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Project Neverused: Revival

Discussion in 'BW NU' started by Django, Jul 3, 2012.

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Django is a loser y/n

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  1. Django

    Django
    is a Smogon Media Contributoris a Tiering Contributoris a Contributor to Smogonis a Forum Moderator Alumnus

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    Project Neverused: Revival


    NU is a constantly changing metagame, and as it changes so do the Pokemon and sets that are useful. As such, with every tier change we will have a new Project Neverused, but all the good sets will be stored in a database. So with that out of the way, welcome to Project Neverused: Revival

    From the T-Monster:
    Rules

    1. You. must. actually. test. the. sets. you. post. I know you might think "I HAVE A REALLY COOL IDEA FOR A SET", but so does Molk. It doesn't mean they work at all. If your post shows obvious signs of not testing the set, I will delete it, and you will be unhappy. Nobody wins. Commenting on sets you haven't tested in response to other posts is fine though.

    2. When you post your sets, post a short description of the set, since people need to know the selling points of the set. At the very least, bullet point what it does well, what conditions it needs to succeed, and what it needs to watch out for. Keep in mind that the set database will be organized into 3 distinct sections, so designate which section your set is for. Here are the sets:

    • A. Creative Movesets. These posts work a lot like they would in a normal creative movesets thread, so just include the selling points of the moveset and/or Pokemon.

    • B. Standard Movesets with a TWIST. These are the kind of movesets that, while being similar to a standard moveset, make a modification that dramatically affects the Pokemon's playstyle. Examples would be a standard moveset having a unique item that has major selling points over the standard item, an EV spread that accomplishes a different goal, or a new move or two that alters the Pokemon's playstyle. Focus on how that small modification benefits the Pokemon in ways the regular item, moves, or ev spread can't achieve, and how this Pokemon's playstyle changes when compared to their standard set.

    • C. Underrated Movesets / Pokemon. There are several sets and mons out there that are well known to already work, but for some reason or another, just aren't used much, or have dramatically fallen in usage. When posting these sets, first focus on why you think the Pokemon's usage is low or why it has dropped so much. After that, give reasons for why you think this Pokemon is under rated. Think about answering questions like "Are there serious advantages to this Pokemon that most people miss?", "Does this Pokemon just need a specialized strategy to show its true potential?", and "How do you overcome the weaknesses that make this Pokemon's usage low?"
    3. Think before you post. If your post is totally useless to the thread, it'll get deleted (or worse I'll sic Zebraiken on you, and I think he's rabid).

    4. Post and discuss movesets whenever you want, this is the key difference from the last thread.

    Have at it.
  2. DTC

    DTC ˢᵉʳᶦᵒᵘˢ
    is a Battle Server Administratoris a Forum Moderatoris a Smogon IRC SOPis a Pokemon Researcheris a Smogon Media Contributoris a Tiering Contributoris a Contributor to Smogonis a Community Contributor Alumnus
    Moderator

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    THE DATABASE

    This is a database of all the sets that have been posted in this thread and proven to be viable. Check out this post every week or so, we NU mods will update this post a lot with new sets.

    Creative Movesets

    Standard Movesets with a Twist

    Sub Salac Samurott

    Samurott @ Salac Berry
    Trait: Torrent
    EVs: 4 HP / 252 SpA / 252 Spe
    Timid Nature
    • Substitute
    • Surf / Hydro Pump
    • Ice Beam
    • Grass Knot / Hidden Power Grass

    Credit to FLCL for the post; DTC for the idea (open)

    This Samurott uses the element of surprise and great coverage to destroy its usual counters. Special Samurott can beat or at least severely injure its usual counters, such as Altaria, Alomomola, and Amoonguss. With Substitute, it can set up on weak attackers such as Wartortle and start firing off powerful attacks. Salac Berry is the crux of this set, allowing Samurott to run through unprepared teams with Torrent-boosted Surfs.

    Sub Salac Samurott is best utilized with hazards, since it can be rather underwhelming without a Torrent boost. Cacturne and Garbador are both good Spikers to run alongside it since they can take Grass-type attacks aimed at it. Cacturne has the advantage of also resisting Electric while Garbador can set up on Amoonguss, which can still beat this Samurott at full HP. With Stealth Rocks and one layer of Spikes up, Samurott is guaranteed to 2HKO 252 HP / 112 SpD Bold Amoonguss on the switch. With Stealth Rocks and three layers of Spikes, this set can even 2HKO 252 HP / 252 SpD Calm Amoonguss with Ice Beam. Besides hazards, this set does not require much team support. Something that can take Cinccino's attacks such as Tangela or Probopass would be helpful since it can KO Samurott under a Sub if it doesn't have the Salac Berry boost under its belt.

    4 HP EV's make it so that Salac Berry activates on the third Substitute. A Timid nature is very important and allows Samurott to beat Absol, Adamant Braviary, and other Samurott. It also gives it the ability to outsrun every unboosted Pokemon in the tier besides Electrode after Salac Berry activates.

    The moves are standard for Special Samurott. Hydro Pump can be used over Surf to hit extremely hard, although it might let you down sometimes. Hidden Power Grass deserves a mention over Grass Knot since it hits light Pokemon such as Alomomola, Wartortle, and Gorebyss harder. However, a stronger hit against Lapras and other Fatmons can be useful.


    Sub Salac Swoobat

    Swoobat @ Salac Berry
    Trait: Simple
    EVs: 172 HP / 252 SpA / 84 Spe
    Modest Nature
    • Substitute
    • Calm Mind
    • Stored Power
    • Hidden Power Ground / Signal Beam / Air Slash / Roost

    Credit to CrashinBoomBang and MMF for the idea (open)

    Okay, this thing is the definition of a high risk high reward Pokemon: It's ridiculously hard to set up right, but once it gets going only priority has a good chance of stopping it, since it outspeeds everything up to Jolly Choice Scarf Cinccino and crushes even Pokemon such as Lickilicky and Musharna with its insanely devastating Stored Power. It works as follows: You bring it in after something dies and then Calm Mind or Substitute as you would with a normal Swoobat. Instead of just attacking, roosting off the damage or Calm Minding once while trying to preserve as much health as possible, you just try to set up as many Calm Minds as possible. Once you have enough boosts, Sub down into Salac Berry range, which gives you an extra 40 BP for Stored power as well as +2 speed, and start sweeping the opponents team. Of course, this should only be done once Pokemon such as Skuntank, Cinccino, Absol, Samurott etc are either sufficiently weakened or removed. If done right, it can devastate entire teams with the right support since revenge killing it without priority is almost impossible.

    Substitute, Calm Mind and Stored Power are a given on this set and should not be replaced. The last moveslot is for a coverage moves that hits Dark-types: Hidden Power [Ground] hits Skuntank much harder than Signal Beam but doesn't do a lot to Absol; it also allows you to break through Pokemon such as Bastiodon and Probopass. Signal Beam hits Absol as well as Psychic types such as Musharna but fails against Skuntank and Steel types. Air Slash is a nice middle ground - it allows you to do a good number to Skuntank, Absol and Musharna but still leaves you helpless against Steel-types. Roost is probably an option to make setting up against Pokemon such as Tangela or Amoonguss easier, but that leaves you completely helpless against Dark-types and needs even more support while also granting you some kind of protection against a last ditch Aqua Jet or something. The EV's can be altered to make Swoobat faster, but the added bulk actually helps a lot against Pokemon with little offensive Prowess (Tangela, defensive Musharna, Alomomola), and makes it much easier to attain multiple Calm Mind boosts. In this case, I just designed it to outspeed Jolly Max Speed Braviary.

