Project The Next Best Thing - rip

Status
Not open for further replies.
Magnemite

Magnemite

is a Site Content Manager Alumnusis a Senior Staff Member Alumnusis a Top Community Contributor Alumnusis a Metagame Resource Contributor Alumnusis a Tiering Contributor Alumnusis a Top Contributor Alumnus
approved by people
op stolen from no one because the op people use for this is practically an ancient document by now

Hello and welcome to The Next Best Thing. This project aims to discover sets for Pokemon in the PU metagame that may not be standard now, but actually work well enough to possibly become the new standard. There are plenty of examples of new sets that have become just as standard as old sets or even overtaken them, even in the relatively young XY PU metagame. This can be seen in the rise of Poliwrath sets other than Resttalk and SubPunch, the complete shift of Mantine (rip ;_;) from being an exclusively defensive threat to an exclusively offensive one, the once standard tank Golem falling out of popularity in favor of the now common fast Weakness Policy set, and other similar trends. As a community it is our goal in this thread to find new sets for established PU threats that may in time even be considered standard or at least close to it.

Each week I will choose a PU Pokemon. You will have 5 days to come up with and post an original set for that Pokemon, along with an explanation how the set works. In the two days after that, the community will vote on which set is the most creative as well as viable. By "original sets", I mean sets that are not already being given main sets on analyses (for Pokemon that do not have in progress analyses yet you will have to use your judgement on what is considered creative and uncommon enough to be worthy of a set here).

When choosing a set to nominate, you should keep in mind how viable and how unique it is. Despite this project being about uniquness, please refrain from posting gimmicky sets like Swords Dance Tangela or Choice Specs Tauros. However, your set should not simply be a standard set with a slight deviation, such as Leftovers over Life Orb on Nasty Plot Mr. Mime. That said, single move changes are generally okay as long as the new move does something specific that the normal set cannot do, such as breaking past a certain check or counter.

Also, please do not "reserve" your sets before you finish your explanation of them.


stoutland.gif

Our current test subject is Stoutland!​
 
Last edited:
Hall of Fame (Click on the sprite within the hide tag to go to the explanation of how the set works)

Week One: Leafeon (Won by Anty)


Leafeon @ Leftovers
Ability: Chlorophyll
EVs: 252 HP / 212 Def / 44 Spe
Impish Nature
- Leaf Blade
- Knock Off / Yawn / Heal Bell
- Synthesis
- Baton Pass

Week Two: Rotom-F (won by scorpdestroyer)

Rotom-Frost @ Chesto Berry
Ability: Levitate
EVs: 252 SpA / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
- Rest
- Volt Switch / Will-O-Wisp
- Thunderbolt
- Blizzard

Week Three: Misdreavus (won by galbia)

Misdreavus @ Choice Scarf
Ability: Levitate
EVs: 4 Def / 252 Spa / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
- Trick
- Nasty Plot
- Shadow Ball
- Thunderbolt

Week Four: Ninetales (won by Texas Cloverleaf)

Ninetales @ Leftovers
Ability: Flash Fire
EVs: 248 HP / 8 SpD / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
- Flamethrower
- Toxic
- Protect
- Substitute

Week Five: Pelipper (Won by Magnemite)

Pelipper @ Life Orb
Ability: Rain Dish
EVs: 252 SpA / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Modest Nature
- Agility
- Hydro Pump
- Hurricane
- Roost

Week Six: Kecleon (won by 2xTheTap)

Kecleon @ Life Orb
Ability: Protean
EVs: 248 HP / 252 Atk / 8 Def
Brave Nature
IVs: 0 Spe
- Trick Room
- Sucker Punch
- Drain Punch
- Knock Off

Week Seven: Lickilicky (won by scorpdestroyer)

Lickilicky @ Leftovers
Ability: Oblivious
EVs: 132 HP / 252 Atk / 124 Spe
Adamant Nature
- Body Slam
- Power Whip / Earthquake / Protect
- Knock Off / Protect
- Wish / Heal Bell

