This commercial is brilliant. To be honest Pokemon does appeal to me largely due to nostalgia, which sometimes undeservedly gets a bad connotation. But the truth is as a full grown adult, I don't play video games that necessarily appeal to adults only because as an adult I just have too many other responsibilities. If I choose to play a video game or even theorize about one, it's to escape back to feeling like a kid again. And Pokemon holds a good position as a franchise with just what it needs to lean in to that. And this commercial to your point is a perfect example of just that.
-
Welcome to Smogon! Take a moment to read the Introduction to Smogon for a run-down on everything Smogon, and make sure you take some time to read the global rules.
Little things you like about Pokémon
- Thread starter Kurona
- Start date
This commercial is brilliant. To be honest Pokemon does appeal to me largely due to nostalgia, which sometimes undeservedly gets a bad connotation. But the truth is as a full grown adult, I don't play video games that necessarily appeal to adults only because as an adult I just have too many other responsibilities. If I choose to play a video game or even theorize about one, it's to escape back to feeling like a kid again. And Pokemon holds a good position as a franchise with just what it needs to lean in to that. And this commercial to your point is a perfect example of just that.
Rereading the Yellow chapter of Adventures:
Lance: Ha! You're going to challenge me with a team of unevolved Pokemon? How ridiculous!
(a few pages later)
Blue: Ah, what a pity I didn't get a chance to use my ace-in-the-hole, my trump card, my clincher, my secret weapon... Snubbull.
Lance: Ha! You're going to challenge me with a team of unevolved Pokemon? How ridiculous!
(a few pages later)
Blue: Ah, what a pity I didn't get a chance to use my ace-in-the-hole, my trump card, my clincher, my secret weapon... Snubbull.
I don’t think there exists the degree of nostalgia for Gen 5 amongst the general public for them to remake the games… like I see motifs of the Gen 4 starters everywhere, people talk about Cynthia, Garchomp, the classic team members, but I don’t see parallels for Gen 5 Pokemon and bosses.
After Gen 4, the next source of nostalgia I see is Mega Evolutions. When I asked one of my students, he said his favorite game was Ultra Sun/Moon (he was 18 for reference).
There's plenty of general public love for Gen 5; I've seen it plenty over the years
Gameplay wise I routinely see people put BW1 or 2 as best in the series (similar arguments being made for every gen 1-5, funny how that works), or want them to do the BW1 thing of all new Pokemon again, or think they look the best or loving the climax or so on and so forth. Not just in niche smogon circles.
Characterwise...People love N
Japan fucking adores the train bros, and Ingo's appearence really spurred a more public love that the western community had been building.
Skyla & Elesa are extremely popular
I feel like Rosa, specifically, is also popular.
Yeah Cynthia's kind of outshining everyone compared to Alder or Iris (or, frankly, Steven, Lance, most champions in general really), but that says more about Cynthia than it does about anything else.
Every generation is a large group of people's favorites. There will always be a market for it and, as Pokemon appeals to everyone old & new, that market will also include people who never interact with or care about the older generations. They'll see oh new Pokemon and be one of 10+ million who just buy it for that reason.
Gameplay wise I routinely see people put BW1 or 2 as best in the series (similar arguments being made for every gen 1-5, funny how that works), or want them to do the BW1 thing of all new Pokemon again, or think they look the best or loving the climax or so on and so forth. Not just in niche smogon circles.
Characterwise...People love N
Japan fucking adores the train bros, and Ingo's appearence really spurred a more public love that the western community had been building.
Skyla & Elesa are extremely popular
I feel like Rosa, specifically, is also popular.
Yeah Cynthia's kind of outshining everyone compared to Alder or Iris (or, frankly, Steven, Lance, most champions in general really), but that says more about Cynthia than it does about anything else.
Every generation is a large group of people's favorites. There will always be a market for it and, as Pokemon appeals to everyone old & new, that market will also include people who never interact with or care about the older generations. They'll see oh new Pokemon and be one of 10+ million who just buy it for that reason.
Less than Gen 4. Which is why you see less merch, like I see Piplup, Chimchar, and Turtwig on a board game my mom grabbed for Christmas. I don’t see many gen 5 plushies or official merch around, comparatively.
