I too had stopped playing because of Mega Mom. Mega Mom is literally the destroyer of metas and has poisoned the OU tier. And no I am not a noob, I keep around 1800 rating constantly.
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Kangaskhanite Tiering Discussion [+Demographics Poll Added to OP]
- Thread starter McMeghan
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We have never banned anything for being over centralizing otherwise politoad who defined multiple play styles would've been banned in 5th gen without a doubt. So stop bringing that up please.
On the other hand we do ban things for being "broken" or in this case we're deciding to ban something who has easy set up opportunities, essentially has no counters and is able to choose which fights it can't beat (not keldeoish way of choosing things it can or can't beat) but instead being forced to choose between multiple viable options. Overall due to the fact that kang is becoming similar to dpp ou and garchomp I think it's safe to ban since it has no opportunity cost (since when was using one of the best if not the best mega atm considered a cost?) but also it provides easy momentum and your opponent is pretty much forced to give up a mon every time kanga comes in safely which isn't that hard. Think the only widely accepted answer to kanga is sableye and even that's not a guarantee since your opponent might have aroma/heal bell support or you know will o miss can still miss.
Besides sableye I believe this is the best way to deal with mega kanga http://i.imgur.com/cEzjsNt.gif
Alright. There is alot of arguing and not alot of discussion on the actual issue at hand: is Kangaskhanite too good to be allowed to continue existing in the OU metagame? First let us keep in mind it is Kangaskhanite, not Kangaskhan itself looking at being banned. Now what makes Mega-Kangaskhan good enough to be looked at for a ban? Good stats? With 100+ base stats across the board (except SpA which doesn't matter, and even then is good enough for specific coverage moves) Mega-Kan's stats are undoubtedly great. The only comparable Pokemon in terms of stat distribution outside of Ubers are the base 100 'mons (Celebi, Jirachi, Mew, Victini, Shaymin), Kyurem and Kyurem-B, and Tyranitar. Now the reason Mega-Kan's is stronger than the base 100's is obvious; considerably increased attack stat and more bulk. So we already see we have a Pokemon that outclasses base 100 stats (which are what tend to be the top-end acceptable stat distrobution for OU).
Now lets look at last three. Kyurem, Kyurem-B and T-Tar. All three of these also have exceptionally high stat distribution so what makes them non-ubers? Two reasons, first: Speed. The two Kyurems fall under the base 95 speed tier and T-tar sits at a measly 65 base speed. The second is typing. T-tar may have great defenses and HP all around but it also has 6 2x weaknesses and a 7th 4x weakness to fighting. The Kyurem's boast 5 different 2x weaknesses. Mega-Kangaskhan however sits on a throne with just one 2x weakness to fighting as well as an immunity. So now we have a Pokemon with strong offensive pressure and above average speed that has only one weak spot to abuse making it VERY hard to cleanly revenge even if you cannot counter it. But does that make it ban worthy? No, just a very strong OU contender. So what makes it ban-worthy? It's ability.
Now let us keep in mind again that it is the item, not the Pokemon that is up for a ban here. This is important because the only way to receive the ability "Parental Bond" is through the use of the item "Kangaskhanite". So for all intents and purposes Kangaskhanite=Parental Bond. This is where the problems begin. Khangaskhanite right off the bat is strictly better than Choice Band. Same amount of damage increase while allowing you to select different moves is absurdly powerful. Would you agree with GameFreak making an item called "Indecisive Band" that gave the same 50% attack boost while still allowing you to choose your move? I guarantee there would be a huge uproar as it ruins the strategic use of the item in the first place. So now we DO have an item that does that. Is that what we as a Pokemon community want to allow to be used in a competitive scene or is that too broken? The precedence for this exact situation has shown us before that no; it is indeed too good to be allowed. Case and Point Soul Dew. Soul Dew's instant Choice Specs while still allowing the use of different moves (particularly more boosting moves) was and still just too damn good. Now to be fair Soul Dew also gave that 1.5x SpD boost aswell. But Kangaskhanite also gives many other beneficial boosts aswell: Kangaskhanite deals the extra 1.5x damage in a separate hit meaning it breaks through subs, breaks through sashes, breaks through sturdy, doubles the chance at a secondary effect occurring, doubles the secondary effect of a move in general, and doubles the chance at a critical hit. So if an item that gave a downside-free Choice Specs + a downside-free Assualt Vest was good enough to banned, then isn't an item that give a downside-free Choice Band + pseudo-Infiltrator + mini-Mold Breaker + Serene Grace + only the GOOD half of Simple + Super Luck ban-worthy aswell?
