IIRC There are multiple mentions of Island Champions existing before Kukui decided to create the Pokemon League, so perhaps he was referring to them in XY, just shortening the term to just "Champion".
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SPOILERS! Mysteries and Conspiracies of Pokemon
- Thread starter stage7_4
- Start date
In fact Kahili was an Island Champion traveling around before becoming an Elite Four member.
Gen 1 and 3 happened at the same time in the timeline so I'm wondering who came up with the fossil regeneration technology first. Did the Cinnabar dudes steal from Devon, or the other way round?? I mean that's a pretty major breakthrough.
Maybe they just shared the research, I dunno.
Maybe they just shared the research, I dunno.
Maybe they did it at the same time or at least close enough to each other it doesn't really matter. Kind of reminds me something I learned about the creation of the first airplane: the Wright brothers weren't the only ones working on one and got it to work. People all around the world were independently making their an airplane and many managed to achieve flight. Could be the same here, both teams just so happened to make a fossil Restoration machine at the same time. Maybe they shared researched, maybe they didn't, all that matters now is that this blasphemy against nature exists.
In ORAS, the Devon scientist that mentions wanting to develop a machine to view Pokemon's dreams also says he discovered someone else (Fennel) doing the same, so it's most likely the same situation.
Think of it like Newton and Leibniz 'creating' Calculus at about the same time, in different places, with different methods, and unaware of each other until after they finished.
Been replaying Heartgold lately, just to see if my favorite still hold up to the test of time.
Immediately found this little shiny cutie. She's adamant too.
But it did bring up a few questions.
1. Why is a watering can considered too dangerous? Seriously, the flower shop won't let you handle the power until you get a gym badge from Goldenrod. They even say it's "too dangerous," I'm not joking. I mean, there's some crazy roadblocks but seriously Gamefreak?
I need to see your permit to carry that squritbottle.
Okay, for a serious one. In the Sun/Moon thread I brought up some interesting poke-figures regarding beast balls. Since they apparently cost about 1,000,000 pokedollars to make, and a bike in the pokemon world also costs the same amount, then each beast ball costs around $200 US dollars each (given the current average price for a highish tier bike for a 10-year-old). A little pricey, but not exactly financially bankrupting (I think I calculated that its about a few months salary for an entry-level scientist to pay for all the beast balls we got, so the Aether foundation could recoup the lost funds by firing just one of the staff, disregarding the fact that beast balls are negative assets).
Do you except payment in Beast Balls?
Replaying Heartgold, I found out something else that sells for a million pokedollars: slowpoke tails.
Now, this only applies to the remake, since the original games had them for $9,800 (geez, inflation these days). That got me thinking, wasn't Team Skull trying to gather slowpoke tails? While they implied they were doing it to make some quick money since y'all are poor and stuff, since we know Team Skull was working with parts of the Aether Foundation, what if Lusamine and her cronnies were gathering and selling slowpoke tails to keep her ultra-beast projects off the Aether foundation account records? It would eliminate the paper trail, and keep her looking squeaky clean ethically while still funding her beast balls, cyro-stasis, and Type: Null development costs.
Despite ethically frowned upon, slowpoke tails do sell for a lot and don't permanently damage the creature, so it would be an easy way to fund expensive research without using a non-profit animal care organization's pocketbook. So if each slowpoke tail is about one beast ball...
The drawback is that this plan hinges on Team Skull actually succeeding in getting and selling a large quantity of Slowpoke tails, which I'll let you decide if they could pull it off.
Yeah, I'm not holding my breath.
Immediately found this little shiny cutie. She's adamant too.
But it did bring up a few questions.
1. Why is a watering can considered too dangerous? Seriously, the flower shop won't let you handle the power until you get a gym badge from Goldenrod. They even say it's "too dangerous," I'm not joking. I mean, there's some crazy roadblocks but seriously Gamefreak?
I need to see your permit to carry that squritbottle.
Okay, for a serious one. In the Sun/Moon thread I brought up some interesting poke-figures regarding beast balls. Since they apparently cost about 1,000,000 pokedollars to make, and a bike in the pokemon world also costs the same amount, then each beast ball costs around $200 US dollars each (given the current average price for a highish tier bike for a 10-year-old). A little pricey, but not exactly financially bankrupting (I think I calculated that its about a few months salary for an entry-level scientist to pay for all the beast balls we got, so the Aether foundation could recoup the lost funds by firing just one of the staff, disregarding the fact that beast balls are negative assets).