Week Eight: Probopass (won by GasQuake)

Probopass @ Life Orb
Ability: Magnet Pull
EVs: 16 HP / 252 SpA / 240 Spe
Modest Nature
- Rock Polish
- Earth Power
- Flash Cannon
- Thunderbolt

Week Eight: Torterra (won by scorpdestroyer)

Torterra @ Custap Berry
Ability: Overgrow
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 Def / 252 Spe
Adamant Nature
- Earthquake
- Wood Hammer / Seed Bomb
- Stealth Rock / Stone Edge
- Endure
 
Last edited:
leafeon.gif

Leafeon @ Leftovers
Ability: Chlorophyll
EVs: 252 HP / 212 Def / 44 Spe
Impish Nature
- Leaf Blade
- Knock Off / Yawn / Heal Bell
- Synthesis
- Baton Pass
Ladies and gentlemen i give you defensive pivot Leafeon. A couple months ago i was experimenting with defensive pivots, as there has been a lack since mush left the tier, but the only ones a i could find where pelipper, which wasnt offensive enough, and solrock which had move illegalities (mourning sun is illegal with baton pass). Leafeon really fulfils that job as it is a good base 130 defense, whilst boasting an attack stat of 110, good coverage and a decent speed. The EV's allow it to outspeed max aurorus and rampardos, which this set can beat with leaf blade. Synthesis provides decent recovery, whilst the last slot is between knock off, annoying things like togetic and tangela on the switch, yawn, which gives you a safer baton pass into a set up sweeper and heal bell, so it can take burns and help its team more. Bullet seed could be used to mess with lead baracle and golem, but you need 132 speed evs which is too much imo.

252+ Atk Tauros Double-Edge vs. 252 HP / 228+ Def Leafeon: 109-130 (32.6 - 38.9%) -- 99.4% chance to 3HKO
252+ Atk Poliwrath Focus Punch vs. 252 HP / 228+ Def Leafeon: 132-156 (39.5 - 46.7%) -- guaranteed 3HKO
+2 252+ Atk Life Orb Carracosta Stone Edge vs. 252 HP / 228+ Def Leafeon: 250-294 (74.8 - 88%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
252+ Atk Throh Storm Throw vs. 252 HP / 228+ Def Leafeon on a critical hit: 84-99 (25.1 - 29.6%) -- guaranteed 4HKO
These are the tiers scariest physical attacks, pls
It can also pivot in on volt switches and check certain random special attackers n_n

I really like the way that this set isnt limited by playstyle and can fill wholes in several teams.
 
Last edited:
leafeon.gif

Leafeon @ Leftovers
Ability: Chlorophyll
EVs: 252 HP / 24 Atk / 68 Def / 124 SpD / 40 Spe
Careful Nature
- Leaf Blade
- Swords Dance
- Baton Pass
- Substitute / Knock Off

This is Baton Pass Leafeon! Instead of sweeping by itself, this set opts to Baton Pass the boosts it got from Swords Dance. Leaf Blade is obvious to have a good STAB. Swords Dance is to boost your attack, which makes you more threatening, and also gives you a nice tool to pass to your teammates. Baton Pass is the crux of the set. You can use it to get momentum, but also to pass Attack boosts or Substitutes. Finally in the last slot there's either Substitute or Knock Off. Substitute enables you to pass it too, as well as get a sub on switches or status, but Knock Off is more threatening offensively and could help a sweep on your own. If you run Knock Off, you might wanna run a more offensive spread as well. The EV spread is something I thought of to outspeed max Speed Adamant Barbaracle at +0 and not get OHKO'd by any common move Barbaracle runs at +2. Both of these are easily KO'd by Leaf Blade obviously. Careful nature is to boost its mediocre special defense and lets it survive some more hits, including Barbaracle's +2 Ice Beam. Don't make this your main check to Barbaracle though as it's kinda shaky as it'll have a chance to faint after any prior damage. The idea is to force something out and either threaten the switchin or Baton Pass out and give a boost to the receiver. If you run Substitute, it completely stops Poliwrath as it can't break your sub and you can just keep boosting on it, and either KO it or take advantage of the switch out.

