Pokémon Mawile

[Forsety]

Personally I can't quite fathom why every spread for Mawile is basically 252/252 HP/Atk, it's like you just ignore it's defenses were boosted to 125/95 and it's typing is among one of the sturdiest in the whole game. Pure Power and it's new 105 base attack easily compensates for the offense, you should be EV'ing it's defenses for added survivability and to give it a chance to attack, setup or Pain Split. Swords Dance sets are especially guilty as power is not your main concern but surviving the damn set up to begin with.

+Atk w/ 120 EV's would already be sufficient to reach over 303 Atk when boosted by Pure power to 606 the equivilent of a base 130 +atk CB user yet you'd still have over 136 EV's to put back into the defenses as you like for either 320 defense or 260 s.def. f course 252 HP is basically required since there is a huge bulk drop off compared to investing in defenses alone.

EDIT: On second thought, probably better it's defense you can actually survive some pretty big physical hits.

 

[Critical_Hax]

I could see a support set investing in defences working and still packing a punch thanks to Pure Power. Mawile's support movepool includes Stealth Rock, weather moves (which may be viable with the auto-weather nerf), Taunt. However, I think the most interesting option for a defensive set it Torment + Protect, since Mawile has great defensive typing which will force switches, a la Heatran, and then you can wall most pokemon that can't hit you hard with more than one move, while racking up damage with Foul Play/Play Rough. The only weakness with that set would be the lack of leftovers recovery, but its possible you can give it Wish or Grassy Terrain support.

 

[Chaoswalker]

A bulky tank like M.Mawile could greatly benefit from some Wish support. While Latias doesn't have the highest HP stat, neither does Mawile and it does have excellent synergy with M.Mawile. Latias covers fire and ground without a problem, while M.Mawile covers dark, ice, dragon, bug, and fairy with 2 1/4s and an immunity. I could see these two being great friends.

If raw HP is wanted though, Blissey can push Mawile back up to 100% in one fell swoop no matter the prior damage or Vaporeon could do similar and cover the fire weakness.

 

[Cipher Admin Lovrina]

Mawile
Adamant Nature
252 HP/120 Attack/136 Defense
@Mawilelite
Swords Dance
Sucker Punch
Play Rough


I really like the looks of Foresty's spread. With Intimidate Mawile can tank even physical super effective attacks. Fairy and Steel are types that are really conducive to physical resistances--despite most fairies having much higher special defense stats. Anyway, I'm still trying to figure out the last coverage move for this type of moveset. Does Mawile want Fire Fang for stuff like Scizor, Forretress, Skarmory, and Ferrothorn? Thunder Punch for bulky waters? Ice Punch for Gliscor and Landorus T? Taunt--does it outspeed anything? Focus Punch?

I was going to go with Brick Break because you get solid coverage with Fairy and can cover both Ferrothorn and Heatran Switch-Ins with one move.

 

[Wendrika]

I was hoping on using my Gen III Mawile down the road (hopefully the move reminder also keeps track of tutor moves, like Body Slam and Seismic Toss).

How viable would be a Impish nature for a bulky Mawile? Sidakarya's proposed set has it as Careful, but I'd love to know which changes I should make to go with Impish. No special reason other than preserve my hard earned ribbons, so don't be too harsh on me for asking.

Also, why not use Hyper Cutter instead of Intimidate, to give some more "humph" to Foul Play? Also, immunity to opposing Intimidates in Doubles if you decide to lead with Mawile.

 

[GrislyBear]

Intimidate is used for easier switching so you can get into mega more easily. Hyper cutter gives no such bonus and the only reason to use Mawile is for its mega form.

 

[El Coqui]

So i started using Mawile in NU just before it got announced to have a mega and thought it was amazing! Walled by few, feared by many after one Swords Dance with a SheerForce/LO set.



