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Year of the Serpent- Electrolyte's 1K RMT

Discussion in 'BW OU Teams' started by Electrolyte, May 1, 2013.

  1. Electrolyte

    Electrolyte The Great Stone Dragon
    is an official Team Rateris a Contributor to Smogonis a Battle Server Moderator
    Mentor

    Joined:
    Jul 5, 2012
    Messages:
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    ~[​IMG] THE YEAR OF THE SERPENT [​IMG]~
    [​IMG][​IMG][​IMG][​IMG][​IMG][​IMG]
    [​IMG] Electrolyte's 1K RMT [​IMG]
    PEAKED: #27

    [​IMG]
    蛇年

    Hey there! It's me again, with another RMT- and this also happens to be my 1000th post here on Smogon! Not only do I have a team and a peak to 'show off', but I also have a few shout outs that I'd like to give about some people that have been not only a huge help but also an inspiration during my stay at Smogon. It is, after all, my 1K. Nevertheless, I'm sure you all want to see the team first, so let's get started!

    2013.
    The Year of the Serpent.

    Honored by many cultures for its beauty, grace, and nobility, the serpent was often connected to royalty and beauty. But they were also feared because of their power.

    Right around the end of my last RMT was Chinese New Year. Because this year is a Snake year, I decided to build a team around a Snake pokemon- and the snake pokemon that immediately came to mind was Gyarados. (haters who think Gyarados is not a Snake can go die in a hole) Not only is it one of the most aesthetically pleasing but also destructive pokemon in the OU tier, it's also a relatively underestimated Pokemln that has a lot of potential, which I think my team shows. SubDD Gyarados is a fearsome sweeper if left unchecked, and can rip apart Sun, Sand, and Rain teams alike with just one boost. It fit the bill, and I was eager to try it out. Here's the end product:

    [​IMG][​IMG][​IMG][​IMG][​IMG][​IMG]

    At first glance, it may seem similar to Kidogo's team, but there are quite a few differences in the way my team works. The team is centered around a Gyarados sweep, with Politoed's Rain as support. Then, I have a secondary and tertiary sweeping core in Scizor and Celebi+Keldeo, respectively, as well as hazard control and a panic button in Terrakion. Scizor plays an important role in Gyarados's sweep because it can KO Dragon types and defensive steel types that wall Gyarados. It covers Lati@s, too, who give Keldeo+Celebi trouble. Celebi not only passes boost to Keldeo but also acts as a special sponge, a bulky pivot, and a counter to bulky Water types. Keldeo is a revenge killer and also a cleaner, and is very deadly after Celebi passes to it. It, Gyarados, or Scizor end matches more often then not. ​

    Peaked #27 (open)

    [​IMG]


    Teambuilding process (open)

    [​IMG][​IMG]
    So, as you know, I started off with Gyarados and his buddy, Politoed. SubDD Gyarados was a destructive, reliable sweeper that I fell in love with almost immediately- and it has not disappointed me since. The obligatory Politoed and Rain support followed, as Gyarados needed Sand and Sun to be off the field and the Rain boost made Gyarados all the more scary. Politoed also provided some defensive backbone and a way to check setup sweepers.
    [​IMG][​IMG][​IMG][​IMG]
    Next came Agility THundurus-T and Choice Scarf Terrakion to aid Gyarados's sweep. I already knew how powerful Nasty Plot Thundurus-T was, and I wanted to try its faster version, which could easily take apart hyper offense teams. Politoed's Rain support let Thundurus use its mighty Thunder, which provided paralysis and hit every opponent for a large chunk of damage. Thundurus's ability to feign a Choice set and nab surprise KO's was also really helpful in tackling defensive teams. Terrakion's role was to revenge kill and clean up after a Thundurus or Gyarados sweep. It checked Dragons such as Dragonite after they set up, and its Fighting-type STAB also helped me defeat Sand teams and specially defensive opponents. Its Rock type STAB also helped me tackle Sun.
    [​IMG][​IMG][​IMG][​IMG][​IMG][​IMG]
    Next up came my defensive core, Forretress and Celebi. I desperately needed a spinner to cover for the Stealth Rock weakness of Gyarados and Thundurus-T, and Forretress's Spikes and ability to wall physical attackers helped the team succeed. Celebi's role was to wall bulky water types, set Stealth Rock, act as a pivot, and lead for the team. It could eliminate Water types such as Jellicent or Gastrodon, and could also sponge special attacks such as Latios's Draco Meteor. I used drypass Celebi to escape Pursuit leads.
    [​IMG][​IMG][​IMG][​IMG][​IMG][​IMG]
    A couple of things were really problematic. Lati@s were really annoying, as they walled Thundy, Politoed, Celebi, and Gyarados, and could revenge kill Terrakion. The team also lacked priority, so things that could get past +1 and KO Terrakion could easily tear the team apart. So, I tried Choice Band Scizor instead of Terrakion, as it could revenge kill just as many things, trap and KO psychic types, and pivot with Celebi. The addition of Scizor made the team slightly weaker to Sun, so I replaced Forretress with Tentacruel, who could handle Sun teams and Sand teams with more ease. Plus, it could act as a backup check to Fighting-types. It was overall much more reliable spinner.
    [​IMG][​IMG][​IMG][​IMG][​IMG][​IMG]
    I realized that Scizor could not fully check everything I needed it to. My team was too slow. I lacked any pokemon faster than 101 base speed, making me extremely weak to opponents such as SD Garchomp or SubCM Latias. Plus, my Stealth Rock weakness was really bothersome. Thundurus-T didn't seem to be pulling its weight, so I replaced it with a Scarfed Keldeo-R. To give the team some special sweeping power, I gave Celebi Nasty Plot so it could hit by itself or pass to Keldeo to attack opponents. I also made Scizor Swords Dance for added offense.
    [​IMG][​IMG][​IMG][​IMG][​IMG][​IMG]
    Finally, there was an obvious Electric weakness in the team because of my four water types, so I decided that I would not be able to run a spinner. Forretress made me weak to Sun, Starmie and Tentacruel made me weak to Electric types, and Donphan just doesn't work with the synergy of the team. Instead, I put in Focus Sash Lead Terrakion, whose Taunt could prevent the lay of hazards on my side. Although it wasn't as reliable as a spinner was, it did get the job done most of the time, and even when it didn't, I could still overcome it because I no longer had THundy-T. Terrakion could also set Stealth Rock, so Celebi could run another coverage move and not have to Lead.

    And that's how the team looks today.



    [​IMG]POKEMON DESCRIPTIONS[​IMG]

    [​IMG][​IMG][​IMG][​IMG][​IMG][​IMG]
    GYARADOS

    [​IMG]
    龙蛇

    [​IMG]
    [​IMG]LongShe (Gyarados) @ Leftovers
    Trait: Intimidate
    EVs: 56 HP / 248 Atk / 204 Spd
    Adamant Nature
    - Bounce
    - Dragon Dance
    - Substitute
    - Waterfall


    Gyarados is the centerpiece of the team. It is powerful, bulky, and fast, and can easily turn tables around during a match or sweep my opponent clean. I chose to use its SubDD set, which gives it a lot of bulk without sacrificing much power. Substitute and Intimidate along with Gyarados's good natural special bulk let Gyarados grab free turns behind a Sub to set up a Dragon Dance, which boosts its Attack and speed to monstrous levels. This lets it set up against many common opposing walls, such as Jellicent, Donphan, or Forretress. Intimidate lowers Gyarados's opponents attack stats too, making them weaker so they too can not break its Sub. Because of this, Gyarados can also easily set up against priority attackers such as Mamoswine, Scizor, or Breloom who are locked into their weaker, resisted attacks after they revenge kill one of Gyarados's teammates. Subsitute also lets Gyarados defeat one of its worst enemies, Volt Switch Rotom-W, who is forced to switch in order to hit Gyarados past its Sub. Substitute also lets Gyarados avoid crits, status, and flinching effects. It is a useful tool for setup.

