You could probably use the scarf set in the annalysis.
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Ask a simple question, get a simple answer - VGC edition
- Thread starter makiri
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You could do a Scarf set (Rock Slide/Close Combat/X-Scissor/Earthquake or something like that), or maybe with Tailwind support.
In all honesty, I'm curious about why more people aren't using Hippowdon over TTar. Could it be because TTar has higher defenses? A Rock and Dark STAB? I don't know the big reason behind it, but Hippowdon just seems better than TTar. The only weather starter with a reliable recovery move; the lack of a Fighting, Ground, Bug, and Bullet/Mach Punch weakness; more viability as a TR pokemon; these are all great advantages to have. The Ice weakness is a pain, but Abomasnow is the only popular Ice type it needs to watch out for since Weavile can't really put any dents in it huge enough to 2HKO Sitrus Berry variants w/o an Expert Belt, and even then, there's his partners to worry about and his recovery move if he uses it. There's also the truth that most popular VGC pokemon with Ice moves are Water types more willing to use their STABs to kill the bulky hippo.
Long story short: Unless you really need to wall special attacks or need the speed of the Scarf set, TTar just seems to be outclassed by Hippowdon.
Long story short: Unless you really need to wall special attacks or need the speed of the Scarf set, TTar just seems to be outclassed by Hippowdon.
I've used Hippowdon before, and find it hilarious how it can sometimes pull a comeback win from a 1 vs 3 situation. It's way better than Tyranitar when it comes to physical attacks, because almost every common physical attacker has something super effective on TTar. However, Tyranitar is much better special defensively, and its Rock/Dark STAB is useful against many Pokemon. Also, Hippowdon's primary form of offense is to use Earthquake, which isn't always feasable, since you can't always have a partner immune to it in play.
I think one of the big problems Hippowdon has is that even if it changes the weather from rain to sand, it's still at a terrible disadvantage against Rain teams. Thus, a team with Hippowdon will either have to face off against the Rain with no weather changer, or be essentially down a Pokemon from the start and bring Hippowdon.
I think one of the big problems Hippowdon has is that even if it changes the weather from rain to sand, it's still at a terrible disadvantage against Rain teams. Thus, a team with Hippowdon will either have to face off against the Rain with no weather changer, or be essentially down a Pokemon from the start and bring Hippowdon.
T-tar has hideous typing to complement it's amazing stats. I agree, Hippowdon should be more popular. But Tyranitar has far greater coverage choices, and after the boost has around twice Hippowdon's SpDef.
These were always the problems I saw with it - you have to either build your team around Earthquake or spam Protect all the time if you want it to do anything, and it has poor matchups against other weathers (since it also has trouble with hail and even some sun abusers in sand). Also, unlike Hippowdon, Tyranitar is easier to fit on teams that aren't sand-based due to its superior move pool.
This might be why you're more likely to see him on a TR team. Cresselia is a great partner since a.) She sets up TR easily, b.) Has levitate, c.) The pokemon that most people use to beat Cresselia are countered by Hippowdon (Chandelure, TTar, maybe Scizor) while Cress is constantly supporting with stuff like T-Wave, TR, and/or Psychic/Ice Beam, and d.) Is tougher to break down than a steel wall reinforced with that Adamantium stuff off of The Avengers comics and the power to heal.
Out of all the weather starters, Hippowdon works the best under TR and shrugs off stray EQs from his partners, which can be very useful. All this coupled with the truth that many of TTar's weaknesses are very common in this year's VGC Metagame make Hippowdon a viable choice over TTar and a powerful threat in general.
Tyranitar has a lot going for it. Tyranitar has amazing offensive-typing. STAB Rock Slide is a gift from above for any VGC Pokemon, which helped out Terrakion in 2011 a lot. Crunch also hits Latios hard while it can't do much back since it's boost in SpD after Sand.
Unnerve Tyranitar is also quite a nice niche Pokemon. I was consulting with my bro Human and he suggested Fire Gem Fire Blast to OHKO Metagross, a common check of Tyranitar. I was more attracted to getting the extra damage on Charti Zapdos and Thundurus and the likes.
I was bored so I decided to see how Dark Gem Adamant Crunch does to common Trick Room Setters:
Unnerve Tyranitar is also quite a nice niche Pokemon. I was consulting with my bro Human and he suggested Fire Gem Fire Blast to OHKO Metagross, a common check of Tyranitar. I was more attracted to getting the extra damage on Charti Zapdos and Thundurus and the likes.
I was bored so I decided to see how Dark Gem Adamant Crunch does to common Trick Room Setters:
252 Atk Dark Gem Tyranitar Crunch vs 252 HP/4 Def Reuniclus: 132.72% - 157.6%
252 Atk Dark Gem Tyranitar Crunch vs 252 HP/4 Def Eviolite Dusclops: 83.67% - 100% (Sand will kill it but it'll still set-up Trick Room)
252 Atk Dark Gem Tyranitar Crunch vs 236 HP/36 Def Dusknoir: 116% - 138%252 Atk Dark Gem Tyranitar Crunch vs 252 HP/64 Def Cresselia: 81.94% - 97.8%
Not the best option for an Item, but it'll give you the upper hand.
