ORAS UU Viability Ranking Thread

[dingbat]

Double posting

I basically applied all of the above except for Mega Aero (sorry meru :[) and Mega Amphy, since I was feeling extremely iffy about those two

Here are other changes I made (I hope i didn't forget what I changed lol):

Goodra --> B-: Its ability to check a lot of shit in this tier has gotten a lot more useful lately (especially w/Serperior getting a lot more potent), and
Dugtrio --> B-: It seems like theres fewer and fewer things it can trap, and it has major difficulty OHKOing shit in this metagame atm, meaning it has to rely on stuff being weakened in order to fulfill its trapping role.
Mismagius --> C: ?????????????????????????????????????? What the fuck was this doing in B- rank?
Milotic --> D: It's basically outperformed by all the other bulky waters within the defensive spectrum, and . The only thing I will grant is that it's not as bad as Scrafty or Trevenant, though.

On that note, I will archive the ranks for the end of January (even though it's the 2nd already), so enjoy the changes that have happened during the month!

 

[DiscoDucky]

Entei for S rank: This thing is a legit threat in this meta that every single team must prepare for. Sacred fire is really fucking spammable right now (although 8pp sucks) and it's damn annoying to switch into because of how often it burns and the extra chip damage it causes when it burns (add hazard support and that chip damage becomes really hard to deal with). Overall it has multiple opportunities in most battles to sear through opposing teams with Sacred Fire and Espeed alone; dedicated counters to this thing are almost necessary against the Sacred Doge, and even then, those burns are capable of wearing down those counters too.

Entei --> A+

I laughed when I reread this.
Fucking finally. You all overhyped this thing way too much.

 

[Schpoonman]

C/C: Heracross for S. There is no deny, we have a new top wallbreaker in UU. Scarf, Choice Band, Swords Dance, SubPunch, Flame Orb. Crobat is your only savior.

Salamence for A+? Jirachi taking a fucking hike makes Snowball that much deadlier, but it still has to compete with Scarf Mienshao, and Fairies (obviously) have free switch-ins on Outrage. The mix set faces a lot of competition, too much, I'd say, to be a true selling point anymore, but the Scarf and Dragon Dance sets are good enough to put it in A+. Keep in mind, this is completely ignoring its defensive capabilities, as 95/80/80 work well as a bulky tank thanks to Intimidate, while 135/110/100 offenses and a brutal movepool means it's NEVER a sitting duck. The only reason I don't immediately support Salamence for S is that we just aren't fully aware of its capabilities, but I'm confident it will be the new premier Dragon and a top threat in UU.

EDIT: Hey, shut up.

 

[DiscoDucky]

C/C: Heracross for D. There is no deny, we have a new top wallbreaker in UU. Scarf, Choice Band, Swords Dance, SubPunch, Flame Orb. Crobat is your only savior.

Salamence for A+? Jirachi taking a fucking hike makes Snowball that much deadlier, but it still has to compete with Scarf Mienshao, and Fairies (obviously) have free switch-ins on Outrage. The mix set faces a lot of competition, too much, I'd say, to be a true selling point anymore, but the Scarf and Dragon Dance sets are good enough to put it in A+. Keep in mind, this is completely ignoring its defensive capabilities, as 95/80/80 work well as a bulky tank thanks to Intimidate, while 135/110/100 offenses and a brutal movepool means it's NEVER a sitting duck. The only reason I don't immediately support Salamence for S is that we just aren't fully aware of its capabilities, but I'm confident it will be the new premier Dragon and a top threat in UU.

I agree. Heracross for D. Heracross is shit.

 

[dingbat]

rip serperior nvm i lied
rip starmie
rip diancie
rip raikou
rip onion lord
yay rachi is gone
suicune is s+++++++++++

I will rank the other shit in a week

 

[UU ALL DAY]

I laughed when I reread this.
Fucking finally. You all overhyped this thing way too much.

ffs I said that Entei shouldn't be S ranked, and that it should be A+ ranked, and people kept hating. smh ppl will do anything to bandwagon, even throw out logic.

Thinking Mence should be A+/S. Considering it's faster than hyderigon (the best dragon before the drops imo), has the ability to go mixed, special, physical, scarf, specs, banded, dd, bulky defog, or just subdd, it can obviously beat would be counters. Things like hippo get beaten by LO Draco + LO Outrage, and it can set up on bulky waters such as suicine/defensive pert with subdd + intimidate. It can run iron tail to beat fairies (not too reliably). Has okay typing, has roost. I can't see this thing being below A+ lol

 

[Thanks Brock Obama]

Hell I think this is gonna be a great time for Mega Aero, with such offensively oriented drops I'd say this is a great time to be Big Bird since it revenges Hera and Terrakion(if it isn't already quickbanned), stops DD Mence from setting up, has gotten a new partner for getting rid of bulky waters in the form of Heracross and just lost two serious checks in the form of Jirachi and Raikou. UU looks set to become a more offensively oriented meta, and since Mega Aero is at its best against offense I'd say S-Rank just might be a possibility in the near future.

