Metagame USUM Pure Hackmons

[Yourself]

Some problems.

So...you say MAud is bad because of it's matchup into Sunsteel and Special Photon. Special Photon I will give you, Muk-A does do a better job of walling that. However, then we get into Sunsteel. I can't think of a Huge Power Mon that doesn't 2HKO MukA with Sunsteel.

Also both melo and AMuk will die to most HP SS users (like MAud) so its Steel weakness doesn't matter that much, and special attackers using poison coverage won’t hit anything aside MAud so it’s pretty MU dependent.

i said "like muk and melo you lose to all huge power attackers because they all carry sunsteel and/or photon". i never said it's sunsteel weakness makes it worse i just said it loses to every huge power mon, as do muk and melo so that wasn't really intented to be a point against it. i was more so saying that muk and melo individually are better special walls then maud.

Anyway, the main thing I want to talk about it the meta itself. The meta actively evolves to counter whatever WG mons are used the most. Muk-A only seems better because people are not accounting for it as much as they are MAud. If Muk-A becomes more of a meta threat then MAud, then suddenly every physical Mon will be running T-Arrows, and now Muk-A is no longer a issue.

it doesn't matter whether every physical mon is running t arrows because it doesn't wall those mons anyways, which is the same reason maud's sunsteel weakness isn't a huge deal.

Also, another thing, item slots. Muk-A has three items realistically it can run. Shed Shell ensures it doesn't just die to every STag Mon, Air Balloon to not lose on sight to No-Guard Fissure, and Safety Googles for clear reasons. MAud, on the other hand, doesn't need Air Balloon ever, and unlike Muk-A, is far harder to STag because of just how bulky it is.

balloon muk is fake anyways you'd rather want innards for fissure and i don't see how muk having to pick between shed shell or goggles is any different to maud. muk runs goggles, oh then you die to stag pdon and potential perish trap bs. maud runs goggles, oh you die to stag sss and that same perish trap bs. how is this a point in maud's favour?

As well, being immune to Moongeist is generally better then being immune to Photon, as Moongeist is much more common as coverage/STAB.

but muk resists geist anyways? the only time that is a downside is dawn wing's z move, which isn't even an ohko at +2 and then dies to knock. muk still walls all those same mgeist users (including the ones with poison), earth power isn't really used and it gets to wall special photon. specially muk is the better wall.

Also, Poison is more or less only ever seen on MGar, and even then they won't always run it. All of this is a long way of saying that MAud will almost always be the #1 WG mon, just because of how resilient it is to the meta around it. Muk-A, while good, is not as resilient as MAud.

Edit: The fact that some mons will run Special Poison moves is actually a showing of MAud domination as a WG. Think about it, what does Poison hit in this format other then MAud? Xerneas? M-Garde? Poison hits next to nothing other then MAud, and yet, it is even a consideration. People don't just run T-Arrows for Muk-A. They run it for all the Steels like M-Aggron, M-Steelix, Doublade, and Heatran, just to name a few. People don't run Knock Off for just Meloetta. It also hits Doublade, M-Slowbro, NDW, and NDM, just to name a few. Compare this to stuff like Sludge Wave, which hits nothing good other then MAud. There is a reason M-Gar run it. Because MAud is extremely good.

"People don't just run T-Arrows for Muk-A. They run it for all the Steels like M-Aggron, M-Steelix, Doublade, and Heatran, just to name a few." ok but for mgeist users earth power is pretty pointless outside of muk as you already hit like doublade and mlix with mgeist, and i've already established the physical side doesn't matter as both lose to every huge power ever, so how is muk any less resiliant to the meta? you can however make that argument with melo bc it gets fucked over by pursuit and bug buzz hits other things specially outside of itself.