My vote is yes. Kangaskhanite for Ubers.
Now lets look at last three. Kyurem, Kyurem-B and T-Tar. All three of these also have exceptionally high stat distribution so what makes them non-ubers? Two reasons, first: Speed. The two Kyurems fall under the base 95 speed tier and T-tar sits at a measly 65 base speed. The second is typing. T-tar may have great defenses and HP all around but it also has 6 2x weaknesses and a 7th 4x weakness to fighting. The Kyurem's boast 5 different 2x weaknesses. Mega-Kangaskhan however sits on a throne with just one 2x weakness to fighting as well as an immunity. So now we have a Pokemon with strong offensive pressure and above average speed that has only one weak spot to abuse making it VERY hard to cleanly revenge even if you cannot counter it. But does that make it ban worthy? No, just a very strong OU contender. So what makes it ban-worthy? It's ability.
Now let us keep in mind again that it is the item, not the Pokemon that is up for a ban here. This is important because the only way to receive the ability "Parental Bond" is through the use of the item "Kangaskhanite". So for all intents and purposes Kangaskhanite=Parental Bond. This is where the problems begin. Khangaskhanite right off the bat is strictly better than Choice Band. Same amount of damage increase while allowing you to select different moves is absurdly powerful. Would you agree with GameFreak making an item called "Indecisive Band" that gave the same 50% attack boost while still allowing you to choose your move? I guarantee there would be a huge uproar as it ruins the strategic use of the item in the first place. So now we DO have an item that does that. Is that what we as a Pokemon community want to allow to be used in a competitive scene or is that too broken? The precedence for this exact situation has shown us before that no; it is indeed too good to be allowed. Case and Point Soul Dew. Soul Dew's instant Choice Specs while still allowing the use of different moves (particularly more boosting moves) was and still just too damn good. Now to be fair Soul Dew also gave that 1.5x SpD boost aswell. But Kangaskhanite also gives many other beneficial boosts aswell: Kangaskhanite deals the extra 1.5x damage in a separate hit meaning it breaks through subs, breaks through sashes, breaks through sturdy, doubles the chance at a secondary effect occurring, doubles the secondary effect of a move in general, and doubles the chance at a critical hit. So if an item that gave a downside-free Choice Specs + a downside-free Assualt Vest was good enough to banned, then isn't an item that give a downside-free Choice Band + pseudo-Infiltrator + mini-Mold Breaker + Serene Grace + only the GOOD half of Simple + Super Luck ban-worthy aswell?
My vote is yes. Kangaskhanite for Ubers.
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Might not be that important to note, but the other guys, Pokemon Online, already have this guy banned (along with Blaziken and Mega Gengar). These idiots think the handful of people running the site are solely responsible when pretty much everyone with half a brain in this community knows it. Lol.
To be fair akuma isn't really broken. His mix up game is the issue. Vortexing or a mix up that leads into itself forces you to guess your way out of a mix up with multiple outcomes. Akuma's issue is that he has low vitality (which isn't really that huge of an issue). It's not really akuma that's broken with his tools it's the mechanics and how they work together, which is why in ultra sf4 delayed wake up exist. No more guaranteed wake up= no more free vortex. All anyone has to do yo beat akuma is apply proper footsies, bait dps, and hit him with a few bnb combos and he is done.
Kangaskhan unlike akuma is just unstoppable under the correct conditions there is no tweaking the mechanics or adjust this or that to make it any less broken. There is currently no way to stop her from killing SOMETHING each and every time she touches the field.
Having read through the thread a bit more and looked over Mega-Kangaskhan's options, I think I'd like to retract my previous opinion of keeping Mega-Kangaskhan in OU. Her coverage is just so broad, and yes there is a huge case of 4MSS limiting her options somewhat, but the main issue seems to lie with the fact that Mega-Kangaskhan has something to handle nearly every single check or "counter" against it.
The only truly effective way I've seen Mega-Kangaskhan handled is Sableye's priority WoW, and simple cleric support can patch this up (especially when you take into account the fact that many Fairies make good clerics and have SE STAB on Sableye).
I don't know if I can retract my previous vote, but I think I'd like to see Kangaskhanite banned to Ubers.
The only truly effective way I've seen Mega-Kangaskhan handled is Sableye's priority WoW, and simple cleric support can patch this up (especially when you take into account the fact that many Fairies make good clerics and have SE STAB on Sableye).
I don't know if I can retract my previous vote, but I think I'd like to see Kangaskhanite banned to Ubers.