    The rest of the moves in Gyarados's moveset are its attacking moves. Waterfall is obligatory STAB that's boosted by Rain and is super useful at checking Sand and Sun teams, who don't often carry many pokemon that can handle multiple boosted Waterfalls. It's solid STAB that can hit quite hard out of Rain as well, and the added flinch chance only makes it even more reliable. Bounce is secondary STAB, hitting Dragon and Grass types for quite a lot of damage. Although it's more powerful outside of Rain than Waterfall, its low accuracy makes it a bit unreliable occasionally but it's still a great move. Its paralysis chance also creates an interesting combo with Waterfall's flinch chance, forming a pseudo (though not often very notable) paraflinch core. Bounce is very useful at defeating Sun teams and Lati@s, both of whom are hit very hard by the move and definitely do not like the paralysis that could come with it.

    Other than sweeping, Gyarados's role on the team also includes checking certain opposing sweepers as well as acting as an Anti-Opposing-Weather pokemon. Because of its unique resistances and Intimidate, it is a good check to a lot of notable top threats in BW2, such as Keldeo, Lando-I, or Volcarona. It can check choice locked opponents too by lowering their attack stat and then setting up and threatening to sweep. Since it has powerful physical Water-type STAB, it can handle Sand and Sun teams too, who often fall apart from continuous onslaught. Plus, Substitute blocks status that Sun teams like to run, which is a useful bonus. Gyarados is often the source of my winning the weather war because it can defeat Tyranitar and Ninetales 1 v 1.

    In Chinese, 'LongShe' basically means 'DragonSnake'. Both creatures were praised for their nobility and grace, as well as for their mysterious power. Gyarados seemed to me like a mix between the two, so I named it so.

    SYNERGY:
    [​IMG] -
    Celebi
    [​IMG] - Keldeo, Terrakion


    [​IMG][​IMG][​IMG][​IMG][​IMG][​IMG]
    POLITOED

    [​IMG]
    青蛙

    [​IMG]
    [​IMG] QingWa (Politoed) @ Leftovers
    Trait: Drizzle
    EVs: 252 HP / 164 Def / 92 Spe
    Bold Nature
    - Perish Song
    - Scald
    - Ice Beam
    - Toxic


    Gyarados performs well as a standalone sweeper, but giving it Rain support really drastically improves its effectiveness. Politoed is here to provide it with that Rain- as well as provide support and physical bulk. By erasing my opponent's weather and putting my own down, I can make sure that the most optimal positions for Gyarados's sweep are set in place. Sand hurts Gyarados because it can't receive Lefties Recovery, and Sun hurts Gyarados because it weakens Gyarados's Waterfall. To be able to erase both of those weathers, I chose to run Rain.

    Politoed's moveset is pretty standard. I chose to use Physically Defensive Politoed, as it could handle Tyranitar with much more ease as well as cover some other important threats. I never really use it all that much other than for checking setup sweepers, crippling walls with Toxic, beating Sand with a bulky Scald, or as occasional fodder- as the Rain is all the team requires from it. However, Politoed's set gives it the ability to support should I need it- for instance, Perish Song is useful because it forces pokemon like SubCM Latias or DDnite out after three turns, lest they perish and lose their best sweeper. It can also force switches that Celebi can scout for, giving me momentum. Scald is Politoed's STAB move, and its burn chance is really helpful when it's trying to counter physical attackers such as SD Scizor. It also hits Sand walls such as Gliscor, Tyranitar, or Hippowdown for a decent amount of damage. Ice Beam is coverage so that Politoed won't be setup fodder for Grass and Dragon types. Toxic cripples walls and puts a timer on Latias, making them much less threatening to the team. Politoed can often bait pokemon such as Rotom-W in, Toxic it, and then play a game of bait-and-run which wears the Rotom down so Gyarados can sweep.

    'QingWa' literally means 'Frog' in Chinese. Politoed is a Frog, so I named it accordingly.

    SYNERGY:
    [​IMG] - Celebi
    [​IMG] - Celebi, Scizor

    [​IMG][​IMG][​IMG][​IMG][​IMG][​IMG]
    KELDEO

    [​IMG]
    马马

    [​IMG]
    [​IMG] MaMa (Keldeo-Resolute) (M) @ Choice Scarf
    Trait: Justified
    EVs: 252 SAtk / 252 Spd / 4 Def
    Timid Nature
    - Hydro Pump
    - Secret Sword
    - Icy Wind
    - Hidden Power [Electric]


    As a superfast revenge killer and a powerful special cleaner, Choice Scarf Keldeo holds its weight on this team by eliminating opposing setup sweepers and erasing what's left after Gyarados's sweep. It's fast, it's powerful, and it is a great answer to a lot of the walls that trouble Gyarados- such as Ferrothorn or Skarmory. In return, Gyarados can setup against Jellicent, Tentacruel, Slowbro, and Amoongus, four pokemon that give Keldeo a lot of trouble. Hydro Pump is insanely powerful STAB when boosted by Rain, muscling past a multitude of opposing walls and finishing off Gyarados's work. It easily blasts past Sand teams and Sun teams alike, and when backed up by a +2 Special Attack boost from Celebi, it can easily dismantle teams. Secret Sword is secondary STAB that hits Steel types and Normal types for a lot of damage. It beats Ferrothorn, which is often a major roadblock to Gyarados's sweep. It also nails Blissey and Chansey for a lot of damage, two pokemon that can take away my momentum by switching into Celebi and then paralyzing a switch in. Icy Wind is used instead of HP Ice because I want to use Hidden Power Electric to hit Gyarados and other Water types. Icy Wind hits Dragons such as Salamence or Dragonite not only hard but also with a crippling effect, so that other teammates can chip in and support the revenge killing effort. HP Electric checks Gyarados and other water types, and also hits Skarmory hard when being locked into Hydro Pump is a risky move.

    Because of its power and speed, Keldeo is the dedicated revenge killer of the team. It's also the dedicated receiver to Celebi's passes, which turn it into even more of a monster than it already is. Its power, coverage, and speed let it check opposing set up sweepers and eliminate physical walls that block Gyarados. It is an important asset to the team.

    Keldeo is more of a horse than a unicorn, in my opinion, so I named it 'Mama', which means 'Horsie' in Chinese. No, it's not the mom of anything; it's a horse. -.-

    SYNERGY:
    [​IMG] - Celebi
    [​IMG] - Scizor, Celebi
    [​IMG] - None
    [​IMG] - Scizor, Celebi


    [​IMG][​IMG][​IMG][​IMG][​IMG][​IMG]
    SCIZOR

    [​IMG]
    虫子

    [​IMG]
    [​IMG] ChongZi (Scizor) @ Iron Plate
    Trait: Technician
    EVs: 148 HP / 252 Atk / 108 Spd
    Adamant Nature
    - Bug Bite
    - Swords Dance
    - Bullet Punch
    - Superpower


    Steel types, in my opinion, are amongst a few of the most powerful and effective set up sweepers in the whole metagame, in my opinion. Every single team I use always probably ends up with one Steel-type boosting sweeper (SubCM Jirachi in Songs About Jane and SD Lucario in Syndicate are two examples) Their bulk and resistances make them not only long lasting but also really easy to set up with, as they can wall many opponents by using sheer resistances alone. I've never really liked CB Scizor all that much, since its popularity sparked the rise of a greater amount of counters and checks to it, rendering it unable to do much whenever I used it. However, for this team, I'm using Swords Dance Scizor- and it is a powerful sweeper that definitely holds its weight each match and supports its team well with its coverage and ability. Swords Dance quickly turns Scizor into a monstrous attacker, boosting its already high 130 Attack to even higher levels, making its Technician boosted, STAB boosted Bullet Punch hit fast and hit hard like a truck. Because of Scizor's numerous resistances, it more often than not finds countless opportunities to set up and sweep, making it a major part of any sweeping done by my team. Bullet Punch is his obvious STAB move, hitting a decent base 90 power as well as going before nearly any other move my opponent can throw at me. Bullet Punch is also useful when I don't use Scizor for sweeping, such as when I want it to force Tyranitar out or threaten weakened opposing sweepers.