Note: Using standard calc sets.
24 Atk Life Orb Leafeon Leaf Blade vs. 4 HP / 0 Def Carracosta: 437-520 (150.6 - 179.3%) -- guaranteed OHKO
+2 252 Atk Life Orb Carracosta Stone Edge vs. 252 HP / 68 Def Leafeon: 282-333 (84.4 - 99.7%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
+2 0- SpA Life Orb Carracosta Ice Beam vs. 252 HP / 124+ SpD Leafeon: 281-333 (84.1 - 99.7%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
24 Atk Life Orb Leafeon Leaf Blade vs. 4 HP / 0 Def Barbaracle: 499-593 (174.4 - 207.3%) -- guaranteed OHKO
+2 252+ Atk Barbaracle Stone Edge vs. 252 HP / 68 Def Leafeon: 232-274 (69.4 - 82%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
252 Atk Life Orb Sheer Force Tauros Rock Climb vs. 252 HP / 68 Def Leafeon: 156-185 (46.7 - 55.3%) -- 17.6% chance to 2HKO after Leftovers recovery
+2 24 Atk Leafeon Leaf Blade vs. 0 HP / 0 Def Tauros: 225-265 (77.3 - 91%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
252 SpA Kadabra Psychic vs. 252 HP / 124+ SpD Leafeon: 153-180 (45.8 - 53.8%) -- 43.4% chance to 2HKO
0 SpA Tangela Hidden Power Ice vs. 252 HP / 124+ SpD Leafeon: 96-114 (28.7 - 34.1%) -- 1.7% chance to 3HKO
0 Atk Poliwrath Circle Throw vs. 252 HP / 68 Def Leafeon: 48-57 (14.3 - 17%) -- possible 6HKO
252+ Atk Golem Rock Blast (3 hits) vs. 252 HP / 68 Def Leafeon: 99-117 (29.6 - 35%) -- approx. 1.9% chance to 3HKO
252 SpA Life Orb Raichu Hidden Power Ice vs. 252 HP / 124+ SpD Leafeon: 146-174 (43.7 - 52%) -- 11.3% chance to 2HKO

So I hope this is decent.
 
Talk about shallow movepools...

SubPass is honestly one of the best things Leafeon can do because it bypasses "counters" such as Tangela, Togetic, and even fast ones like Ninetales and Scyther, but I prefer a more offensive spread to the one listed by Snaquaza; his spread isn't too bad though.

Nevertheless I'm not going to post offensive SubPass because someone else is probably going to do it sooner or later, so here's an idea:

leafeon.gif

Leafeon @ Life Orb
Ability: Chlorophyll
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 Def / 252 Spe
Jolly / Adamant Nature
- Swords Dance
- Sunny Day
- Leaf Blade
- Knock Off

Double dance Leafeon. If midgame breaking is your preference or against slower teams, Leafeon can set up Swords Dance as per normal and smack stuff. However if you're looking for a late-game sweep and there's this annoying little Sneasel or Simipour or Tauros that is looking to halt it, click Sunny Day and clean up the mess, outspeeding and KOing the "faster checks" to Leafeon. Unlike double dance Sawsbuck or sets like SubSalac, Leafeon actually has existent bulk meaning it survives priority like Sneasel's Ice Shard or weaker stuff like Scarf TAURPS allowing you to KO even after Intimidate:
252 Atk Life Orb Sneasel Ice Shard vs. 0 HP / 4 Def Leafeon: 109-133 (40.2 - 49%) -- guaranteed 3HKO

252+ Atk Tauros Double-Edge vs. 0 HP / 4 Def Leafeon: 144-169 (53.1 - 62.3%) -- guaranteed 2HKO