    This set benefits a lot from screen protection, so pairing it with something that learns Light Screen and especially Reflect is recommended; with a Reflect up you can Calm Mind once as they bring in something such as Life Orb Cinccino, Calm Mind again as they Rock Blast for only 72-88 (which should activate Salac Berry unless you're really unlucky), and begin sweeping their team with a 220 base power STAB Stored Power off 834 Special Attack. It also appreciates hazards, especially Toxic Spikes, which allows it to kill foes such as Lickilicky much easier. However, the most important thing is still the removal of priority users in general and Dark-types in particular, since those are among the only things that can stop it after a successful setup.


    Under Rated Movesets / Pokemon

    SubSD Lickilicky


    Lickilicky @ Leftovers
    Trait: Own Tempo
    EVs: 224 HP / 32 Atk / 124 SDef / 128 Spd
    Careful Nature
    • Substitute
    • Swords Dance
    • Body Slam
    • Power Whip
    Credit to NoLuckInvolved for the idea (open)

    I haven't really seen anyone use this set recently, despite the fact it's incredibly effective with all the Regenerator cores running around. The EVs may look weird, however they serve a purpose. The HP EVs gives Lickilicky 404 HP, meaning its Substitutes cannot be broken by Seismic Toss, from the likes of Hypno or something. Those HP EVs, alongside 124 Special Defence EVs , with a Careful nature, means that Lickilicky's Substitute can never be broken by Amoonguss's Sludge Bomb, Rotom-S's Volt Switch and any of Alomomola's attacks. It can also take weak physical attacks, like defensive Lickilicky's Body Slam. The Speed EVs enable Lickilicky to outspeed Pokemon with a base Speed of 65, with 4 Speed EVs (:3), such Alomomola, Emboar, and anything below, like Tangela and Golem. Body Slam is the STAB move of choice, it also has a 30% chance of inflicting paralysis. Return is a viable alternative. Power Whip is its coverage move of choice, hitting Rock-types who resists Body Slam hard, such as Carracosta, Golurk and Golem. As far as team mates go, I've been using Musharna, as it can take on a majority of the Fighting-types in the tier, who generally have an easy time against this Lickilicky set. It can even support Lickilicky with Heal Bell! While in return, Lickilicky can take on Ghost-type attacks aimed at Musharna.


    Sunny Day Exeggutor

    Exeggutor
    (M) @ Leftovers
    Trait: Chlorophyll
    EVs: 4 Def / 252 SAtk / 252 Spd
    Modest Nature (+SAtk, -Atk)

    • Sunny Day
    • SolarBeam
    • Psychic
    • Sleep Powder

    Credit to CrashinBoomBang (open)

    Sunny Day Exeggutor is ridiculously good in the current metagame. Even without any HP investment, it is decently bulky and can live most hits that aren't super-effective with ease to set up Sunny Day. Once sun is up, Solarbeam will decimate most things that don't resist it, easily OHKO'ing both Zangoose and Cinccino. Psychics power isn't very far behind, OHKO'ing Emboar and Swellow easily, as well as physically defensive Amoonguss after Stealth Rock; it also 2HKO's Braviary. The only things that don't mind taking hits from this too much are Pokemon that resist it, which is pretty much limited to Klang, Cacturne, Skuntank and other Exeggutor, or dedicated special walls such as Lickilicky. Sleep Powder is an emergency button for this set, allowing Exeggutor to beat many of the Pokemon listed above and generally incapacitate almost everything it can't KO in one hit.

    Of course, Exeggutor has many other options on this set, such as running a Life Orb over Leftovers. Leftovers helps a lot when sweeping as well as tanking hits in general, and it doesn't gain many notable KO's; in fact, the only one I can think of right now is Braviary after Stealth Rock damage. A Timid nature is also an option, but without Modest the OHKOs against Swellow, Cinccino and Zangoose are no longer guaranteed. The extra speed comes in handy against Pokemon such as Rotom-S though, who outspeed you with a Modest nature. The last option would be using another move such as Substitute or Hidden Power [Fire] over Sleep Powder, which isn't worth it for me personally, but I guess it can work.


    April, May and June Sets


    Show Hide

    Creative Movesets

    Mixed Simipour

    Simipour (M) @ Flight Gem
    Trait: Gluttony
    EVs: 4 Atk / 252 SAtk / 252 Spd
    Naive Nature (+Spd, -SDef)
    - Acrobatics
    - Ice Beam
    - Hydro Pump
    - Low Kick

    Credit to TropOUs for the post and Zebraiken for the idea
    Low Kick might seem weird here but it has a few specific uses such as 2hkoing Regice(this means you Molk) and OHKOing Cryogonal if I have used its Flight gem before/ a Ludicolo is still alive, it also gets the hit on the rare Lapras and 2HKOes it . And Acrobatics is just to deal with Ludicolo that can be really annoying for him otherwise. Other two moves are standard coverage for Water-types. Because it has problems with other Water-types a Grass-type or Electric pokemon such are recommended to make everything easier for Simipour.

    Mixed Attacking Seviper

    Seviper (M) @ Life Orb
    Trait: Shed Skin
    EVs: 52 Atk / 200 SpAtk / 252 Speed
    Modest Nature (+SpAtk, -Atk)
    - Sludge Wave
    - Giga Drain
    - Flamethrower / Sucker Punch
    - Earthquake

    Credit to Full2Half for the idea, AyoGabos for the post
    The idea behind this set is to handle the infamous core of Tangela, Quagsire, and Flareon. With 100 Base Special Attack, Seviper can certainly pack a punch with STAB Sludge Wave against Tangela, Giga Drain against Quagsire, and Earthquake against Flareon with the 52 Atk EVs. I think the idea behind this is very creative seeing as the core is able to stifle many offensive teams.

    tennisnote: the original set listed Flamethrower, but Flamethrower doesn't hit much more than the other moves, and user bean1706 mentioned he used Sucker Punch for priority.

    Offensive Vileplume

    Vileplume (F) @ Life Orb
    Trait: Effect Spore
    EVs: 32 HP / 4 Def / 252 SAtk / 220 Spd
    Modest Nature (+SAtk, -Atk)
    - Sludge Bomb
    - Giga Drain
    - Synthesis
    - Sleep Powder

    Credit to Raseri
    Offensive Vileplume is a force to be reckoned with. Akin to Venusaur last generation Vileplume uses her exceptional special attack a long with great dual-stabs to demlolish many offensive Pokemon. Braviary, Magmortar and the like are crippled if they come in on Sludge Bomb. Giga Drain lets you beat all the ground types in the meta. Sleep Powder cripples just about everything and Synthesis lets you heal on predicted switches if you need to keep Vileplume alive.