    The next two moves are really for support purposes only, and do also provide Scizor with coverage to hit walls that resist Bullet Punch. Bug Bite is Scizor's secondary STAB move that hits Grass-types, Psychic-types, and Dark-types, primarily Celebi, Lati@s, Hydreigon, and Tyranitar, for a lot of damage. By removing Psychic types, Scizor aids Keldeo's sweep, since Keldeo often dislikes Psychic-type opponents. Removing Grass-types also helps the team succeed, as Chlorophyll sweepers such as Venasaur can hit half of my team super effectively with its Grass-STAB. Superpower, as suggested by a lot of the commentators, lets Scizor hit Steel types such as Heatran or Ferrothorn for a lot of damage. It also lets Scizor touch Skarmory, hitting it a decent chunk of damage, especially after a Roost.

    In a way, Scizor is a standalone sweeper that happens to defeat pokemon that counter the rest of the sweepers on this team, and that is why I chose it for this slot. Not only is it able to and capable of tearing holes in my opponents defenses nearly any time during the match, it can also remove counters and pokemon that trouble the team. Plus, it can revenge kill things Keldeo can't, such as Scarfers that are faster or Chlorophyll sweepers in the Sun.

    Because I couldn't tell what kind of insect it was, I just settled for 'ChongZi'- which means 'bug' in Chinese.

    SYNERGY:
    [​IMG] -
    Gyarados, Politoed, Keldeo, Terrakion


    [​IMG][​IMG][​IMG][​IMG][​IMG][​IMG]
    TERRAKION

    [​IMG]


    [​IMG]
    [​IMG] Niu (Terrakion) @ Focus Sash
    Trait: Justified
    EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
    Jolly Nature
    - Taunt
    - Stone Edge
    - Close Combat
    - Stealth Rock


    Although it could be the most disposable member of the team, Terrakion is in no way wasting this slot. Its primary role is to weaken my opponent early in the match and maintain hazard control for my side with Stealth Rock and Taunt. It is my dedicated lead, and sets Stealth Rock quickly and efficiently, crippling any Flying-types or Bug-types that might annoy me later. It also forces teams with SR weak pokemon to forfeit a turn in order to spin, which I can utilize to my advantage and give myself momentum or nab a boost. It's an important move that every single team should carry. Taunt lets Terrakion prevent opponents from laying their hazards down on my own side, and also prevents any early setup attempts such as LeadNite. Terrakion's Taunt is extremely important not only during the early stages of the game but also during mid game, as it must switch in again to keep bulky hazard layers such as Skarmory in check.

    The rest of Terrakion's movepool gives it a fair amount of offense that lets it put forth some offensive pressure, giving me momentum early in the match. Close Combat is powerful physical STAB that hits many things for quite a lot of damage, and is especially useful at hitting bulky Steel types such as Ferrothorn, who walls Gyarados, or Heatran, who walls Scizor. Stone Edge is useful to have and hit Sun teams with, as it gives me an edge against Ninetales leads. It also nails Flying and Bug types for a fair amount of damage should I need to hit them later too.

    Aside from being a lead, Terrakion can also be a panic button if the conditions are right and it can preserve its Sash. It can come in after a fainted teammate and tear off a huge chunk of HP from my opponent while it survives with 1% because of its item. Terrakion is also a magnificent dry receiver from Celebi when it faces a Tyranitar, because almost all the time it can get hit by either Pursuit or Crunch, both of which give it an attack boost that immediately gives myself loads of momentum. Its powerful physical coverage is also helpful at removing Rain defensive cores such as FerroCent, FerroTent, or Heatran.

    If you haven't caught the drift yet, I named Terrakion 'Niu' because that means 'cow' or 'bull' in Chinese. That's what it is (right?)

    SYNERGY:
    [​IMG] - Scizor, Celebi
    [​IMG] - Gyarados, Celebi
    [​IMG] - Gyarados, Celebi
    [​IMG] - Scizor, Celebi
    [​IMG] - Gyarados, Politoed, Keldeo, Scizor
    [​IMG] - Gyarados, Politoed, Keldeo, Celebi
    [​IMG][​IMG][​IMG][​IMG][​IMG][​IMG]
    CELEBI

    [​IMG]
    洋葱

    [​IMG]
    [​IMG] YangCong (Celebi) @ Leftovers
    Trait: Natural Cure
    EVs: 108 Spd / 252 HP / 150 SDef
    Calm Nature
    - Baton Pass
    - Giga Drain
    - Psychic
    - Nasty Plot


    Part of the original 6 pokemon of the team, Celebi has kept its spot the whole time because of its magnificent support capabilities. Its typing, resistances, and movepool are perfectly tailored to help it support this team to the max. Originally, it was the layer of Stealth Rock on the team, but the inclusion of Terrakion rendered this no longer necessary, so I used the slot to try out a new trick that a few people have also used before, Nasty Plot. I had already been running Baton Pass to pivot and escape Pursuiters because Celebi was an important wall for the team, so Nasty Plot accompanied it well, letting Celebi pass power boosts over to Keldeo to try to pull off a sweep. It also let Celebi itself hit things for quite a lot of power even though it doesn't have any investments- as +2 Giga Drain can 2HKO SpDef TTar in the Sand, and Celebi can easily sponge a Crunch.

    Of course, passing is only a small part of what Celebi does to support the team. As a bulky pivot, it is my go-to when I need to check or counter most of the special attackers of the tier, such as Choice Scarf Latios, LO Latias, Scarf Keldeo, SpDef Rotom-W, or Def Politoed. Because of its Psychic typing, I can also use Celebi to check Fighting types, something Gyarados is capable of but can't afford to sustain damage while doing. Psychic lets Celebi hit all of those Fighting (and Poison!) types very hard, often for the OHKO. This way, Celebi can safely and solidly check opponents such as Toxicroak, Breloom, Conkeldurr, or Tentacruel. In fact, Celebi's EVs are tailored specifically for this role. 108 Speed EVs let it outspeed Jolly Breloom, which also lets Celebi outspeed Adamant Mamoswine and SubPunch / Bulk Up Toxicroak. I have considered using 116 Spe EVs to outspeed Swords Dance Toxicroak, but they usually carry Sucker Punch, so outspeeding them is not as important. Giga Drain is secondary STAB that lets Celebi hit water types, ground types, and rock types AND heal itself. This lets it keep itself in a relatively good shape to continue checking opponents that I need a check to.