What? Is Leafeon weak without an SD boost?
252 Atk Life Orb Leafeon Leaf Blade vs. 0 HP / 4 Def Eviolite Sneasel: 183-216 (72.9 - 86%) -- guaranteed 2HKO

252 Atk Life Orb Leafeon Leaf Blade vs. 0 HP / 0 Def Tauros: 177-211 (60.8 - 72.5%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Stealth Rock

-1 252 Atk Life Orb Leafeon Leaf Blade vs. 0 HP / 0 Def Tauros: 118-140 (40.5 - 48.1%) -- 61.3% chance to 2HKO after Stealth Rock - TAURPS cannot OHKO while you outspeed and 2HKO with double-edge recoil

252 Atk Life Orb Leafeon Knock Off (97.5 BP) vs. 0 HP / 4 Def Scyther: 147-173 (52.3 - 61.5%) -- guaranteed OHKO after Stealth Rock

252 Atk Life Orb Leafeon Knock Off (97.5 BP) vs. 0 HP / 0 Def Ninetales: 155-183 (54 - 63.7%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Stealth Rock

Some of these night seem kinda weak, but keep in mind two things: a) the calcs are with Jolly, but Adamant is perfectly viable with this set and will actually achieve a lot more KOs such as vs Sneasel after SR, and b) this is late game ffs nobody's telling you to take down a Ninetales from 100% HP.

Good teammates for this are: entry hazards which help a lot as you could see from the calcs, Pokemon to beat Tangela and Togetic because this set doesn't focus on beating its usual counters, just its usual faster checks. You can actually just throw in your standard Leafeon teammates o.o
 
Megazard wanted me to post. :> Something I have been playing around with is SubToxic Leafeon.

leafeon.gif

Leafeon @ Leftovers
Ability: Chlorophyll
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 Def / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Substitute
- Toxic
- Leaf Blade
- Knock Off

The idea behind the set is to bait common switchins to Leafeon, like Togetic, Tangela, and Avalugg, using Toxic on them as they switch in, and then wear them down by spamming Substitute and potentially knocking off some lefties until they're at low health and Leafeon can either pick them off, or they're so weakened they won't be able to take on anything else anymore. It obviously works best with a similar sweeper to take advantage of this. Probably not overall best set, but it's pretty legit and fun to use. :]
 
Are you worried because you let Carracosta or Barbaracle get a Shell Smash and those two are just beating your team? Scarf Leafeon to the rescue!

leafeon.gif

Leafeon @ Choice Scarf
Ability: Chlorophyll
EVs: 252 Atk / 16 Def / 240 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Leaf Blade
- Knock Off
- Double Edge
- X-Scissor / Toxic / Baton Pass

This is basically a last resort against SS Carracosta or Adamant Barbaracle (Jolly Barbaracle can't be outspeed by Leafeon outside of sun), while dealing with some other pokés that expect it to be a kinda supportish poké or just expect it to be setupping with Swords Dance.

252 Atk Leafeon Leaf Blade vs. 4 HP / 0 Def Solid Rock Carracosta: 306-363 (105.5 - 125.1%) -- guaranteed OHKO
252 Atk Leafeon Leaf Blade vs. 4 HP / 0 Def Barbaracle: 468-552 (163.6 - 193%) -- guaranteed OHKO

Leafeon can also handle (Catching them in the switch in) some usually quick threats like:

Tauros:
252 Atk Leafeon Leaf Blade vs. 0 HP / 0 Def Tauros: 136-162 (46.7 - 55.6%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Stealth Rock

Eviolite Sneasel:
252 Atk Leafeon Leaf Blade vs. 0 HP / 4 Def Eviolite Sneasel: 141-166 (56.1 - 66.1%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Stealth Rock

Serperior:
252 Atk Leafeon X-Scissor vs. 252 HP / 0 Def Serperior: 162-192 (45.7 - 54.2%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Stealth Rock

Ninetales:
252 Atk Leafeon Double-Edge vs. 4 HP / 0 Def Ninetales: 147-174 (51 - 60.4%) -- guaranteed 2HKO