NOW....i think Mawile just made moves in ways previously unheard of. I would still like to note that a SheerForce/LO set would still destroy lives leaving Mawile in RU now eith the set:
SheerForce/Life Orb
Adamant 252att 252hp 4spd
-SuckerPunch
-SwordsDance
-RoughPlay
-IronHead

MegaMawile I can see in UU/OU thanks to its typing and boosted stats with the exact same move set. While I dont consider HugePower to be such a different damage output than SheerForce/LO, the boosted attack and defenses do allow MegaMawile to rise up to OU-status with or without SwordsDance. You can omit SD for IcePunch for coverage and still do fantastic. Just my opinion but ill be using regular Mawile in low tier and Mega in upper tier

 

[Runic]

Personally I can't quite fathom why every spread for Mawile is basically 252/252 HP/Atk, it's like you just ignore it's defenses were boosted to 125/95 and it's typing is among one of the sturdiest in the whole game. Pure Power and it's new 105 base attack easily compensates for the offense, you should be EV'ing it's defenses for added survivability and to give it a chance to attack, setup or Pain Split. Swords Dance sets are especially guilty as power is not your main concern but surviving the damn set up to begin with.

+Atk w/ 120 EV's would already be sufficient to reach over 303 Atk when boosted by Pure power to 606 the equivilent of a base 130 +atk CB user yet you'd still have over 136 EV's to put back into the defenses as you like for either 320 defense or 260 s.def. f course 252 HP is basically required since there is a huge bulk drop off compared to investing in defenses alone.

EDIT: On second thought, probably better it's defense you can actually survive some pretty big physical hits.

See my SubSplit set:

Sub Split
Nature: Adamant
Ability: Intimidate -> Huge Power
Item: Currently Unnamed Mega Mawile Megastone
EVs: 252 ATK / 172 Def / 84 Spe
- Substitute
- Sucker Punch
- Pursuit/Rough Play
- Pain Split

Subsplit them and then predict them to death. No STAB or anything but you won't need it. I put all that in Def because with that much investment, you can take an EQ from pretty much everyone unbanded except STAB powerhouses, and you can pain split the guy who used it and fuck them up. Fire, in many cases, will OHKO even with max investment, and you're better off just Sucker Punching or switching out. That and it's neutral to more physical types than special. Speed investment is to outrun Jellicent so you don't get whisped or any horrid bullshit like that.

 

[Cipher Admin Lovrina]

Too bad Mawile doesn't get Pursuit. Still, Rough Play and Sucker Punch coverage is really nice! Does anybody have a suggestion for a third coverage move for a swords dance or substitute + three move set? Iron Head seems a bit redundant. What about Ice Punch, Thunder Punch, Crunch, Fire Fang, or Brick Break?

 

[GrislyBear]

Iron head seems redundant? Steel hits fairy, ice and rock, play rough hits dragon, fighting and dark, sucker punch hits ghost psychic

That sounds like coverage to me.

 

[Slheyas]

Iron Head is great.

Makes Mawile easily able to destroy Fairies, while not really caring about them (Is there even a single Fairy type that wins against Mawile? I'm doubtful about even Azumarill)

 

[sidakarya]

Iron Head is great.

Makes Mawile easily able to destroy Fairies, while not really caring about them (Is there even a single Fairy type that wins against Mawile? I'm doubtful about even Azumarill)

I think LO-Togekiss with Fire Blast is the only one.

 

[Cipher Admin Lovrina]

I think Iron Head is redundant because almost all Fairy-types have weak to subpar defenses, so Rough Play will be ripping them up regardless. With the exception of maybe opposing Mega Mawile, who will still only take neutral damage. I'm leaning towards Fire Fang for Skarmory, Scizor, Ferrothorn, Forretress, Aegislash, Ice Punch for Gliscor, Garchomp, and Landorus-T, or Brick Break for Ferrothorn, Heatran, and Magnezone switch-ins!

 

[sidakarya]

I think Iron Head is redundant because almost all Fairy-types have weak to subpar defenses, so Rough Play will be ripping them up regardless. With the exception of maybe opposing Mega Mawile, who will still only take neutral damage. I'm leaning towards Fire Fang for Skarmory, Scizor, Ferrothorn, Forretress, Aegislash, Ice Punch for Gliscor, Garchomp, and Landorus-T, or Brick Break for Ferrothorn, Heatran, and Magnezone switch-ins!