Sylveon alone gets mentioned more than any Gen 5 mon, unless you’re talking about the competitive scene. IG this is all anecdotal evidence, but I bet if you counted fan art on r/Pokemon and their fan-made “Regional Forms/Paradox Forms” Gen 5 gets left out more frequently.
It’s very much an “internet game” where more dedicated fans are going to give it love due to its high quality. These people also coincidentally have more complaints about new games.
One of the ideas of remakes, is that they’ll modernize the gameplay, which would be unpopular with the crowd that likes B/W because they’d butcher some of the elements that made it special.
Oh one hundred percent. I’m just predicting in Gen 10, they’ll either revisit Kanto, Johto, or Kalos (for Megas specifically) instead because these people are more interested in those regions. And even if they do, it will do noticeably worse than BDSP in comparison to mainline titles.
Then again, I’d love to be wrong because I love the Generation, and I think their next remake will be a step up from BDSP.
Nostalgia for every generation is not equal. That’s why they’ll always return to Kanto more frequently. It’s not necessarily a linear decline from generation to generation. I’d say it’s 1 > 3 > 4 > 6/7 (S/M more for the game, Kalos more for the aesthetic) > 2 > 9 > 5 > 8.
Edit: now they did engage more with Gen 5 designs in Gen 9, so maybe I am off the mark more than I think. Hm.
Last edited:
The fossil/ghost missingno.
You know how Ditto's lore is that it's the most powerful pokemon because it can harness the power of all the others?
Fossing/ghost missingno does that in the games:
You can choose its typing and starting moves based on what pokemon you catch it with, but it does not learn any moves by level-up.
Its base stats and TM movepool change dynamically and are based on the last pokemon in your party, meaning it can effectively learn any TM.
This mon solves the pokégods' biggest weaknesses (no stab and no reliable recovery) and shows how Mewtwo is the perfect pokémon because you cannot make fossil/ghost missingno stronger than Mewtwo without using either its or the pokégods' stats.
It's even one of the few (or only) glitchmons ot have a unique non-garbled-mess sprite (only the front tho).
They never did anything like this in the future games, it's something that only exists in gen 1.
You know how Ditto's lore is that it's the most powerful pokemon because it can harness the power of all the others?
Fossing/ghost missingno does that in the games:
You can choose its typing and starting moves based on what pokemon you catch it with, but it does not learn any moves by level-up.
Its base stats and TM movepool change dynamically and are based on the last pokemon in your party, meaning it can effectively learn any TM.
This mon solves the pokégods' biggest weaknesses (no stab and no reliable recovery) and shows how Mewtwo is the perfect pokémon because you cannot make fossil/ghost missingno stronger than Mewtwo without using either its or the pokégods' stats.
It's even one of the few (or only) glitchmons ot have a unique non-garbled-mess sprite (only the front tho).
They never did anything like this in the future games, it's something that only exists in gen 1.
Gen 4 also had a really good reason to see a recent influx of merchandise. Personally speaking when I go to the store and go down the toy aisles just to see what's going on, I see a mix of Pokemon with an understandable bias towards recent releases.
Speaking of, the TCG is about to launch a set with N as a headliner and is getting a "all unova pokemon are here" set around June.
Sylveon alone probably gets more mentioned than most generations of Pokemon because it's an eevee (heck it probably gets more mentions than Leafeon & Glaceon, comparatively), but I wouldn't necessarily say more people like Gen 6 overall because of it, you get me? (Nor am I saying Gen 6 is unpopular, to be clear)
I think writing off the internet entirely is a bit weird, so I guess that wipes out anything I've noticed. Like look I don't doubt that the people you speak with in real life might prefer other generations, but if we're going off that sample pool as the oen that counts then I rarely see Pokemon talked about publicly in real life at all (& the one notable time I did was a guy who wanted them to just keep updating the game to have every region in it which was. something, alright.). & obviously you & I both know that would be insane to use as evidence as anything.
It's why I specified I see discussion of Gen 5 outside of the context of niche adults complaining about a series they haven't liked but still play for some reason in about a decade. I've seen plenty of passive love for Gen 5 over the years.
I don't think they would keep going back to the gen 5 well if people didn't like it.
I do not think this would upset the BW crowd any more than it would upset any other fans of their games. Honestly I usually see people upset they didn't update enough.