Kadabra:
252 Atk Leafeon Leaf Blade vs. 4 HP / 0 Def Kadabra: 322-379 (145 - 170.7%) -- guaranteed OHKO

Purugly:
252 Atk Leafeon Leaf Blade vs. 4 HP / 0 Def Purugly: 189-223 (66.5 - 78.5%) -- guaranteed 2HKO

Chatot:
252 Atk Leafeon Leaf Blade vs. 0 HP / 4 Def Chatot: 121-143 (41.2 - 48.8%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Stealth Rock
252 Atk Leafeon Knock Off (97.5 BP) vs. 0 HP / 4 Def Chatot: 175-206 (59.7 - 70.3%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
252 Atk Leafeon Double-Edge vs. 0 HP / 4 Def Chatot: 216-255 (73.7 - 87%) -- 87.5% chance to OHKO after Stealth Rock

Raichu:
252 Atk Leafeon Leaf Blade vs. 0 HP / 0 Def Raichu: 211-250 (80.8 - 95.7%) -- 56.3% chance to OHKO after Stealth Rock

Rapidash:
252 Atk Leafeon Double-Edge vs. 4 HP / 0 Def Rapidash: 156-184 (57.3 - 67.6%) -- guaranteed 2HKO

Scarf Rotom Fridge:
252 Atk Leafeon Leaf Blade vs. 0 HP / 0 Def Rotom-F: 124-147 (51.4 - 60.9%) -- guaranteed 2HKO


Watching at this, we can conclude that Leaf Blade isn't that bad of a STAB in PU and can deal with some faster threats without problems... and Double Edge should be enough against any Fire and Flying type trying to switch in Leaf Blade... Knock Off just for quick Utility on eliminating some annoying items (and dealing cool damage to Haunter, Missy, Gourgeist and Metang) and X-Scissor just for Serperior, but if you like you can just change it for Toxic for quick status or Baton Pass for "Dry Passing" and trying to get momentum if you expect your opponent to switch.

What do you think guys?

Cya!
 
Last edited:
Rennyjesus said:
Are you worried because you let Carracosta or Barbaracle get a Shell Smash and those two are just beating your team? Scarf Leafeon to the rescue!

leafeon.gif

Leafeon @ Choice Scarf
Ability: Chlorophyll
EVs: 252 Atk / 16 Def / 240 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Leaf Blade
- Knock Off
- Double Edge
- X-Scissor / Toxic

This is basically a last resort against SS Carracosta or Adamant Barbaracle (Jolly Barbaracle can't be outspeed by Leafeon outside of sun), while dealing with some other pokés that expect it to be a kinda supportish poké or just expect it to be setupping with Swords Dance.

252 Atk Leafeon Leaf Blade vs. 4 HP / 0 Def Solid Rock Carracosta: 306-363 (105.5 - 125.1%) -- guaranteed OHKO
252 Atk Leafeon Leaf Blade vs. 4 HP / 0 Def Barbaracle: 468-552 (163.6 - 193%) -- guaranteed OHKO

Leafeon can also handle (Catching them in the switch in) some usually quick threats like:

Tauros:
252 Atk Leafeon Leaf Blade vs. 0 HP / 0 Def Tauros: 136-162 (46.7 - 55.6%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Stealth Rock

Eviolite Sneasel:
252 Atk Leafeon Leaf Blade vs. 0 HP / 4 Def Eviolite Sneasel: 141-166 (56.1 - 66.1%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Stealth Rock

Serperior:
252 Atk Leafeon X-Scissor vs. 252 HP / 0 Def Serperior: 162-192 (45.7 - 54.2%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Stealth Rock

Ninetales:
252 Atk Leafeon Double-Edge vs. 4 HP / 0 Def Ninetales: 147-174 (51 - 60.4%) -- guaranteed 2HKO

Kadabra:
252 Atk Leafeon Leaf Blade vs. 4 HP / 0 Def Kadabra: 322-379 (145 - 170.7%) -- guaranteed OHKO

