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Ubers CCAT 2: Runway is Clear, You are Free to Land [Step 4 - Playtesting]

Discussion in 'BW Ubers' started by bojangles, Feb 10, 2012.

?

What's the next teammate?

Poll closed May 16, 2012.
  1. Jirachi

    12.5%
  2. Cobalion

    0 vote(s)
    0.0%
  3. Darkrai

    12.5%
  4. Blaziken

    50.0%
  5. Deoxys-A

    12.5%
  6. Choice Scarf Heatran

    12.5%
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  1. bojangles

    bojangles IF YOU TRULY BELIEVE,
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    [​IMG]
    [​IMG]Ubers Community Create a Team 2: THE REUBERING[​IMG]

    The point of CCAT is to create a team that is both competitive and innovative, bringing something rather fresh into the metagame that is not used much.

    That's exactly what we're going to do.

    Yesterday I posted a thread about Ubers SpikeStacking, which is definitely the most dominant strategy right now. Almost every team will consider packing Ferrothorn, Forretress, or Tentacruel to play hazards. The most popular set for Dialga now is not BU or Scarf but Support. And even if you're not running your own Spikes, you'll probably consider having a Rapid Spinner so you don't fold to your opponent's hazards.

    Even outside of stall or bulky offense teams, entry hazards can perform an important role in guaranteeing various OHKOs or 2HKOs for your sweepers.

    The question I want to ask with this CCAT is: is it possible for a team to do well without entry hazards acting as a guarantor for some damage? Therefore, for this CCAT, Stealth Rock, Spikes, and Toxic Spikes are all banned.

    Will we choose to go with offense, relying on the brute force of our Pokemon to blow past the competition even without some softening? Will we go with a bulkier team and hope that our weaker Pokemon can weather the storm of our opponent's entry hazards while getting in for a bit of damage? Will we go batshit insane and try to stall without entry hazards? Will Ghosts be as important for our team? Will we see a rise in Xatu? Only time will tell!

    Process:

    Please stay related to the topic.

    With that said, we can get going! Start submitting your suggestions, remember that they should function well in the current metagame.

    Step 1: We are using Flame Charge Reshiram
    [​IMG]
    Reshiram @ Life Orb
    Mild | 4 Atk / 252 SpA / 252 Spe
    ~ Flame Charge
    ~ Outrage
    ~ Blue Flare
    ~ Draco Meteor

    Step 2: We are building a Sun Offense team.

    The Team So Far



    Reshiram

    [​IMG]

    Groudon

    [​IMG]

    Water Arceus

    [​IMG]

    Xatu

    [​IMG]

    Blaziken

    [​IMG]

    Terrakion

    [​IMG]


    Importable (open)
    Reshiram @ Life Orb
    Trait: Turboblaze
    EVs: 4 Atk / 252 SAtk / 252 Spd
    Mild Nature (+SAtk, -Def)
    - Flame Charge
    - Outrage
    - Blue Flare
    - Draco Meteor

    Groudon @ Leftovers
    Trait: Drought
    EVs: 200 HP / 200 Atk / 108 Def
    Adamant Nature (+Atk, -SAtk)
    - Swords Dance
    - Thunder Wave
    - Earthquake
    - Stone Edge

    Arceus-Water @ Splash Plate
    Trait: Multitype
    EVs: 252 HP / 240 SDef / 16 Spd
    Calm Nature (+SDef, -Atk)
    - Recover
    - Grass Knot
    - Thunder Wave
    - Roar

    Xatu (M) @ Light Clay
    Trait: Magic Bounce
    EVs: 252 HP / 252 Def / 4 Spd
    Bold Nature (+Def, -Atk)
    - Light Screen
    - Reflect
    - Roost
    - U-turn

    Blaziken (M) @ Life Orb
    Trait: Speed Boost
    EVs: 4 HP / 252 Atk / 252 Spd
    Jolly Nature (+Spd, -SAtk)
    - Swords Dance
    - Hi Jump Kick
    - Flare Blitz
    - Protect

    Terrakion @ Life Orb
    Trait: Justified
    EVs: 252 Atk / 4 Def / 252 Spd
    Jolly Nature (+Spd, -SAtk)
    - Substitute
    - Swords Dance
    - Stone Edge
    - Close Combat



    LET'S GO BOYS

    Thanks to Crux/Furai for the OP
  2. TrollFreak

    TrollFreak (╮°-°)╮┳━┳ (╯°□°)╯ ┻━┻
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    1st Post ^__^

