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CAP 16 CAP 5 - Part 12 - Flavor Ability Discussion

Discussion in 'CAP Process Archive' started by Birkal, Apr 28, 2013.

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  1. Birkal

    Birkal caw
    is a member of the Site Staffis an Artistis a Super Moderatoris a Community Contributoris a CAP Contributoris a Battle Server Admin Alumnusis a Smogon Media Contributor Alumnus
    Super Moderator

    Oct 12, 2010
    Even though the playtest is going on (read about it here, we still need to decide on a flavor ability for Malaconda! Remember though, this ability should be little significance competitively. Malaconda already has two competitive abilities, and our Policy Review Committee has deemed that two is the maximum number.

    The following abilities are banned from this discussion:

    Air Lock
    Bad Dreams
    Color Change
    Sand Veil
    Shadow Tag
    Slow Start
    Snow Cloak
    Victory Star
    Wonder Guard
    Zen Mode

    Arena Trap
    Huge Power
    Magic Bounce
    Magic Guard
    Pure Power
    Sand Stream
    Serene Grace
    Snow Warning
    Speed Boost​

    Furthermore, I'm going to come right out with it and say that Unreleased Dream World abilities are banned from this dicussion. We don't need to putz around with Malaconda having Drought as its unreleased DW ability; that opens up a dangerous can of worms.

    If you're left wondering why these abilities are banned, check out this thread to learn more. Remember, the ability we choose here is an Ineffective Ability, meaning that it should be inferior to both Harvest and Infiltrator (Malaconda's competitive abilities). As is now standard with flavor discussions and polls, I will be slating any entry that is a) competitively inferior to Malaconda's other two options and b) follows the above rules. If you have any other questions about how this thread works, don't be afraid to PM me.

    I don't think we need too much time to dwell on this, so you can expect this thread to be open for three to four days.

    CAP 5 so far:

    Name: Malaconda
    [​IMG] [​IMG]
    animated (open)
    [​IMG][​IMG] [​IMG]

    Typing: Dark / Grass
    Abilities: Harvest / Infiltrator
    Stats: 115 HP / 100 Atk / 60 Def / 40 SpA / 130 SpD / 55 Spe
    Height: 5.5 m / 18’ 0’’
    Weight: 108.8 kg / 240 lbs
  2. Stratos

    Stratos Banned deucer.

    Aug 26, 2010

    • one of the seven deadly sins
    • makes sense in conjunction with harvest
    • what caused adam and eve to eat the apple
    • competitively useless
  3. Eagle4


    Apr 14, 2012
    Now, I can see three options Malaconda can have regarding our non-competitive ability.

    Gluttony: Reasoning behind this is fairly straightforward. Gluttony is one of the seven deadly sins, which was the concept behind Malaconda, as the snake in Genesis. Gluttony as a pokemon ability also relates to Harvest as berry flavour, meaning we have double flavour going on here. I'm throwing my support behind Gluttony for now, it is certainly the most fitting.

    Unnerve: This ability also has double flavour, but to a lesser extent. Unnerve fits with the berry flavour, whilst showing off Malaconda's sinister manner.

    No Ability: This is for those who feel that there is no need for Malaconda to gain a flavour ability. To be honest though, no pokemon needs a flavour ability, but it is always nice to have one, since flavour is ALWAYS NICE.
  4. dwarfstar

    dwarfstar mindless philosopher

    Apr 7, 2011
    I'm inclined to say we don't really need an extra ability. Not everything has two normal abilities and a DW ability; I think throwing one on seems a little pointless.

    That being said, if we end up having one, I'd be inclined to support Gluttony or Unnerve, for the reasons Eagle4 outlined.
  5. Sgt.Moose


    Oct 17, 2010
    - It is a big snake, so why the heck not?
    - Fits the berry-theme it's playstyle has.