    In terms of synergy, Celebi is absolutely vital. It resists a majority of the weaknesses of the team. It walls and handles Water-types, Ground-types, Grass-types, Electric-types, Fighting-types, and special attackers, passes special attack boosts to Keldeo, and acts as a bulky tank for the team. It checks threats such as Rotom-W, Breloom, Mamoswine, Thundurus, Lati@s, or Politoed, and puts forth a fair amount of offensive pressure too because of Nasty Plot. It is extremely vital to the success of the team.

    YangCong means 'onion' in Chinese. Don't worry, I've takked to experts. Celebi is not celery, nor is it garlic, nor is it a watermelon. It's an onion.

    SYNERGY:
    [​IMG] -
    Gyarados, Politoed, Keldeo, Terrakion
    [​IMG] - Gyarados, Keldeo, Terrakion, Scizor
    [​IMG] - Keldeo, Terrakion, Scizor
    [​IMG] - None
    [​IMG] - Scizor
    [​IMG] - Politoed, Keldeo, Scizor
    [​IMG] - Keldeo, Terrakion, Scizor


    So, that's the team! I've had quite a lot of success with it, peaking at #27 on the OU ladder, and rising. The team has a lot of great offensive synergy inside of it, and many offensive checks to offensive pokemon. Plus, it has many pokemon that have the capability of sweeping, giving me many different angles in which I can hit my opponent. Despite this, there are still some weaknesses in the team:

    Opponents that I find annoying:
    [​IMG]- Skarmory
    Skarmory is a big threat, and probably the biggest threat to this team of all other OU pokemon. Skarmory is quite annoying for this team to handle, especially when it is supported by other bulky pokemon. It totally walls Scizor, Gyarados, Terrakion, and Celebi, and forces me to use Politoed or Choiced Keldeo to take it down, making me forfeit a lot of momentum. Plus, it sets hazards all over my face, annoying my spinner-less team and breaking Terrakion's Sash if it's still intact. Whirlwind and Sturdy makes it nigh impossible to take down quickly and efficiently, as it can just sponge a hit, Whirlwind, and recover back HP as a switch and take more hazard damage. Still, Gyarados can defeat it if it's weakened, Keldeo can OHKO with Hydro Pump, and Politoed can burn it with Scald. The trick is to wear it down enough so that more teammates can take it down.
    [​IMG]- Latias
    Although it's not as annoying as Skarmory, Latias still poses a threat to this team because of her speed, power, and bulk. Psychic hits Keldeo and Terrakion hard, and HP Fire beats Scizor. My only hopes of beating her are to catch her on the switch in with Terrakion, or Pursuit her with Scizor while in Rain, because she totally walls everyone else. Politoed can Toxic her, however, which really helps when I'm trying to take her down.
    [​IMG]- Latios
    Choice Scarf Latios is the only real threat to the team, but it can still deal an unpleasant amount of damage. It soundly checks Gyarados until it gets to +3, and can OHKO Keldeo and Terrakion with Psyshock. To beat it, I need to keep Scizor alive, so that I can trap and and be done.
    [​IMG]- Ferrothorn
    Ferrothorn has always been a massive roadblock to this team, even with the inclusion of Terrakion and Keldeo. It walls Celebi, Politoed, and Gyarados to the Sun and back, and can Leech Seed stall a weakened Scizor to death. Power Whip makes the thought of switching in my Fighting types unbearable, so it's often extremely tough for me to take down. To take it down, I usually make a daring switch with Keldeo / Ferrothorn or boost up with Scizor and then 2HKO with Bug Bite.

    Here's an Importable so you guys can try out the team:
    Importable (open)

    LongShe (Gyarados) @ Leftovers
    Trait: Intimidate
    EVs: 56 HP / 248 Atk / 204 Spd
    Adamant Nature
    - Bounce
    - Dragon Dance
    - Substitute
    - Waterfall

    MaMa (Keldeo) (M) @ Choice Scarf
    Trait: Justified
    EVs: 252 SAtk / 252 Spd / 4 Def
    Timid Nature
    - Hydro Pump
    - Secret Sword
    - Icy Wind
    - Hidden Power [Electric]

    QingWa (Politoed) @ Leftovers
    Trait: Drizzle
    EVs: 252 HP / 252 Def / 4 SpA
    Bold Nature
    - Perish Song
    - Scald
    - Ice Beam
    - Toxic

    Niu (Terrakion) @ Focus Sash
    Trait: Justified
    EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
    Jolly Nature
    - Taunt
    - Stone Edge
    - Close Combat
    - Stealth Rock

    ChongZi (Scizor) @ Leftovers
    Trait: Technician
    EVs: 248 HP / 252 Atk / 8 Spd
    Adamant Nature
    - Bug Bite
    - Swords Dance
    - Bullet Punch
    - Superpower

    YangCong (Celebi) @ Leftovers
    Trait: Natural Cure
    EVs: 108 Spd / 252 HP / 150 SDef
    Calm Nature
    - Baton Pass
    - Giga Drain
    - Psychic
    - Nasty Plot


    MADE CHANGES
    ~Pursuit --> Superpower
    ~Lefties on Scizor --> Iron Plate
    ~Scizor's spread
    ~Politoed's spread

    POTENTIAL CHANGES:
    ~Life Orb > Swords Dance on Terrakion
    ~Politoed --> Offensive
    ~Terrakion --> SpDef Jirachi
    ~Terrakion --> Lando-T
    ~Terrakion --> Lead Garchomp
    ~Celebi --> Starmie / Tentacruel

    I'd like to thank you all for taking the time to read this RMT. I've hoped you enjoyed it! If so, don't forget to drop a comment and click that heart-shaped pokemon-shaped button up at the top!



    Now, since this is also my 1K post, I'd like to give a few thanks, shoutouts, and reflections on my stay here at Smogon.

    The first group of people that I'd like to thank are my now-fellow RMT'ers here on Smogon. You guys are all awesome and I'm honored that you guys have recognized my efforts here in the RMT forums! I'd like to take a moment and thank some of you who've truly made a difference to me during my stay here on Smogon. I'll try not to be too sappy.
    Some notable people (open)

    Delko- Mr. Delko, I know you might not ever see this RMT, but I'd like to thank you for everything you've done regardless. You gave me useful advice back when I was a wee rater, and our discussions on PS! regarding girls have been interesting and fun! I hope you're having fun in Austr. if you're reading this! :]
    Jirachi- Jirachee you are actually a pretty good uzr :P Thanks for all of your advice and support as I've grown and improved as a rater. They were really helpful and I'm glad they have helped me improve so much. I'm happy to have worked with you n_n
    TNT- because you wanted a shoutout and because you make good RMT's and because you like Naruto and because MY AVATAR IS BETTER THAN URS
    haunter- We haven't really talked much but I still would like to thank you for not only leading this site but also giving me all of my badges :P You're an awesome guy and it's good to know that people like you run this place :)


    Also, I'd like to thank a few people that have made my endeavors and shenanigans on PS! worthwhile as well.
    Most of em are staff members now (open)

    MJB- I know you don't like sap so I'll make this short and sweet- you're a good guy. Keep it up. ;P
    Closet- Remember when I was anothing and you were aVoice? Haven't times passed quickly? Haha, nostalgia. It's nice to have you as a 'co-worker' now, and I'll never forget the things we've done on PS! together :D
    Nixhex- Teambuilding with you has always been fun, since your ideas and creativity as well as your interesting view of the OU metagame has given a lot of my very own teams spark and zing. Plus, you're an awesome guy and easy to approach, even if your music tastes are a bit... odd. :P
    Arcticblast- Duo mods ftw. You too are very unique when it comes to teambuilding, and I've enjoyed our little 'pep talks'. Congrats on the forum mods! You deserve it!
    oarpheus- I've had so much fun with you man, and all those hours have definitely been worth it :] Our dream (;D) might not ever come true but we've had fun nevertheless!
    all the other staff members- because you guys would eat me alive if I didn't ;) When I first become a Driver, I felt happy that I could finally control some parts of the chat- but I never would have thought that the best parts of being in the staff would be the staff members themselves! You guys are awesome; keep it up.