    [​IMG] @ [​IMG]
    Trait: Multitype
    EVs: 4 Def / 252 SAtk / 252 Spd
    Timid Nature (+Spd, -Atk)
    - Calm Mind
    - Judgment
    - Recover
    - Refresh

    Arceus-Flying is a rarely used Pokemon, but it is very good at what it does. With it's Flying-type STAB only resisted by Zekrom, Heatran and Jirachi, Arceus-Flying can tear teams apart. However, instead if using a coverage move to hit named Pokemon, Refresh imo is better, as it allows Arceus to set up on Blissey and Chansey, both Pokemon who are very common in the metagame. Also, thanks to it's typing, it's immune to both Spikes and Toxic Spikes, and it can Recover the damage taken from Stealth Rock.

    tl;dr, Arceus-Flying is a great Pokemon, as well as a great Pokemon to build a team around
  3. pi face

    pi face a
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    Not even stealth rock? Really?
  4. Furai

    Furai wellfare
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    When it comes to no Entry Hazards, I think we need to hit hard, and hit fast.
    For this I got two suggestions;

    [​IMG][​IMG][​IMG]
    Palkia @ Choice Specs
    Trait: Pressure
    EVs: 252 SAtk / 4 SDef / 252 Spd
    Timid Nature (+Spd, -Atk)
    - Hydro Pump
    - Spacial Rend
    - Fire Blast
    - Thunder

    Boy, I remember how excited everyone where when Platinum gave Palkia Hydro Pump. In fact, it was shockingly powerful; it 2HKOs Blissey in rain, which is something huge for a special attack to do. Not only that, as Palkia's Speed is rather high, peaking at 328 Speed, outspacing a lot of threats such as Rayquaza, Dialga, and Kyogre. It also is one of the best switch-ins into Kyogre, as Palkia 4x resists the fearsome Water Spout. Palkia also has incredibly amazing STAB and coverage. Hydro Pump it's like a truck with rain support, and in conjuction with Spacial Rend they have pretty wide coverage, which is only resisted by Ferrothorn and the rare Empoleon or Shedinja. However, all of those are covered by either Fire Blast or Thunder, respectively.

    [​IMG][​IMG][​IMG]
    Lucario (M) @ Life Orb
    Trait: Justified
    EVs: 252 Atk / 4 Def / 252 Spd
    Adamant Nature (+Atk, -SAtk)
    - Swords Dance
    - Close Combat
    - ExtremeSpeed
    - Shadow Claw

    Luuuuuuuke. This is often shadowlooked by Groudon or Arceus, but hey, neither has a 120 STAB move and priority! (Return on ExtremeKiller is dumb get out) This definetly is a forgotten wonder, and it's fun to with, as it requires more prediction than Arceus while still has tons of power. Swords Dance skyrockets Lucario's Attack to 700 which is outstanding. Justified also makes it a great switch-in to Darkrai and Dark Arceus, as the former takes 64.41% - 76.16% from a +1 ExtremeSpeed, so with some prior damage which is likely to happen, Darkrai is dead. Close Combat is an amazing STAB move, even 252/252+ Groudon takes 69.80% - 82.43% from it after a Swords Dance boost! Shadow Claw rounds up the set with amazing coverage, hitting Ghost- and Psychic-types such as Lugia and Giratina-o for super effective damage.
  5. locoghoul

    locoghoul Banned deucer.

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    With no hazards I could suggest something like a Prankster poke (priority taunt) or a Magic Bounce poke (kinda obvious). Not saying that these are my suggested CCAT pokes, just suggesting some good partners for the team
  6. polop

    polop
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    Xatu can prevent hazards from being set-up and pretty much is a much more massive troll then the likes of other stuff. It's pretty much necessary seeing as that the team will lack hazards. Are we allowed to use Rapid Spin though? If so I see Excadril also being a very useful player... (THIS IS WAY TOO FAMILIAR TOO NO HAZARDS CHALLENGE ASDF).

    [​IMG]

    Xatu (M) @ Light Clay
    Trait: Magic Bounce
    EVs: 252 Atk / 252 Def / 4 Spe
    Bold Nature (+Def, -Atk)
    - Light Screen
    - Reflect
    - Roost
    - U-turn / Toxic / Hidden Power Fire / Night Shade

    Prevents hazards from being set up from Ferrothorn and Forretress, it can also prevent set up from stuff like Dialga and Groudon if we can predict well enough. Also provides Dual Screens so that we can have our sweepers easily set up, and plow through stall teams once they ruin themselves with Hazards.