I agree that nostalgia isn't equal, but I do not think it is so unequal to believe that a game would be so unpopular that they would pass on it forever. Even gen 8!
They also engaged more with gen 5 designs in Gen 8.
I'm not really agreeing with your ranking here either, but I think that gets to the heart of this: it's very subjective based on anecdotal experience & our interpretations of that. Personally it's why I'm also hedging that broader appeal is always present and that a game will generally always sell enough to be worth while; nothing about Gen 5 is SO unpopular to never touch again, nor is it so sacred that they would never dream of besmirching it like some others think*.
If they pass on it entirely, I think it will just be because they want to reign in the release schedule, want to step away from remakes and/or felt they had a cooler idea for a follow-up to a different generation (ie: they liked whatever is planned for Z-A, but honestly to an extent you can say the same for having Let's GO squeezed in before BDSP happened). And even then I don't see it be skipped forever.
*the only game I think GF sees as sacred cow is Gen 1 and this mostly feels represented in being extra weird about Pokemon availability and clocks. Honestly I fully expect a BDSP-styled Gen 1 game somewhere down the line. Perhaps gen 10, like you say! It is the big anniversary after all.
Talking about caves in the favorite game thread reminded me about how when Indigo Disk came out I watched a buddy play it and I was completely blown away by Chargestone Cavern. It's so sprawling and deep, so filled with items, Pokemon and strong trainers. What a spectacular reimagining of the source material, like damn they're capable of making 3D caves at this level? Please give Reflection Cave this treatment, I wanna play through something like this without having to shell out $90
I could see them referencing the E4 rooms a bit for the underground; there's bound to be theme overlap so may as well pull on some of those ideas. "referencing the game we're not actually remaking, but in a round about way" also feels...right, if that makes sense. (e: in fact they do the same thing with the distortion world by having it be the backdrop for the restricted legendary fights!)
Distortion World feels a bit too distinct from Area Zero for me to see the influence. Beyond being a "different kind of world for the climax" (much more literal with DW than AZ, mind) and "enter through the hole on a mountain" (well, giant crater in the middle of a mountain range) it's very different in aesthetic, presentation, how you go through it and background inspiration.
Bit of a shame we don't go into it in L:A actually. Would have been interesting to see what they could do with the concept in a proper 3D Space....on the other hand it probably would have been a disaster to actually play....
SV's caves honestly aren't bad overall. The one near Tulip's town and the entire Glaseado mountain complex are surprisingly vast and Glaseado in particular is easy to get lost in. There's even, like, jumping puzzles.
Kitakami's interior cave system is also pretty neat.
I mean it's SV so all these caves are very janky; the jump puzzles are hard to get a handle on and the closeness of the walls means the camera can get sticky. But all in & all fun little areas to explore. Love the giant sudden drop from the top of the mountain to the pool of water where feebas spawns.
Last edited:
This was an interesting watch
I like seeing Pokemon Centers outside of cities and towns, particularly in the early generations. Counterintuitively, I think they make their regions feel more like a rugged wilderness, like "we're not building a settlement, but we recognise that it's challenging out here, dangerous even, so we've constructed an outpost for travellers". Healing NPCs obviously serve the same purpose, but from an in-universe perspective they feel less intentional, although they do effectively convey the idea that the Pokemon world is kind and community-oriented, even amongst strangers.
Later regions tend to feel much more widely settled and in the Switch era we get almost immediate access to fast travel, so even when a Pokemon Center is nominally outside a town or city, it doesn't give me that same feeling that I've arrived at an oasis.
Later regions tend to feel much more widely settled and in the Switch era we get almost immediate access to fast travel, so even when a Pokemon Center is nominally outside a town or city, it doesn't give me that same feeling that I've arrived at an oasis.
Playing Gen 7 (Moon) for the first time right now (I am late, I know…) and while there are quite some aspects that bother me (sooo many trade evolutions in the dex…sloooow cutscenes), something that I think is quite neat is the difficulty so far. Maybe it’s just my team composition (difficulty in Pokemon can be super dependent on what you have. Olivia was incredibly easy for me because Mudbray solo) but there have been some fights were I struggled. Maybe it’s just earlygame, idk. I do want to stress that EXP share is off and I have banned the use of revives in battle, and I do try to not let Mons get KOd despite this not being a Nuzlocke (at this point it’s more of a habit haha)
Totem WishiWashi almost wiped me because nothing but Magnemite could damage him or Alomomola enough, and Magnemite is too frail.