 

[p2]

Mega Pinsir for S rank or A+ minimum, I don't even think this one needs explained

edit: oops, never noticed dingbat saying he'd rank the newly uu pokemon next week

 

[Pokemoon]

Mega Pinsir for S rank or A+ minimum, I don't even think this one needs explained

sort of the same with terrakion

 

[Kurona]

Can we get some clarification on what's quickbanned or not before ranking stuff to obvious S+?

 

[xMarth]

I will rank the other shit in a week

No reason to talk about the viability of the mons that are obviously broken and will most likely be quickbanned within a day or two. The new drops won't be added to viability until after the first vote on bans if my memory serves me correctly.

On a side note I will take the side that wants Mega Aerodactyl in S-rank. It is time for him to ascend.

 

[JuanchoTacorta]

Arcanine B+--->B As well as Offensive Arcanine is partially outclassed by Darmanitan, Infernape or Entei (Close Combat>Stone Edge), his defensive set has lost his favourite check, Rachi. Now he has to check Pinsir and Heracross now (hope Terrakion's quickban), as Mega-Aero will rise to S-rank. If he doesn't get any new set, he should go down the rank.

Mega Absol A- ---> A-/B+ The big issue about Absol was getting the Mega-stone activated. And Jirachi, Starmie, as well as Celebi were two pokemons who allowed him to evolve. Now they are gone, and we have two bulky fight pokes like heracross and terrakion. So getting the Mega is now even harder. But if he gets it, he will be a great lategame sweeper against them.

 

[Revelation]

I'd like to see Crobat go from A+ back to S. Jirachi and Raikou left while Heracross and (Mega) Pinsir joined UU so I do think it's S worthy again. It retains all of its past utility as well as handling these new threats. It also outspeeds Seperior.

EDIT: Some calcs I looked up -

252 SpA Life Orb Serperior Leaf Storm vs. 248 HP / 0 SpD Crobat: 57-68 (15.2 - 18.2%) -- guaranteed 5HKO after Stealth Rock
252 SpA Life Orb Serperior Dragon Pulse vs. 248 HP / 0 SpD Crobat: 101-120 (27 - 32.1%) -- guaranteed 3HKO after Stealth Rock
252 SpA Life Orb Serperior Hidden Power Rock vs. 248 HP / 0 SpD Crobat: 146-172 (39.1 - 46.1%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Stealth Rock

0 Atk Crobat Acrobatics (110 BP) vs. 0 HP / 0 Def Serperior: 228-270 (78.3 - 92.7%) -- 31.3% chance to OHKO after Stealth Rock

252 Atk Guts Heracross Close Combat vs. 248 HP / 60 Def Crobat: 79-94 (21.1 - 25.2%) -- 0.2% chance to 3HKO after Stealth Rock
252 Atk Guts Heracross Megahorn vs. 248 HP / 60 Def Crobat: 79-94 (21.1 - 25.2%) -- 0.2% chance to 3HKO after Stealth Rock
252 Atk Guts Heracross Knock Off vs. 248 HP / 60 Def Crobat: 116-137 (31 - 36.7%) -- guaranteed 3HKO after Stealth Rock
252 Atk Guts Heracross Stone Edge vs. 248 HP / 60 Def Crobat: 356-420 (95.4 - 112.6%) -- guaranteed OHKO after Stealth Rock

0 Atk Crobat Acrobatics (110 BP) vs. 0 HP / 4 Def Heracross: 544-648 (180.7 - 215.2%) -- guaranteed OHKO

 

[Nightingales]

Scarfbat does a great job at disposing both threats, though it can take some time to actually wear down the team enough to the point that it can step in and clean house.

Mega Aero should go to S, too, considering that it can outspeed the base forms of both when not-mega and still deliver lethal power, either in Rock Slide/Stone Edge/Whatever it runs or a flying option.

 

[dingbat]

There is no way I will rank mega pinsir/terra, they are clearly broken shit that will get quickbanned

 

[Tom the Bomb]

I believe Heliolisk should go to at least B-. With Raikou gone, there is a shortage of viable speedy electric types in the tier, and Heliolisk is one of them. It hits almost as hard as Raikou and has a nice immunity to water, making it a good bulky water switch in. While a scarf set may not be the most powerful, it outspeeds every relevant scarfer in the tier (barring crobat if you count that), outspeeding Terrakion and Infernape by 1 point. It has great coverage in Surf and Grass Knot, allowing it to nail ground types on the switch much harder than most electric types. Also, it has dual STAB in Hyper Voice that eases prediction with Ground types. Overall, Heliolisk is a lot better in this meta solely due to the fact that Raikou is gone.

