1. Welcome to Smogon! Check out the Smogon Starters Hangout for everything you need to know about starting out in the community. Don't forget to introduce yourself in the Introduction and Hangout Thread, too!
  2. Welcome to Smogon Forums! Please take a minute to read the rules.

Gen 5 The RU Viability Ranking Thread

Discussion in 'Ruins of Alph' started by Molk, Oct 5, 2012.

  1. atomicllamas

    atomicllamas on good days I am charming as fuck
    is a Forum Moderatoris a Tiering Contributoris a Contributor to Smogon
    Moderator

    Joined:
    Apr 16, 2013
    Messages:
    1,974
    I'm on my phone, so sorry if this sucks, but I was the person who originally pushed for crawdaunt to be high C, and it's flaws are just as notible as they were before. Mainly it is too slow even after a boost and it has the defenses of a wet paper towel. Don't get me wrong it is a cool mon, I've tried band daunt with tailwind support and it wrecks souls, but it requires a lot of support, as it can't switch into anything really. The meta hasn't changed at all since it was dropped to high C, so this comes back to SilentVerse's point about people rank inflating mons they have used. Crawdaunt should stay high C, not because it is a bad mon, but because it requires a lot of support, or a very favorable team match up to function at all.

    Edit: anyone else think high A is too generous for Smeargle? The meta game is so prepared for sleep inducers, and in spite having access to literally every move, it only has like 2 usable sets, with very similar counters. Low/Mid A may be a better choice for how it functions in the current meta.
    Last edited: Oct 5, 2013
    Nozzle likes this.
  2. Magnegun

    Magnegun

    Joined:
    Dec 16, 2012
    Messages:
    30
    I agree with Cinccino for Top B. While Cinccino is by no means a potent death sweeper, an excellent 115 speed and respectable 95 attack along with a 125 powered STAB Basically leave Cinccino as a very effective clean up mon. Once all it's resists are gone, this thing hits fairly hard, being able to potentially OHKO defensive slowking after rocks and always KO after 3 layers of spikes (With no rocks.) Cinccino is not without problems, it tends to get screwed over by moderately fast scarfed mons and steel types, but being able to OHKO top tier threats like Moltres, Kabutops and sceptile and obligatory neutral coverage with normal stab leave me to think Cinccino is perfectly where it is, perhaps even Low A but i'm not fussed.
  3. Molk

    Molk Crustle knocked off the opposing Rhydon's Assault Vest!
    is a Tutoris a member of the Site Staffis an official Team Rateris a Smogon Social Media Contributoris a Smogon IRC AOPis a Super Moderatoris a Community Contributoris a Tiering Contributoris a Contributor to Smogon
    RU Co-Leader

    Joined:
    Jul 27, 2011
    Messages:
    4,018
    I'm not going to make any updates at the moment because there hasn't been that much discussion on the proposed Pokemon, but i'm actually here to make a proposal myself about a Pokemon that i think should be on the list (low on the list of course, but it still deserves a spot imo). This pokemon is Shedinja. (don't laugh :x)