Some random trainers Sylveon also caught me off guard since Magnemite was once again too frail and everything else did not do enough damage, leading to almost complete team destruction.
Totem Lurantis… actually defeated me. 4/6 Mons got oneshot by Solar Blade (Makuhita, Brionne, Mudbray, Misdreavus), Magnemite dies to 2 Solars or Weather Ball, and Salandit can only take like 2 physical attacks from Trumbeak and Formeo. Evolving Makuhita and a T-Wave-Hex combo did the trick but these Totems don’t mess around, especially once they call their support. I like that. These games will probably be really though when I nuzlocke them eventually…
Totem WishiWashi almost wiped me because nothing but Magnemite could damage him or Alomomola enough, and Magnemite is too frail.
Some random trainers Sylveon also caught me off guard since Magnemite was once again too frail and everything else did not do enough damage, leading to almost complete team destruction.
Totem Lurantis… actually defeated me. 4/6 Mons got oneshot by Solar Blade (Makuhita, Brionne, Mudbray, Misdreavus), Magnemite dies to 2 Solars or Weather Ball, and Salandit can only take like 2 physical attacks from Trumbeak and Formeo. Evolving Makuhita and a T-Wave-Hex combo did the trick but these Totems don’t mess around, especially once they call their support. I like that. These games will probably be really though when I nuzlocke them eventually…
I'm in a similar situation, down to the same version of the game. I don't know if I even like the game, but I'll give it the fact the boss battles are excellent fun. I mentioned it in passing in another thread, that this feels like a game where you're meant to shift your team around based on
upcoming matchups. I also play w/o xp share, but have 9-12 Pokemon I rotate in and out of my lineup depending on the next boss. I haven't wiped but I did cheat on a non-totem battle on the first island and use a revive. I avoided wiping until the ghost totem, but that took a few tries. You're gonna really like that one.
also on the note of trade Pokemon in the dex, you can chain some of them which is annoying, and there may be people in your area still playing unlike some of the earlier gens
I also love how the Pokemon look: I usually prefer sprites but they do look genuinely cool in 3d, much better than the Switch titles.
I agree. There's a lot I want to nitpick, but after watching the video, I can't help but agree: the Hoenn Pokemon were introduced in a way that made them stand out and feel fresh, without having to completely let go of the old guard. Sometimes I feel like that works against the games, as I don't like all of the designs, and many of the Pokemon were weak, but I still associate them with specific locations. I'm more forgiving to Platinum and Johto's dex than most, but especially Platinum didn't do a great job highlighting the additions to it.
And by the time we get to Sun/Moon, well half the Pokemon hyped up by the game are from a different region, and only 30 percent of encounters are new. I think it's tough because at this point Game Freak decided that what people want is to play with a bunch of fan favorites so we'll have to catch Pikachu and Gyarados and friends every time, but there's nothing you can do about that.
On the subject of nitpicking, I have no problem with Dugtrio and Magneton, I am actually strongly against the idea that every type should be represented equally in a dex, I think Black and White's "derivative" designs were simply meant as direct homages and there's nothing wrong with that, the Johto stuff is fine in context, I think the whole Geodude vs Aron thing was slightly poorly reasoned even tho I don't disagree... but I wish we'd see more like Hoenn and hearing it in this context helped me appreciate the region more.
Morty and Pryce in Gen 2 were literally just two dudes wearing t-shirts.
Gen 2 Brock probably takes the crown for most "dude wearing t-shirt". Literally just a white T-Shirt. Pryce is at least wearing stripes and Morty's black shirt goes with his purples for the ghost aesthetic.
Morty and Pryce in Gen 2 were literally just two dudes wearing t-shirts.
I'm the same but for houses. The NPCs inhabiting these places usually come across as complete kooks and quite often will say something like "I haven't had a visitor in who knows how long!" because they've been obsessively dedicating themselves to some niche pursuit or other. Kanto actually has a bunch of these considering how urban it's characterised as, but its routes tend to be quite large so when you find a house like this it genuinely feels quite isolated and like a little respite from the outside world. Often with regions with less space like Johto and Alola they end up just feeling like they're on the outskirts of whatever town is nearest (like the Daycare in both regions) even though there's a lot of large, isolated locations to explore in both of those places.