    [​IMG]

    Excadrill @ Life Orb
    Trait: Sand Rush
    EVs: 4 HP / 252 Atk / 252 Spe
    Adamant Nature (+Atk, -SAtk)
    - Swords Dance
    - Earthquake
    - Shadow Claw / Rock Slide
    - Rapid Spin

    The ONLY spinner capable of plowing through Ghost Arcues, who will be problematic seeing as stall teams will be doing everything they can to stop their precious hazards from being spun away. Excadril OHKOes Ghostceus after a Swords Dance with EQ and can take a hefty chunk of HP out of Gira-o with a Shadow Claw also, OHKOing 252 HP versions after Stealth Rock and 1 turn of Sandstorm damage. It's defense is not to be underestimated either, its high base 110 HP stat in conjunction with a steel-typing allows it to tank Dragon hits with some comfort.

    EDIT: I JUST GOT MAJORLY NINJA'D by locoghoul.
  7. Furai

    Furai wellfare
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    I don't really see why we would base our team around Xatu. Excadrill is more reasonable, however.
  8. gookie

    gookie Adominnustrata
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    If we are to build a team that uses no entry hazards I think we either need to use Xatu / spinner, or a team in which every pokemon can create or aid a win condition so we don't get hopelessly spiked on. That means powerful wallbreakers, and stallbreakers: DDQuaza, NP Darkrai, Terrakion, and Wobbuffet which punishes hazard layers.
  9. trickroom

    trickroom
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    Since Trick Room strategies rarely gets to use hazards anyway, I am posting the base of Ubers Trick Room teams.

    [​IMG]
    Dialga @ Life Orb
    Trait: Pressure
    EVs: 252 Atk / 4 Def / 252 SpA
    Quiet Nature (+SpA, -Spe)
    - Trick Room
    - Draco Meteor
    - Fire Blast
    - Outrage

    This Dialga is incredibly rare in Ubers now, I am pretty sure I am the only one who used it. Draco Meteor smashes Groudon and 2HKOes even the bulkiest Dialga. Fire Blast destroys Steel-types preventing anyway likely setups. Outrage and the Attack EVs are actually very useful for cleaning up teams and it does a large amount of damage to things like Ho-Oh, Blissey and Kyogre, especially when Dialga just used Draco Meteor. Outrage 2HKOes Arceus as well. Heatran is extinct anyway.

    Trick Room Dialga works well on its own. Not sure on Trick Room strategy as a whole.
  10. LighTz911

    LighTz911

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    Would Espeon be viable? Even though it is frail, it keeps a more offensive presence in your team as well at outspeeding a good amount of Ubers.
  11. locoghoul

    locoghoul Banned deucer.

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    I used it once back in GenIV along with Quit Kyogre and Scizor. The whole TR strat didn't work thaat well for me but I can tell you Dialga is a beast. Have you considered Air Balloon as an item?
  12. trickroom

    trickroom
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    Without Life Orb, you no longer OHKO Groudon with Draco Meteor and Kyogre can now easily survive Outrage. Dialga needs the power to fully abuse the four turns. LO Fire Blast also 2HKOes Support Arceus in the sun.
  13. Vratix

    Vratix

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    [​IMG]
    Support (StallTwo)
    @Leftovers
    Nature: Timid
    Moveset
    ~ Taunt
    ~ Recover
    ~ Will-O-Wisp
    ~ Light Screen / Psystrike
    EVs: 252 HP / 80 SpD / 176 Spe

    People rarely expect even a bulky or let alone a defensive Mewtwo with the rather excellent CM set running around. This set can cause anguish to an opponent when they expect the wrong set or simply just underestimate the defensive capabilities of this Genetic monster. Even knowing the set often won't help you as Mewtwo outpaces anything that is bulky enough to rely on status so it can render it impotent with taunt and its surprisingly excellent bulk allows it to outlast most sweepers and even survive a lit of popular revenge-killers.
    However, look out especially for Ho-oh and to a lesser extent Reshiram.
  14. locoghoul

    locoghoul Banned deucer.

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    Ok, how about this. I propose either Zekrom or Reshiram as the new CCAT pokes. Gen V is been here for a while and the new dragons haven't received enough love (at least from what stats say). It's all about Kyogre, Dialga, Arceus, Giratina, Ferrothorn, Tentacruel, etc, etc and no 5th Gen legendaries! I'm not very familiar with Zekrom so I wouldn't really know how to play him effectively. I'm sure if we can increase its usage, then Kyogre would at least have another check besides Palkia (although both are still handled by Ferrothorn I guess).