- it tanks Mold Breaker moves better than AMuk and Melo (both physical and special)

physically muk, melo and maud die to huge power so it's a non factor, but if you did wanna go down that route maud has the sunsteel weakness and the other to resist/are immune to photon. what matters is what they wall specially. maud can't wall special photon where as muk and melo can which is already a big deal. muk walls all the same mgeist users maud does and gets to wall ones with poison. yes melo being weak to bug buzz hurts but it tanks a boosted bug buzz from most things (with mmy it's a 25% ohko) and fires back with spec thief whereas maud just drops to boosted mgar sludge wave (the main poison user really) so it's not terrible and melo is still overall a better special wall then maud.

- it is not weak to Fissure

i acknowledge muk's fissure weakness is an issue but what i said in my post is i still think muk is better regardless of this due to just being a better wall specially by itself.

- it is pretty slow which is great

this applies to melo, not muk, good melo teams usually makes up for it with slow team mates who aren't weak to bug like ferro.

edit:
spamton instead of ha ha reacting to my post why don't u take the time to reply to me and prove urself right

 

[Guysmash]

physically muk, melo and maud die to huge power so it's a non factor, but if you did wanna go down that route maud has the sunsteel weakness and the other to resist/are immune to photon. what matters is what they wall specially. maud can't wall special photon where as muk and melo can which is already a big deal. muk walls all the same mgeist users maud does and gets to wall ones with poison. yes melo being weak to bug buzz hurts it tanks a boosted bug buzz from most things (with mmy it's a 25% ohko) and fires back with spec thief whereas maud just drops to boosted mgar sludge wave (the main poison user really) so it's not terrible and melo is still overall a better special wall then maud.

I don’t understand the 1st part, why would any MBreaker user use modly moves ? Except for weird coverage
Outside of MMY and UNecro no one runs photon so being immune to it is cool but uh hey, others do it like Yveltal or MGyara.
For MGeist immunity you may prefer MAud to avoid Bug Buzz becasue only MGar runs it and with MGeist AND Sludge Wave it won’t be able to deal damage to blob/dark type/zygarde depending of its coverage so walling it isn’t much a big deal.

i acknowledge muk's fissure weakness is an issue but what i said in my post is i still think muk is better regardless of this due to just being a better wall specially by itself.

If you want a special wall but don’t care about OHKO weakness just run a blob then

this applies to melo, not muk,

Melo is the most likely to become #1 WG, it won’t happen to muk due to its Fissure weakness so underspeeding melo is really important, moreover it also under speed things such as MPert or MSci which Melo doesn't (and melo and muk is a tie)

 

[ZeldaFan1]

but muk resists geist anyways? the only time that is a downside is dawn wing's z move, which isn't even an ohko at +2 and then dies to knock. muk still walls all those same mgeist users (including the ones with poison), earth power isn't really used and it gets to wall special photon. specially muk is the better wall.

If you are willing to discount Earth Power for being rare, Poison moves must also get that same discount, because they are also rare. As well, Muk-A cannot switch in on NDW if they already smashed. Even if they do switch in on the smash, there is still a mind game to be played. If they switch out, the Knock Off does nothing and they can continue to pressure the Muk-A. Remember, if the Muk-A ever gets under 78%, it no longer can withstand NDW.
(+2 252+ SpA Necrozma-Dawn-Wings Menacing Moonraze Maelstrom vs. 252 HP / 252 SpD Muk-Alola: 326-384 (78.7 - 92.7%) -- guaranteed 2HKO)
As well, Muk-A cannot always run Knock Off. Something like Pursuit is, in my experience, more common then Knock Off on Muk-A. And, if you switch in on the Shell Smash, and predict them to switch out, and they don't, Muk-A dies.
(252 Atk Muk-Alola Pursuit (40 BP) vs. -1 252 HP / 252 Def Necrozma-Dawn-Wings: 256-304 (64.3 - 76.3%) -- guaranteed 2HKO)
On the other hand, MAud can completely ignore this the vast majority of the time, as it is completely immune to Moongeist. Don't get me wrong, Muk-A is good. It just has more quarks that have to be dealt with in teambuilding then the other good WG mons.

