Garbodor (GP 2/2)

Wobble said:

Suicide Spiker anyone? There was a whole thread on it just a while back that passed QC.

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Flashrider57 said:

@Wobble: Whoops! Gotta add that when I can. Thanks!

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• I disagree with Toxic Spikes getting a slash right now, they are really bad in this meta. Amoonguss #1, Zangoose doesn't care for them. I don't see a real reason to use them right now, so I think Drain Punch should be the only option there.
  
• Giga Drain also needs a big mention, since without attack investment it will hit the main targets harder, such as Golem and Carracosta. The difference in damage isnt huge, but it gives Garbodor some form of recovery. I'd support Giga Drain being the secondary slash and Seed Bomb being moved to AC, as even with a -SpA nature it is still hitting the aforementioned threats harder.
  
  
• Also, I'd really expand on the teammates, since a lot of stuff loves Spikes support. Potential teammates: Swellow, Braviary, Zangoose, Cinccino, Emboar, Sawk, Klang, Samurott. I wouldn't mention all of these, mention Swellow, Zangoose, Cinccino and Klang specifically though in my opinion.
  
  
• In OO I think you mean Clear Smog and not Haze. Since Gunk Shot and Haze aren't even relatable.
  
  
• Honestly I think that Haze is more valuable than Clear Smog on Garbodor, since the amount of Pokemon that run a set-up move and Taunt are basically 0(Taunt + Bulk Up Vigoroth gg meta). and Haze allows you to stop Klang from setting up. So it at least has a little bit more viability.
  
  
• I'd also expand on c&c quite a bit, add stuff like Rampardos and other things that don't really care about it. Like most Special-attackers.
  
  
• I'm not exactly sure what's happening with the Offensive Spikes set, since MMF has made a set that was approved. So before this is fully approved we'll need to decide a plan of action for that.

Flashrider57 said:

Also, I was wondering about the Offensive Spikes set. I'll leave it to you QCers. In the meantime, if anyone else has any more comments, feel free to share! Thanks in advance for your input!

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Flashrider57 said:

Sorry for sounding a bit rude, but this needs to be GP checked. I have a busy schedule coming up, so I need to get this done as soon as possible. Thanks.

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[Overview]
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<p>Garbodor is the Trash Bag Pokemon, and at first glance most people assume that it IS trash. It has a small support movepool, and most of its offensive movepool is based around its horrible Special Attack stat. Additionally, Poison is not a good typing to have with all the Psychic-types roaming around NU, especially Shadow Tag Gothitelle. For those who look closer, however, it turns from one person's trash into another's treasure, for Garbodor has a couple of surprises. For example, its Poison typing, while leaving it weak to Psychic, works well with its good bulk, by allowing it to check common Fighting-types, such as Gurdurr that are also common. Furthermore, its supporting movepool includes Spikes and Toxic Spikes, while Clear Smog allows it to counter stat-boosters. Finally, it isn't a sitting duck, as it possesses a nice base 95 Attack stat, allowing it to hit hard with STAB Gunk Shot. If you use it right, Garbodor can turn out to be a nice addition to your team.</p>

[SET]
name: Spikes Support
move 1: Spikes
move 2: Drain Punch / Toxic Spikes
move 3: Gunk Shot / Rock Blast
move 4: Clear Smog / Giga Drain
item: Leftovers
ability: Aftermath
nature: Impish
evs: 252 HP / 240 Def / 16 Spe

[SET COMMENTS]
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<p>With access to Spikes, decent defensive typing, and good bulk, Garbodor makes a great supporter for its teammates. Spikes is essential, as it allows it Garbodor's teammates to sweep weakened opponents. Drain Punch is a useful move in general to provide semi-reliable recovery, while also threatening opponents such as Skuntank and Probopass, that who would otherwise set up all over Garbodor. Gunk Shot allows Garbodor to hit hard off of its good base 95 Attack stat, preventing Pokemon the likes of Exeggutor from switching in at will. Finally, Clear Smog counters stat-boosting efforts foes such as Bulk Up Gurdurr, who would otherwise be able to threaten Garbodor's teammates after several boosts.</p>