    The EVs are specific, enough speed to outrun max speed marowaks, only 32 HP evs to drop LO recoil by one( you hit 299 hp) and the last four in defense to tank fighting types a bit better. Max Special attack for more oomph

    Bulky Swords Dance Ursaring

    Ursaring (M) @ Leftovers
    Trait: Guts
    EVs: 252 HP / 28 Atk / 132 SDef / 96 Spd​
    Careful Nature (+SDef, -SAtk)​
    - Swords Dance​
    - Substitute
    - Frustration​
    - Crunch/Earthquake

    Credit to CrashinBoomBang
    This set looks weird, but it's basically like a more offensive Sub Swords Dance Lickilicky. Ursaring has acceptable bulk; with the given EV's it can easily outspeed and set up a Sub against Tangela which it will be unable to break in one hit. Ursaring can then proceed to alternate between Swords Dance and Substitute until it is at +4 where it will always 2HKO Tangela. If they switch out then you're still at +2 behind your sub, and very few Pokemon can survive boosted STAB attacks from base 130 attack, even if the stat is nearly uninvested.

    The last slot depends on what its teammates can remove: If Ghost types are easy to remove then Earthquake is the better option to kill Pokemon such as Golem, Regirock and Bastiodon, all of which can beat Ursaring without Earthquake. If Rock types aren't a problem, then Crunch can be used to kill Ghost types such as Misdreavus, Haunter and Drifblim, which otherwise wall the set.

    The EV's, as previously stated, allow Ursaring to Swords Dance up against Tangela, since 4 Special Attack Giga Drain will never break its Sub. 96 Speed lets it outspeed most Tangela so you can use Substitute before they can Sleep Powder or Leech Seed you. The remaining EV's were played in attack to strengthen Ursarings blows a bit.

    Lickilicky might seem like a better option thanks to its superior defenses, but Ursaring has a few qualities that make it stand out: First and foremost, its attack stat is almost 1.5x as high as Lickilicky's, which can make a big difference if it can't boost all the way up to +6. For example, Ursaring almost always OHKO's 252/0 Emboar with a +2 Frustration, while Lickilicky would have its Sub broken while being forced out the next turn thanks to the threat of a super-effective Superpower or a Blaze boosted Flare Blitz. Another draw of Ursaring over Lickilicky is Guts: even if Toxic Spikes are up, Ursaring doesn't become useless since its attacks get powered up which allows it to go on a suicide rampage. It also means burns by Lava Plume/Will-O-Wisp don't mean the end for it. The final important thing Ursaring has over Lickilicky is Crunch, which allows it to beat Drifblim, as well as Haunter/Misdreavus more consistently. It's also a decent neutral coverage move.

    The things Lickilicky has going for it are the ability to hit Rocks and Ghosts (to a certain extent) at the same time with Power Whip, as well as much greater bulk. Ursaring, unfortunately, is also unable to beat Quagsire without Toxic Spikes (unless you get burned by Scald), while Lickilicky easily OHKO's. Basically, while Lickilicky does have some things going for it, Ursaring can run a SubSD set just as well.

    Life Orb Weezing

    Weezing @ Life Orb
    Trait: Levitate
    EVs: 240 HP / 252 SAtk / 16 Spd
    Modest Nature
    - Substitute
    - Pain Split
    - Sludge Bomb
    - Fire Blast

    Credit to CrashingBoomBang
    Weezing's passable Special attack, good movepool and unique typing allow it to be an effective defensive anchor for offensive teams. Possessing useful Fighting and Grass resists as well as a Ground immunity, Weezing can switch into a plethora of threats such as Serperior, Tangela, Amoonguss and Sawk with ease and either set up a Substitute, leech their health with Pain Split or outright attack with a decently powered Sludge Bomb or Fire Blast. Substitute allows Weezing to scout the opponents next move, and prevents Tangela and Amoonguss from using Status or Leech Seed; they are also unable to break it with any move bar Hidden Power [Psychic]. Pain Split allows Weezing to regain some of its health when something it can't handle 1 on 1, such as Probopass, switches in. Sludge Bomb is a STAB move and hits surprisingly hard with maximum investment and a Life Orb boost. Fire Blast is the preferred coverage move because it allows Weezing to get, at the very least, a neutral hit on every type except Rock. Thunderbolt can be used instead of Fire Blast as a coverage moves to hit Water types harder, but loses a lot of power against neutral targets compared to Fire Blast.

    Sludge Bomb's poison rate is extremely helpful when faced with threats such as the aforementioned Rock types or special walls such as Lickilicky because it means they can't stall Weezing forever. More speed can be run to outspeed specific targets such as Golem and most Emboar but, most of the time, Haunter does a better job at being a speedy Sub + Pain Split user; Weezing should make use of its great natural bulk. One advantage of a speed set would be Pain Split healing a lot more HP in percent. Be warned, however, that Tangela can now break an eventual Substitute with Hidden Power Rock which makes Weezing unable to retain one every time like it could with that bulky spread.

    Like SubSD Ursaring could be compared to Lickilicky, this set can kind of be compared to Haunter. They both make use of the combination of Substitute + Pain Split to keep their low base HP as high as possible. While Haunter is stronger and a lot faster, it is also a lot frailer and absolute Skuntank bait, which is everywhere in the current metagame. Weezing can also risk attacking stuff such as Golem since it's far from being one-shotted by Rock Blast or Sucker Punch.

    Standard Movesets with a Twist

    SubDisable Drifblim

    Drifblim (F) @ Flying Gem
    Trait: Unburden
    EVs: 252 Atk / 4 Def / 252 Spd
    Jolly Nature (+Spd, -SAtk)
    - Acrobatics
    - Substitute
    - Will-O-Wisp
    - Disable

    credit to No Luck Involved
    It's the standard Acroblim but instead of Destiny Bond it uses Disable. Since Drifblim has similar immunities and resistances as Gengar/Haunter it forces switches in a very similar way. What sets it apart from the standard set is the ability to beat standard bird counters/checks 1v1 like Golem, Regirock, Armaldo and Bastiodon. Max Atk Rock Blast Golem is a problem but as long as Wisp doesn't miss Blim will survive, Disable it and force it out or stall it out. Probopass is a notable exception because it has access to Power Gem and Volt Switch. Electric Types with BoltBeam coverage is also great counter to this but it eats up any Choiced mons.

    An advantage Drifblim has over Haunter is its speed after Unburden which allows it to Sub before everything including Scarfers and Disable them, so Drifblim can't be easily forced out offensively. It also has a very powerful attack that only has a few select counters in NU, allowing it to sweep once Rock/Steel and massively bulky stuff have been eliminated which Drifblim itself can do so it's quite self supporting. Like SubDisable Haunter/Gengar, it just loves hazards. I use max Speed because I prefer to have the good initial Speed to tie with Gardevoir and guarantee to outspeed Absol. I haven't found any calcs yet to suggest Adamant is particularly needed.

    I was using the standard AcroBlim to support my pseudo bird team to good success and I've recently began testing this as a way to more reliably take out bird counters than Destiny Bond although it does lose the general utility of a super fast DBond.

