the fact that mglalie was described as "just kind of bad" and gastrodon was described as "just ass" LMAO
justice for gastrodon
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Metagame National Dex Metagame Discussion
- Thread starter Nashrock
- Start date
justice for gastrodon
I mean even in the very niche bulky water ground type role Gastrodon is outclassed by Quagsire. Quagsire even has a better version of storm drain in water absorb, and Quagsire gets unaware which is a huge plus. Maybe a mega could help Gastrodon? I feel like all it really needs is just stat buffs. Its ability is okay and it’s got a great movepool.
Sort of agree hippo is a solid defensive mon but you have to be careful about just switching in to zard y and pelipper. The former can 2hko spdf hippo if it carries fire blast (if no lefties/any chip), and pelipper can click water moves. Hippo also can't touch zard y or pelipper outside of whirlwind/toxic/yawn (unless you run rockslide/stone edge) so its a kind of passive check. Its hard to fit rock move when you want hazards, recover, EQ, and whirlwind/toxic. Thats why I prefer it on offense teams with eject button.
252 SpA Charizard-Mega-Y Fire Blast vs. 252 HP / 252+ SpD Hippowdon: 186-219 (44.2 - 52.1%) -- guaranteed 3HKO after Leftovers recovery
0 SpA Pelipper Scald vs. 252 HP / 252+ SpD Hippowdon: 146-174 (34.7 - 41.4%) -- 66% chance to 3HKO after Leftovers recovery
yea gastrodon is not in the best place rn, i was just commenting how a15g implied that gastro was worse than mglalie...
Sorry I missed that part. There is no way in hell Gastrodon is worse than Mega Glalie. The one thing Mega Glalie can do is refrigerate explosion and that’s pretty much useless.
I mean, I’m gonna play devils advocate and stick up for Mega Glalie if no one else will.
Mega Glalie is one note but it can be a somewhat threatening one note. It’s also a Spiker that can hit hard with Refrigerate boosted returns and double edges as an aggressive attacker on webs teams since non grounded Pokemon doesn’t exactly love to fight Mega Glalie. Plus it packs Ice Shard, right? So it’s not the worst you can attempt to use. It does get Trailblaze which is kind of funny to imagine.
But nobody is gonna say Mega Glalie is an underrated masterpiece. Still flawed as hell.
Mega Glalie is one note but it can be a somewhat threatening one note. It’s also a Spiker that can hit hard with Refrigerate boosted returns and double edges as an aggressive attacker on webs teams since non grounded Pokemon doesn’t exactly love to fight Mega Glalie. Plus it packs Ice Shard, right? So it’s not the worst you can attempt to use. It does get Trailblaze which is kind of funny to imagine.
But nobody is gonna say Mega Glalie is an underrated masterpiece. Still flawed as hell.
In my opinion Mega Glalie’s two biggest problems is its rock weakness and being a mega. It would be great to come in as a wall breaker, especially on webs teams. But taking 25% from stealth rocks per switch in really limits it. And if it wasn’t a mega it could run boots to solve this, or a choice item to become even more threatening. All of these flaw especially become apparent when you have mega options like Zard-Y, Mega Diancie, T-Tar and others to choose instead.
Deoxys-S is fine. Honestly. Lead set is best.
IMO offensive D-S while great vs. offense still doesn’t break steels that well. Big Daddy (Mega) Scizor handles it well, as does M-Mawile, Iron Crown, etc. Extra fat steels like Ferrothorn, Melmetal, and Heatran can check it if it lacks/exhausts its FightingZ.
On another note, this tier reminds me of how cracked Volcarona is. No the mon is not “ban” busted, but boy does that thing run through an ill-prepared team like no other. It’s a fucking freight train.
I’ve had an Av Iron Crown only take about 60% from a Deo-S Fightium Z before. It’s definitely not broken.
I’ve always believed it’s a skill check for the teambuilder. Same as Arch in rain in my opinion. They just make sure you’ve built a good team.
I agree. Most the things that check volc also check chardy, which is basically needed on any good BO or Balance team.
Volc goes for sweeps and Zard y goes for instant big damage, both are special attacking fire types which run coverage of the same types (Volc runs fire stab, quiver, Giga drain and hp ground while zard y runs fire stab, solar beam, scorching sands and roost. Volc can replace hp ground with psychic or bug buzz tho). It’s natural both will have overlapping checks.
IMO psychic terrain HO set is better, I’ve been 6-0’d by it while I can consistently deal with lead sets, was the team I was suing at the time of the 6-0 ill prepared? Probably, but do the teams I build keep DeoS hazard leads in mind? No. I often forget DeoS is something I need to prepare for, hazard leads are fine but the HO set, oh god I need to remember that in the team builder and prepare for it. It requires minimum prep too as well, like one psychic resist or dark type and ur good.