<p>However, There are a couple of other options for Garbodor. Toxic Spikes can be used over Drain Punch to provide another entry hazard, but with all the Poison-types running around NU, this is usually an inferior option. Likewise, Rock Blast can be used to deal with Substitute users such as Haunter, but is otherwise less useful than STAB Gunk Shot. Finally, Giga Drain can threaten Golem and Seismitoad, that who would otherwise threaten beat Garbodor, but the loss of Clear Smog can be painful when dealing with stat-boosters.</p>

[ADDITIONAL COMMENTS]
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<p>The given EVs maximize Garbodor's HP, while 16 Speed EVs allow Garbodor to outspeed Max maximum Speed Golem. The rest is dumped into Defense, hitting an EV jump point. However, A specially defensive spread can be used—shifting the EVs from Defense to Special Defense, in order to—lets Garbodor better tank hits from special attackere attackers (such as who?), but note that this lowers Garbodor's ability to take attacks from wall Fighting-type Pokemon. Also, Shed Shell can be used over replace Leftovers to escape Shadow Tag Gothitelle, but this lowers Garbodor's survivability. Movewise, Garbodor does have a couple more options. Haze can be used over Clear Smog to deal with stat-boosters that either possess a Steel-(remove hyphen, insert space)typing, such as Klang, or hide behind Substitutes, such as some Calm Mind Misdreavuses. However, this is not recommended, as it is illegal with Spikes, which is Garbodor's main niche in NU. Pain Split is another option for recovery, and allowing s it to heal off of high HP walls such as Lickilicky.</p>

<p>Unfortunately, Garbodor has quite the a number of problems in NU that it has to deal with. For example First and foremost, Shadow Tag Gothitelle can trap Garbodor and kill destroy it with STAB Psychic. Other bulky Psychic- and Ground-type Pokemon (such as?) can also threaten Garbodor with STAB attacks or set up as it switches out. Exeggutor can also switch into anything bar Gunk Shot and threaten to OHKO with STAB Psychic, Also, while Probopass can switch into any set that lacks Drain Punch, and proceed to set up entry hazards, paralyze Garbodor, or threaten it with STAB Earth Power. Additionally, it Garbodor fears Rapid Spinners Rapid Spin users, such as Armaldo, which can tank Garbodor's that can tank its hits and remove entry hazards. To deal with Psychic-types, Dark-types such as Absol and Skuntank are great teammates, as they can trap Psychic-types by threatening with STAB Pursuit. Additionally Furthermore, spinblockers such as Golurk help out a ton by preventing the removal of entry hazards from being removed, while also maintaining an offensive presence and utilizing Spikes to take down weakened enemies.</p>

[SET]
name: Offensive Spiker
move 1: Spikes
move 2: Toxic Spikes / Drain Punch
move 3: Gunk Shot
move 4: Seed Bomb
item: Air Balloon / Leftovers
ability: Aftermath
nature: Adamant / Jolly
evs: 4 HP / 252 Atk / 252 Spe

[SET COMMENTS]
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<p>While the previous set concentrates on Garbodor's utility value and bulk, this set focuses more on Garbodor's offensive potential with its and base 95 Attack stat. Spikes is once again the entry hazard of choice, allowing and allows its teammates to take advantage of a weakened opponents. Toxic Spikes is also used on this set, as it can cripple Pokemon such as Alomomola, while also luring in Poison-types for a teammate such as Shadow Tag Gothitelle to switch in on. However, Drain Punch can be used if Pokemon such as Probopass are problems problematic. Gunk Shot is Garbodor's STAB move, hitting and hits Grass-types such as Exeggutor hard, while also having a slight chance to cause poison. Finally, Seed Bomb hits dents Ground-types such as Seismitoad and Golem hard, who would otherwise cause problems for Garbodor.</p>