    Shedinja has been shunned by most competitive battlers for quite a while despite its great number of immunities because of its vulnerability to passive damage, especially entry hazards, which actually OHKO it upon switch in, but after playing around with a Shedinja team i was lent by another player, i found that while it definitely needed quite a bit of support to function (this team had natu to keep hazards away which actually worked the majority of the time), it was quite an invaluable team member provided with this support. When hazards can be kept off the field, Shedinja's immunities make it quite the annoying Pokemon to deal with. Its immune to both U-turn and Volt Switch, allowing it to stop Pokemon trying to use these moves cold with a bit of prediction (especially choiced ones!) to avoid random hidden powers and other coverage moves then use a dry baton pass to grab momentum for its own team while the opponent is most likely forced out. It can check several big threats such as Durant, Escavalier, Medicham, Shell Smash Omastar and many more too thanks to its immunities to all but a few coverage moves they could possibly use (Rock Slide Durant mainly)! Escavalier has pursuit to hit Shedinja in theory, but it can't Pursuit Sheddy as it comes in because of Pursuit mechanics, dry baton passing lets it get away from Escavalier safely if Pursuit is used, if Escav is locked into any other move it can just go ahead and burn it. Shedinja just doesn't set there after walling something either, it has a decent base 90 Attack to work with along with a decently powered STAB move and priority in Shadow Sneak, Will-O-Wisp to inflict burn and slowly wear down bulkier Pokemon, and a slow Baton Pass to help you gain the switch advantage. Of course, as mentioned before to be able to do this at all Shedinja needs quite a bit of support: ways to get rid of hazards such as Kabutops and Natu are pretty much required (although spinning isn't too hard compared to other tiers), and Pokemon that can reliably take on the Pokemon that can hit Shedinja super effectively need to be covered. Provide that though, and Shedinja can be quite the cool win condition and pivot, and deserves a spot in somewhere around High D rank imo, but no higher.
    Last edited: Oct 8, 2013
    ScraftyIsTheBest and Hollywood like this.
  4. Hollywood

    Hollywood le toucan has arrived
    is a Tutoris a member of the Site Staffis a Battle Server Administratoris a Super Moderatoris a Community Contributoris a Smogon IRC SOPis a Tiering Contributoris a Contributor Alumnusis a Smogon Media Contributor Alumnus
    Other Metas Leader

    Joined:
    Jun 18, 2012
    Messages:
    4,288
    Posting real quick to support Shedinja for D-rank. It's obviously pretty support reliant as well as a bit prediction reliant (though the better you know the metagame, the easier it is to use Shedinja for sure), but with some pretty big support from teammates, it can be really useful for an offensive team. With its slow Baton Pass, Shedinja can come in against something that can't touch it, force it out very easily, and pivot into something to check whatever comes in to beat it. This also allows for passive damage against Shedinja's checks, which helps to eliminate them later on in the match. The coolest part of a team with Shedinja though is the good Pokemon that you get to use alongside it. Moltres and Scyther are both really great Pokemon that both really hate Stealth Rock, but with so many preventative measures for Stealth Rock, it usually won't be up on your side to begin with. Shedinja is honestly more of a support Pokemon than anything else; using an offensive SD set is a really bad idea because of how easy it is to force out, but using it for the momentum it creates can be really valuable. Definitely not a top-tier Pokemon by any means, but certainly worthy of D-rank.
  5. atomicllamas

    atomicllamas on good days I am charming as fuck
    is a Forum Moderatoris a Tiering Contributoris a Contributor to Smogon
    Moderator

    Joined:
    Apr 16, 2013
    Messages:
    1,974
    I'm gonna throw my hat in the ring to support Shedinja for high D (<-- wtf kind of saying is that). It is actually super annoying with a slow baton pass meaning if you support it correctly, it will gain you a shit ton of momentum, while having support moves like will-o-wisp, or decent attacking options like STAB shadow sneak (watch out for dragon oO. Also it is super annoying when the opposing shedinja dodges 1/1 will-o-wisp and 4/5 stone edges, smh.
  6. electricwolf

    electricwolf

    Joined:
    May 19, 2013
    Messages:
    12
    I'm not a veteran but I've been playing quite a few RU matches over the last few days, and here are my (likely incorrect) opinions.

    I've never been up against a Moltres that made me re-evaluate my team. It might have great stats but that SR weakness is pretty crippling. If I don't completely fudge my predictions then I've usually got SR up in the first few turns which is 50% off it's health. If Druddigon is in on good health then I can usually Dragon Tail it out so that it'll die when it next switches in and if one of my mons is in bad health then I just let it die and bring in something that can usually OHKO Moltres.
    I have time and time again found in matches that my Magmortar set forces very easily predicted switches, such as people expecting a tbolt, switching to Quagsire and getting HP Grass'd.
    Whether or not it's how my team is built, I would not swap Magmortar for Moltres.

