reshiram can switch in at will and threaten Forretress with their STAB Fire-type attacks, only really fearing Stealth Rock damage or Toxic. Kyogre has little to fear from any of Forretress's attacks, and can drown Forretress with its Water-type STAB moves. Finally, although rare in today's metagame, Heatran can roast Forretress with Lava Plume or Fire Blast, and Poison Heal Gliscor can freely come in and either Taunt Forretress or set up a Substitute.</p>
<p>Much has changed with the shift to BW, but Forretress is still Forretress. It remains exceptionally good at what it does, namely providing entry hazard and Rapid Spin support, but outside of that role, it is extremely limited. BW brought it a few buffs in Volt Switch and the improvement to Sturdy, which now acts as a psuedo-Focus Sash. Sadly, threats such as Reshiram and Magic Bounce Xatu have also come into play, making life a bit harder. All in all, play safe, support Forretress well, and watch as your opponent is shredded and poisoned at every turn by layer after layer of entry hazards. Be a bit careless and predict wrongly, though, and shudder as your bagworm is wiped out every match without fail.</p>
[SET]
name: Support
move 1: Spikes
move 2: Rapid Spin
move 3: Toxic Spikes
move 4: Pain Split / Toxic / Volt Switch
item: Leftovers
nature : Careful
evs : 252 HP / 4 Def / 252 SpD
[SET COMMENTS]
<p>Forretress's amazing Bug / Steel typing, great overall bulk, and access to Rapid Spin, as well as all three entry hazards, make it a great choice for a support role on nearly any team. Due to the lack of Pokemon able to reliably set them up, Spikes is a massively useful move on Forretress in Ubers. Furthermore, there are a wide range of grounded Pokemon immune to Toxic Spikes, but affected by Spikes, such as Steel Arceus, Excadrill, Ferrothorn, and Dialga; this makes Spikes a great move to use on Forretress. Toxic Spikes are the second hazard that Forretress will often use; they can be incredibly dangerous in Ubers due to very threatening Pokemon such as Darkrai, Mewtwo, Blaziken, Palkia, and the majority of Calm Mind Arceus formes (most notably Ghost) being put on a timer once poisoned; note, however, that Calm Mind Arceus inflicted with only regular poison can still pull off a sweep. All weather starters are also vulnerable to Toxic Spikes, making them an effective weapon in winning the weather war. With the prevalence of Choice items and Draco Meteor users, Forretress will find plenty of opportunities to set up its hazards. Rapid Spin is where Forretress carves out its biggest niche. Thanks to its great resistances to common Ghost-, Dark-, Ice-, and Dragon-type attacks, it is able to consistently switch in and remove entry hazards, allowing Pokemon such as Ho-Oh, Lugia, and Reshiram to come into play without losing huge chunks of their health. Bulky grounded Pokemon such as Groudon, Palkia, most Arceus formes, and Chansey also appreciate Forretress's ability to remove the Toxic Spikes that greatly reduce their staying power.</p>
<p>Pain Split, Toxic, and Volt Switch are mainly filler options, but they have their uses. The first allows Forretress to switch into Choice-locked resisted moves more recklessly; and, perhaps more importantly, makes Forretress one of the best Ferrothorn counters in the game. Ferrothorn can only significantly damage Forretress with Iron Barbs and Leech Seed, but with Pain Split Forretress can set up hazards and Rapid Spin on Ferrothorn to its heart's content. Toxic allows Forretress to cripple spinblockers and walls such as Lugia and Ho-Oh, which are immune to Toxic Spikes, and also punishes Arceus formes that might try to set up on Forretress. Finally, Volt Switch lets Forretress act as a scout after it has laid a few entry hazards, and can be useful for maintaining offensive momentum, or even setting up a Pursuit trap on a careless spinblocker.</p>
[ADDITIONAL COMMENTS]
<p>Max HP and Special Defense along with a Special Defense-boosting nature is necessary to make the most of Forretress's relatively low special bulk, as it needs all it can get to take the Draco Meteors and Ice Beams thrown around in Ubers. Leftovers is the item of choice, as the passive recovery helps Forretress to shrug off weak or resisted attacks. Keep in mind, however, that even with full investment, neutral special attacks still take a fair chunk out of Forretress's health, so ensure that you play off of its numerous resistances.</p>
<p>A more physically defensive spread (252 HP / 36 Def / 220 SpD with a Bold or a Relaxed nature) can be used with Toxic to check certain physical attackers. This spread ensures that Forretress is never 2HKOed by +1 Outrage from Dragon Dance Rayquaza. However, Forretress will still struggle against even non-Life Orb Extreme Killer Arceus packing Earthquake; as such, a spread of 252 HP / 136 Def / 120 SpD can be used to always avoid the 2HKO from a +2 Adamant Arceus using Earthquake. Life Orb Extreme Killer Arceus still possesses the ability to 2HKO after Stealth Rock with Earthquake almost all the time (guaranteed for Adamant, even without Stealth Rock); at this point, one should just use a fully physically defensive spread. Forretress also struggles with Lum Berry variants of Extreme Killer Arceus, which can absorb one Toxic and will beat Forretress more often than not, even if the Forretress is packing Pain Split.</p>