Other than that, I believe DeoS is fine, HO terrain sets aren’t that common on ladder atm from what I’ve experienced.
Well, RIP Deoxys...
I am not happy with how this suspect turned out so I will do what any sensible person does and start complaining on message boards!
I am genuinely surprised that this guy got banned (again). I didn't think that there was actually enough reason to ban it. It definitely didn't seem overwhelming nor did it enable anything to an unhealthy degree. Its measly base 95 Sp. Atk made it fail to get an OHKO on basically anything that isn't weak to psychic and if it wants to Nasty Plot it risks eating a U-Turn and losing a good chunk of HP in the process. It was also extremely prone to status as no one in the right mind would let it set up without consequence. Lead sets were also nothing noteworthy, but they were a form of hazard lead that actually beats Great Tusk (gee, heaven forbid we have one of those...). I don't think anything can convince me that Deoxys Speed was broken, if anything it felt like a skill check to the unprepared.
If any of the 42% Ban Voters happen to be reading this, I just want to talk to you... and don't mind my Tera Fire Choice Specs Chi-Yu in Sun, that's just there for persuasive purposes.
I am not happy with how this suspect turned out so I will do what any sensible person does and start complaining on message boards!
I am genuinely surprised that this guy got banned (again). I didn't think that there was actually enough reason to ban it. It definitely didn't seem overwhelming nor did it enable anything to an unhealthy degree. Its measly base 95 Sp. Atk made it fail to get an OHKO on basically anything that isn't weak to psychic and if it wants to Nasty Plot it risks eating a U-Turn and losing a good chunk of HP in the process. It was also extremely prone to status as no one in the right mind would let it set up without consequence. Lead sets were also nothing noteworthy, but they were a form of hazard lead that actually beats Great Tusk (gee, heaven forbid we have one of those...). I don't think anything can convince me that Deoxys Speed was broken, if anything it felt like a skill check to the unprepared.
If any of the 42% Ban Voters happen to be reading this, I just want to talk to you... and don't mind my Tera Fire Choice Specs Chi-Yu in Sun, that's just there for persuasive purposes.
rest in piss deoxys-speed lmao
looking forwards to a moon suspect since it's most likely the next pokemon to get looked at. I'm excited to see what it can do for the metagame since having an offensive pokemon with DD that is able to handle kingambit seems like a very nice pokemon for this metagame. Also there's the possibility it's just broken and it doesn't get freed but it will certainly be an interesting suspect
looking forwards to a moon suspect since it's most likely the next pokemon to get looked at. I'm excited to see what it can do for the metagame since having an offensive pokemon with DD that is able to handle kingambit seems like a very nice pokemon for this metagame. Also there's the possibility it's just broken and it doesn't get freed but it will certainly be an interesting suspect
If a mon as mediocre as Deo-S can't get unbanned, I really doubt Roaring Moon will get unbanned either lol.
Granted Deo-S suspect barely got any tractions, but the same arguably happened during the Roaring Moon suspect last time where I saw 0 people use Roaring Moon on the ladder (I think I saw more Deo-S's during this suspect than I did Roaring Moon's in the last suspect). I have very little reason to believe this Pokemon will be unbanned.
Yeah the Deoxys test made me kinda lose faith in our sense of democracy, but a Roaring Moon test is something I would really like to see.
I bet that the National Dex community would vote to ban Ledian just because it would be funny.
On that thought, let's suspect test Ledian just because it would be funny!
Oh yeah, and I think that the worst part about Deoxys getting banned is the fact that Dragapult now monopolizes the Speed industry. By that I mean that Dragapult is pretty much the fastest thing in OU by a mile, it would've been nice to have something to contend with it but it is what it is, as much as I absolutely despise the outcome.
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It's a shame that such an overrated mon like Deoxys-S wasn't unbanned even Dragapult and Zamazenta are more threatening and both are fine, it makes me think about the future for the other suspects tests, well, it was fun but disappointing, anyway I'll be on the lookout for the future of the tier.
Imo, if we can't handle having Deoxys-Speed around, a mon that I personally didnt even find annoying, in fact, one that I never lost too, then how do we expect to suspect test all those other mons you guys keep claiming that are gonna be fair and balanced in this current powercreep metagame. I mean, DeoS was a perfect candidate for that, and we neglected it, imagine Palafin, Mega Metagross, Annihilape being suspect tested only to be banned harder. If we wanna try to unban something, which I feel like the metagame is balanced with what we have btw, then there needs to be proper reasoning for it. Like how would it impact the meta, does it have answers, what sets are the most likely to pop up, what cores would it form, etc etc. Hopefully if we test out another mon, it is one we are confident enough to keep around.