    Lead Torterra

    Torterra@Leftovers
    Trait: Overgrow
    EVs: 4 HP / 252 Atk / 252 Spe
    Adamant Nature (+Atk, -SAtk)
    -Bullet Seed
    -Earthquake
    -Stealth Rock
    -Synthesis

    from NoBlue
    The main idea that led me to this set is using Bullet Seed to take out Golem before it can set up Stealth Rock. The set itself has a good mix of power and bulk, can set up its own rocks, and has recovery. Bullet Seed is actually pretty useful for Substitute users. Looking at the top 10 leads list up there, Torterra is actually a pretty good matchup for almost all of them.

    Choice Band Cinccino

    Cinccino (M) @ Choice Band
    Trait: Technician
    EVs: 252 Atk / 4 Def / 252 Spd
    Jolly Nature (+Spd, -SAtk)
    - Bullet Seed
    - Rock Blast
    - Frustration
    - U-turn

    credit to Alex Arthur
    You don't really see the drop in speed [from not using scarf] since Zebra outspeeds you anyway :P But seriously this guy can wear down teams or act as a cleaner late game. Though I've lost more than 1 game to his scarfed breath en when he is the only one left.


    Mixed Exeggutor

    Exeggutor (M) @ Life Orb
    Trait: Chlorophyll
    EVs: 80 Atk / 252 SAtk / 176 Spd
    Rash Nature (+SAtk, -SDef)
    - Leaf Storm
    - Low Kick
    - Psychic
    - Sleep Powder

    Credit to FLCL
    This Exeggutor plays a lot like the Choice Specs set except it has the ability to defeat common checks such as Probopass, Lickilicky, and Cryogonal through the use of Low Kick, which comes off a surprisingly high 245 attack stat. Probopass and Cryogonal are both OHKO'ed on the switch while Specially Defensive is guaranteed to be 2HKO'ed with Rocks up.

    Additionally, Life Orb helps to bluff Choice Specs if you have not yet fired off an attack. Using Sleep Powder on the first turn is a good idea since the opponent will likely switch out after that, giving you a free shot on the incoming Pokemon. This can catch opponents off guard as they try to anticipate which Pokemon you will switch in after firing off a "Choice'd Sleep Powder".

    The EV's are used to outspeed standard Golem, which enables you to put it to bed before it can use Stealth Rock, unless it's holding the uncommon Lum Berry. Max special attack makes sure Exeggutor can hurt just about everything with a Life Orb Leaf Storm. The rest is dumped into attack to make Low Kick hit as hard as possible. A Rash nature is used to preserve Exeggutor's attack, speed, and decent physical bulk.


    Under Rated Movesets / Pokemon

    CB Kangaskhan

    Kangaskhan (F) @ Choice Band
    Trait: Scrappy
    EVs: 252 Atk / 4 Def / 252 Spd
    Adamant Nature (+Spd, -SAtk)
    - Double-Edge
    - Earthquake
    - Sucker Punch
    - Ice Punch

    from CBB
    Scrappy is also one of the greatest abilities in the entire game; with it Kangaskhan can easily threaten every non-Rock/Steel Pokemon not called Tangela with its STAB attacks alone, doing 52% minimum to the most defensive Misdreavus with an Adamant Choice Band boosted Double-Edge. Most of the aforementioned Rock and Steel types are easily eliminated by its powerful Earthquake, though, which only leaves Tangela as a truly insurmountable wall. Sucker Punch is also a great priority move, even though locking yourself into it with a Choice Item isn't the best idea. It actually hits surprisingly hard, even from Kangaskhans mediocre attack stat.

    The only problem I had with Kangaskhan is that it seems outclassed at some points. It's not as much as a hard hitter as Sawk, doesn't have Emboar's offensive typing and movepool and isn't as fast as stuff like Swellow. In conclusion, it's basically one of the only offensive Pokemon that also combines good bulk and decent speed, making it a rare sight in NU. Its great offensive typing (when taking scrappy into account) is also a godsend.


    Bulk Up Scraggy

    Scraggy (M) @ Eviolite
    Trait: Shed Skin
    EVs: 252 HP / 4 Def / 252 SDef
    Careful Nature (+SDef, -SAtk)
    - Bulk Up
    - Drain Punch
    - Crunch
    - Rest

    credit to Molk
    yes, the best Defensive Bulk up user (except possibly duosion/musharna) is a LC with low stats, but there are quite a few reasons why scraggy should be used over something such as throh. \

    1) shed skin, most bulk up users have to deal with toxic spikes, burn, and toxic in general, with the only way to remove it being a cripping, 2 turn rest, or in gurdurr's case, nothing at all! Scraggy's shed skin makes it semi immune to status such as toxic or burn, and lets it set up on walls that rely on toxic to deal damage quite easily. But thats not all, even if scraggy is forced to use rest, it has a pretty high chance of waking up early! (52% to the exact) giving less time for the opponent to crit it while its asleep

    2) Dark typing, other bulk up users like gurdurr and throh get their ass kicked by the fairly common gardevoir, musharna, duosion and kadabra. in short, scraggy's dark typing allows it to say "fuck you!" to every psychic and ghost type in the tier! (bar specs gardevoir with focus blast.) It also gives Scraggy perfect coverage bar croagunk with just its STABS! and a significantly stronger and more reliable dark move than its bretheren.

    Scraggy's main disadvantages are the inability to deal major damage without multiple bulk up boosts, and the fact that its bait for things like Cbraviary and sawk/gurdurr to come in, and therefore should be used with things that can take on these threats for best results.

    Mixed Emboar

    Emboar @ Expert Belt
    Trait: Blaze
    EVs: 160 Atk / 252 SAtk / 96 Spd
    Rash Nature (+SAtk, -SDef)
    - Superpower
    - Fire Blast
    - Grass Knot
    - Hidden Power [Ice] / Head Smash

    Credit to FLCL


    Mixed Emboar is simply amazing in the current metagame. It can feign a Choice set and grab surprise KO's on things such as Amoonguss, Carracosta, and Quagsire. This Emboar is extremely hard to wall thanks to its ability to hit hard both physically and specially, making it great against defensive teams. It's best used early game to gain the momentum right away and hopefully punch some hopes in the opponent's team, opening up for a path for a sweep by another Pokemon.

    Although this set is slow, it's usually not a problem since Mixed Emboar's main role is to break down walls. It would definitely enjoying having Thunder Wave support though, since it can probably mow over most teams after they are Paralyzed. The main Pokemon that should be paired up with this set are ones that can take advantage of walls being removed, such as Samurott or Absol. Sturdier Pokemon that can switch into Emboar's weaknesses are also good teammates since it is extremely easy to come in after something has died and revenge kill Emboar.

    Fire Blast and Superpower are givens on a Mixed Emboar set. They can break down bulky Grass-types who usually run defense and Normal-types who usually run special defense. Grass Knot can grab OHKO's on things such as Golem and Carracosta looking to tank a hit and KO with Earthquake or Waterfall. The last slot is used to hit Altaria, who would otherwise wall Emboar. Hidden Power Ice is the most reliable option, but Head Smash will be the better option once Shadow Tag Lampent comes out.

    96 Speed EV's are used to outrun max speed Golem and is the standard option for Choice Band sets. However, since Golem is no longer as common, they can be adjusted to fit your team. Max special attack is used to hit as hard as possible with Fire Blast, which will be Emboar's main move. The rest is dumped into attack to hit harder with Superpower, doing huge amounts of damage to the likes of Flareon and Lickilicky.