Interestingly despite being larger regions Hoenn and Sinnoh actually don't have a lot of these. Most of the ones which are there tend to be residences of significant characters like Lanette or the Berry Master rather than randomers. Unova of course has caravans on a bunch of routes which is one of many little details I like about that region, and it also has a couple of little buildings here and there which are clearly dedicated rest stops for travellers or workers since they just contain a few bunk beds. Made the place feel so much more alive to me.
I think it's pretty cool how the tie-in media has recently started doing big, unprompted celebrations for individual old regions. Just recently we've gotten:
-A Gold & Silver 25th anniversary merch line
-TCG Pocket doing a Sinnoh set as its first major expansion
-Trademark leaks saying a Unova set with all 156 for the physical TCG is coming in a few months
In the past they've never done this kind of stuff unless it's A) Kanto, B) tying into a remake/new project or C) part of a broader franchise celebration that goes through every region e.g. the Sitting Cuties plush line
-A Gold & Silver 25th anniversary merch line
-TCG Pocket doing a Sinnoh set as its first major expansion
-Trademark leaks saying a Unova set with all 156 for the physical TCG is coming in a few months
In the past they've never done this kind of stuff unless it's A) Kanto, B) tying into a remake/new project or C) part of a broader franchise celebration that goes through every region e.g. the Sitting Cuties plush line
little bit of like little bit of annoyed but ill just leave it all in this thread
the slugma egg you get from primo in hgss is really nice. getting access to a pokemon you would otherwise have to wait until kanto to catch regularly before you even face the first gym is really cool and its something i always pick up and use whenever i play through those games. although i have zero clue how you're actually supposed to figure out the codes to get the eggs without using an external website.
the other two eggs on the other hand are a bit of a let down. mareep and wooper are both pokemon you can find in the wild grass just south of violet city which makes their eggs rather pointless when they could have been used to give players access to other late game pokemon like with the slugma egg.
the slugma egg you get from primo in hgss is really nice. getting access to a pokemon you would otherwise have to wait until kanto to catch regularly before you even face the first gym is really cool and its something i always pick up and use whenever i play through those games. although i have zero clue how you're actually supposed to figure out the codes to get the eggs without using an external website.
the other two eggs on the other hand are a bit of a let down. mareep and wooper are both pokemon you can find in the wild grass just south of violet city which makes their eggs rather pointless when they could have been used to give players access to other late game pokemon like with the slugma egg.
Last edited:
I'm not that hot on ORAS as remakes (though I would like to replay them sometime - need a good challenge run idea...) but goddamn if they didn't have some gorgeous visuals for some of the gyms. In general I really like what was done with the gyms in ORAS, the redesigns felt tasteful and didn't stray too far from the feel of the originals. (Except Mossdeep's, which stinks.) I'm also quite partial to the gym theme in those games, I've always found RSE's rather forgettable.
Sootopolis also gets an additional point for changing up its trainer rosters so that the trainers in there actually use suitably strong and evolved Pokemon like Starmie, Ludicolo, Golduck, and Wailord instead of all the Goldeen, Luvdisc, and Azurill they used in RSE (Mossdeep, to its credit, also does add a lot more diversity than the original games had). It's a shame Fortree's trainers couldn't have been a bit more interesting and that Petalburg keeps its shitty lineup, but I've ranted extensively about why Petalburg Gym is awful on this forum already.
Sootopolis also gets an additional point for changing up its trainer rosters so that the trainers in there actually use suitably strong and evolved Pokemon like Starmie, Ludicolo, Golduck, and Wailord instead of all the Goldeen, Luvdisc, and Azurill they used in RSE (Mossdeep, to its credit, also does add a lot more diversity than the original games had). It's a shame Fortree's trainers couldn't have been a bit more interesting and that Petalburg keeps its shitty lineup, but I've ranted extensively about why Petalburg Gym is awful on this forum already.
I had a friend come over for my birthday and when I wanted to show him my team in Pokémon X I remembered they congratulated you for your birthday at the Pokemon Center, and we both agreed that was a pretty nice and heartwarming addition that got to stay. I recently found out that in japanese XY and ORAS they used a more traditional Birthday song, it's so pretty, I never heard this one before in the games' soundtrack.