[ADDITIONAL COMMENTS]
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<p>The given EVs maximize power and Speed, allowing Garbodor to set up hazards quicker more quickly while maintaining an offensive presense presence. The choice between Air Balloon and Leftovers is up to choice, as Air Balloon gives Garbodor a temporary immunity to hazards and Ground-type moves, while Leftovers provides constant recovery. An alternate option is to use a combination of Focus Sash and Weak Armor to boost Garbodor's Speed; however, this is usually suited for teams that can afford the loss of Garbodor in exchange for fast Spikes set-up. Another option is to choose between natures. If one wants to 2HKO Golurk with Seed Bomb, then Adamant is the best option; however, Jolly Nature allows Garbodor to outspeed and OHKO Absol with Drain Punch.</p>

<p>Offensive teams will appreciate this set more than balanced teams will, so Pokemon such as Zangoose and Cinccino are great options for teammates. Additionally, Pokemon that get rid of Psychic-types, such as Skuntank, are also good teammates for Garbodor.</p>

[Other Options]
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<p>Garbodor has a couple more options that it can use effectively. It can use With Rain Dance and or Sunny Day to act as a combination weather and entry hazard setter, allowing it to , Garbodor can set up both weather and entry hazards, and fit onto weather teams effectively. Pain Split is another option, as it provides a semi-stable recovery option that also weakens the opponent. Haze is also is a possibility, as it is a better version of Clear Smog that hits Steel-types and as well as through Substitutes. However, it is illegal with Spikes, which is Garbodor's main niche in NU, making Haze and is hence an inferior choice. Curse is an option for boosting Garbodor's Attack and Defense, but Garbodor's typing makes it very vulnerable to Psychic-types. Stockpile is another way to boost Garbodor's defenses, but Stockpile is an inferior option as it can only boost to three levels. A specially attacking set is possible, but Garbodor's horrible Special Attack stat discourages this idea (why do you mention it as being possible, then?).</p>

<p>One A special mention goes to an Life Orb attacking set with Life Orb of Gunk Shot, Seed Bomb, Drain Punch, and Rock Polish. Rock Polish allows Garbodor to outspeed many major threats, such as Exeggutor, allowing Garbodor to and threaten some of its usual counters. Additionally, Garbodor's surprisingly good coverage, along with a Life Orb boost and its solid Attack stat, allows it to hit a number of threats hard with a LO boost off of its good Attack stat, such as Probopass, while its bulk allows it to survive hits. However, please note that Garbodor's Attack stat, while good, is usually not enough to sweep an opponent. Also In addition, Garbodor is usually more useful as a supporter rather as an offensive presence than as an attacking threat. Use the offensive set at your own risk.</p>

[Checks and Counters]
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<p>Despite Garbodor's good power and bulk, there are a number of Pokemon that can deal with Garbodor it easily. Bulky Psychic- and Ground-types threaten Garbodor easily, as they can threaten to kill Garbodor take it out before it has fully sets up Spikes. Additionally, powerful special attackers can blast Garbodor hard, as it is almost always uninvested in Special Defense. Shadow Tag Gothielle Gothitelle is a prime example, as it can trap Garbodor and kill KO it easily with STAB Psychic. Musharna is very bulky, and has Heal Bell to get rid of poison, while Duosion is immune to poison; and both can set up in Garbodor's face with Calm Mind. Exeggutor also threatens Garbodor, although it must beware a STAB Gunk Shot to the face. Duosion is immune to poison, and it can also set up Calm Mind without fear from Garbodor. </p>

<p>Probopass can easily switch into any Garbodor lacking Drain Punch, set up entry hazards, and either cripple Garbodor with Thunder Wave or kill KO it with Earth Power. Rotom-S is immune to hazards Spikes and Toxic Spikes and can cripple Garbodor with Trick, while Ramparados Rampardos can outright ignore entry hazard damage (not quite sure i get what you mean) and hurt Garbodor hard with STAB Head Smash or Earthquake.</p>

(any particular way you can organize the second paragraph of mons? the first paragraph is great, but the second reads more like a random listing and it's not as helpful as it could be :/. what i'm guessing you're getting at is to split them into two different sections: 1) pokemon that can take it out with ground moves and 2) disruptive stuff like trick, and recommend pokes that take reduced hazards damage, though if you could give a few more examples that'd be best :>)

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