RESURGENCE OF SNOW!!
Keep in mind before reading: I’m not looking forward to a rating, I’m just sharing an idea. Otherwise this would’ve been in the RMT sub-forum. It’s not in the team bazaar because it’s using a somewhat gimmicky concept.
Snow has always been an interesting weather to me, it’s far from notable compared to the other weathers and is easily the weakest, but that doesn’t necessarily mean that it can’t be disgustingly powerful. I know it would be far more fitting to have made this post yesterday (Christmas Day) as it would suit the occasion extremely well, but I didn’t get the idea to make a snow team, I did but it was late at night and I shouldn’t have been playing Pokémon. I finally made it today so, let’s go over. Snow gives a 50% boost to ice types in gen 9, and it enables fat mons with ice body. Snow really enables offensive threats like arctozolt and Kyurem, this hyper offense snow I made seems interesting. It’s part webs, part snow and part screens, yes it has screens, mainly aurora veil. I’m using alolan ninetales as my snow setter because no one is seriously going to use abomasnow. It’s part webs so even after Ninetales is fainted, arctozolt can be quite useful and still make holes. I’m using a specs set on Kyurem which has blizzard instead of ice beam. Arcotozolt is a mixed set with blizzard and bolt beak. Snow can be versatile, it can shut down other weathers and provide a powerful screen in aurora veil, it can have offensive Pokémon be surprisingly bulky and have them take hits. In fact I’m willing to say the only reason snow is not considered full gimmicky is because of aurora veil’s great effect. I am a sun enjoyer but I love snow equally, both are easily my favorite weathers.
I’m now gonna share a snow team I made, but I’m not sure whether that’ll be subforum misuse since it might be something which should be in the team bazaar, I’ve purposefully not mentioned a few mons on the team and their role to let this stay here. If so, please tell me and i’ll move it there, now here’s a comedically bad snow team:
https://pokepast.es/83a3b136b794ad45
I’m not a good team builder, use this at your own risk ^^^
Keep in mind before reading: I’m not looking forward to a rating, I’m just sharing an idea. Otherwise this would’ve been in the RMT sub-forum. It’s not in the team bazaar because it’s using a somewhat gimmicky concept.
Snow has always been an interesting weather to me, it’s far from notable compared to the other weathers and is easily the weakest, but that doesn’t necessarily mean that it can’t be disgustingly powerful. I know it would be far more fitting to have made this post yesterday (Christmas Day) as it would suit the occasion extremely well, but I didn’t get the idea to make a snow team, I did but it was late at night and I shouldn’t have been playing Pokémon. I finally made it today so, let’s go over. Snow gives a 50% boost to ice types in gen 9, and it enables fat mons with ice body. Snow really enables offensive threats like arctozolt and Kyurem, this hyper offense snow I made seems interesting. It’s part webs, part snow and part screens, yes it has screens, mainly aurora veil. I’m using alolan ninetales as my snow setter because no one is seriously going to use abomasnow. It’s part webs so even after Ninetales is fainted, arctozolt can be quite useful and still make holes. I’m using a specs set on Kyurem which has blizzard instead of ice beam. Arcotozolt is a mixed set with blizzard and bolt beak. Snow can be versatile, it can shut down other weathers and provide a powerful screen in aurora veil, it can have offensive Pokémon be surprisingly bulky and have them take hits. In fact I’m willing to say the only reason snow is not considered full gimmicky is because of aurora veil’s great effect. I am a sun enjoyer but I love snow equally, both are easily my favorite weathers.
I’m now gonna share a snow team I made, but I’m not sure whether that’ll be subforum misuse since it might be something which should be in the team bazaar, I’ve purposefully not mentioned a few mons on the team and their role to let this stay here. If so, please tell me and i’ll move it there, now here’s a comedically bad snow team:
https://pokepast.es/83a3b136b794ad45
I’m not a good team builder, use this at your own risk ^^^
Why did Deoxys-Speed need a 60% unban percentage? Shouldn't that be 50%+1 as per this thread, similarly to Palafin in regular OU?
I hate to be that guy but does this mean we will never test Deoxys Speed again?
Likely not, the most likely way is too swarm kyu’s house for one. (This is a joke)
More seriously tho, likely no suspect unless the community wants one REALLY BADLY.
nah just use ninjask bruh, talking about dominating the speed industry without even mentioning my boi.