Do you except payment in Beast Balls?
Replaying Heartgold, I found out something else that sells for a million pokedollars: slowpoke tails.
Now, this only applies to the remake, since the original games had them for $9,800 (geez, inflation these days). That got me thinking, wasn't Team Skull trying to gather slowpoke tails? While they implied they were doing it to make some quick money since y'all are poor and stuff, since we know Team Skull was working with parts of the Aether Foundation, what if Lusamine and her cronnies were gathering and selling slowpoke tails to keep her ultra-beast projects off the Aether foundation account records? It would eliminate the paper trail, and keep her looking squeaky clean ethically while still funding her beast balls, cyro-stasis, and Type: Null development costs.
Despite ethically frowned upon, slowpoke tails do sell for a lot and don't permanently damage the creature, so it would be an easy way to fund expensive research without using a non-profit animal care organization's pocketbook. So if each slowpoke tail is about one beast ball...
The drawback is that this plan hinges on Team Skull actually succeeding in getting and selling a large quantity of Slowpoke tails, which I'll let you decide if they could pull it off.
Yeah, I'm not holding my breath.
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Er, I believe the Slowpoke Tails were 1,000,000 Pokedollars in the originals as well, but only from the guy trying to sell you them by the Route 32 entrance to Union Cave. They were still 9800 Pokedollars at the Mahogany Town shop IIRC.Been replaying Heartgold lately, just to see if my favorite still hold up to the test of time.
Immediately found this little shiny cutie. She's adamant too.
But it did bring up a few questions.
1. Why is a watering can considered too dangerous? Seriously, the flower shop won't let you handle the power until you get a gym badge from Goldenrod. They even say it's "too dangerous," I'm not joking. I mean, there's some crazy roadblocks but seriously Gamefreak?
I need to see your permit to carry that squritbottle.
Okay, for a serious one. In the Sun/Moon thread I brought up some interesting poke-figures regarding beast balls. Since they apparently cost about 1,000,000 pokedollars to make, and a bike in the pokemon world also costs the same amount, then each beast ball costs around $200 US dollars each (given the current average price for a highish tier bike for a 10-year-old). A little pricey, but not exactly financially bankrupting (I think I calculated that its about a few months salary for an entry-level scientist to pay for all the beast balls we got, so the Aether foundation could recoup the lost funds by firing just one of the staff, disregarding the fact that beast balls are negative assets).
Do you except payment in Beast Balls?
Replaying Heartgold, I found out something else that sells for a million pokedollars: slowpoke tails.
View attachment 77411
Now, this only applies to the remake, since the original games had them for $9,800 (geez, inflation these days). That got me thinking, wasn't Team Skull trying to gather slowpoke tails? While they implied they were doing it to make some quick money since y'all are poor and stuff, since we know Team Skull was working with parts of the Aether Foundation, what if Lusamine and her cronnies were gathering and selling slowpoke tails to keep her ultra-beast projects off the Aether foundation account records? It would eliminate the paper trail, and keep her looking squeaky clean ethically while still funding her beast balls, cyro-stasis, and Type: Null development costs.
Despite ethically frowned upon, slowpoke tails do sell for a lot and don't permanently damage the creature, so it would be an easy way to fund expensive research without using a non-profit animal care organization's pocketbook. So if each slowpoke tail is about one beast ball...
The drawback is that this plan hinges on Team Skull actually succeeding in getting and selling a large quantity of Slowpoke tails, which I'll let you decide if they could pull it off.
Yeah, I'm not holding my breath.
The dangerous part isn't the watering can, but rather the Sudowoodo you're supposed to use it on. Granted the flower shop lady is still being a bit of an overly worried ninny either way...
Considering that rock resists normal, it makes even less sense that the Plain Badge is proof you can take on a Sudowoodo, but if we were going by that logic we couldn't get a license to own a squirtbottle until the fighting or steel gym at least. 5-6 badges just to water your begonias, must be tough to live in Johto.
Then again, Whitney's primary offense is rollout, a rock move. So is this Gamefreak being secretly really clever or just a weird coincidence?
From the developers that brought you hot Skitty on Wailord action.
Yeah, no way Gamefreak intended it.
Yeah, no way Gamefreak intended it.
Pokedollar Exchange Rate: Pokedollar is originally based on the yen so 1 mil in yen is like 9k American. Don't know why they were selling pedal bikes for that much, maybe its an exaggeration from the player character's point of view? "I wanted to buy a bike, but the bike guy was like 'My bike costs like 1 million Pokedollars', or might as well been for that much". Though them selling Slowpoke Tails for that much can still make sense, gourmet food and all.