    And, there are some LC people that I want to thank for making my transition into LC smooth, easy, and fun.
    Other people (open)

    blarajan- you're a fag but you're still cool because you tutored me and shit. You know you'll never have as cool of a tutee as me ;P
    Charmander- you're so creepily obsessed with your violin; it's not even funny. But hey, that's one of the best parts about you! Oh, and you're good at LC and stuff but who cares about that lol
    Delver- Are you ready to win LCPL? I sure as hell am. I'm honored that you not only bid for me for quite a hefty price but also made me Co-Captain of the Murkrow Mafia. Here's to a win!


    Now, I'd like to give a shoutout to everyone I've talked with or done something with in the recent past. I can't fit all of your names here; but if I've appreciated things that you've done, you'll know it! You guys know who you are. n_n

    Once again, I'd like to thank the community of Smogon for being awesome. Every single one of my now 1000 posts have been worth the time and thought, and I'm happy to know so many of you. Hopefully, I'll get to know even more of you in the future!


    [​IMG][​IMG][​IMG][​IMG][​IMG][​IMG]
    THANKS FOR READING~

  2. Frochtejohgurt

    Frochtejohgurt

    Joined:
    Aug 28, 2011
    Messages:
    213
    sup,

    I was using Gyarados for long time myself and I found Skarmory not to be too big of problem, since +1 Waterfall in the rain will 2HKO and the only thing it can do to you is phazing. Unfortunately it roost up on every phaze-in, but Keldeo (and Politoed kinda). To put more pressure on it, I recommend to use either Life Orb or Swords Dance on Terrakion. I guess Life Orb is more workable, since Taunt is too important for hazard control, but Swords Dance lets you keep the Sash and makes life even harder for Skarmory. Life Orb makes really difficult to heal up on Terrakion after taking prior damage like a Waterfall from Gyarados for example. Also I would change Politoed to the Special Attacker set with Hydro Pump or Surf / Ice Beam / Focus Blast / Encore. I think it flows better with your team and puts much more pressure on Skarmory (definately can't heal up on you now) and also Ferrothorn, which aids Gyarados big times. It also hits the Latis for more damage. Encore is there to create free switches and setup opportunities. Lovely. The spread would be 224 HP / 252 SAtk / 32 Spd with Modest. Still bulky with much more power and some speed to creep on CBtars.

    Nice team
  3. thenewguy24

    thenewguy24

    Joined:
    Mar 16, 2013
    Messages:
    29
    Hey man nice team I'm glad to see nastypass celebi getting more usage as it is a very dangerous and underused threat in OU. Now onto the team, you more or less mentioned the few threats to this team, so I guess I can help by nipicking a thing of two. For starters, I'd swap leftovers for iron plate on scizor and give him superpower over pursuit. This will help with your problem to ferrothorn as well as bluffing the choice set with scizor allows him to quite easily set up late game and sweep with bullet punch if your opponent thinks hes choiced. However, you lose your pursuiter and what seems to be your main way of dealing with the lati@s twins.

    But--- **+2 252+ Atk Iron Plate Technician Scizor Bullet Punch vs. 4 HP / 0 Def Latios: 312-367 (103.31 - 121.52%) -- guaranteed OHKO**

    +2 252+ Atk Iron Plate Technician Scizor Bullet Punch vs. 252 HP / 0 Def Latias: 282-333 (77.47 - 91.48%) -- guaranteed 2HKO (After sr possible Ohko)

    So it seems this is the best way to address your main problems of ferro and the lati twins without completely changing a poke or moveset. Hope I could help and good luck with the team.
  4. Trinitrotoluene

    Trinitrotoluene ♪~ i don't want to know what she did; she is not who i am ~♪
    is a Tutoris a Community Contributoris a Team Rater Alumnus
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    noob lyte my avatar > yours smh

    Anyways, this is a pretty cool team. However, your vulnerability to Tornadus is very disconcerting. As your team stands, it can come in for free against your Celebi, and proceed to spam HURRICANE, which 2HKOes every member of your team even without a LO / Specs boost after SR is set up against you. The only Pokemon you have that's faster than it is your own Keldeo, which does not like HURRICANEs one bit. To help ameliorate this weakness, I'd strongly motion towards using a Specially Defensive Jirachi over your Terrakion. This change gives you a Pokemon that can effortlessly best Tornadus thanks to its massive special bulk and resistance to HURRICANE, as well as a Pokemon that can turn back the pendulum of time with Wish support, something Gyarados will find extremely handy, thanks to your use of Substitute. This change also gives you a more solid answer for the Lati twins, which can deal a substantial amount of damage to your team if left unchecked. Also, with that change established, you're free to run Superpower over Pursuit on your Scizor, giving you a more reliable means of eliminating Ferrothorn and heavily damaging Skarmory after a SD boost.

    Now for some small nitpicks and recommendations. First off, if you do follow through with my recommendation of Jirachi over Terrakion, I'd like you to use an EV spread of 148 HP / 252 Atk / 108 Spe over your current EV spread and an Iron Plate over Leftovers, as suggested by thenewguy24. The former change gives your Scizor the ability to outpace the standard specially defensive Heatran and beat it with Superpower, and the latter change is explained in thenewguy24's post, so read it if you haven't already. Anyways, a small list of nitpicks can be located below.

    Set:
    [​IMG]
    Jirachi @ Leftovers | Serene Grace
    Careful | 252 HP / 232 SpD / 24 Spe
    Body Slam | Iron Head | Wish | Stealth Rock


    Thunder and a Sassy nature can be used over Body Slam if other bulky waters are too annoying for your team to face. Be sure to move the Speed EVs to Special Attack if this is done. Also, I'll place the burden of finding a nickname for it on you.

    Nitpicks:
    • [​IMG] ====» [​IMG]
    • [​IMG]
      • Pursuit ====» Superpower
      • 248 HP / 252 Atk / 8 SpD ====» 148 HP / 252 Atk / 108 Spe
      • Leftovers ====» Iron Plate

    Good luck with your team!
  5. Masterclass

    Masterclass

    Joined:
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    566
    I don't agree with this, I don't think this team needs to look any more like Kidogo's team. Add that Jirachi and you're a Thundurus short of Kidogo's team. :/

    Edit: also looking at your threat list with jirachi and Thundurus-T you're no longer weak to skarmory or Lati@s.
  6. TCR

    TCR We're all going to hell, we may as well go out in style
    is a Contributor to Smogon
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    hey lyte! as i told you, i absolutely love this team. and as promised, im going to offer what meager advice i can give. *sniff* you've gotten so much better since i first met you. *cries*

    im going to go against everyone here, and recommend you trying out Choice Scarf Scizor. IIRC, jolly+scarf outspeeds the latis? if not, lol, completely ignore this.

    anyway, i think it should help you with forcing out lati@s and pursuit trapping you, when latias plays mind games by subbing and whatnot, and even if they have hp fire, you can usually outspeed them and ohko them with pursuit or uturn, depending on how you want the match to go. If the opponent is using scarftios, simply switch in on dragon pulse or draco meteor and pursuit :]

    another threat i see arising are common rotom-w/scizor cores. unfortunately, i cant really offer much without completely messing your entire synergy up.

    maybe try out Terrakion ---> Landorus-t? just watch out for hydro pumps.