    Ok, bad choice. Its craps over other Malacondas.
  6. Unoriginal Name

    Unoriginal Name

    Jan 25, 2013
    Truant is disallowed. Anyway...
    First thoughts:

    Gluttony seems like a nice choice. Makes sense flavour-wise and all, plus kind of cool. It's not like this thing gets Belly Drum, after all.
    Unnerve allows Malaconda to beat other Malaconda 1v1, and would generally be superior to Infiltrator due to this, at least in a metagame centered around Malaconda. Do not want.
    No ability is kind of... Eh. I just want a little bit of flavour to go along with this thing. It wouldn't be bad or unfitting, persay, just a little, you know, less desirable than an ability.
  7. dwarfstar

    dwarfstar mindless philosopher

    Apr 7, 2011
    I don't think we need to worry about whether Unnerve will allow Malaconda to beat others of its own kind 1v1, as Harvest is an integral part of its niche. That said, Gluttony does seem a little better.
  8. paintseagull

    paintseagull pink wingull
    is an Artist Alumnusis a Forum Moderator Alumnus

    Jul 22, 2010
    Gluttony or nothing. Unnerve goes against Malaconda's personality. Malaconda wants you to eat the berry. Eat it now. It's delicious. Have more!!
  9. dwarfstar

    dwarfstar mindless philosopher

    Apr 7, 2011
    Ooh, hadn't thought of that. Unnerve is a bad idea, then.

    ...Except Gluttony would sort of defeat that purpose as well, since Malaconda himself will be eating it before you get the chance.
  10. Bughouse

    Bughouse Like ships in the night, you're passing me by
    is a member of the Site Staffis a Forum Moderator Alumnusis a CAP Contributor Alumnusis a Tiering Contributor Alumnusis a Contributor Alumnus

    May 28, 2010
    Aside from the obvious Gluttony suggestion, I'd like to also bring up Aftermath and Cursed Body.

    Aftermath - "A consequence, especially of a disaster or misfortune." Banishment from the Garden of Eden.
    Cursed Body - Maybe not so much the body being cursed, but the Golden Apple sure is. It started the Trojan War.
    Another obvious simple option for a snake is Shed Skin, though I don't favor this one, since it's kinda boring.
  11. Eagle4


    Apr 14, 2012
    Despite these abilities having somewhat decent flavour, Cursed Body, and to a greater extent, Shed Skin, are all viable competitive abilities for Malaconda. Aftermath is a nice idea, but I lean towards Gluttony simply from the fact that it has better flavour, and is less competitive.
  12. dwarfstar

    dwarfstar mindless philosopher

    Apr 7, 2011
    @srk1214: As much as I love the idea of Cursed Body in terms of flavor, I have to point out that while those three abilities are not specifically banned, I don't think they fall under the category of "ineffective ability" that we're looking for, since all three have some competitive utility. Shed Skin helps mitigate the problems with Rest and any stray burn/deadly poison that Malaconda might encounter, and Aftermath punishes physical attackers who KO Malaconda with contact moves. (It's also worth mentioning that Aftermath's Japanese name, Yuubaku, translates to "detonation", and that ability makes no flavor-sense on any Pokemon who can't learn Explosion and/or Selfdestruct.)
    EDIT: ER made an excellent point regarding Cursed Body allowing Malaconda to force switches and spam Glare. I'll have to oppose this as well.
  13. Bughouse

    Bughouse Like ships in the night, you're passing me by
    is a member of the Site Staffis a Forum Moderator Alumnusis a CAP Contributor Alumnusis a Tiering Contributor Alumnusis a Contributor Alumnus

    May 28, 2010
    Remember that Malaconda has Harvest. Anything not good in some unique niche will never be used. I agree that potentially Shed Skin falls into this category. I also cede that Aftermath's original Japanese is about Detonation and that all who have the ability can use Explosion/Selfdestruct, so I'll table Aftermath.

    But I don't understand the fight against Cursed Body lol. It's not competitive on Malaconda. For all intents and purposes Cursed Body is as useless as Gluttony. Harvest outclasses Cursed Body in all cases.

    We already have Infiltrator. Cursed Body is of comparable outclassed-ness.
  14. ElectivireRocks

    ElectivireRocks Banned deucer.

    Nov 12, 2011
    I strongly disagree with this. Malaconda can take almost any special SE hit including Ninetales' sun boosted Fire Blasts and Volcarona's unboosted Bug Buzzs, which would force switches if Cursed Body activates and make its Glare spamming job even easier. Ok probably not in Volcarona's case, but pokemon such as Ninetales, Thundurus and Heatran would definitely need to switch out.
    Even without berries it has semi-reliable healing tools in Aromatherapy and Synthesis.

    Gluttony is fine for what I'm concerned.
  15. Shiruba


    Mar 1, 2013
    I'd like to nominate Pressure for flavour. Not only is it inferior to Harvest, but it also makes sense - it's pressuring you to eat the apple.