I think at this rate we should just consider Pokedollar its own currency with its own rules. If they say 1 mil is a lot, it's a lot. And being Aether Foundation looks to be a non-profit organization which probably runs on government grants, spending even a percentage on that money on making expensive Beast Balls is taking money away from other research or maintenance.
New Mystery: True Beast Ability?
Beast Boost isn't the original Ability of the Ultra Beasts, rather its an Ability they gained by going through an Ultra Wormhole. So does that mean they have another Ability that Beast Boost overrode? Evidence towards this is Necrozma, who is an Ultra Beast that passed over to our dimension many years ago but its Ability isn't Beast Boost but rather Prism Armor. Now I'm sure we could relate some existing Abilities to a few (Guzzlord having Gluttony, Xurkitree having Lightning Rod, etc.), but going by the description of some it sounds like they would have unique Abilities (even if they are copies of existing Abilities like Prism Armor is). Like Cute Charm can't work for Pheromosa as ALL Pokemon are suppose to become attracted to it. Kartana would probably get a Hyper Cutter-like Ability (Hyper Cutter in Japan is called "Supernatural Claws" if you're wondering why it can't just have Hyper Cutter). Not sure about Buzzhole, Nihilego, and Celesteela.
I think at this rate we should just consider Pokedollar its own currency with its own rules. If they say 1 mil is a lot, it's a lot. And being Aether Foundation looks to be a non-profit organization which probably runs on government grants, spending even a percentage on that money on making expensive Beast Balls is taking money away from other research or maintenance.
New Mystery: True Beast Ability?
Beast Boost isn't the original Ability of the Ultra Beasts, rather its an Ability they gained by going through an Ultra Wormhole. So does that mean they have another Ability that Beast Boost overrode? Evidence towards this is Necrozma, who is an Ultra Beast that passed over to our dimension many years ago but its Ability isn't Beast Boost but rather Prism Armor. Now I'm sure we could relate some existing Abilities to a few (Guzzlord having Gluttony, Xurkitree having Lightning Rod, etc.), but going by the description of some it sounds like they would have unique Abilities (even if they are copies of existing Abilities like Prism Armor is). Like Cute Charm can't work for Pheromosa as ALL Pokemon are suppose to become attracted to it. Kartana would probably get a Hyper Cutter-like Ability (Hyper Cutter in Japan is called "Supernatural Claws" if you're wondering why it can't just have Hyper Cutter). Not sure about Buzzhole, Nihilego, and Celesteela.
My guess: Our adventure, as seen in the game, is heavily subsidized. We earn and spend money during the adventure, but for all practical purposes we're never handling more than pocket change. Winning or losing a Pokémon battle should not make large sums change hands, and minors shouldn't be running around with large amounts of money on their person anyway. Even at 1 million, the bike doesn't seem that valuable (you get the bike for free later on, after all), so it may just be that the bike shop is not in on the subsidies program. In regular shops (and for winning/losing battles), only a symbolic sum is paid.
This means we're getting Poké Balls and medicine almost for free, possibly a lot less than their true value, and that the real cost is carried elsewhere. Maybe your mom and the local professor are sponsoring your adventure because you have shown such proficiency with Pokémon. Maybe you're getting a scholarship of sorts, or even corporate sponsors.
Because of subsidies, we can't accurately compare the relative value of goods and services in the Pokémon world. A trip to Sushi High Roller may not cost the equivalent of 200 bottles of high-end medicine, the restaurant simply isn't in on the program. You can buy a fedora for 80,000 Pokédollars, but that may not really be the equivalent worth of 16 Nuggets. The Kanto Starter Mega Stones initially cost 1 million Poké Dollars, which may not be such an outrageous sum at all, given that a bike costs the same. But as a Trainer, you're rarely handling such amounts of money.
I can imagine the economy of the Pokémon World easily running into the billions of Poké Dollars even for household budgets. Maybe the Poké Dollar is even a derived currency, and that the "real economy" runs on a different one, where less zeroes are required to handle transactions.
At a guess, I'd say a million Poké Dollars at the very most amount to 1000 US dollars. Probably less than half that. To ease our journey and lower the risk of mugging/scams or something, we're just handling tiny sums, while somebody else take care of the real funding of our carefree wandering lifestyle.