    Reshiram screams for sun support so we'll be pretty much making a sun team. Some ppl may not like this seeing how the ladder is filled with rain teams. However I think Reshiram's STAB are overlooked. A Flame Charge set is imo the best set although the blobs need to go first
  15. Bossness

    Bossness

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    I also propose Zekrom as the new CCAT pkemon. It can beat all rain teams(pokes-kyogre and party, everybody knows who they are) with its substitute+hone claws set - i have done this plenty of times. If we base a team around it then it might as well become an anti-metagame pokemon. So about the set, i would suggest the standard subclaws set wits either 84 speed evs to outspeed tentacruel or 164 speed evs to outspeeds lugia, heck why not max speed? Sorry if this post does not seem important.
  16. D4RR3N

    D4RR3N

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    Terrakion @ Life Orb
    Trait: Justified
    EVs: 252 Atk / 4 Def / 252 Spd
    Jolly Nature (+Spd, -SAtk)
    - Close Combat
    - Stone Edge
    - Rock Polish
    - Swords Dance

    Great Pokemon. RP/SD Terrakion blows holes on opponent's teams, which eases his team mates to sweep. Another notable job Terrakion does is checking Extremekiller Arceus, which is probably one of the biggest offensive threats as of now.
  17. Furai

    Furai wellfare
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    You two should bring us sets. It's nice and all that you support rarely-seen Pokemon, but geez, give us something to build around. <_<
  18. tomtom5858

    tomtom5858

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    The second one did give us Sub+Hone Claws, which is a very effective set in the current meta.
  19. bojangles

    bojangles IF YOU TRULY BELIEVE,
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    OK, I’m going to try and analyze all the options we have for the CCAT here. Don’t expect this to be without bias, since I’m a human after all. My purpose with this is not to have pure democracy but to produce a successful team, so I’m going to take a more proactive role here.

    Flying Arceus
    This is a pretty interesting Pokemon, but there are things that pop out about it to me. Slow-boosting sweepers benefit greatly from entry hazards because they are generally incapable of immediately punching holes in the opposing team, meaning that they will suffer more from not having entry hazards. I think that, while a Flying Arceus team can definitely work, Flying Arceus will be incapable of being truly worthwhile without the aid of Stealth Rock.

    Choice Specs Palkia
    Ah, a forgotten threat. Specs Palkia, while not as omnipotent as Kyogre, is really quite powerful, and since its job is just to get in, crush some poor Pokemon’s skull, and then switch out, it won’t suffer as greatly from not having entry hazards. Hitting powerful very quickly is one of the most important points for a central Pokemon, since they can prevail on a team without entry hazards, meaning that we will have a more successful team. Specs Palkia definitely fits the bill for that.

    Swords Dance Lucario
    I remember this guy from Theorymon’s olden days. Lucario, with its great typing, can get in pretty easily, especially with the help of Wobbuffet. While Lucario doesn’t have the “switch in, kill something, switch out” quality of Specs Palkia, it can do some serious damage after just 1 Swords Dance, since it has excellent Attack and moves (Close Combat wrecks a lot of Pokemon). I would, however, consider changing to Inner Focus and Crunch, since Justified will probably not activate overly often and Crunch will do more than Shadow Claw (Crunch always OHKOes min/min Giratina-O).

    Xatu
    While Xatu seems like a pretty good teammate for our CCAT, I don’t see how we would build around it. For that reason, I’m leaving it off the poll.

    Excadrill
    I actually really like the idea of Excadrill for this challenge. Like Lucario, Excadrill can boost its Attack extremely quickly. While it doesn’t have the best movepool, it has enough to get by, with Earthquake and Rock Slide or Shadow Claw. It also supports its team pretty nicely with Rapid Spin. Exca can also come back in later in the game to clean up its opponents, because of its boosted Speed in the sand. This could actually prove to be pretty important since we may be missing out on some OHKOs and 2HKOs because of the lack of entry hazards!

    Trick Room Dialga
    This is a Pokemon I’ve never actually used. The Trick Room strategy can really throw players for a loop, so in addition to Dialga just being powerful in general, there’s a certain novelty factor that may work. The only thing that worries me is that, without TR up, it’s going to have a rough time since it has no bulk investment. I would feel more comfortable having this on a full-on Trick Room team, and it would probably make it easier on us for a CCAT. Something to keep in mind for the process.

