Are we seriously going to discuss Ninetales for one whole week? We've been at it for less than half a day and we unanimously agree that it is a shitty excuse for a 'mon and that the only thing it can do is turn Venusaur into one mean motherfucker.
Choice Specs is used on moltres despite the fact it has an even bigger stealth rock weakness and moltres switches alot as well. Choiced fire types not named heatran are incredibly underrated in ou.Something about an offensive choice set on a pokémon that has to switch in and out several times during the match and is weak to stealth rock just doesn't sound right to everyone, you know.
Moltres reached an astounding 0.3% usage in december so I don't see how it's any relevantChoice Specs is used on moltres despite the fact it has an even bigger stealth rock weakness and moltres switches alot as well. Choiced fire types not named heatran are incredibly underrated in ou.
Alternatively, you can tailor your 'Tales so it survives as long as possible, thus keeping your weather up as long as possible. 'Tales' lifespan is already pretty short; it can't really afford to run CB or Specs sets like 'Toed or Ttar.Since everyone and their mother can force Ninetales out, I really don't think that switching out because of the Choice item is any more difficult on the fox to be honest. If you're going to be jumping into the battle field because you need to put sun up and you're going to die anyways, you can at least try to hit hard.
It isn't as if Ninetales wasn't switching in with rocks just to set up Sun if that's the better play.
Rapid Spin support is only really nessecary for 1 possible choiced fire type in OU and thats specs ninetales, which is incredibly rare. Infernape and Heatran are both neutral to SR and Volcarona much prefers the freedom of switching moves that quiver dance offers. The true problem with choiced fire types is that in the current OU Politoed can easily switch in and stomach a choiced fire attack, heatrans noticably and they both suffer other problems that make them undesirable. Infernape is hard to switch in initially and the only thing that seperates him from terrakion as a choice user is U-Turn, and a differant secondary STAB, unless you really want to use u-turn / spam flare blitz under sun (hard to pull off) then terrakion completly outclasses.Moltres reached an astounding 0.3% usage in december so I don't see how it's any relevant
Choiced fire types are not underrated - they just require good rapin spid support. Being a fire type in OU is hard enough already; but having to lock yourself into one move only means you'll be more easily forced out. Which only means you'll take more SR damage.
Ninetales needs the discussion. It is shit, but talking about what it can do is the only way to figure out how to get around it being shit. Since it'll be OU for the foreseeable future, figuring out a way to make it work is insanely helpful for Sun teams.Are we seriously going to discuss Ninetales for one whole week? We've been at it for less than half a day and we unanimously agree that it is a shitty excuse for a 'mon and that the only thing it can do is turn Venusaur into one mean motherfucker.
Scarf NineTrolls is the only thing I miss about the Gene days. Starting the battle 6-5 was always nice, until turn 2 when it was back to 5-5 because Tales died. Even with the Scarf, I would run Wisp to deal with lead Tyranitars and Terrakions, got some surprise cripples. Outside of surprise factor though, ScarfTales BLOWS.I've used Scarf Tales before for the lolz, and let me tell you: it sucks.
I had originally used it to lol troll those Scarf Genesect leads back when it wasn't banned, but I found its lack of power (even if I tried modest) very disappointing alongside its horrible coverage and "decent" speed. Furthermore, its SR weak and is horrible for revenge killing for the above reasons.
Also, it sucks at winning the weather war, which is Tales' main job. Why would I need a scarfer anyway when Chloro sweepers are fast enough to sweep on their own and to outspeed most scarfers?
My issue with SubDisableTales is that, unlike with Gengar, many Pokemon have more than one move that can break Ninetales' sub. Gengar abuses his immunities to Fighting, Ground and, to a lesser extent, Normal, to disable attacks because (ostensibly, anyway) few Pokemon have more than one move to hit Gengar (e.g. as soon as you disable Terrakion's Stone Edge, he can't touch you). And even on Gengar it doesn't work out so well. Using Disable on Ninetales will really only stopped Choice'd attackers, and will do very little against anything else.Scarf NineTrolls is the only thing I miss about the Gene days. Starting the battle 6-5 was always nice, until turn 2 when it was back to 5-5 because Tales died. Even with the Scarf, I would run Wisp to deal with lead Tyranitars and Terrakions, got some surprise cripples. Outside of surprise factor though, ScarfTales BLOWS.
Honestly though, I'm glad Tales got Mon of the week because like someone above said we need to discuss it to find a way to work it. I like the Sub-Disable idea, and will certainly be trying that out on my next Sun team.
It's certainly an option, but I find that Xatu beats the vast majority of rock setters. Xatu can stand up to all the defensive setters (Ferry, Forry, Skarm, etc) and has some interesting tricks against some of the offensive ones. For instance, Tyranitar hoping to set up rocks gets promptly U-Turned into Dugtrio who proceeds to smash him. Terrakion also meets a similar fate, although the outcomes may vary (pending choice sets).I don't play Sun, but...no Rapid Spin? Yes, Magic Bounce helps, but you won't be perfect with it, and many Rockers can OHKO Xatu, so you can't constantly switch him in.
Ninetales actually doesn't have such a shallow movepool, it lacks decent offensive options, but it's a rather mediocre offensive pokemon anyways.a shallow movepool,