 

[Guysmash]

ok but for mgeist users earth power is pretty pointless outside of muk as you already hit like doublade and mlix with mgeist

This is absolutely true but special photon users could run eartpower : it deals with muk and steel stuff (252+ SpA Sniper Mewtwo-Mega-Y Earth Power vs. 252 HP / 252+ SpD Steelix-Mega on a critical hit: 492-579 (138.9 - 163.5%) -- guaranteed OHKO

252+ SpA Sniper Mewtwo-Mega-Y Earth Power vs. 252 HP / 252+ SpD Muk-Alola on a critical hit: 474-561 (114.4 - 135.5%) -- guaranteed OHKO) and will probably use bug Buzz + set up move. In these cases I really think MAud is one of the best WG to counter that

 

[Yourself]

I don’t understand the 1st part, why would any MBreaker user use modly moves ? Except for weird coverage
Outside of MMY and UNecro no one runs photon so being immune to it is cool but uh hey, others do it like Yveltal or MGyara.
For MGeist immunity you may prefer MAud to avoid Bug Buzz becasue only MGar runs it and with MGeist AND Sludge Wave it won’t be able to deal damage to blob/dark type/zygarde depending of its coverage so walling it isn’t much a big deal.

my bad i read it wrong. yes maud is better into mold breaker mons ur right.

If you want a special wall but don’t care about OHKO weakness just run a blob then

wg blobs have the weakness of dropping to secret sword, and you don't hard wall mmy and all u can do is whirlwind it so it isn't a 100% reilable special photon check. nobody has really ran these but you probably could run them yeah.

Melo is the most likely to become #1 WG, it won’t happen to muk due to its Fissure weakness so underspeeding melo is really important, moreover it also under speed things such as MPert or MSci which Melo doesn't (and melo and muk is a tie)

melo is more vunerable to the meta due because bug buzz hits things other then itself and pursuit is a move that exists. as for muk, people make the fissure weakness out to be the most detrimental thing ever. most teams want innards nowadays as it's hard to fit answers to all the huge power bs, and surely getting to wall special photon and mgeist users even with poison is worth having to sack innards to fissure in certain mu's and struggling to the rare pursuit + fissure, so idt it's a big deal.

 

[Guysmash]

wg blobs have the weakness of dropping to secret sword, and you don't hard wall mmy and all u can do is whirlwind it so it isn't a 100% reilable special photon check. nobody has really ran these but you probably could run them yeah.

I meant Innards blobs, if the oppo uses sacred sword it’s probably a MGuard and other mons could then wall it once you know it isn’t a threat

melo is more vunerable to the meta due because bug buzz hits things other then itself and pursuit is a move that exists. as for muk, people make the fissure weakness out to be the most detrimental thing ever. most teams want innards nowadays as it's hard to fit answers to all the huge power bs, and surely getting to wall special photon and mgeist users even with poison is worth having to sack innards to fissure in certain mu's and struggling to the rare pursuit + fissure, so idt it's a big deal.

I see what you mean but if your team is weak to hp stuff, then sacrificing your Innards for NGuard is probably a bad idea, this is why you'd prefer MAud/Melo/MGyara and others

worth having to sack innards to fissure in certain mu's

Yeah, melo and muk can be better than MAud but it’s MU dependent (or at least WG core dependent) overall MAud is still better because more consistent

 

[Yourself]

If you are willing to discount Earth Power for being rare, Poison moves must also get that same discount, because they are also rare.

you said muk was more vunerable to the meta bc of t arrows so i literally just asked how is muk being weak to special ground any different to maud being weak to special poison when on special attackers ground and poison ks only useful for muk and maud.

As well, Muk-A cannot switch in on NDW if they already smashed.

ok and? this shouldn't be happening and this applies for like any mon if u don't hard wall the sweeper.

Even if they do switch in on the smash, there is still a mind game to be played. If they switch out, the Knock Off does nothing and they can continue to pressure the Muk-A.

muk underspeeds and parting shots on most wgs, and slower stuff like mbro doesn't come in on knock.