Pretty sure he's talking about SFII Akuma and not SFIV. SFII Akuma was banned from tournament play.
Mega Mom just gets too many things for free and invalidates an entire item. Other Pokemon with similar power/speed can be revenge killed by a super effective Focus Sash-er, but not Mega Mom.
To be fair SFII akuma wasn't even unblockable without knowing the code to get him. Not saying that is why he was banned, but it was one of the few things that was discussed (fighting gamer first pokemon player second).
One of the reasons for his ban was not everyone knew the sf 2 code to unlock him which caused a lot of players to be unfamiliar with the match up. So without knowing the code people couldn't adequately train against akuma.
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Look. This is ridiculous. I run Kanga and he is easily one of the less bulky mega's as far as being able to take a hit. Where do we go next? Blaziken, Gengar, Kanga, then what? Gyrados? One of the greatest things in pokemon battling is strategic counter interference. Sounds to me like some people need to learn how to counter it by taking the time to build teams that counter these new threats. OU man.
Look, there are literally 66 pages that explains why what you are saying is completely wrong. Go read the thread before making posts like you just did -_-.
66 Pages (Double what was here when i last viewed the page) and no decent anti ban argument? this shit is over.
but reading the repetition in this thread, answering the same point repeatedly cause scrubs don't read the thread....its gonna give me nightmares.
hope next suspect (if any) actually provides decent discussion. Mega Luke will be fun. Genesect and Deo-S too.
Nope.
Not happening.
fine i got this.
Nothing counters Kanga. Nothing. well Sableye does but thats it. and if you think Kanga isn't bulky you probably have never fought him, Its bulkier than Celebi and Jirachi, Walls last gen, And its has only 1 Weakness.
the rest of your post is legitimate nonsense.
but reading the repetition in this thread, answering the same point repeatedly cause scrubs don't read the thread....its gonna give me nightmares.
hope next suspect (if any) actually provides decent discussion. Mega Luke will be fun. Genesect and Deo-S too.
No.
Nope.
Not happening.
fine i got this.
Nothing counters Kanga. Nothing. well Sableye does but thats it. and if you think Kanga isn't bulky you probably have never fought him, Its bulkier than Celebi and Jirachi, Walls last gen, And its has only 1 Weakness.
the rest of your post is legitimate nonsense.
I'm sorry. Did you say Mega Mom, with 105/100/100 defenses was not bulky?
252+ Atk Silk Scarf Arceus Extreme Speed vs. 0 HP / 0 Def Mega Kangaskhan: 163-193 (46.4 - 54.9%) -- 66% chance to 2HKO
Nope.
Which is exactly what this thread has been created for. If you believe Kangaskhanite should remain OU and has counters please support your reasoning with factual hard-data. This is your chance to keep Mega-Kangaskhan from going to Ubers, don't waste it. Also note that Blaziken was banned, not Blazikinite.
Wow, just wow. I intended to stay out of this after yesterday, since the discussion was becoming exponentially worse, but this... yeah. Firstly, if Base 105 HP and 100 Defenses (better all-around than Jirachi) isn't bulky enough for a sweeper, then I don't know what is. Secondly, though, you're just assuming that "because one mega got banned, all of them will be." That's what is known as a slippery slope argument, and it's utterly false. So please, go back to trying to sign up for tutoring on a tournament thread.
It's your job to read the thread, but...I'll say this anyways.
The problem with "taking the time to build teams that counter these new threats" is that this is the concept of overcentralization. It shows that a Pokemon is SO broken that it forces people to make entire teams to stop a single Pokemon or two, which is absolutely unhealthy because it doesn't allow people to be creative with team building and therefore prevents many new players from joining. Saying that Kangaskhan is a "less bulky mega" is NOT a good argument. For a sweeper, 105/100/100 IS bulky--bulkier than Hydreigon AND all the Base 100 Pokemon.
Blaziken was banned as a whole because...I don't need to explain--it's Blaziken. It was banned in Gen 5 for good reason. Mega Gengar was banned because it had the raw stats, Shadow Tag, and the movepool to abuse. It was the best Perish Trapper, could actually attack, Disable was still just as viable, and it almost guaranteed victory in the hands of a wise battler. Mega Kangaskhan has so many great qualities for even a sweeper in Ubers that even Deoxys-A is jealous of. Parental Bond is mostly the problem; the moves Mega Momma uses is the filler. 200 Seismic Toss, Sub/Sash Breaker, and not to mention that Parental Bond is basically like Choice Band Serene Grace on TOP of all that, except you can freely switch attacks. Guys, either hit can also Crit...oh, and she gets Wish/Protect. That's what I ALWAYS wanted to see, right?