  3. Tribute

    Tribute

    Joined:
    Jul 7, 2007
    Messages:
    236
    [​IMG]
    Swanna

    At first glance, Swanna is pretty mediocre looking, with passable speed, but severely mediocre attacks and sub-par defenses and a seemingly shallow move pool. However what she lacks in stats she makes up for with powerful STAB attacks, the ability to go mixed to break special walls, and access to a perfect set of moves to get her job done.

    Now that she's made her glorious entrance, on to set options and how to use Swanna.



    All Out Sweeper
    [​IMG]@ [​IMG]
    Ability: Hydration
    Nature: Naive(+Speed, -SpDef)/Rash(+SpA, -SpDef)/Timid (+SpA, -Atk)/Modest(+SpA, -Atk)
    EVs: 252 SpA/4 Atk or Def/252 Speed
    - Surf
    - Hurricane
    - Ice Beam/Roost
    - Brave Bird/Roost

    Personally, this isn't my favorite set, but its still a feasible option for Swanna. Surf/Hurricane are her most poweful STABs and provide neutral coverage on anything you're likely to find in NU. For the other two slots you have a few options. Ice beam hits Altaria, who is otherwise a thorn in Swanna's side, for 4x damage instead of neutral, OHKOing even Max/Max every time after rocks*. Brave Bird has lost a lot of its utility with Cryogonal gone but it can be situationally useful for things like Curse Muk before it curses (assuming max hp and spdef) Or any other wall running Max HP/Max SpDef. Roost only gets a slash set because on an all out attacking set you will be hard pressed to find a chance to roost because of Swannas frailty. Concerning nature, +speed is always on option, but because her attacking stats leave something to be desired i prefer running modest/rash for maximum power as Swanna naturally outspeeds most anything she needs to, although she can work as a late game cleaner very well with paralysis/burn support on key opponents (Read: paralyze anything faster than her and burn Absol so you can live a sucker punch)

    * 252 SpAtk Life Orb Swanna (+SpAtk) Ice Beam vs 252 HP/252 SpDef Altaria (+SpDef) : 89.27% - 105.08%
    31.25% chance to OHKO
    - Guaranteed after rocks



    Stall/Wall-Breaker [Possibly Into Late Game Cleanup]
    [​IMG]@ [​IMG]
    Ability: Hydration
    Nature: Modest(+SpA, -Atk)
    EVs: 252 SpA/4 Def/252 Speed
    -Surf
    -Hurricane
    -Roost
    -Rain Dance

    This. This. THIS. Right here, is my favorite set to run on Swanna. You probably think I'm insane for trying to stall break with such medicore stats, but read on. As mentioned previously, Surf/Hurricane provides all the coverage you need to hit the current metagame for at least neutral damage. Where this set shines is coming in on common walls abusing the fact Rain Dance functions not only as a +1 for Surf but also a 5 turn auto-heal-bell by setting up Rain as they try to status it and proceeding to fire off Rain boosted stab surfs and 100% accurate hurricanes, roosting off life orb/opposing attacks (I know i said you'll be hard pressed to find a place to roost, but walls don't hit hard, just be careful not to roost into a giga drain from amoongus). Optionally, following forcing out the wall(or killing it) proceed into late game cleanup with the afformentioned status support while your rain is still up :pimp:

    A Few examples of common walls that swanna can setup on and break(I'll add more when i think of them):

    Amoongus -
    Rain Dance as they spore and proceed to spam hurricane until its dead(OHKO on 252/0 amoongus and 90% to max sp.def)

    Alomamamola -
    Rain Dance on a protect or toxic and proceed to spam Hurricane, it does min 74% so it will lose wish stalling, meaning either it dies or you get a free hit off on something as they switch. Freely roost off waterfall/LO recoil as needed during protects(It HAS to protect or it straight up dies).
    252 SpAtk Life Orb Swanna (+SpAtk) Hurricane vs 252 HP/0 SpDef Alomomola: 74.91% - 88.2%
    2 hits to KO (with Leftovers)


    Defensive Misdreavous (Be careful they aren't packing T-Bolt) - Worst missy can do is WoW or T-Wave you, setup rain in its face. Following that, spam surf until they die or switch(Hurricane if you expect an incoming water resist like Samurott, who gets shit on by hurricane)

    Detailed Result:
    252 SpAtk Life Orb Swanna (+SpAtk) Surf vs 252 HP/0 SpDef Eviolite Misdreavus:
    59.57% - 70.37%
    2 hits to KO
  4. TROP

    TROP [02:45] <~Molk> i have a personal hatred for druddigon
    is a Tiering Contributor

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    The original glorious Swanna user reporting in. There was only one use for Brave Bird back in the old days, OHKOing Cryogonal with it because it was able to take fabulous Swanna hits rather easily unless you got really lucky with Hurricanes(real men need no rain for Swanna). You don't really need it anymore and that slot would be better for Roost to keep Swanna healthy and able to hurt her opponents more before she goes down. And for Ice Beam, I never liked it, maybe it is because I had Sneasel for random dragon slaying or the fact that unless lol misses it gets overall the same kills as Hurricane Ice Beam on all of its main targets, except for Altaria, has the same power than a neutral Hurricane too.

    Based on that, and the fact that Swanna is the best mon in the world, and the coolest Game freak made for BW, I decided to simply use her fantastic STABs and find a way to overcome her frailness. If some of you have played on Smogon's NU since at least January, you probably remember and faced this set at least once.

    [​IMG] (F) @ Life Orb
    Trait: Hydration
    EVs: 252 SAtk / 252 Spd
    Timid Nature (+Spd, -Atk)
    - Surf
    - Roost
    - Substitute
    - Hurricane

    I originally got the idea for this set from a post made by Raseri back in I think round 2.It helps with some of Swanna's problems such as being easily revenged by Sucker Punch from Absol and Skuntank and being very prone to being revenge killed next turn by faster opponents.
    How this set works is simple, come in something Swanna will scare the fuck out or can't damage it at all i.e Alomomola or that your opponent can't afford to lose yet and set up a Substitute, from there all you need is to click the best move for the situation, and thanks to Swanna's fantastic offensive typing you will hardly have to worry about something that is not a Hurricane miss because she hits everything in the tier for at least neutral damage, unless you meet the mighty Chinchou.Roost is mostly filler and to keep Swanna healthy and able to set more subs, reduce the recoil she will be taking thanks to her SR weakness and Life Orb and make opponents that are slower and not really bulky scared of her when she manages to use it. Hydration is just because her other abilities are awful and taking advantage of the occasional rain is nice.

    Nature is also up to preference, personally I prefer Timid to outspeed annoying pokemon such as Sawk, Pinsir, and the occasional Sawsbuck, but Modest has a decent increase in power that can prove itself useful in some cases.

    I know this should be obvious, Swanna works better against slower offensive teams and more defensive oriented, give her a bit of hazard support and she will crush almost everything in her way. Cincinno is this set's #1 enemy, and if attempting to use it, removing it should be your main priority or just wear it down with the hazard support Swanna loves so much with something that is able to take it hits and force it out, like Klang.
  5. TLCJR4LIFE

    TLCJR4LIFE

    Joined:
    Jul 20, 2010
    Messages:
    193
    Phione and the Rain Stallers.