    "C'mon... You know you want it... It'd taste good! Not like anything is gonna happen, anyway... Just a bite?"
  16. akela


    Mar 22, 2012
    Solar Power - Normally would be competitive. However, with the stats Malaconda has, I feel it would not be competitive.

    Overgrow - Like this is competitive in the slightest.

    Pickup - Picks up discarded berries?

    I don't know. Just trying to give others some more ideas for flavor abilities.
  17. Objection


    Sep 27, 2008
    Flavourwise, I think this is the best ability that has been suggested so far. Gluttony is a close second by virtue of the whole seven deadly sins thing.

    I'd like to suggest one that may seem a little odd: Unburden. Flavourwise, I'm thinking once someone has picked the apple from Malaconda, they have succumbed to the temptation, making evil (and by extension Malaconda) stronger in some way. Competitively, I don't know much, but it sounds like Malaconda would find it extremely difficult to use the speed boost from Unburden to go on a killing spree.
  18. Nyktos

    Nyktos Custom Loser Title

    Aug 27, 2008
    I like Pickpocket a lot. Stealing items is reasonably fitting for Malaconda, but the part that makes it really work for me is that you steal the item only when the opponent hits you -- i.e. Malaconda lures the opponent in with the apple and then steals an item. It's also an ability distributed solely as the Dream World ability for Dark-types, so the precedent makes sense.

    I also definitely like Gluttony, for reasons already stated. Malaconda doesn't quite scream "glutton" to me, but it works well enough. No third ability is fine, too.
  19. Brotagonist


    Apr 23, 2013
    Gluttony being one of the seven deadly sins makes sense with the religious motifs in Malaconda.
  20. Kirbyofthestars


    Nov 17, 2012
    I think I agree with this, combined with the fact that Gluttony has limited usefullness. However, I could see it having potential to open up a Liechi Berry set (although it might not work in many situations).
  21. The Steam Punk

    The Steam Punk

    Jan 1, 2013
    Gluttony makes a lot of sense, so I'm OK with that, but I'd also like to suggest Anticipation, since snakes are supposed to be clever, you know? It's also quite inferior to Harvest, and even Infiltrator. Just my two cents.

    EDIT: Just saw Pickpocket up a few posts. Love the idea.
  22. dwarfstar

    dwarfstar mindless philosopher

    Apr 7, 2011
    Pickpocket actually makes a lot of sense. That's the best one so far IMO.

    Objection, the Japanese name of the ability translates to "acrobatics". That doesn't seem to fit Malaconda too well...
  23. Homeslice


    Sep 14, 2010
    Totally throwing all my support behind Pressure, caused Eve to eat the apple and it's completely useless on Malaconda because you can't PP stall with it w/o Leppa Berry and Harvest
  24. Deck Knight

    Deck Knight RIP DryPass Vaporeon
    is a Forum Moderatoris a CAP Contributoris a Smogon Media Contributor Alumnus
    CAP Head Mod

    May 27, 2005
    Uncompetitive Abilities:

    Aftermath / Anger Point - Wrath equivalent. Though the latter would be situationally scary with Sucker Punch.
    Cute Charm - a stand-in for Lust.
    Defiant / Justified - A staple of "Prideful" Pokemon and fairly irrelevant given most common Intimidate Pokemon easily defeat it.
    Gluttony - Exactly what it says on the tin.
    Pickpocket / Rivalry - Greed / Envy equivalent.
    Stall - Sloth equivalent.

    Personally I like Gluttony, Defiant, and Stall the most out of these choices.
  25. RivRivRiv


    Mar 12, 2013
    I happily throw my support behind Pressure and Pickpocket, but here are a few others to mull over.

    Anger Point: Flavour wise this works off the whole "if you leave a snake alone it'll leave you alone but if you don't it'll probably try to kill you" idea. Competitively it's pretty useless, although Mala certainly has more chance of using it effectively than any Pokemon who currently has it. We'd need more discussion on wether it is competitively viable.

    Limber: Flexible in Japanese, makes sense for a snake, and completely outclassed by Harvest and Lum Berry.

    Oblivious: Malaconda is so evil and heartless that it could never love another creature. Obviously useless because no one uses infatuation moves.

    Stall: This reminds me of another of the sins, Sloth. Does nothing for Malaconda beyond making sure Payback gets its power doubled.

    Edit: Ninja'd on Stall and Anger Point. That'll teach me to get distracted mid-reply
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