    4 attacks E-belt Eelektross is incredibly versatile, especially if you go mixed. I've seen plenty of people switch in Steelix after an Eel Superpower only to get a Flamethrower OHKO. At times I wish it had more bulk or speed but it does a great job, with amazing coverage and I've never really needed to change it for anything else. In an average match it gets between one and two kills because most people do not expect it to have 4 coverage moves. Quite a few people have lost Durants to the fact that they forget that Eel has flamethrower.

    Aerodactyl is great for the fast Taunt, Stealth Rock and because people usually predict it to have Edge/Quake. Having a predictable set is actually great because you can really surprise people when you don't have the standard set.
  7. EonX

    EonX Rise Above
    is a Tutoris a member of the Site Staffis a Smogon Social Media Contributoris a Forum Moderatoris a Community Contributoris a Tiering Contributoris a Contributor to Smogonis a Smogon Media Contributor
    Moderator

    Joined:
    May 27, 2011
    Messages:
    1,901
    Shedinja: I'd go for High D on this thing. My thoughts have p. much been covered already, but it is a neat niche Pokemon. Certainly not amazing or a top tier Pokemon, but it can work for you if you give it the support it needs (which is a lot, but eh, that's why it should only be D rank, right?)
  8. Omfuga

    Omfuga

    Joined:
    Mar 17, 2012
    Messages:
    248
    Basically agreeing with what Molk said. Shedinja has a total of 12 immunities (including an immunity to volt-turn) and is left untouched by almost half the tier! I gave him the team he was referring to, and with natu and spinning support shedinja almost always gets a chance to shine. Natu works really well with volt-turn (which the team has), shedinja supports the volt-turn with baton pass, and overall a lot of pokemon that can stop the momentum are left helpless at getting their own momentum by being walled by shedinja attempting to use u-turn or volt switch. Shedinja can also use protect to utilize scouting for random moves, etc. If you choose not to use baton pass, you can use swords dance and sweep some teams with a surprisingly decent 90 base attack stat. All in all, shedinja is really good at walling a lot of stuff, but needs a shitton of support to work and still has quite a few weaknesses (dark, ghost, fire, flying, rock)
    TRC likes this.
  9. SomeDrunkRockLee

    SomeDrunkRockLee

    Joined:
    Sep 8, 2012
    Messages:
    182
    One pokemon which isn't ranked at all and I feel should be is Zwelious; while somewhat outclassed by Drudiggon, who carries all important priority, better bulk, and lacks misses from hustle, Zwelious boosts the strongest outrage in the game (actually, I'm not sure this is still true with Kyurem-B running around, but still, it's more powerful than Rayquaza), powerful enough to get KOs that Druddigon, specifically banded variants, would otherwise struggle with. Additionally, Zwelious has the lovely advantage of being able to be used beside Druddigon; after luring in and heavily damaging physical walls, Druddigon can sweep much more effectively. Zwelious is a particularly good partner for Druddigon on Drag/Drag/Mag style teams, where he can power though opposition and open up a chance for Druddigon to shine.

    So, what tier should Zwelious be? My first inclination would be mid C rank; Zwelious has several "notable niches" in the RU metagame, possessing his unbelievably strong outrage and working as an efficient psuedo-supporter who aids Druddigon. Zwelious can facilitate the tanking of one of the most powerful and dangerous threats in RU, which is amazing in its own right.

    However, Zwelious is not without flaws; he possesses far less bulk than Druddigon, forcing him to only weaken a few threats before he falls to faster, powerful attacks. He also doesn't appreciate the extra weaknesses, allowing Pokemon like Gallade and Durant to force him out and use him as set up fodder. Lastly, Zwelious struggles from the slight chance that, due to hustle, his attacks can miss.