 

[Dilwar]

I'd like to see Crobat go from A+ back to S. Jirachi and Raikou left while Heracross and (Mega) Pinsir joined UU so I do think it's S worthy again. It retains all of its past utility as well as handling these new threats. It also outspeeds Seperior.

EDIT: Some calcs I looked up -

252 SpA Life Orb Serperior Leaf Storm vs. 248 HP / 0 SpD Crobat: 57-68 (15.2 - 18.2%) -- guaranteed 5HKO after Stealth Rock
252 SpA Life Orb Serperior Dragon Pulse vs. 248 HP / 0 SpD Crobat: 101-120 (27 - 32.1%) -- guaranteed 3HKO after Stealth Rock
252 SpA Life Orb Serperior Hidden Power Rock vs. 248 HP / 0 SpD Crobat: 146-172 (39.1 - 46.1%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Stealth Rock

0 Atk Crobat Acrobatics (110 BP) vs. 0 HP / 0 Def Serperior: 228-270 (78.3 - 92.7%) -- 31.3% chance to OHKO after Stealth Rock

252 Atk Guts Heracross Close Combat vs. 248 HP / 60 Def Crobat: 79-94 (21.1 - 25.2%) -- 0.2% chance to 3HKO after Stealth Rock
252 Atk Guts Heracross Megahorn vs. 248 HP / 60 Def Crobat: 79-94 (21.1 - 25.2%) -- 0.2% chance to 3HKO after Stealth Rock
252 Atk Guts Heracross Knock Off vs. 248 HP / 60 Def Crobat: 116-137 (31 - 36.7%) -- guaranteed 3HKO after Stealth Rock
252 Atk Guts Heracross Stone Edge vs. 248 HP / 60 Def Crobat: 356-420 (95.4 - 112.6%) -- guaranteed OHKO after Stealth Rock

0 Atk Crobat Acrobatics (110 BP) vs. 0 HP / 4 Def Heracross: 544-648 (180.7 - 215.2%) -- guaranteed OHKO

Your calc on Knock Off does not take into account Crobat holding an item. So, the first Knock Off does 46 - 54, which is enough for a 2HKO after SR, factoring in the next weaker Knock Off.

 

[xMarth]

Your calc on Knock Off does not take into account Crobat holding an item. So, the first Knock Off does 46 - 54, which is enough for a 2HKO after SR, factoring in the next weaker Knock Off.

I believe he was calcing for Defensive ACrobat which does not hold an item.

 

[Revelation]

Your calc on Knock Off does not take into account Crobat holding an item. So, the first Knock Off does 46 - 54, which is enough for a 2HKO after SR, factoring in the next weaker Knock Off.

I believe he was calcing for Defensive ACrobat which does not hold an item.

Yup. I was.

 

[Dilwar]

Yup. I was.

Oh, TIL. Why does it not just carry Black Sludge and Brave Bird? :/

 

[Hogg]

Oh, TIL. Why does it not just carry Black Sludge and Brave Bird? :/

No recoil, and it becomes a solid Knock Off switch in with some bulk and no item. In return it's less of an offensive threat, so ACrobat is really only for bulkier teams that want it for support.

 

[GULLY]

Acro and bb are only a difference of 10 pp. So iwouldnt say its only for bulkier teams the loss of residual recovery actually kinda makes it more offensive

 

[SlickHippo99]

Slurpuff B- --> B+ Slurpuff is seriously good right now. It can sweep much more easily with Jirachi gone and can take advantage of Salamence locked into dragon type moves. It can set up a Sub on status users, then set up a free belly drum as the opponent switches out. Once that happens, it's pretty much gg if the opponent's poison types and priority users are dead. It's fairly easy to bring in without hard-switching and predicting too, thanks to users of Volt Switch/ U-turn/ Baton Pass like Rotom-H and -C, Vaporeon, Crobat, Hydreigon, Gligar, and M-Beedrill. In the current metagame, it is certainly more viable than the rest of the other 'mons in B- right now I think.

 

[thegrovylekid]

Not really a change, but I noticed that Mega Camerupt is more viable in OU than UU. Why is that?

 

[Dilwar]

Not really a change, but I noticed that Mega Camerupt is more viable in OU than UU. Why is that?

Probably because it faces off against the Pokemon in OU better than it does in UU. UU has a lot of bulky waters and other good checks like Hydreigon, so Camerupt doesn't really find room to perform.