We've done calculations. We've done arguments. We've even seen odd moves that she can learn and they're abused like no other. It's clear that Mega Momma has no counters because nothing can truly switch into everything. Sableye is the closest it gets to a downright counter, and even then, it's only because it has Priority Will-O-Wisp and Recover. Other walls--bulkier ones--are taken down without a second thought. CHECKING Mega Kangaskhan is still difficult because most Pokemon are 2HKO'd the the ones that aren't really can't do much against her. Cresselia came to mind with me, but her pathetic offenses and lack of Will-O-Wisp don't go far. Revenge Killing seems to be the only way I've heard of taking our angry marsupial out, which is still made partially difficult because of the fact that many Pokemon can't lay a decent hit on it before they're taken down. Infernape is regarded as the best Revenge Killer (rightfully so). ONE Pokemon.
This thread has enraged me...a lot, to be honest. I'm sure it did the same for many others. I'm taking a break from posting for a while.
There are a million reasons why I want to delete this post, but given the amount of quality responses regarding Kangamom's bulk that its gotten in the past 11 minutes, I've decided to keep it. This is a perfect example of faulty theorymon and fallacious reasoning that is almost too bad to stomach. Any more posts this bad will be deleted or infracted.
I am certain that MKhan will be banned. When you stack up the pros and cons of keeping her in or out, the pros way outweigh the cons. Mentioned many times before is the path of slowly removing many of the megas. I do think that this Pokemon brings something unique to the table that no other Pokemon can match, and that is her ability obviously. Blaziken and Gengar were powerfull for sure, but Blaziken would fall to priority and Gengar lost levitate, so if you were able to get an earthquake off, you could potentially kill him. Both of those Pokemon could not OHKO through sashes, sturdy, or substitutes. On top of all of that, 90% of the time or more, this Pokemon will be standing even if you get an attack in. As it has been said before many times, after you weaken her, you have to have a strong revenge killer that withstands dark type attacks.
I hope that after the banning of MKhan, people will calm down and stop quick banning Pokemon. I was saddened by the Blaziken ban, because he has checks. Azumarill and Talonflame, both of which are fairly common can check and counter Blaziken. I wasn't sad at all by the loss of Gengar, and expected that from the day I saw his ability. And Kangaskhan is too powerful to let run loose in OU. BUT! I hope it ends here, and my thought is that it will. M-Lucario, M-Gyrados, M-Pinsir, M-Mawile, and M-Medicham all have exploitable weaknesses. And none of them can OHKO through Sash/Sub/Sturdy or have the titanic bulk (with only one weakness) to the table. So, though MKhan had a short run, let us hope that as a community, we will stop banning these Megas after the loss of this OP kangaroo.
I hope that after the banning of MKhan, people will calm down and stop quick banning Pokemon. I was saddened by the Blaziken ban, because he has checks. Azumarill and Talonflame, both of which are fairly common can check and counter Blaziken. I wasn't sad at all by the loss of Gengar, and expected that from the day I saw his ability. And Kangaskhan is too powerful to let run loose in OU. BUT! I hope it ends here, and my thought is that it will. M-Lucario, M-Gyrados, M-Pinsir, M-Mawile, and M-Medicham all have exploitable weaknesses. And none of them can OHKO through Sash/Sub/Sturdy or have the titanic bulk (with only one weakness) to the table. So, though MKhan had a short run, let us hope that as a community, we will stop banning these Megas after the loss of this OP kangaroo.
Sorry, I think if I read one more post comparing Khan to Pinsir I'm gonna blow.
Mega Pinsir has
Weaknesses to the most common attacking types (Fire, Ice, Electricity, Rock, and Flying)
Mega Pinsir can't attack while boosting.
Talonflame, Talonflame, Talonflame.