    While somewhat outclassed by Druddigon, I believe Zwelious has a definite niche in the RU tier.
  10. atomicllamas

    atomicllamas on good days I am charming as fuck
    is a Forum Moderatoris a Tiering Contributoris a Contributor to Smogon
    Moderator

    Joined:
    Apr 16, 2013
    Messages:
    1,974
    Umm Zweilous is already mid C...
    Laurel and Celever like this.
  11. Celever

    Celever

    Joined:
    Sep 25, 2012
    Messages:
    2,870
    Here is my problem with Shedinja, and it's something you've been saying all along: Shedinja requires a hell of a lot of support and he can do well. So can Farfetch'd. I've been playing with Farfetch'd in NU recently and you can get a sweep going letting Ninjask set up a bunch of speed boosts and a few Swords Dances. That's one pokemon support, Shedinja requires a rapid spinner, some resists for the various types it is weak to etc. etc. and a whole team must be built around it. Yes, the same can be said for Riolu, but Riolu actually has a fantastic niche in RU. Unless you wanted to because, "lol it's shedinja", why would you consider using Shedinja? The only thing I can think of is stalling the other team to death with a hell of a lot of resistances thanks to wonder guard, but Shedinja has terrible defensive typing anyway and most Pokemon in RU run coverage moves that beat it, for example the Fighting-Type Pokemon such as Hitmonlee use Stone Edge or Rock Slide, some Grass Types such as Lilligant or Sceptile run Hidden Power Rock. Flying-Type Pokemon are also quite common in RU and there is Absol who uses Pursuit all the time, and he is incredibly good and common. The sad thing is that teams could run a Fighting, Grass-with-HP-Rock, Flying-Type AND Absol-or-Spiritomb to some fair success depending on the last couple of Pokemon you choose. My point is that to use Shedinja you have to want to use Shedinja, you need a hell of a lot of team support which could be said about anything AND the types Shedinja is weak to are really common in RU. Leave Shedinja unranked.
    Silvershadow234 likes this.
  12. Lasagne

    Lasagne me!me!me!me!me!me!me!me!me!me!me!
    is a Pre-Contributor

    Joined:
    Apr 15, 2013
    Messages:
    2,545
    apart from that team that popped up recently for shedinja, nothing has changed about it. It is still a terrible Pokemon and I don't know why people are suddenly bandwagonning for it to be moved up. Yes, it stops voltturn. Whoopee. Yes, its immune to a bunch of types. That's the whole POINT of shedinja. It requires an insane amount of support, to the point where a whole team had to be made around it for it to be even remotely viable. there were three ways to stop hazards being set up. If that's not too much support then I don't know what is. Shedinja is still terrible, and simply shouldn't be used unless you're a cheater like molk. Stay in e rank you useless bug
    Celever and Nozzle like this.
  13. SomeDrunkRockLee

    SomeDrunkRockLee

    Joined:
    Sep 8, 2012
    Messages:
    182
    Oh really? I must of must have missed it while scanning over it... I used ctrl-F too and didn't find it lol...

    Maybe because I was spelling it wrong D:
  14. Worldtour

    Worldtour aka Swamp-Rocket
    is a Site Staff Alumnusis a Forum Moderator Alumnusis a Contributor Alumnus

    Joined:
    Aug 2, 2010
    Messages:
    1,484
    i agree with Celever. The thing about Shedinja is that 90% of the time I see one, I am not kidding when I say every member helps it in some way, even if its subliminally. I mean, when you are required to use a Natu to make it work, you've gone too far at that point. With support anything can work, and Shedinja is truly a gimmick at best an the amount of support it needs makes it only work on a team 100% focus around it and only it. Almost every single common threat beats it easy as well - other than Uxie all of the S-Rankers and almost all the A Rankers, have ways to easily dispatch of Shedinja. Keep it in E, its not worth it.
    Last edited: Oct 10, 2013
    Celever likes this.
  15. Omfuga