    [​IMG]


    Phione @ Damp Rock
    Trait: Hydration
    EVs: 252 HP / 252 Def / 4 SDef
    Bold Nature (+Def, -Atk)
    - U-turn
    - Rain Dance
    - Rest
    - Scald (do not use Toxic)




    While this set is on-site it truly is one of the more underrated mons in the tier based on it's dismal one percent usage rate.

    Previously it was largely outclassed by Rain supporters such Volbeat, and for good reason. In Hyper Offense rain teams, Volbeat was largely superior, being able to Encore lock to force switches and pass Substitutes to Ludicolo and Gorebyss. However, with the rise of Regenerator Amoonguss, the fall of dangerous threats like Magmortar and the general changes in the metagame, a new style of play has become viable, Rain Stall.

    Phione completely outclasses Volbeat and any other Rain Supporter with it's solid all around stats, workable speed, and annoying bulk with completely instantaneous full recovery in the rain, all the while being completely immune to status. At this point Phione is so rare you still have unfortunate turns like

    "Phione used Rain Dance"

    "Foe Pokemon used Toxic!"

    U-Turn is an excellent move for keeping momentum, denting grass types before switching and getting in just a bit of chip damage before switching to a wall breaker to get rid of that pesky Milk Drinking Miltank(who is completely walled by Phione due to inability to paralyze and eventual Scald burn).

    In a rain stall team, you should NEVER use Toxic like on-site. Ever. Phione will sorely miss the ability to burn and do solid damage with Scald, especially in the rain where it can do around 30-40 percent on solid bulky pokemon like Miltank and Kangashkan and hopefully burn them. Phione can also do situational things like taking out Choice Scarf Sawk by Resting on its Close Combat's until it gets enough drops to KO with Scald.

    The best thing about Phione is despite lack of Leftovers recovery, it's difficult to KO if you are careful with it. Pretty much anything physical and not an electric type or a STAB Normal will 3HKO it and give it a chance to Rest and start Scalding, or U-Turn/Switch to a better wall.

    Phione's really shining moment is against fellow walls however....there are only a handful of walls that can beat Phione one on one, obviously Tengela and Amoonguss being one of those, however, Phione can still get in a cheap shot with U-Turn and switch to something like Noctowl which walls those bulky grass types.

    Phione is also low maintenance....while it and the team certainly benefit from rain, it can be used just like a normal stall mon without having to worry about getting rain up at every opportunity to win the match.
  6. Ewil

    Ewil

    Joined:
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    Messages:
    467
    [​IMG]

    Alomomola @ Leftovers
    Trait: Regenerator
    EVs: 252 HP / 252 Def / 4 SDef
    Impish / Bold Nature
    - Wish
    - Protect
    - Knock Off
    - Waterfall / Scald


    Is simply a twist but i would suggest Knock Off over Toxic on Alomomola.
    It has a gimmick use since you suppose to switch in Alomomola on a Physical sweeper and then, your opponent's best choice is switching to the appropriate counter. It's a very predictable action with Alomomola on your side so you can start knocking off opponet's items. One of the common switchs in on Alomomola is Tangela and he's severly crippled if he loosing his Eviolite.
    This twist in the usual set is recommanded to use with a partner that can lay down hazards, especially Toxic-Spikes since they can ovviate to the loss of Toxic in the Alomomola set and she can take advatage with Knock Off and Protect.
  7. Yonko7

    Yonko7 Guns make you stupid. Duct tape makes you smart.
    is a Contributor Alumnus

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    This set is also useful if its a team that needs para-support rather then poison. Also, knocking off Evolites and stray Lum Berrys is invaluable.
  8. Chidori

    Chidori

    Joined:
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    My completely original...
    [​IMG]
    Pikachu
    Type: Electric
    Ability: Lighting Rod
    Nature: Hasty/Naive
    Item: Light Ball
    EVs: 68 Atk/188 SpA/Spd
    Moves:
    -Fake Out
    -Thunderbolt
    -Hidden Power (Ice)
    -Brick Break

    Everyone always uses that silly Sub + Focus Punch combo but they don't realize that Pikachu is much better then that. Fake Out is there as a priority move as well as to cause a flinch. Thunderbolt is there for STAB and can easily take down water types like Wartortle and flying types like non choice scarf Bravery. Hidden Power is there to take down weakened grass and ground types. And last but not least, Brick Break is there specifically for Bastiodon and other Normal Types that have their EVs not invested on Defense. Of course, other non defensive pokemon can easily be damaged including steel types.
  9. Sweet Jesus

    Sweet Jesus Neal and Jack and me, absent lovers...

    Joined:
    Apr 22, 2012
    Messages:
    509
    Seems like a noob trap. who stays in on a potential stab hurricane with amoonguss and alomomola ? Smart players are more likely to switch to a special wall or electric type to tank the hurricane and volt switch back. Defensive pelipper seems better for this kind of set imo. Put lum berry if you really miss hydration and you'll get rain dish instead. The loss in speed is highly worth the better bulk imo and pelipper finds a new niche with the decline of stone-edge and the rise of ice punch (you wanted accuracy, here now take a fucking pelican !). Plus modest swanna speed ties with max speed 85's which is pretty unfortunate (and means even post-trick rotom can come in on rain dance or hurricane and volt switch).

    About TLC's phione: cool stuff, original. Me like (so sad he can't take eviolite though)
  10. Tribute

    Tribute

    Joined:
    Jul 7, 2007
    Messages:
    236

    If they have an electric type/flying resist or special wall i just go for surf, because electric does not resist water despite being SE against it and any "offensive" electric types generally get OHKO'd, if they live i just go into piloswine.

    Rain boosted surf calcs on electric types who resist hurricane in NU:

    Detailed Result:
    252 SpAtk Life Orb Swanna (+SpAtk) Surf vs 0 HP/4 SpDef Rotom-F: 98.76% - 116.18%
    87.5% chance to OHKO

    Detailed Result:
    252 SpAtk Life Orb Swanna (+SpAtk) Surf vs 252 HP/4 SpDef Rotom-F: 78.29% - 92.11%

    Detailed Result:
    252 SpAtk Life Orb Swanna (+SpAtk) Surf vs 4 HP/0 SpDef Zebstrika: 125.68% - 147.95%
    Guaranteed OHKO

    Detailed Result:
    252 SpAtk Life Orb Swanna (+SpAtk) Surf vs 252 HP/0 SpDef Eelektross: 81.82% - 96.26%

    Detailed Result:
    252 SpAtk Life Orb Swanna (+SpAtk) Surf vs 252 HP/252 SpDef Eelektross: 61.76% - 72.99%

    Detailed Result:
    252 SpAtk Life Orb Swanna (+SpAtk) Surf vs 0 HP/0 SpDef Raichu: 117.24% - 137.93%
    Guaranteed OHKO

    Detailed Result:
    252 SpAtk Life Orb Swanna (+SpAtk) Surf vs 0 HP/0 SpDef Emolga: 152.19% - 179.28%
    Guaranteed OHKO


    As far as a special wall, i can generally beat special walls 1v1 with roost/rain dance bar regice or missy packing T-Bolt
  11. Chidori

    Chidori

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    He got you there Jesus. You call him a Noob? If he can actually get these result then you shouldn't really be responding.