Purugly:
252 Atk Leafeon Leaf Blade vs. 4 HP / 0 Def Purugly: 189-223 (66.5 - 78.5%) -- guaranteed 2HKO

Chatot:
252 Atk Leafeon Leaf Blade vs. 0 HP / 4 Def Chatot: 121-143 (41.2 - 48.8%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Stealth Rock
252 Atk Leafeon Knock Off (97.5 BP) vs. 0 HP / 4 Def Chatot: 175-206 (59.7 - 70.3%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
252 Atk Leafeon Double-Edge vs. 0 HP / 4 Def Chatot: 216-255 (73.7 - 87%) -- 87.5% chance to OHKO after Stealth Rock

Raichu:
252 Atk Leafeon Leaf Blade vs. 0 HP / 0 Def Raichu: 211-250 (80.8 - 95.7%) -- 56.3% chance to OHKO after Stealth Rock

Rapidash:
252 Atk Leafeon Double-Edge vs. 4 HP / 0 Def Rapidash: 156-184 (57.3 - 67.6%) -- guaranteed 2HKO

Scarf Rotom Fridge:
252 Atk Leafeon Leaf Blade vs. 0 HP / 0 Def Rotom-F: 124-147 (51.4 - 60.9%) -- guaranteed 2HKO


Watching at this, we can conclude that Leaf Blade isn't that bad of a STAB in PU and can deal with some faster threats without problems... and Double Edge should be enough against any Fire and Flying type trying to switch in Leaf Blade... Knock Off just for quick Utility on eliminating some annoying items (and dealing cool damage to Haunter, Missy, Gourgeist and Metang) and X-Scissor just for Serperior, but if you like you can just change it for Toxic for quick status...

What do you think guys?

Cya!
Click to expand...

Ive used this quite a lot and was originally going to post this there. One thing that definitely should be added is baton pass, it allows Leafeon to get momentum on a predicted switch (there are a lot that wall it, avalugg for example), or just to get out of an unfavourable match up. Also, about your calcs, most of those pokemon are not switching into leafeon, its main job is revenge killing, it shouldnt try and handle those pokes 1 on 1.
 
Anty said:
Ive used this quite a lot and was originally going to post this there. One thing that definitely should be added is baton pass, it allows Leafeon to get momentum on a predicted switch (there are a lot that wall it, avalugg for example), or just to get out of an unfavourable match up. Also, about your calcs, most of those pokemon are not switching into leafeon, its main job is revenge killing, it shouldnt try and handle those pokes 1 on 1.
Click to expand...

Added Baton Pass... But about revenge killing, it is pretty obvious that Revenge Killing is just going to be its main niche but... if you have a poké that can't beat Leafeon, you will maybe try to switch to one of those quick sweepers to just beat it cuz isn't supposed to be quick enough to handle them... and that's when those calcs become important because none of those offensive pokés can safely switch in onto Leafeon cuz all of them will be 2HKOed easily...
 
Grimoire God because subtoxic is good in a metagame where really only Lickilicky carries status healing moves.
 
479-frost.png lol idek wat you're doing

Rotom-Frost @ Expert Belt
Ability: Levitate
EVs: 252 SpA / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
- Volt Switch
- Thunderbolt
- Blizzard
- Will-o-wisp/HP ice/Snatch

There are two types of next best thing sets: Those which you've used and know to be usable, and those that you thought of for a post. I've been using expert Rotom-F quite successfully, as life orb cannot bluff a scarf set. It's quite easy to go for blizzards, watch them go into poliwrath, and click thunderbolt. While I normally use HP ice, snatch is a secondary gimmick I thought of just now specifically for the next best thing, as a scarftom locked into blizzard is easy smash fodder for any of the tier's smashers, as well as normally allowing sneasel, regice, aurorus, ninetales, simipour, clefairy, carbink, and dusclops a chance to set up. Should probably be disregarded, but throwing it on for extra style points :^)
 
Status
Not open for further replies.
Back
Top