I almost imagine the Pokedollars might not even be a proper currency. They might be sort of a voucher system for Trainers that don't have cash value without something like a Trainers' license (which explains why there's an expected age before receiving a starter and becoming an official league trainer), so it also explains why trainers never get accosted for money outright, criminals instead stealing Pokemon or fence-able goods. For places like the clothing stores, they can opt into the Pokedollar system to be reimbursed for money on things bought with Pokedollars, but perhaps the exchange rate varies between "necessities" such as Pokemon medicine and food compared to luxury items like a bike or clothing, as a means to avoid having an inflationary economy by everyone opting in and buying things with Pokedollars, and some things like real estate simply cannot be sold at all through them. Given the nature of casinos, maybe it's a bit of a meta joke: everyone gets things by buying coins rather than winning them, so only accomplished trainers would have the money to buy the coins and thus "buy" Casino prize mons, ensuring they go to worthy care takers.
Oh boy, dex entries.
Slowpoke: I'd imagine Slowpoke tails break off as a sort of defense mechanism, similar to some species or lizard. So while they can be taken in capitivity, or maybe even scavenged by fisherman, it's still poaching to capture Slowpoke for the explicit purpose of taking their tails.
Grimer/Muk: Was this entry for normal or Alolan form? I would imagine the sludge eaters are necessarily endangered (yet). It's just natural selection at work as with real species. In a time where sludge was a more common pollutant, normal Grimer thrived since they had more to eat obviously (I'd imagine they'd basically eat something like water polluted by something like feces or oil wells in the wild). Alolan Grimer were just an offshoot that happened to be able to eat more solid waste like actual hard packaging, plastic, and garbage, which isn't normally an advantage, but in Alola people produce more solid garbage than they do sludge given the tourism industry and overall less industrial feel to it. Natural selection at work thus favors the traits of Alolan Grimer, and the human element makes the cycle self-perpetuating, since people become less hesitant about producing solid garbage when the Alolan Grimer/Muk population can easily "recycle" it for them, and without the inherently toxic physiology of normal Grimer/Muk. Wild Grimer/Muk may also be a factor in their decreasing numbers if the theory I noted above for their wild food source is true. If their presence/vicinity kills plants, they drive off herbivorous species, and the predatory species for those go with them. No other Pokemon in the area means there's no waste for them to feed on. This is an interesting one to me given I'm studying Biology in my current courses.
Metang/Metagross: This one is a bit muddier given how the terms can be misused in pop culture, but I think I have a simple explanation. The Metagross entry only lists its speed at processing a calculation, but intelligence is defined as the ability to apply information to experience and life. Metagross can think faster, but it doesn't necessarily have more knowledge than it did as a Metang. It's like the difference between coding new functions into a computer and simply giving it a more powerful processor, especially since it explicitly mentions having 4 brains is what lets it figure the information out quickly. Metang may also mean that the act of combining does not increase intelligence itself, rather than it simply pools the intelligence/cognitive power of the two Beldum. For example, in something like DBZ or Yugioh (or Steven Universe as I've been told), a fused being is meant to be greater than the sum of its parts, as if the act of fusing introduces more potential than the two pieces working in tandem. Metang is quite literally the intelligence of two Beldum in one body, rather than two Beldum plus additional mental capacity as a result of combining for some chemical reason.
Vanilluxe: It may be that the heads of Vanilluxe are not individually minded, rather they are extensions of the "central" brain. Compare Hydreigon, which grows a second head that has separate sentience from the first as a Zweilous, and then has one functioning head and two without functioning intelligence that serve as appendages. Vanilluxe's sentience may be in something else like the "cone", with the heads merely serving as structures it can regenerate or at the very least function without.
Probably because it runs on the same checks as the other abilities that inflict something upon contact. But look how cute it is as it's KO'd!
"My darling Pokemon looks delightful even when fainted!"
--PokeFan Miguel, Hoenn
While replaying HG/SS, it's come to my attention that the only person to successfully use a pokemon to attack a human is Lance when his Dragonite uses hyperbeam on Mahogany town store owner. Who is actually working for team rocket, but let's not ruin this with facts: Lance used a pokemon to attack a human.
I mean, the guy's responsive afterwards so it appears to have been as effective as being shoved against a wall. Still weird that our only confirmed pokemon on human attack is from a "good-guy." It's always those you trust the most, isn't it?