252 Atk Dark Gem Tyranitar Crunch vs 252 HP/4 Def Eviolite Dusclops: 83.67% - 100% (Sand will kill it but it'll still set-up Trick Room)
252 Atk Dark Gem Tyranitar Crunch vs 236 HP/36 Def Dusknoir: 116% - 138%252 Atk Dark Gem Tyranitar Crunch vs 252 HP/64 Def Cresselia: 81.94% - 97.8%
Not the best option for an Item, but it'll give you the upper hand.
There's no doubt T-Tar is a boss, the only thing holding it back is a 4x weakness to fighting. Even the number of offensive capabilities cant stop the fact that T-Tar is frail in VGC. A fake out from hitmontop gets TR up and breaks a possible T-Tar sash or a Close Combat takes it down when it holds chople. Considering Intimitop is one of the most common pokes in VGC12 its a definite problem. This makes T-Tar more viable as a Goodstuff team member than a sandstorm team neccesity due to the fact that a good partner is an asset.
Its pretty simple on why ttar is so good. Sheer Versatility. He's the best weather setter in terms of stats. He's good in tailwind by slapping 100 speed evs, great for goodstuff just looking for weather control in case of a weather battle, great trickroom mon with rock slide for a high flinch ratio.Did I mention he can go mixed in a sun team with unnerve?
Hippo got ehhh low speed for weather set up but ehh who needs weather 1st. It has lol sp.def, and gets no bonus for SS. Did I mention ttar works well with cresselia too. Even better than hippo. He doesn't need fliers to use his best moves too. Ttar also has that movepool and is not limited to one stab which isn't good with out support.
Hippo got ehhh low speed for weather set up but ehh who needs weather 1st. It has lol sp.def, and gets no bonus for SS. Did I mention ttar works well with cresselia too. Even better than hippo. He doesn't need fliers to use his best moves too. Ttar also has that movepool and is not limited to one stab which isn't good with out support.
Dark gem is absolutely devastating, but losing a Chople is just as heavy a price to pay
yeah but dark gem on t tar is almost pointless when trying to stop TR, T-Tar will get FO'd 90% of the time. and then your best bet is just to score a KO on the TR user and try to stall it out
Unless you have a faster FO on your side.
Yes, a Faster FO is just what we need. There's only one problem, though: about 90% of the users of FO are IntimiTops that both lower TTar's attack to the point that it won't be able to KO the TR starter in time and are ready to shove their feet up TTar's *** at any waking moment.
I think you'll find on dedicated TR teams that percentage is significantly lower.
Edit: Did some quick math with the data sheet. Only 37% of FO users are Hitmontops, both Intimidate and Technician. Once again though, on dedicated TR teams that number falls hard.
Definitely noticed this, Scrafty is probably the most prevalent one
People like Scrafty that much. I guess the idea of 2 boosting moves, the great set of abilities it has, and a dual STAB that hits almost everybody for neutral damage are too good to pass up.
That and the fact it has amazing bulk with STAB drain punch ti increase its longevity
So my friend and I are relatively new to competitive Pokemon and we want to go to a regional this year. We like teaming up together for Double Battles and that's the way that we prefer to play with half of each other's Pokemon on the team.
Now we know we can't do that for the VGC tourneys. So here's my question:
Do they allow any form of coaching for any of the matches at a VGC tourney? My friend and I want to be able to get the feeling of being on a team with using one DS.
Now we know we can't do that for the VGC tourneys. So here's my question:
Do they allow any form of coaching for any of the matches at a VGC tourney? My friend and I want to be able to get the feeling of being on a team with using one DS.
Aww.. OK, thanks anyway.
After viewing Usage stats and other such things over these passed couple months, I have found that Skarmbliss has had it's own trends. As more things became common, new things rose up in usage to counter those things, and then something rises to counter that until we get to a very altered version of what we had in the beginning. For example, I have been thinking of running a 244HP/252Atk/12Speed Hitmontop to out-speed other Hitmontops by just one point (92 instead of 91). So I guess my question is this: Is this a smart decision for live tournaments, such as regionals? Will it be a stupid investment that will only lead to a drop in HP and no real gains or will Hitmontop be as common at regionals as it is on Skarmbliss and the investment actually lead to me outspeeding standard Hitmontops?
It's not necessarily a bad idea, but there's nothing keeping the Hitmontops you see at regs/nationals from having more than 4 speed EVs. It's not a bad idea to run some speed on your Hitmontop, but you can't take anything you see on PO for granted, and just because a certain EV spread or move is popular on PO it doesn't garentee that you'll be seeing it all the time.
Since you probably won't notice much of a difference from losing 1 HP, there isn't really much harm in investing in a point or two more speed. However, the worth of having a bit more speed really depends on how important it is for your team that your Hitmontop is able to outrun other Hitmontop (and I suppose Metagross as well). Personally, if your going to do some speedcreep, I would say to have 93 or 94 speed if it is really important to outrun other Base 70s, just to be sure. But even then, there's always going to be the ones that actually invest a sizable amount of EVs into speed.
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