He has a 25% Stealth Rock weakness in base and a 50% Stealth Rock weakness in Mega
He's walled by Skarmory who can 2HKO with Brave Bird, Bronzong who can retaliate and OHKO with Rock Slide, Zapdos who can OHKO, Landorous-T with Intimidate + Stone Edge, Trolled to Death by Foul Play Sableye and defeated by basically anything with good physical bulk that carries a move of the aforementioned type. (Rocky Helmet Slowbro is a good candidate I think)
A Mega Pinsir check is any fast special sweeper that switches in after another pokemon faints. 99% of the time a special sweeper has an Ice/Fire/Electric Move. Also throw Rotom-W on that list and bonus points if the other poke has electric typing which resists flying STAB. Also, if Reflect is up, then MP is as good as dead because he depends on OHKOs with either Return/Earthquake/Quick Attack. He doesn't have bulk or defensive typing to last long. On top of that, Pinsir depends on Jolly Nature to avoid being outsped by Garchomp, Salamence, Jirachi, Landorous and all the other threats in 90 - 100 speed tier that carry something he's super effective to (which is like all of them). So he misses out on extra damage from an Adamant nature.
Since this is the Kanga thread I'll wrap up without going into scarves n' stuff.
But before I finish, lets make something clear, Pinsir is an absolute monster once set up with SD. However, it's hard for him to switch in and actually set up.. On top of that, even if he kills one poke with a revenge Quick Attack you can send in so many things against him as long as you're not stuck with 3 layers of spikes and stealth rock on your side of the field.
Finally, below is the set Mega Pinsir depends on (unlike Kanga who has such versatility)
Quick Attack (Flying)
Return (Flying)
Earthquake
Swords Dance
Mega Pinsir has
Weaknesses to the most common attacking types (Fire, Ice, Electricity, Rock, and Flying)
Mega Pinsir can't attack while boosting.
Talonflame, Talonflame, Talonflame.
He has a 25% Stealth Rock weakness in base and a 50% Stealth Rock weakness in Mega
He's walled by Skarmory who can 2HKO with Brave Bird, Bronzong who can retaliate and OHKO with Rock Slide, Zapdos who can OHKO, Landorous-T with Intimidate + Stone Edge, Trolled to Death by Foul Play Sableye and defeated by basically anything with good physical bulk that carries a move of the aforementioned type. (Rocky Helmet Slowbro is a good candidate I think)
A Mega Pinsir check is any fast special sweeper that switches in after another pokemon faints. 99% of the time a special sweeper has an Ice/Fire/Electric Move. Also throw Rotom-W on that list and bonus points if the other poke has electric typing which resists flying STAB. Also, if Reflect is up, then MP is as good as dead because he depends on OHKOs with either Return/Earthquake/Quick Attack. He doesn't have bulk or defensive typing to last long. On top of that, Pinsir depends on Jolly Nature to avoid being outsped by Garchomp, Salamence, Jirachi, Landorous and all the other threats in 90 - 100 speed tier that carry something he's super effective to (which is like all of them). So he misses out on extra damage from an Adamant nature.
Since this is the Kanga thread I'll wrap up without going into scarves n' stuff.
But before I finish, lets make something clear, Pinsir is an absolute monster once set up with SD. However, it's hard for him to switch in and actually set up.. On top of that, even if he kills one poke with a revenge Quick Attack you can send in so many things against him as long as you're not stuck with 3 layers of spikes and stealth rock on your side of the field.
Finally, below is the set Mega Pinsir depends on (unlike Kanga who has such versatility)
Quick Attack (Flying)
Return (Flying)
Earthquake
Swords Dance
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You don't need to worry buddy, none of the other Megas are anywhere close to op, as you yourself mentioned, it's combination of bulk, speed and power, coupled with a good movepool, is unmatched by any other mega poke, none of them can do what Kanga can. Not too mention, all the other Megas actually have counters, or something holds them back from truly breaking everything, like being slow, squishy, exploitable weakness, bad movepools, not worth it over normal form (lol, megazam XD). You can rest easy ;).
why is that survey asking for my age and adv ou experience lol
anyway, im finally gonna speak on kanga, i think its broken. at first i was thinkin it has built in weaknesses that make it manageable - predictability, susceptible to rocky helmet, hard countered by ghosts and basically beaten by mons like skarmory and ferrothorn. but as countless others have already addressed, this meta isn't bw ou - a good kanga user basically keeps kanga on reserve. we have options like defog now for slow stally teams that try to passively damage kanga or we can go the route of having our fast spikers back in deoxys-s which give kanga even more offensive presence. the fact is if you aren't carrying a few specific passive counters like skarm, ferro, dusclops, sableye, cofag, etc you're getting whacked by combinations of what are basically cb returns or double edges followed by sucker punches. who cares if something is predictable if it can get what is basically a swords dance and then whack you with those cb moves. personally the set that i think is too good is sucker punch/eq/power up punch/normal move. like any mon it has its weaknesses but you just revenge and dish out damage at such an unfair rate even to things like landorus-t. on an unrelated note, let's start realizing mega kanga basically gets inverse zap cannons if it wants as well with a 100% acc/51% para stab body slam.