    Omfuga

    Joined:
    Mar 17, 2012
    Messages:
    248

    The second you compared it to farfetch'd your argument was completely moot. Farfetch'd is a horrible pokemon regardless of what kind of support you bring to the table. Even so, no matter what support you gave it it would be a worse generic flying-normal type than every other one in the tier anyway. Also, the reason people want shedinja to be a D+ in the first place is that it needs so much support. Shedinja also has a niche that literally no other pokemon in the whole game-- not just the RU tier-- can fulfill. If shedinja didn't need to worry about spikes or stealth rock obviously it would be much higher such as a B or an A, but the whole reason they're attempting to make it a D+ is due to the fact that its massive necessary support is a hindrance.
    TRC likes this.
  16. Celever

    Celever

    Joined:
    Sep 25, 2012
    Messages:
    2,870
    I will go through your 2 points sepeately.

    "Farfetch'd sux".

    I know that Farfetch'd is a terrible Pokemon, however it can still work with a hell of a lot of support. Replace Farfetch'd with Shedinja and you basically have a description of Shedinja. The whole point of the comparison is that Farfetch'd actually needs less support from Shedinja in a way, one-Pokemon support in Ninjask, and it can sweep against the right team match up. Shedinja can't boast this, as it also needs a Rapid Spinner, type resists, lures, rest of the team etc. etc.. Also, "it would be a worse generic flying-normal type than every other one in the tier anyway" is something that I understand, however look at all Bug- and Ghost-Type Pokemon ranked on the tier list:
    The lowest Bug-Type Pokemon is Ninjask, and the lowest Ghost-Type Pokemon is Dusknoir. Both Ninjask and Dusknoir are better than Shedinja; this doesn't mean that Ninjask and Dusknoir are good, it means that Shedinja is worse.

    Ok for your second points I'm not quite sure you know how this system works. We are not ranking every random Pokemon, we're not going to have Ponyta and Happiny in Low D at some point, we are ranking Pokemon that are good, possibly better than just viable. D is for the odd Pokemon that have odd niches, such as Natu or Ditto, Low D is for the Pokemon who generally fail to give the support but the team isn't built around them, the majority of D-Rank Pokemon are support Pokemon. Ninjask, Natu, Audino and Dusknoir for example, these don't have teams built around them, they are part of the support a team uses. In fact, no Pokemon on the rankings has a whole team built around them besides Riolu, who actually has a pretty low-risk high-reward strategy if you can use it correctly. Shedinja can boast none of these things, and thus should not be ranked. Also, saying that without a hazards weakness Shedinja would be A or B rank really shows that you have no idea what's going on...
  17. Wepwn

    Wepwn

    Joined:
    Jul 13, 2013
    Messages:
    375
    So a pokemon with 12 resistances doesn't have a "odd niche"? Shedinja can shut down some of the most dangerous sweepers in this metagame such as Omastar, Durant as most don't run Rock Slide now, SubCM Uxie, Klingklang and this list can go on. Also you mentioned Absol can easily pursuit trap but what if its sash is still intact? Your absol will get straight OHKOd. We all know shedinja isn't a godlike pokemon but when used correctly it will probably be the most one of the most annoying mons you have ever played against. All in all shedinja does have a good niche in this tier, ye it needs some support but i doubt you have played a shedinja team being used correctly. It can come in on choiced locked pokemon and just get a HUGE momentum boost on your side with baton pass. Spinning isn't too hard to do in this tier as Kabutops can beat every ghost 1 on 1 and makes it so easy to get rid of hazards which obviously shedinja appreciates. I say Shedinja for High D because of it's shit ton of immunites, can stop some of the a lot of the deadly sweepers in this metagame and it can get your team a huge momentum boost when needed.
    Last edited: Oct 11, 2013
  18. Celever

    Celever

    Joined:
    Sep 25, 2012
    Messages:
    2,870
    What exactly are the resistances, though?

    Normal, Fighting, Poison, Ground, Bug, Steel, Water, Grass, Electric, Psychic, Ice, Dragon.

    Of those, types with at least 2 notable users of them in RU:

    Normal, Fighting, Ground, Water, Grass, Electric, Psychic (forgive me if I'm being a little harsh here).