    EDIT: Why does fat appear on the quote?
  12. CrashinBoomBang

    CrashinBoomBang <~BKC> fuck consent
    is a Contributor to Smogonis a Tiering Contributor Alumnus

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    To be honest, those Pokemon shouldn't switch in when rain is up (but rather on the turn Rain Dance is used, into a Surf or as a revenge kill), so those calcs aren't really relevant.

    Anyway, I believe that Swanna is a great Pokemon in general right now, but you should probably remove the all out sweeper set from your post since it's not original by any means. I like both Sub and Rain Dance + Rest though.
  13. Machineae

    Machineae

    Joined:
    Aug 26, 2011
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    This is the only set I use currently and will ever use on Swanna. IMO its the best because you don't have to waste time setting up RD. You also out speed walls, so you don't need to even bother with Hydration. I just like this set the best because of the ease at which you can go into a battle against a slower team and come out at the top after eliminating threats to Swanna.
  14. Yonko7

    Yonko7 Guns make you stupid. Duct tape makes you smart.
    is a Contributor Alumnus

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    Messages:
    651
    But outside of rain, isn't the accuracy of Hurricane 70%. I feel that things that resist water and get lucky with hurricane can beat her.

    - that's a bad way to beat her xD
  15. Sweet Jesus

    Sweet Jesus Neal and Jack and me, absent lovers...

    Joined:
    Apr 22, 2012
    Messages:
    509

    I didn't call him a noob, I said his examples of oppurtunity to set up rain dance were only valid against noobs. I didn't think it was necessary to reply to his answer but if you think I should, here it goes:

    First off, as I said, swanna's speed with modest is not that good and since it's very frail, it will really struggle getting rain up. Predicting a switch and going for surf surely is an option but this is just a calssic situation where a hard hitting pokemon has a choice to try and predict the swith or not. If it is to be used like that, swanna is probably not the best option for other special attackers run better speed, bulk power and require no set up to have 100% accuracy attacks that hit very hard and no SR weakness for more swith-ins. If swanna's dual typing is the niche your team needs, something else should help set up the rain, because swanna will have a very tough time setting it up itself against experienced players. The free moveslot can be used on sub like on tropiOUs set and swanna can still act the same way with rain support because this set is too slow and frail to set it up itself. Tribute also did not mention eviolite buzz in his calcs and as cbb said, they include rain is already up while I suggested people would switch to faster electirc types on the turn they swap amoonguss and swanna sets up rain (since he's modest nealry every electric type outspeeds him, that was the point).

    As for the term noob, if it offended you, I am sorry but I was not talking about tribute but the opponents who spored and toxiced swanna. My comment was meant to be constructive only. Let's not start any drama on smogon (humans invented facebook for that).
  16. JacobJinglepocket

    JacobJinglepocket

    Joined:
    Sep 7, 2011
    Messages:
    44
    [​IMG]

    Zweilous@Eviolite
    Trait:Hustle
    EVs: 252 HP, 4 Atk, 252 SpDef
    Careful nature (+SpDef, -SpAtk)
    ~Rest
    ~Sleep Talk
    ~Dragon Tail
    ~Toxic/Protect/Crunch

    This is a set I've been using for the NU research week. It faces stiff competition as a bulky Dragon-type from the likes of Dragonair and Shelgon, who have arguably better typing and abilities; and Altaria, who has access to Roost and Heal Bell. Its main advantage over those Pokemon is its secondary Dark-typing, giving it useful resistances to Ghost- and Dark-type attacks, as well as an immunity to Psychic attacks.

    Zweilous is meant to be a bulky pivot for teams that are in need of its multitude of resistances; switch into any predicted Electric-, Fire-, Grass-, Water-, Ghost-, Dark-, or Psychic-type attack and proceed to wreak havoc. Dragon Tail to force out anything that dares to set up in front of you, while Resting off any status or damage Zweilous racks up along the way. Toxic is the main option in the fourth slot to wear down any non-Poison or Steel type the opponent switches in, though Protect may be used to scout for the random Fighting or Ice type attack, as well as stall for time. I recommend you have Toxic Spikes down if you decide to go with Protect. Crunch is also an option if you choose to use Zweilous on a more offensive minded team, keeping the likes of Gardevoir from Focus Blasting you all to hell.

    The EVs are for maximum special bulk, allowing to wall threats such as Amoongus, Charizard, special Eelektross, and Haunter. Psychic types that lack Focus Blast, such as Musharna and Kadabra, also have a hard time breaking through Zweilous' meaty Special Defense with Hidden Power Fighting. Having entry hazards down is also important, allowing Zweilous to rack up residual damage every time it phazes out a Pokemon.

    Golurk pairs well with Zweilous, setting up Stealth Rock while walling any Fighting- or Bug-type attacks thrown the dark dragon's way. Wartortle takes any Ice-type attacks and can Rapid Spin away the opponent's entry hazards. Vileplume and Amoongus can also endure Fighting-type's assaults while healing status with Aromatherapy for the former, or shutting down threats with Spore for the latter.
  17. FLCL

    FLCL
    is a Tiering Contributoris a Team Rater Alumnusis a Forum Moderator Alumnusis a Community Contributor Alumnusis a Past SPL Winner

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    I think Dragonair does that set better since it now has access to Marvel Scale which boosts its defense when it's asleep and a much more accurate Dragon Tail. It also lacks weaknesses to Fighting and Bug, which comes in handy when walling opponents.
  18. Axa

    Axa

    Joined:
    May 14, 2010
    Messages:
    400
    [​IMG]@Life Orb
    252 Atk, 120 Sp. Atk, 132 Speed
    Brave (+Atk, -Spd)
    ~Wood Hammer
    ~Earthquake
    ~HP Ice
    ~Synthesis/Rock Polish

    "What?" you may ask on seeing HP Ice. One thing a lot of people easily overlook is that Torterra has 75 base Sp. Atk, which, while not mind-blowingly amazing, is still enough to catch people off-guard.

    With HP Ice, one of Torterra's biggest stumbling blocks, Tangela, is almost guaranteed to be 2HKO'd, with it being guaranteed with Rocks. (The given EVs ensure that Torterra always outspeeds 0 Spe Tangela.) Altaria is still 2HKO'd after Rocks.

    There are of course problems- Wood Hammer + Life Orb takes a heavy toll on Torty's health, even with Synthesis, which you won't always get the chance to use. Rock Polish becomes a secondary option- 132 Speed EVs with a -ve nature still mean you outspeed +ve Swanna after a single Rock Polish. Pokemon like Golbat and Rotom-S become harder to take down without Rock Slide/Stone Edge. Weezing still walls you from heck to back (interestingly, HP Psychic has a 53% chance to 2HKO Weezing before Rocks, but is near useless otherwise).
  19. FLCL

    FLCL
    is a Tiering Contributoris a Team Rater Alumnusis a Forum Moderator Alumnusis a Community Contributor Alumnusis a Past SPL Winner

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    DTC and I came up with this set when we were building a team together.