    Stalltwo
    Oh man I love Stalltwo, but I don’t know if you really want to do this without entry hazards. Unless you put some Toxic users on your team, you’re in for a long, long stall war. Psystrike, while still being pretty decently powerful, is coming off an unboosted Special Attack stat, meaning that it will not be able to break opposing stall that easily (it can only 2HKO Fighting Arceus now). I don’t know how a team around this could beat an opposing stall team, since we would have no entry hazards.

    Sub + Hone Claws Zekrom
    This is another Pokemon to definitely look into. One of the most popular Pokemon right now, Ferrothorn, becomes set up bait for this Zekrom, unless they spam Leech Seed to catch it switching in. After it gets in and behind a Substitute, Zekrom can boost up pretty easily so the lack of entry hazards will really only come into play if your opponent is using Focus Sash Pokemon. As a side note, there’s definitely something poetic about building around a Pokemon that specifically thrashes one of the biggest entry hazard users in a non-entry hazard challenge…

    Flame Charge Reshiram
    Reshiram hits like a truck, no question. However, since Reshiram is only boosting its Speed and not its offensive stats, it will have a harder time sweeping without some softening up of its opponent. Since we don’t have entry hazards, we will need to make sure we have some good Pokemon to do so if we decide to go this route. It’s still possible though, especially since Flame Charge Reshiram is something that a lot of team are frankly totally unprepared for if the sun is up.

    Dual Boosting Terrakion
    This is an interesting Pokemon for this CCAT. As I’ve said a few times, an important selling point of the Pokemon we use is going to be the “hitting hard” factor; we need a Pokemon who can blow through the opposition, even in the absence of entry hazards. After a Swords Dance, Terrakion can definitely do that with its great STAB coverage. However, what makes Dual Boosting Terrakion especially interesting to me is that, after it’s punched some wholes, it can elect to Rock Polish to clean up. Obviously the dream scenario is to get to +2/+2, but, in being realistic, the order you boost is important too.

    I have made a poll which will be open for 48 hours as of this post. Get voting!
  20. trickroom

    trickroom
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    Without any entry hazards on your side, Lucario is actually pretty weak and unable to break past usual walls. Lucario is only good with Spikes support if I remembered correctly.

    To me, Terrakion is generally the better choice over Lucario for more power, bulk and Speed in exchange for resistances and Extremespeed.

    We can just leave out Trick Room Dialga I guess since the whole team has to be built around a Trick Room team which will be a shaky play style.

    Reshiram is good because it threatens any Spikes user, even Tentacruel gets smashed by Outrage.
  21. barry4ever

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    The inability of entry hazards kind of makes stuff like Lucario underwhleming since like Trickroom said, it absolutely needs Spikes to guarantee its success.

    For me, its Excadrill, Reshiram, SubClaws Zekrom and Terrakion who I'm consider about voting. Now, lets get to each of them individually. I'm dont think Double Dance Terrakion or Excadrill is really the way to go since arent strong enough to really base a team around (unless you're using Sand and Excadrill). So, between SubClaws Zekrom and Flame Charge Reshiram its a tough choice for me since both of them are awesome mons. But, I think I'll give my vote to SubClaws Zekrom just because he's a teensy bit more versatile and threatening imo.
  22. bojangles

    bojangles IF YOU TRULY BELIEVE,
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    Looks like we are building a team around FLAME CHARGE RESHIRAM!

    [​IMG]
    Reshiram @ Life Orb
    Mild | 4 Atk / 252 SpA / 252 Spe
    ~ Flame Charge
    ~ Outrage
    ~ Blue Flare
    ~ Draco Meteor

    This thing is a monster most team just don't prepare for. In the sun, not many Pokemon can take a Blue Flare, and the combination of Dragon and Fire is unresisted thanks to TurboBlaze. Furthermore, after switching into Flame Charge, Kyogre is KOed by Draco Meteor!

    Let's start with discussing what kind of team to make!
  23. trickroom

    trickroom
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    I actually think Mild should the nature for Reshiram as the extra power really helps punish bulky Kyogre switch ins. Using Mild also hits Blissey or Chansey significantly harder and allows a better chance to OHKO Arceus. I seen more Modest Scarf Kyogre than Timid ones these days.

    Flame Charge Reshiram has to be on Offensive teams in my opinion. It dies fast and hits hard. Weakness to hazards halts its sweep easily.
  24. shrang

    shrang Reaction to Ubers ladder
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    It's pretty hard to make anything defensive if you're building it around Flame Charge Reshiram, IMO. Sun offense is the most ideal for obvious reasons.
  25. Furai

    Furai wellfare
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    I support Sun Offense, seeing as Reshiram would really appreciate that sun boost which makes it even a bigger nuke!
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