Come to think of it:
- 252+ Atk Huge Power Mawile Play Rough vs. 248 HP / 0 Def Azumarill: 334-394 (82.67 - 97.52%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
- 252+ Atk Huge Power Mawile Play Rough vs. 248 HP / 252+ Def Sylveon: 262-309 (66.49 - 78.42%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
- 252+ Atk Huge Power Mawile Play Rough vs. 248 HP / 0 Def Togekiss: 289-342 (77.47 - 91.68%) -- guaranteed 2HKO

OHKO's are likely on Azumarill and Togekiss if you can keep Stealth Rock up, and Sylveon can't do much even with HP Ground. It might be worth it to forgo Iron Head for a coverage move. Fire Fang seems the most appealing to me, since it hits the only thing that resists Dark+Fairy (Mawile itself) super-effective and does a number on a lot of Steels.

 

[Slheyas]

Mawile can deal a lot of damage to other Mawiles with Iron Head.

Honestly I'd rather carry Stone Edge to deal with fire types, but that's because I'm rolling with Substitute Mawile and can afford to stay in against a Fire Pokemon.

Also fun fact, Mawile pretty much always OHKO Mega-Blaziken with Play Rough, same thing for Mega Lucario.

That attack is REALLY good.

 

[Speedholes]

With Mawile's excellent 2 move coverage (Fairy + Dark), would a RestTalk set work? I was thinking something like:

RestTalk
Nature: Adamant
Ability: Intimidate -> Huge Power
Item: Mawilite
EVs: 252 HP / 36 Atk / 128 SpD / 92 Spe
- Play Rough
- Crunch / Foul Play
- Sleep Talk
- Rest

The EV spread hits the same benchmarks as sidakarya's spread from the last page, but is slightly more efficient and gives you 8 extra EVs to play with. I went ahead and invested them into Speed to outspeed neutral natured uninvested TTar, which seems to be a thing this gen with defensive AV TTar. Again, it hits them same SpD benchmark as before, letting you avoid the 2HKO from Latios barring HP Fire. Everything else is dumped into HP and then Attack, hitting 570 Attack with Huge Power.

Rest and Sleep Talk lets Mawile overcome its shortcomings of having no reliable recovery and its weakness to status (Burn in particular). In general RestTalk has been improved this gen thanks to the changes to the sleep counter. The given EV spread lets Mawile act as a great check to several specially-oriented threats as well as allowing it to threaten out weaker walls or defensive mons who can't break though its great defenses and typing. Crunch is more reliable than Foul Play and hits most walls harder, but Foul Play could end up slamming an enemy switch-in for massive damage. Unfortunately Sucker Punch isn't really much good on this set since it's so unreliable in conjunction with Sleep Talk.

Thoughts? I think it comes down to whether the benefits of RestTalk are worth giving up powerful priority, but I haven't played enough to know yet.

 

[Wendrika]

Thoughts? I think it comes down to whether the benefits of RestTalk are worth giving up powerful priority, but I haven't played enough to know yet.

I'm kinda new, so I'm still struggling on which natures are acceptable in each situation. So, I ask, why Adamant? The set you based from had Careful set in, I supose for extra bulkiness. Shouldn't it be a preferable nature for Sleep Talk? That, or having Huge Power is such a huge thing that it's pratically mandatory to milk all that's worth from it, by using a nature that doubly benefits from it.

But isn't surviving blows a priority for Sleep Talk users? Shouldn't bulkiness be better?

 

[Zemyla]

So considering there's a speed tie between Mega Mawile and Azumarill, how much damage does Azumarill's Waterfall/Aqua Tail do to Mega Mawile?

 

[Critical_Hax]

An Adamant nature is perfectly acceptable on a specially bulky set because due to Mawile's base attack and Pure Power, you get a considerable amount of stat points from that 10% boost with a + nature, than you would if you used a +SpD nature. In fact, unless you need special bulk which exceeds a 248/252 neutral spread, then Adamant is numerically more efficient, since you can achieve that level of special bulk, but maximise the bonus points you gain because attack will naturally be the highest raw stat. Basically, unless you have damage calculations to prove that you avoid a few important KOs with a Careful SpD spread, you're being inefficient with your stat distribution by running careful, and this problem is exasterbated by Pure Power, since it makes attack investment all the more attractive. As such, Speedholes' spread is more efficient, since it takes advanatge of the extra dividends a +Atk nature gives you, and frees up some more EVs to distribute where you see fit.