    GL with your team lyte! hope i helped, or at least stirred some ideas into your head :] thank you for the shout out as well!
  7. Jukain

    Jukain fuck redew
    is a Smogon Media Contributoris a Tiering Contributoris a Contributor to Smogon
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    lyte :D

    This is obviously a great team just based on the fact that you achieved a high peak with it. However, there a few things that can be improved. First off, Pursuit is rather odd on Swords Dance Scizor. See, when those Psychic-types switch out, they don't actually achieve anything. You on the other hand get to fire off a powerful boosted Bug Bite. In fact, you can take advantage of those Psychic-types as they run away in fear. For this reason, I suggest replacing Pursuit with Roost. You're running a bulkier spread on your Scizor, but you're not really taking advantage of it. Your Scizor is a perfect candidate on your team to take beatings from foes such as Salamence and Latios, but it needs Roost to really survive against them. Additionally, Roost makes it easier to obtain boosts. Psychic-types shouldn't be a major issue anyway with Celebi to back Scizor up.

    On Politoed, I highly recommend running some Speed EVs. I'd recommend moving 92 EVs to Speed. This allows you to get the jump on neutral-nature Gorebyss in addition to Dragonite, Heatran, Skarmory, and Breloom. This is mainly useful for getting off a Perish Song before any of these Pokémon set up or do whatever they do. This nets a final EV spread of 252 HP / 164 Def / 92 Spe.

    Other than that, it looks like you have a fairly solid team. Congrats again on the peak!

    Oh yeah and thanks a bunch for forgetting me D: .cry
  8. Bluwing

    Bluwing

    Joined:
    Aug 3, 2012
    Messages:
    594
    Hello Electrolyte this team is realy nice and it is a very solid team. As you have pointed out the weaknesses against Skarmory and Ferrothorn/hazards this problem is mainly caused because your Keldeo is Scarfed, to solve this problem I would suggest Expert Belt Keldeo over your current Scarf one this set also works better with your NP Celebi as it won't be choice locked. So now Keldeo is Expert Belt then you need to put the scarf on something, and I just wanna suggest using your Politoed as your scarfer running the excact same set just with Hydro Pump over Scald for better damage, these suggestion fixes your problems while still maintaining your goal also your team now will have a lot more wallbeaking power due to Expert Belt Keldeo and more versatility.

    The Sets:

    [​IMG]
    Keldeo @ Expert Belt
    Trait: Justified
    EVs: 4 HP | 252 SAtk | 252 Spd
    Timid Nature (+Spe, -Atk)
    - Surf
    - Secret Sword
    - Icy Wind
    - Hidden Power [Electric]

    [​IMG]
    Politoed @ Choice Scarf
    Trait: Drizzle
    EVs: 4 HP | 252 SAtk | 252 Spd
    Timid Nature (+Spd, -Atk)
    - Hydro Pump
    - Ice Beam
    - Toxic
    - Perish Song
  9. The Unlucky one

    The Unlucky one

    Joined:
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    924
    I swear someone needs to make a list of everything Gyarados is considered to be (i'm totally with you though, it is a serpent!) Alright I'm basically going to echo the ideas of Iron Plate Scizor and 92 Speed EVs on Toed.They overall increase the efficiency of the team by a bit. I'm going to go by a note that these changes might not work with you perfectly as its one of those weird ideas I came up with for your team (what do you expect lol). First of all looking at your threats you mention the Lati Twins and Skarmory being big threats so naturally a lot of people did recommend Jirachi on Terrakion's spot. However I really feel Jirachi>Terrakion won't work perfectly because it will slow down the momentum since Rachi will be a forced SR pivot when SR+U-Turn isn't really a possibility on most Rachi given they pretty much have to stick in Wish. Jirachi still is a huge benefit to the team but you really wanna pose an offensive presence to what you threaten out. This makes me think Jirachi might be a better fit over Scizor than over Terrakion. I'm not very sure about what problems that Scizor covers that Jirachi and the rest of the team don't so I honestly think the team would benefit from it. It also isn't forced to run SR on the team, so maybe even a CM Variant would work with Superachi HP Fire/Flash Cannon/Thunder working over Scizor instead of SpD Rachi over Terrakion My teambuilding is really weird so you don't really have to follow this lol. Thanks for the semi shoutout.

    @Above. Yeah Ebelt Keldeo works perfectly actually you can run Flash Cannon/HP Fire/GK Rachi then. Didn't think of Ebelt Keldeo
  10. Laga

    Laga Thank u based danish pastry
    is a Community Contributoris a Tiering Contributor
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    Hell yeah Electro, doing exactly as I reminded you ;) This is a fantastic team, and I don't really have much to say about it, as I think it has good synergy; both offensive and defensive. I mostly made this short post to say happy 1000 posts!!! :^D
  11. Reymedy

    Reymedy They live and die by my command.
    is a Tutoris an official Team Rateris a Forum Moderatoris a Community Contributoris a Tiering Contributor
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    Hello.
    Congratulation for the ... posts ? and for the peak.

    Looks like a Rain offense, along with a Celebi and a Gyarados. Right off the bat, I can tell that the weakness to Electric moves seems frightening, but let's see.

    The weaknesses :

    - I think the biggest one would be a decently played Volt-Turn combo. I mean, Rotom-W comes fairly easily and can Volt-Switch, you're then forced to go to Celebi and if he switches to Scizor (or anything with U-Turn), I don't see how you can get the momentum back. Scizor could go in on a Volt-Switch I guess, but it's risky and hazards will worn you down fast, on top of that, given Scizor's speed and his high usage, he's likely to be easily checked by your opponent.

    - Thundurus looks still threatening, the Agility version with LO can 2HKO your Celebi with HP Ice after Rocks damage.

    - Sub CM Jirachi could be kinda annoying, since he hits everybody for super effective damages at the moment, bar Celebi, who can't really force him out, thus Jirachi will just get a Sub for free. Scizor can check him I guess, but the lack of Roost can be annoying here, +1 Thunder could hurt quite a bit if we add up SR damages.

    - I think your match-up against Sun teams is really tough from what I see. You rely heavily on your weather considering how the Water moves are important, what if their power is /2. So, maybe a Sun Team relying on Gothitelle to trap, or something like that could be an issue.

    And, of course, the weaknesses mentionned in the previous posts.

    So, the changes :

    - First, I would strongly support the replacement of Terrakion for a Chomp. It seems like it would really help your team in almost every way. It will force Skarmory to come in, so with a good set, you will be able to maybe kill Skarmory. Moreover, with a Yache berry, you could totally surprise kill Thundurus-T and stop his sweep if he's at +2 Speed (Chomp could lure Tornadus like this too). He obviously checks Jirachi perfectly. You also get an Electric immunity to not let Rotom-W grab the momentum in a risk-free way by spamming Volt-Switch, this coud help.
    Oh, and Venusaur doesn't break through a Chomp as easily as it breaks through a Terrakion.

    - I think the offensive moves you chose for Celebi could be different. I'm thinking about something like EarthPower/HPIce to hit Ferrothorn, Skarmory, Jirachi, Tornadus, Thundurus-T, Lati@s... basically every threat, harder. The coverage is pretty neat, and while you lose your stabs, having a better coverage and grabbing SE hits could be better.

    - Minor changes, like getting Roost over SuperPower on Scizor (so you set-up on Ferrothorn) since I feel like Scizor is really important for your defensive backbone. I'd also opt for a Specs Toed to pressure Sun Teams and Ferrothorn (can't switch on FBlast etc).