can i hard counter kanga? yeah but much like it has been for previous suspects such as tornadus-t or dpp chomp, those counters are too passive compared to the pressure this pokemon puts on you. we don't need to pretend kanga is arceus just acknowledge it simply hits too hard and can actually take hits back on top of that. there's not much more to say that hasn't been said already
anyway, im finally gonna speak on kanga, i think its broken. at first i was thinkin it has built in weaknesses that make it manageable - predictability, susceptible to rocky helmet, hard countered by ghosts and basically beaten by mons like skarmory and ferrothorn. but as countless others have already addressed, this meta isn't bw ou - a good kanga user basically keeps kanga on reserve. we have options like defog now for slow stally teams that try to passively damage kanga or we can go the route of having our fast spikers back in deoxys-s which give kanga even more offensive presence. the fact is if you aren't carrying a few specific passive counters like skarm, ferro, dusclops, sableye, cofag, etc you're getting whacked by combinations of what are basically cb returns or double edges followed by sucker punches. who cares if something is predictable if it can get what is basically a swords dance and then whack you with those cb moves. personally the set that i think is too good is sucker punch/eq/power up punch/normal move. like any mon it has its weaknesses but you just revenge and dish out damage at such an unfair rate even to things like landorus-t. on an unrelated note, let's start realizing mega kanga basically gets inverse zap cannons if it wants as well with a 100% acc/51% para stab body slam.
can i hard counter kanga? yeah but much like it has been for previous suspects such as tornadus-t or dpp chomp, those counters are too passive compared to the pressure this pokemon puts on you. we don't need to pretend kanga is arceus just acknowledge it simply hits too hard and can actually take hits back on top of that. there's not much more to say that hasn't been said already
I personally think Mega Kanga is very strong but it still might be too early to decide on a ban. The fact remains that when we have bank, we will have access to a lot more pokemon that can check/revenge kill him. This honestly reminds me of the Keldeo discussions all over again and even he ended up staying as he is. Sure one of Kanga's greatest strengths is it's ability to pick its counters but this is in what a lot of people feel is already a very predictable meta atm. Post-Bank i have a feeling that M-Kang will see more troubles in its sweep.
I also feel i have to agree, that it feels like we will slowly lose one mega at a time based on them being "too powerful". Where does it stop, soon i feel we will be having Mega Luke discussions due to the danger in mis-predictions regarding what set he is currently running. Plus that being amplified by the boost he sees to his base stats + adaptability. Mega Scizor would eventually be another one people will talk about due to his past two generations in OU being really solid + his increased bulk as a Mega.
My two cents is it will be best to just wait for PokeBank and then make a decision on the ban of M-Kang. I think we might be jumping the gun out of frustration in this stagnant meta.
I also feel i have to agree, that it feels like we will slowly lose one mega at a time based on them being "too powerful". Where does it stop, soon i feel we will be having Mega Luke discussions due to the danger in mis-predictions regarding what set he is currently running. Plus that being amplified by the boost he sees to his base stats + adaptability. Mega Scizor would eventually be another one people will talk about due to his past two generations in OU being really solid + his increased bulk as a Mega.
My two cents is it will be best to just wait for PokeBank and then make a decision on the ban of M-Kang. I think we might be jumping the gun out of frustration in this stagnant meta.
Don't we have Pokebank OU for this kinda thing where all the Pokemon are available on the simulator anyway? Since I don't play much PokeBank OU, how well does Kangaskhan do on said Pokebank OU, if it does as well as it does on non-Pokebank OU, then Pokebank would unlikely make much of a difference.
I don't play Pokebank OU, but since it has access to Seismic Toss and Wish, in addition to a few other toys, it's probably even better.
Pokebank Mega Mom has Seismic Toss, Wish, and Fire Punch. Also Drain Punch. All of which make her amazingly deadly.
NO! NOPE NO NOOOOOOOOOO NOPE
as an example of the supposed "New bank pokemon," Lugia, An Uber, the bulkiest of ubers gets 2HKOed. Giratina is 2HKOed. Groudon is 2HKOed. NOTHING new comes available post bank that will help.
and if i hear one more slippery slope argument i'm gonna have to smack a bitch. it doesn't work that way. EVERY OTHER Mega has Cons that are exploited, and exploited naturally through decent team building, even Luke, who is still frail as balls. at most AT MOST Luke might get banned and i don't think he will. no other meg is that exceptional.
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