    Sub Salac Samurott

    [​IMG]

    Samurott @ Salac Berry
    Trait: Torrent
    EVs: 4 HP / 252 SAtk / 252 Spd
    Timid Nature
    • Substitute
    • Surf / Hydro Pump
    • Ice Beam
    • Grass Knot / Hidden Power Grass

    This Samurott uses the element of surprise and great coverage to destroy its usual counters. Special Samurott can beat or at least severely injure its usual counters, such as Altaria, Alomomola, and Amoonguss. With Substitute, it can set up on weak attackers such as Wartortle and start firing off powerful attacks. Salac Berry is the crux of this set, allowing Samurott to run through unprepared teams with Torrent-boosted Surfs.

    Sub Salac Samurott is best utilized with hazards, since it can be rather underwhelming without a Torrent boost. Cacturne and Garbador are both good Spikers to run alongside it since they can take Grass-type attacks aimed at it. Cacturne has the advantage of also resisting Electric while Garbador can set up on Amoonguss, which can still beat this Samurott at full HP. With Stealth Rocks and one layer of Spikes up, Samurott is guaranteed to 2HKO 252 HP / 112 SpD Bold Amoonguss on the switch. With Stealth Rocks and three layers of Spikes, this set can even 2HKO 252 HP / 252 SpD Calm Amoonguss with Ice Beam. Besides hazards, this set does not require much team support. Something that can take Cinccino's attacks such as Tangela or Probopass would be helpful since it can KO Samurott under a Sub if it doesn't have the Salac Berry boost under its belt.

    4 HP EV's make it so that Salac Berry activates on the third Substitute. A Timid nature is very important and allows Samurott to beat Absol, Adamant Braviary, and other Samurott. It also gives it the ability to outsrun every unboosted Pokemon in the tier besides Electrode after Salac Berry activates.

    The moves are standard for Special Samurott. Hydro Pump can be used over Surf to hit extremely hard, although it might let you down sometimes. Hidden Power Grass deserves a mention over Grass Knot since it hits light Pokemon such as Alomomola, Wartortle, and Gorebyss harder. However, a stronger hit against Lapras and other Fatmons can be useful.
  20. Axa

    Axa

    Joined:
    May 14, 2010
    Messages:
    400
    Just a question for the Swanna lovers; can Pelipper run its set effectively as well? It has many similiar traits, though it's far more defensive, has Rain Dish instead of Hydration. Its biggest problem is its slow speed, in retrospect.
  21. Alex_Arthur

    Alex_Arthur

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    Mar 29, 2010
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    50
    Swanna's speed really set it apart from Pelipper in my opinion. There's nothing stopping you using Pelipper but I don't think it would work nearly as well without being able to outrun some things.
  22. Audiosurfer

    Audiosurfer @ Audiosurfite
    is a member of the Site Staffis a Forum Moderatoris a Community Contributoris a Smogon Media Contributoris a Tiering Contributoris a Contributor to Smogon
    Moderator

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    Isn't Marvel Scale illegal with Sleep Talk though? That's what it says onsite anyways.
  23. swiftzx

    swiftzx

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    Jun 30, 2012
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    Not anymore with the BW2 move tutors.
  24. Tribute

    Tribute

    Joined:
    Jul 7, 2007
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    Ironically the entire reason i started using Swanna was because a while back i saw a LC video on youtube and they used a Rain dance hurricane abusing Wingull so i got the idea to try it with Swanna.

    That being said, Pelliper does have more bulk, but its alot slower and has less attacking power
  25. BlackLightAttack

    BlackLightAttack

    Joined:
    Jun 29, 2010
    Messages:
    75
    Glaceon @Choice Scarf
    [​IMG]

    Ice Body

    Timid
    4 HP
    252 SpA
    252 Spe

    Ice Beam
    HP Ground/HP Fighting/HP Electric
    Shadow Ball
    Hyper Voice/Signal Beam/Wish

    This is a twist on the standard Choice Specs set. The main attraction here is how surprisingly fast it is with a scarf. Trick your opponent into thinking you're Specs or Support and this thing can really wreak havoc. Keep in mind Glaceon's base speed is the same as Emboar's, and its special attack stat is through the roof. They might be equally viable common Scarf users if not for Emboar's much better typing.

    Ice Beam is the obvious STAB of Choice, and probably what Glaceon will be using 75% of the time. Coming off of a massive 130 base SpA, it's nothing to scoff at. Glaceon also has a few options when it comes to Hidden Power choices. HP Ground is recommended by the Choice Band set to cover Rock, Steel, and Fire-types that threaten Glaceon, not to mention handy super effective hits on Electric and Poison types. This is probably the best option. However, HP Fighting also hits the Rock and Steel-types, while also smashing Ice-types that switch in to resist an Ice Beam, as well as Normal and Dark-types. HP Electric has the poorest super effective coverage of the 3, but does score the important super effective hit on Water-type switch ins, along with completing a ghetto BoltBeam combo. Shadow Ball is there for coverage as well as its usable base power, and the last slot is mostly filler. Luckily, the BW2 move tutors have opened up some options for this slot. What you choose as your Hidden Power will likely determine what fills it. Hyper Voice has the obvious downside of not hitting anything super effectively, but has high base power and gives Glaceon a safer bet for neutral coverage. Signal Beam really isn't recommended due to the plethora of resistances that Bug-type attacks face, but it can offer a valuable super effective hit on Dark-types if your'e not running HP Fighting. Wish is the final option for some last-ditch support, but it doesn't work as well without the HP investment that the Specs set carries.

    While testing this set, I used the Ice Beam/HP Electric/Shadow Ball/Hyper Voice combination. HP Electric was probably a bad choice to go with Hyper Voice, but it did pay off to dent Water-type switch-ins a few times. It's surprising to say the least. Like I said, though, about 75% of the time, Glaceon was just spamming Ice Beam. It was put on a team where SubPunch Golurk was supposed to be the star, but more than half the time I only ended up winning because I was able to fall back on Glaceon and its speedy Ice Beam spam. The team was Golurk, Toxic Boost Zangoose, Glaceon, Torkoal, Simple Calm Mind Swoobat, and Wish Lickilicky. It worked pretty well for Glaceon, having a Rapid Spinner as well as a Wish passer. It never had a hard time getting in for a revenge kill. It also served as a very nice switch-in to relatively weak hits (most often Wartortle's Scalds) thanks to Glaceon's formidable bulk.

    I haven't tested a hail team, but it's pretty obvious that Scarfed Glaceon would do well on one, as rare as they are these days. Unfortunately, hail teams are now missing their premier Rapid Spinner now that Cryogonal is gone, and Rapid Spin support is critical. Luckily, Ice Body can help recover HP lost to residuals.

    The main pro here for Scarfed Glaceon is the surprise factor, which is generally the main reason for using these creative movesets in the first place. Its fantastic SpA stat certainly helps, as I find it doesn't need the Choice Specs to severely dent a large portion of the metagame. Its movepool is disappointing, but with its choice of Hidden Power and the new Move Tutor attacks it just barely manages a respectable lineup.

    The downsides are obvious: it's outclassed as a specially-offensive Scarf user by many, like Rotom and Gardevoir (who can also utilize Trick to provide some utility). It generally loses to common Scarf users, bar Rampardos. You'll need to find your Sawk check somewhere else, to be sure. Its typing is a major let down, offering too many weakenesses and only one resistance. But with the right team, it can be a shock that can quickly turn the game in your favor.
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