    THE SETS :


    [​IMG]
    Garchomp @ Yache Berry/Focus Sash
    Rough Skin
    4 Atk / 252 SpA / 252 Spe
    Hasty Nature
    - Stealth Rock
    - Earthquake
    - Surf
    - Draco Meteor

    You can go for a -SpD nature if you prefer the Sash. The Sash could help to bait and kill Lati@s.
    Surf does on average 50% to PDefensive Skarm with Rain up, so you force him out, and he probably won't be ready to stop a Gyarados' sweep. EQ still hurts Jirachi enough to get an 0HKO after SR on the Sub/CM version. Fire Blast could still be used by the way since it would help against Sun Teams relying on Forretress to spin hazards (and against Ferrothorn, FB still does a decent chunk to Skarm even under Rain).


    I hope I helped, good luck with your team.
  12. Ezio

    Ezio .
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    Since you aren't running Taunt on Terrakion, Garchomp mostly outclasses it as a SashRock lead. This is really the only major change I can see in your otherwise solid team. As Remedy said, Garchomp can lure Skarmory and take it out but I don't think Skarmory is as much of a problem as Ferrothorn. For this reason, I think SD Chomp is the best choice.

    Garchomp @ Focus Sash
    4 HP / 252 Atk / 252 Spe
    Jolly
    -Earthquake
    -Outrage
    -Swords Dance
    -Stealth Rock

    After a boost, Chomp 2hkos Ferrothorn through Leech Seed and Protect. Ferrothorn really will not be in a position to answer Gyarados at all. I realize Gyarados can set up on many variants of Ferrothorn but Iron Barbs and Power Whip is more of a dick to your team than Skarm's phazing. Also, Rough Skin beats opposing Terrakion leads. Good luck with the team!

    EDIT: Use Iron Plate, the bluff is great and Bullet Punch actually gets noticeably more powerful.
  13. peng

    peng

    Joined:
    May 21, 2009
    Messages:
    470
    I haven't rated in ages and don't really play this game properly anymore so take anything I say with a pinch a salt. I was just browsing the forums and this team caught my eye because I just don't really understand what you are trying to do with it.

    Show Hide
    I guess the first thing I want to look at is:
    How can you start teambuilding with Gyarados + Politoed, and still have problems with Ferrothorn and Skarmory?
    Surely when teambuilding around Gyarados the first thing you should be looking to do is lure in and eliminate its 2 biggest counters? Not only that, but this team doesn't really enjoy facing one of Gyarados' best checks either - Rotom-W. I haven't played for a while but I know that Signal Beam Rotom-W (actually pretty much Signal Beam on any Electric-type) is better now than it has ever been with the omnipresence of Celebi, and the heavy reliance of those teams on SDef Celebi to beat the most dangerous sweepers around.

    The other major issue here is general hazards, especially on defensive teams. You're answer to stall seems to be "hope they are weak to Gyarados otherwise I lose". Luckily for you, a lot of Sandstall teams do look very weak to SubDD Gyara, but those with Skarmory (or Ferrothorn) are going to be an issue. I think the reason this team looks so stall weak is a combination of the team's susceptibility to Spikes, Gyarados' SR weakness and also your slightly flawed approach to break defensive cores. Although Keldeo does beat a lot of Gyarados' premier checks and counters 1v1, those counters sure as hell aren't staying in on Keldeo. As a result, this team kind of struggles to get past a core as basic as Skarmory / Jellicent, especially once you add in Spikes and the possibility of Tyranitar or Hippowdon.

    The second thing I want to touch on is:
    What is NP Celebi really doing for you?
    I've been seeing this set everywhere since Kidogo posted it (btw sets like this have been used on and off for years so idk what all people are suddenly so hyped about it), but on a lot of teams it just doesn't fit. I think this team is a good example of where Nasty Plot just doesn't seem to make sense. You have a single good recipient who is Choice Scarfed and will maybe get a single KO at best vs defensive teams before they just go into one of their multiple Water / Fighting resists. This team is heavily reliant on you catching Jellicent with a +2 HP Electric to have a chance of getting through well-played stall, which isn't a good sign. I can see the merit of getting a +2 Scarf Keldeo against offense, but this team already matches up decently against offensive teams even without the Baton Pass element. I personally feel as though this whole "NP passing to Scarf Keldeo" is incredibly overrated, especially when this team makes little effort to bait in and weaken Latias, Jellicent and Celebi beforehand.


    The actual rate:
    When I first looked at the team I thought it would be a cool fix to try and fit in Offensive Starmie somewhere. Starmie actually does lure in and weaken Ferrothorn with Rain-boosted Hydro Pumps to open up for a Gyarados sweep, as well as providing Rapid Spin to give Gyarados greater longevity. The best place this would actually fit would be over Celebi, which as I mentioned, doesn't seem to be doing much in my mind that the team couldn't already do without it. The only reason you should really be using Gyarados anyway is because of its ability to check and set-up on Landorus-I and Keldeo and then easily tear through Sand balance. As a result, Celebi is redundant and counter-intuitive when trying to orchestrate a Gyarados sweep.

    If you honestly want to use Celebi, theres really very little reason not to just put Feraligatr over Gyarados, as it requires very little support, can lure+weaken Jellicent / Latias / Celebi, and makes a +2 Scarf Keldeo a feasible win condition for you.

    Assuming you go with Starmie over Celebi, I think it would also be a good idea to try Life Orb over Leftovers / Iron Plate on Scizor. LO Scizor does a great job of luring and weakening both Jellicent and Skarmory (you'll need some speed investment for Jellicent but I'm not familiar enough with the game atm, ask someone else for specific spreads) to help you sweep with Gyarados, or in a pinch, Keldeo. The boost in power from Leftovers to Life Orb is huge in helping you deal with Venusaur, meaning you require fewer turns of Life Orb recoil because you can revenge-kill it with priority - still not ideal but it definitely improves your match-up vs sun.

    Turns out I didn't really think this out very well because now you look pretty weak to Rotom-W, although it still gets worn down really quick by trying to switch-in on Starmie or Keldeo. Easiest fix is probably Ferrothorn over Terrakion, which does make you weaker to Thundurus-T but also greatly improves your match-up against opposing Gyarados. If Thundurus-T proves to be a massive issue (which it probably will), then Scarf Politoed is also an option to give you another check.

    tl;dr
    [​IMG]->[​IMG]
    [​IMG] @ Leftovers -> Life Orb + more speed
    [​IMG]->[​IMG]

    Some of my suggestions might be a bit dated but I think the principle behind them is still sound - this team doesn't really help Gyarados or Keldeo sweep that well at all. You have 2 separate halves to the team that seem to work independently of eachother and on paper it doesn't look like either side can really get much done.

    GL etc etc

    30 mins of excellent procrastination.
  14. Electrolyte

    Electrolyte The Great Stone Dragon
    is an official Team Rateris a Contributor to Smogonis a Battle Server Moderator
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    Whoo, there are a lot of replies. I'd like to thank everyone so far who's left a comment or clicked that luvdisc- it really means a lot!

    @Frochtehjogurt- LO Terrakion seems like an interesting idea, and if I don't take any other suggestions, I probably will use LO Terrakion for its extra power. I will consider an offensive Politoed as well, since having another reciever would be cool. Though, I don't think I can give up Politoed's bulk and ability to defeat other weather inducers very easily. Thanks for the rate!

    @thenewguy: I will definitely try Iron Plate on Scizor, and I've already swapped pursuit with Superpower. Being able to trap Lati@s is useful, but being able to dent Steel types such as Skarmory is a lot more important. Thanks for the suggestion!