    That's 7 immunities in all. Sure, that looks pretty good, but it is weak to:

    Flying, Rock, Ghost, Fire, Dark.

    Of those, types with at least 2 notable users of them in RU:

    Flying, Rock, Ghost, Fire, Dark.

    Plus, it is weak to all residual damage, hazards feature on most teams so that may as well be a type on its own... and so does residual damage like Toxic or Scald. Count both of that and Shedinja essentially has 6 weaknesses, or types it is weak to. You then need a Pokemon to account for all of these. At a glance, that would be a team such as:

    Shedinja, Steelix, Kabutops, Spiritomb, [filler] [filler].

    This covers all of the types decently, as well as a spinner. Now that's all well and good, but then what does Shedinja even do? Terribly weak Shadow Sneaks akin to a 0- Attack Spiritomb? Using it's masterful X-Scissor to dent the Grass-Types who will KO it anyway? Shedinja's only niche is having a bunch of immunities, 7 of which are useful and then having almost as many weaknesses that will certainly KO it with most of those types featuring as coverage option on other Pokemon anyway. By that I mean:

    Fighting, Ground and sometimes Normal and Grass Pokemon use Rock-Type coverage.
    Manectric and Grass Pokemon use Fire-Type coverage.

    This means that, as a whole, Shedinja walls a total of:
    Show Hide
    Accelgor
    Clefable
    Cryogonal
    Electivire
    Ferroseed
    Galvantula
    Klinklang
    Lanturn
    Poliwrath
    Quagsire
    Qwilfish
    Uxie

    13 Pokemon in RU, not even considering residual damage they may set up or inflict. Considering that, 7.

    This is of course common sets.

    Now, there are so many more than 13/7 Pokemon in RU. Some teams won't even feature any of these, particularly as most of them are incredibly uncommon (Quagisre? Poliwrath? Clefable? Klinklang?). There is 1 S-Rank threat in this, Uxie, who is a support Pokemon anyway. From memory, everything is else is B-Rank at best except for Qwilfish, who is another Support Pokemon. So this is this apparently amazing Pokemon, one who can wall 5 obscure (Accelgor, Clefable, Electivire, Galvantula, Klinklang) Pokemon and Uxie all the time, a variety of other Pokemon sometimes and ever more if you get lucky with the sets they are using.

    Shedinja doesn't have a good enough niche to be placed in D-Rank, leave the thing rotting in E.
  19. Wepwn

    Wepwn

    Joined:
    Jul 13, 2013
    Messages:
    375
    I clearly stated Shedinja builds huge momentum for your team when it comes in on a mon it can shut down. No one here has said that shedinja is a powerhouse, people that support shedinja are arguing the fact that it can build huge momentum and it can shut down deadly set up sweepers. Also, why are you listing the mons it walls when its clearly situational. What if lets say Rotom-c (which isnt on the list of what gets walled by Shedinja) is locked into Volt switch. What do you do? You're forced to switch out as the Shedinja simply baton passes out and gets a huge amount of momentum. You're not taking choice items into account which is what Shedinja loves coming into the most.

    I'm sticking with my word and saying Shedinja for High D
  20. Celever

    Celever

    Joined:
    Sep 25, 2012
    Messages:
    2,870
    Well sure, choice items are fine and all but then you realise what choice users use: Aggron uses Head Smash, Rotom-C uses HP Fire. In fact, most choice users have some kind of coverage Shedinja is weak to which, with some good prediction, can leave you one Pokemon down. Plus, you said it yourself, Shedinja is situational. This isn't a set which can be situational, this is a whole slot on your team that only works against certain kinds of certain Pokemon. I get that he can work, but then you have to acknowledge that the rest of the time it doesn't. And by the rest of the time I would give 90% of the time at least.
  21. Turtleye