I don't know how much Waterfall would do, but I recall seeing 252 Atk+ Mega Mawile has a decent chance to OHKO Azumaril after SR, and I doubt that an unboosted Waterfall + Aqua Jet will OHKO 252 HP Mawile. The real question is does a +6 Aqua Jet OHKO Mawile, because I suspect Adamant 252 Atk Mawile will KO Azumaril from 50% with Sucker Punch.

 

[sidakarya]

So considering there's a speed tie between Mega Mawile and Azumarill, how much damage does Azumarill's Waterfall/Aqua Tail do to Mega Mawile?

- 252+ Atk Choice Band Huge Power Azumarill Waterfall vs. 248 HP / 0 Def (M-)Mawile: 196-232 (64.68 - 76.56%) -- guaranteed 2HKO

Assuming no first Intimidate before mevolving (normal Mawile is still 2HKO'd, but takes slightly less damage)
Azumarill might be faster just to outspeed Jellicent though.

Looking at it more carefully, I think Adamant does work better on a specially bulky M-Mawile set, rather than Careful as I made it before. You could even use 252 HP / 128 Atk / 44 SDef / 92 Spe if Stealth Rock isn't a concern, and it gives you even more attacking power at 608 Attack.

 

[Critical_Hax]

- 252+ Atk Choice Band Huge Power Azumarill Waterfall vs. 248 HP / 0 Def (M-)Mawile: 196-232 (64.68 - 76.56%) -- guaranteed 2HKO

Assuming no first Intimidate before mevolving (normal Mawile is still 2HKO'd, but takes slightly less damage)
Azumarill might be faster just to outspeed Jellicent though.

Well, in that case, the advanatge would go to Azumaril, since it looks like Aqua Jet will KO after a Waterfall and SR. I noticed you use 248 HP, so i just calculated and yep, Stealth Rock number, even with the resist. I assume you'll drop 8 EVs into Speed then, since theres no real advantage to not speed tie with other base 50s (like a slower U-Turn/Superpower for Scizor in the mirror)

 

[sidakarya]

Well, in that case, the advanatge would go to Azumaril, since it looks like Aqua Jet will KO after a Waterfall and SR. I noticed you use 248 HP, so i just calculated and yep, Stealth Rock number, even with the resist. I assume you'll drop 8 EVs into Speed then, since theres no real advantage to not speed tie with other base 50s (like a slower U-Turn/Superpower for Scizor in the mirror)

I have a habit of using SR numbers for everything, even when I'm calculating something that resists it. 252 HP can work too (that calculation is about the same).

 

[Forsety]

See my SubSplit set:

I did see it and it runs no HP EV's at all, I know the aim is to max Split damage but that shouldn't be your goal at all you're severely overestimated the remaining defenses Mawile has after sacrificing so much HP. For example even after MEvo'ing a regular Jolly Garchomp EQ with absolutely no boosts would get a clean OHKO on you with your spread, you take roughly 25% more damage because of it and if it's LO'd it could KO you even through the -1 attack unless you invest in HP.

Given there isn't really a reason why you'd have that confrontation (likelihood is Garchomp would annihilate you with LO or SD anyway) but it was just to illustrate what kind of fire you're playing with.

Thoughts? I think it comes down to whether the benefits of RestTalk are worth giving up powerful priority, but I haven't played enough to know yet.

Never. Not when you're this slow.

 

[Speedholes]

Never. Not when you're this slow.

Yeah, that's what I thought. Sucker Punch coming off Mawile's huge Attack stat is just so good and helps it check threats like Latios and Gengar alot better, it's pretty much mandatory if you're trying to use it offensively (or at all, honestly). Such a shame it doesn't get Drain Punch or something, Pain Split is so unreliable.

Mawile seems to have trouble using alot of its options. Swords Dance is hard to use properly with such low speed, and Sub kinda sucks without any leftovers or recovery. It's too slow to really use support options like Taunt. Are there any other moves that stick out? Would it be worth bothering with things like Torment to abuse its resistances, or is it just better to go all-out attacker with coverage moves?

I really want to love MegaMawile, but it just seems hard to find a spot for it in a team.

 

[Yamborski]

Keep in mind Huge Power doubles Mawile's final attacking stats, not its base stats. This means 4 EVs gives you two extra attack at level 100. In other words not maxing out attack has a pretty high stat loss that accompanies it. Adamant nature + 252 EVs ends up having 178 more attack than Careful with 0 Attack.