For context, this is Hyper Beam in gen 4 (and 5 but I couldn't find a good quality Gen 4 only):
There have been a few attempts (Ghetsis tries to ice the player in B2/W2, Lusamine attempts to attack Lillie in Su/Mo), and I guess Ghetsis freezing an entire town seems a lot larger in scale even if it's implied it was "harmless freezing" even if the science doesn't check out. Anybody I'm forgetting?
I mean, the guy's responsive afterwards so it appears to have been as effective as being shoved against a wall. Still weird that our only confirmed pokemon on human attack is from a "good-guy." It's always those you trust the most, isn't it?
For context, this is Hyper Beam in gen 4 (and 5 but I couldn't find a good quality Gen 4 only):
There have been a few attempts (Ghetsis tries to ice the player in B2/W2, Lusamine attempts to attack Lillie in Su/Mo), and I guess Ghetsis freezing an entire town seems a lot larger in scale even if it's implied it was "harmless freezing" even if the science doesn't check out. Anybody I'm forgetting?
The Colosseum games has a few example of Pokemon attacking people. In battle sometimes your Shadow Pokemon may attack Wes (playable character of the original) or the opposing trainer when its in Hyper Mode in the original game, we're told a few times how (Shadow) Pokemon have attacked people, though I think the best example is in XD where a Snagem Grunt used his Gloom's Sleep Powder to put Michael (playable character of X) asleep and stole his Snag Machine.
Cresselia~~
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I think I might have located Jynx's knees from the datamined running animation.
While this bump just felt like a weird bump when Jynx is in battle, the bump becomes more exaggerated when Jynx is running.
I think it's the first time we get to know where her knees are.
And wow, those are some really short legs. (long legs are meant to be pretty in Japanese beauty standards)
While this bump just felt like a weird bump when Jynx is in battle, the bump becomes more exaggerated when Jynx is running.
I think it's the first time we get to know where her knees are.
And wow, those are some really short legs. (long legs are meant to be pretty in Japanese beauty standards)
Is it ever explained where the NPCs in the Battle Tree, etc. get their legendaries from? One had a Latios, Latias, Thundurus, and Virizion in a Double Battle. You'd think anyone skilled enough to acquire them would be famous. Are they Fallers who came from a world where the legendaries were never caught by player characters?
I prefer to think of it as we should expect every NPC to (potentially) have access to the same technology as the player.
Therefore, if the player can trade with people from "other realities" (aka other game packs/trainer ID's), or import pokemon from past timelines (aka Pokemon Box/Pokemon Transporter), then it stands to reason that some NPC's can do the same.
Basically a very long winded way to say that the NPC's are probably not "fallers," but the pokemon probably are.
If true then jeebus are those NPC's getting a sweet deal. Every legendary on the GTS seems to want my first born son just to trade for a Zapdos with inferior stats and natures. Not to mention all the "will trade my Pidgey for a Mew."
Now as for why every NPC doesn't do this, well I still like my long-running theory that the player character (and gym leaders/battle tower clone facility trainers) are pokemon prodigies and the common man struggles with training more than three pokemon and different types. Or maybe they fail at the GTS as much as I do. Either way, Battle Tree trainers are the elite of the elite, the top %.
I always considered any use of Legendaries in the Battle Facilities as non-canon, a meta thing to give the player more of a challenge. The Pokemon that Abigail used to battle you during the Ultra Beast missions I see more as her canon team.
Cresselia~~
Junichi Masuda likes this!!
I always considered what happens in battle facilities aren't real Pokemon, but are somewhat computer generated things, even in the Pokemon world.
(Like how those people don't really own those Pokemon)
Because how your items are not used in these battles, and your Pokemon do not seem hurt after the battle.
And, starting in Gen VI, affection has no effect in those battles.
Not really, just give them 3 rainbow beans and they'll DIE FOR YOU. Pokemon have notoriously low standards.
Considering that Youngster Tristan can make it past the Elite Four, it's not out of the question that preschoolers can be much better at pokemon than some adults. Heck, considering the eevee sidequest, it could be argued the pokemon training is easier the younger you are (until you have to get a job and pay taxes). Then throw in the anime age vs. usefulness parabola (where "usefulness" is relegated to the youngest and oldest ends of the spectrum and nothing in between) and the question inverts on itself: why are so many grown adults in the Battle Tree and why aren't there MORE preschoolers?
Beyond this we're just hitting our heads against "gameplay and story segregation." Unless you've got a theory to explain it, we'll just be here all week asking these types of questions. As others have said, it's a little easier to consider these areas non-canon.
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