    @TNT: noob TNT your avatar isn't even from the anime >:I
    Hurricane is occasionally a problem, especially when it comes to Specs Tornadus-I. Luckily, it's not all that popular, and I CAN check it with Stealth Rock+Keldeo or Sash Terrakion. I'll try your Jirachi set though, since it seems as if it could patch up my Lati@s and Electric weakness a bit better. I've also taken your suggestion of running a different EV spread for Scizor; though it becomes much less bulky after its Lefties and much of its bulk is taken away. Still, the offense will probably be a lot more useful. Thanks for the rate and luvdisc, TNubT!

    @minime114: Choice Scarf Scizor and Lando-T are definitely interesting options, though I must say that I've already expressed my dislike for Choiced Scizor, because it's too easy setup fodder and doesn't hit hard enough. I might try Lando-T, but its inability to touch Ferrothorn could be quite annoying. Thanks for the rate, anyway!

    @Pokemonnumeros: You didn't have those numbers in your name so I didn't recognize you! Roost over Pursuit is an interesting idea, and I would try it if I hadn't already decided to make Scizor more offensive. I need it to rip and tear holes in my opponent's offense, so extra speed and coverage is more important. I've also taken your suggestion for Politoed's EV spread. Thanks bud!

    @BROstime: That's a very neat suggestion that I will definitely look into. Giving Keldeo the ability to switch attacks would definitely be awesome- but I'm afraid it loses a lot of its cleaning capability because it loses its massive speed. Politoed could cover things as a scarfer and another reciever, but it's also burdened by a low speed stat, so it can't really revenge kill boosted opponents. Still, I'll definitely consider it. Thanks for the idea!

    @The Unlucky One: Offensive Jirachi seems like a pretty cool idea. It could cover some of my weaknesses and act as a special bulky sweeper. I'll try it out. Thanks for the suggestion, man!

    @Lagalaga: Thanks man! I'm glad you like the team so much! :]

    @Remedy: Garchomp is definitely a good suggestion. It does seem to patch up a lot of the team's problems well; including its weakness to Volt Turn and weakness to Steel types. I'll definitely test both SR Lead with Fire Blast and SR Lead with SD- though I'll probably end up using Fire Blast since SD makes me weaker to Skarmory. The only thing I don't exactly like about Garchomp is its lack of Taunt- though further offensive pressure would definitely be useful, and it could also act as a pseudo reciever to Celebi to boost its Fire Blast to Steel-melting levels. Thanks for the rate!

    @Hyperbeem: As I said to Remedy, I will definitely try Garchomp. Thanks!

    @PenguinX: Ninja'd v.v Anyway, a lot of what you said does make sense. Ferrothorn and Skarmory are problems because the team is centered around Gyarados. As I said in teambuilding, I originally had Thundurus-T to check / counter both as well as handle Stall, which you also mentioned in your post. However, I gave up Thundy-T and split the role of handling defensive teams amongst the rest of my pokemon because Thundy-T's weakness to Stealth Rock and my inability to fit in a spinner without totally ruining my defensive momentum was unsatisfactory. I guess if I change Celebi for Starmie I can once again try to fit in Thundy-T instead of Keldeo, though the loss of Celebi, as you've said, greatly weakens the team to numerous different special attackers and Bulky Water types, too, which Starmie can not handle as well. I might be able to retry Tentacruel in the slot, and then change Terrakion to a Ferrothorn as you've said, but again, these are all big changes that I still have to test, haha. Either way, thanks for the rate!
  15. kakuna

    kakuna

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    Reading through other posts I really have to side with peng I don't understand the logic behind most of your pokemon selections, tbh you team kind of looks like a ripoff of Kidogo's. Your celebi set doesn't make much sense, you will want a bulkier electric resist or at least one with recover. I would replace keldeo with toxicroak right off the bat because toxicroak can take on water types who can give gyarados trouble in some situations. Breloom is also a valid choice here, but keldeo just compounds your electric weakness and your team's overall weakness to bulky waters. If you want to keep celebi I would make it fully specially defensive, and give it stealth rock over giga drain as well as recover over nasty plot. There are honestly a lot of ways you could go with this team but as it currently is your celebi set is pretty out of place and scizor would probably fit better as another steel type like SubCM jirachi. The only definite thing to do is scrap keldeo for toxicroak because you need to take down bulky waters. I know it is weak to jellicent as well, which is why you have all the speed in politoed. Lastly terrakion might not be the best offensive stealth rock user especially if you can shove stealth rocks onto celebi, so powerful attacker of your choice would be good. A special electric type like jolteon could pass subs to gyarados and maybe facilitate a sweep as well as maintaining some of the revenge killing capabilities keldeo had, toxicroak sucker punch is good for the others.


    Summary:
    Jolteon, Toxicroak, and Jirachi >>> Terrakion, Keldeo, and Scizor


    SpD celebi > idkwtfii celebi

    So your line up should be:
    Defensive Politoed, SubDD Gyarados, SD toxicroak, SpD celebi, SubCM jirachi, and SubPass jolteon. Jolteon could actually fit really nicely luring out grounds and ferrothorn for your other team members to set up on.


    My reasoning in a nutshell:
    -PenguinX
  16. Enoch

    Enoch

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    Mar 19, 2013
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    88
    Great job Flare, love the team.
  17. ShootingStarmie

    ShootingStarmie
    is an official Team Rateris a Forum Moderatoris a Tiering Contributor
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    Hey man, cool team. This isn't going to be much of a rate, mainly because I haven't got much time, but I just want to point out one serious threat to your team that I don't think have been mentioned yet. Rotom-W. It easily gets a switch into Gyarados, and can hit 4 out of 6 of your Pokemon super effectively (it can also burn Scizor, or hit it hard with a ran boosted Hydro Pump). While you do have Celebi, who is perhaps the best counter to Rotom-W, it just puts huge pressure on Celebi, while still needing to tank hits from Thundurus-T (which you also seem pretty weak to) and Keldeo. Just something to consider when laddering.

    Cool team man, it's obvious you've put a lot of work into this RMT, Luvdisc'd.

    (P.S. sorry for the poor rate, I might edit this post later)
  18. dragonuser

    dragonuser Today, tomorrow, and always with a frozen heart
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    Hey there,

    This is a pretty solid team with few issues. The main ones, as you mentioned, seem to be Lati@s and opposing Skarmorys. Lati@s can really come in vs a lot of your team and give threaten a large portion of your team, while Skarmory can easily wall the majority of your team and stack hazards. While I hate making this team look even more like Kidogo's I really think a Specially Defensive Jirachi with Thunder would work well over Scizor. Jirachi gives you a fantastic check to Lati@s, while also giving you an immediate way to threaten Skarmory, which your current Scizor lacks (not to mention it needs to be boosted, and without LO isn't doing too much damage anyways). Jirachi also maintains your Steel-Type, while also giving you another recipient for Celebi (surprisingly you lack many NP receivers). Now if you want Jirachi to play a more offensive role, you can always use a more offensive Calm Mind + Wish Jirachi instead. Calm Mind + Wish Jirachi would also be a better NP recipient. Now I somewhat disagree that Ferrothorn is a major threat to your team, in that Celebi should hypothetically be setting up on it, since Gyro Ball should be doing under half meaning you can setup a NP and recover stall pp. However if you are still worried you can run a Choice Specs Politoed with Focus Blast over your current set, but seeing as that would make your team near identical to Kidogo's I am somewhat wary of suggesting it. Anyways, cool team and gl.

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