    Turtleye

    Joined:
    Jun 7, 2013
    Messages:
    365
    Don't forget Uxie and Qwilfish run Toxic sometimes.
    Celever likes this.
  22. atomicllamas

    atomicllamas on good days I am charming as fuck
    is a Forum Moderatoris a Tiering Contributoris a Contributor to Smogon
    Moderator

    Joined:
    Apr 16, 2013
    Messages:
    1,974
    K in all honesty though, this makes shedinja viable, lets say the opponent has ultimate glue mon Emboar, the only move it can use is Flare Blitz as it risks being walled if it uses anything else, making Druddigon or Slowking even better switch ins than usual as emboar won't want to risk using a move that is completely walled. Also lets not pretend rotom-c always runs HP Fire, I rarely use it, I would be much more worried about a defensive rotom-c with will-o-wisp tbh. Plus the fact that Shedinja is immune to Volt Switch (and U-turn!) means that it will be a annoyance even to choiced mons that do have coverage. Shedinja if supported properly and played correctly generates more momentum than any other pokemon, and while it requires a shit ton of support it isn't that big of a deal given that Kabutops is a great spinner and the extra support you put into keeping hazards of the field allow you to abuse other shit like Moltres or Scyther with no excess support. Shedinja deserves to be High D, no one is saying it is amazing, but it has a definite niche, and it shouldn't be written off because it requires a lot of support. Comparing Shedinja to Farfetch'd is ridiculous when Shedinja actually generates momentum, completely walls at least 20% of the meta game, and has sweet support moves like will-o-wisp to annoy mons that can't do shit to it (outrage locked Druddigon comes to mind).
    Soulgazer likes this.
  23. Soulgazer

    Soulgazer ᕦ(ò_óˇ)ᕤ
    is a Tutoris an official Team Rateris a Community Contributoris a Tiering Contributoris a Contributor to Smogonis a Forum Moderator Alumnus

    Joined:
    May 6, 2013
    Messages:
    1,794
    As someone who used the Shedinja team everyone talks about to smash Molk and ladder, I want to support Shedinja for Top-D. This little bug generates a ton of momentum on your side and can easily let you have the control on your opponents with big range of immunities. Of course Shedinja needs quite a lot of support to work perfectly, but it will work extremely well when you give it the support it needs.
  24. Punchshroom

    Punchshroom para is worse than sleep
    is a Community Contributor

    Joined:
    Dec 5, 2012
    Messages:
    2,711
    I wonder why Sheddy isn't ranked at all in NU, but actually considered for a rank in RU? Is it because RU has better spinners? I dunno about you but Sheddy kinda fears for its life wherever it turns: that Durant may or may not have Rock Slide, that Slowking may or may not have Fire Blast, you can't stop Grass-types without fearing Leech Seed or some sort of Hidden Power....and it just so happens that some Pokemon you do wall can set up hazards in your face: Druddigon, Qwiflish, Accelgor, Roselia are such examples. I get that the ton of immunities + slow Baton Pass can generate momentum, but why rank it here just for that instead of other tiers (like NU)?
  25. atomicllamas

    atomicllamas on good days I am charming as fuck
    is a Forum Moderatoris a Tiering Contributoris a Contributor to Smogon
    Moderator

    Joined:
    Apr 16, 2013
    Messages:
    1,974
    Well one, Shedinja is probably more viable in RU than it is in NU due to the fact that Kabutops can actually spin, and two I don't see why the hell we care about Shedinja's rank in the NU viability rank in this thread. Maybe it is underrated in NU, or maybe it is the fact that it is often used by shit players as a gimmick (seriously seen one without a spinner, lol) that make people instantly dismiss the bug. However, the fact that good RU players like Molk, Wepwnemon, and Omfuga are trying to push for a certain rank should give you a hint that it actually is good and not just a gimmick used by shit tier players (I have seen it in action). Molk went like 35-1 with Shedinja, and I think it is funny when people who hardly play RU, and definitely have never played with or against (a good player using) Shedinja come into an RU thread and argue about it's placement.

Users Viewing Thread (Users: 0, Guests: 0)