<p>A Ghost-type is a mandatory teammate to block Rapid Spin, which can otherwise waste all of Forretress's hard work; the Giratina formes are probably the best, and both have good synergy with Forretress, though Ghost Arceus makes a great choice as well. Blissey and Chansey can take most neutral or super effective special attacks directed at Forretress in stride, while supporting the team with Wish or Stealth Rock. In return, Forretress can easily set up on many of the physical attackers that threaten Chansey or Blissey, such as Garchomp and Groudon that lack a Fire-type move. Palkia can switch into many Pokemon that often come in on Forretress, such as Choice Specs Kyogre, Reshiram, Giratina-O, opposing Palkia, and Mewtwo, and threaten them with Thunder or its STAB Dragon-type attacks, and thus makes a great teammate. Sweepers such as most Calm Mind Arceus and Kyogre love having Forretress as a partner to both set up and remove Toxic Spikes. Ho-Oh and Reshiram enjoy Rapid Spin support, and can easily switch into most Fire-type attacks for Forretress; in return, it can tank Dragon-type moves for Reshiram and come in on defensive Groudon without a Fire-type move, which is a constant threat to Ho-Oh. Groudon also forms a potent physically defensive core with Forretress, and can set up Stealth Rock, phaze with Roar or Dragon Tail to rack up entry hazard damage, and scare Dialga off with STAB Earthquake. Kyogre can lessen Forretress's Fire-type weakness thanks to Drizzle and destroy Fire Punch Groudon, Ho-Oh, and select Arceus formes. Zekrom can stop defensive Kyogre and Ho-Oh with its STAB Bolt Strike. Dialga is also a great teammate, as it can come in after Forretress uses Volt Switch on the Giratina formes looking to spinblock, scaring them off and setting up Stealth Rock.</p>
<p>Despite the third slot being dedicated to a secondary hazard most of the time, Forretress can employ an additional utility move for fourth slot. Pain Split + Volt Switch allows Forretress to stay healthy and gain momentum. Pain Split + Toxic allows it to check Extreme Killer Arceus. Gyro Ball, Hidden Power Ice, and Payback also have their uses. Gyro Ball provides Forretress with a usably meaty STAB attack, and can hit common switch-ins such as Mewtwo, Darkrai, and Giratina-O for reasonable damage. It also gets a super effective hit on Kyurem-W, 2HKOing it even without Stealth Rock, although a Choice Specs-boosted Draco Meteor 2HKOs Forretress in return. Hidden Power Ice gives Forretress the ability to counter Gliscor, provided that Forretress is healthy, and a strong attack against Rayquaza and Shaymin-S. Payback can be used to check Latias and Latios, but Forretress can only switch into sets with Dragon Pulse and Grass Knot, as Thunder, Surf or Hidden Power Fire will maul it. However, a +1 Dragon Pulse will 3HKO Forretress from either of the twins, making Forretress a shaky check at best.</p>
<p>Stealth Rock can be used over Spikes or Toxic Spikes on more offensive teams lacking another entry hazard supporter. However, in most cases, it's a waste of Forretress's potential, especially considering the range of other Pokemon that can also set up Stealth Rock.</p>
[Other Options]
<p>As previously mentioned, Forretress is fairly limited outside of the listed options. Shed Shell is an option to escape from Magnezone, but Forretress will greatly miss the Leftovers recovery. Forretress learns Reflect and Light Screen, and can thus make decent use of a dual screens set, but it should usually opt to Volt Switch out or simply lay more entry hazards rather than use a screen. Under Light Screen and rain, however, Forretress can be a tough nut to crack with even Fire-type attacks. Protect can be used in the last slot to scout for foes carrying a surprise Fire-type attack, such as Espeon and Groudon, and also eases prediction when dealing with Choice item users, but the listed moves are generally more useful, and Forretress already has many move options as it is. Earthquake can be used to catch Heatran, Magnezone, and Reshiram on the switch. A Custap Berry in conjunction with Sturdy can allow Forretress to function as a sort of suicide lead, but that is usually a waste of its defensive potential.</p>
[Checks and Counters]
<p>Magic Bounce Espeon and Xatu with Hidden Power Fire are probably Forretress's biggest counters; they reflect its attempts to set up entry hazards and can OHKO with a 4x super effective Hidden Power. Tentacruel can also be annoying, as it absorbs Toxic Spikes, has access to Rapid Spin, and can scare Forretress off with a potentially rain-boosted Scald, while Forretress can do little back bar Earthquake. Forretress has trouble with any Pokemon carrying a Fire-type move as well, as most of them will OHKO if rain is not present; Reshiram, Dialga, Palkia, Giratina-O, and Mewtwo are the most common users. Although Groudon is normally setup fodder for Forretress, it will sometimes run Fire Punch or Overheat to fry the bug. Both Ho-Oh and Reshiram can switch in at will and threaten Forretress with their STAB Fire-type attacks, only really fearing Stealth Rock damage or Toxic. Kyogre has little to fear from any of Forretress's attacks, and can drown Forretress with its Water-type STAB moves. Finally, although rare in today's metagame, Heatran can roast Forretress with Lava Plume or Fire Blast, and Poison Heal Gliscor can freely come in and either Taunt Forretress or set up a Substitute.</p>