Remember, if the Muk-A ever gets under 78%, it no longer can withstand NDW.
(+2 252+ SpA Necrozma-Dawn-Wings Menacing Moonraze Maelstrom vs. 252 HP / 252 SpD Muk-Alola: 326-384 (78.7 - 92.7%) -- guaranteed 2HKO)
As well, Muk-A cannot always run Knock Off. Something like Pursuit is, in my experience, more common then Knock Off on Muk-A. And, if you switch in on the Shell Smash, and predict them to switch out, and they don't, Muk-A dies.
(252 Atk Muk-Alola Pursuit (40 BP) vs. -1 252 HP / 252 Def Necrozma-Dawn-Wings: 256-304 (64.3 - 76.3%) -- guaranteed 2HKO)

then ur just gonna have to play better and not let it get chipped. as well as a team builder if ur running pursuit you should have another mon that answers dawn wings like zygod.

On the other hand, MAud can completely ignore this the vast majority of the time, as it is completely immune to Moongeist. Don't get me wrong, Muk-A is good. It just has more quarks that have to be dealt with in teambuilding then the other good WG mons.

this is the only time mgeist being a resist comes into play and outside of this 1 mon muk is generally a better geist wall then maud bc it can wall mgar more reliablely, and it gets to wall special photon too. the "quirk in the builder" most of the time is you need innards, but nowadays innards is close to mandatory anyways and imo the benefits from muk are worth the fissure weakness.

 

[Yourself]

I meant Innards blobs, if the oppo uses sacred sword it’s probably a MGuard and other mons could then wall it once you know it isn’t a threat

innards blobs are supposed to be sacked why would they be ur primary special wall?

I see what you mean but if your team is weak to hp stuff, then sacrificing your Innards for NGuard is probably a bad idea, this is why you'd prefer MAud/Melo/MGyara and others



Yeah, melo and muk can be better than MAud but it’s MU dependent (or at least WG core dependent) overall MAud is still better because more consistent

the point i have been making the full time is the benefits of muk are worth the harder but more rare mu's where u need to sack innards to fissure. usum teambuilding is just picking ur weaknesses but when i use muk it's better then maud more often then not so you could make the argument muk is more consistent.

 

[Guysmash]

innards blobs are supposed to be sacked why would they be ur primary special wall?

Nah, not like main spe wall but as muk they tank spe and die to fissure (ofc muk will still be better at walling spe)

the point i have been making the full time is the benefits of muk are worth the harder but more rare mu's where u need to sack innards to fissure. usum teambuilding is just picking ur weaknesses but when i use muk it's better then maud more often then not so you could make the argument muk is more consistent

Yeah I got that but I still think MAud is more consistent than AMuk. It also depends on where you play. I may be wrong but I think you play more on tours and me on ladder. Due to the bs ladder MAud is way more consistent, for tours it’s surely a whole other debate

 

[Ransei]

Good evening USUM Hackmons thread, tonight I have two things to post about. Firstly, I went into collecting all the replays of USUM PH games that were played in PHPL and assembled them into generating usage stats for them. Here are the PHPL usage stats for USUM PH during PHPL. Take these as you may.

+ ---- + ------------------- + ---- + ------- + ------- +
| Rank | Pokemon             | Use  | Usage % |  Win %  |
+ ---- + ------------------- + ---- + ------- + ------- +
| 1    | Mewtwo-Mega-X       |   60 |  47.62% |  53.33% |
| 2    | Blissey             |   48 |  38.10% |  45.83% |
| 3    | Chansey             |   41 |  32.54% |  65.85% |
| 4    | Kartana             |   38 |  30.16% |  60.53% |
| 5    | Zygarde-Complete    |   38 |  30.16% |  47.37% |
| 6    | Groudon-Primal      |   36 |  28.57% |  36.11% |
| 7    | Audino-Mega         |   35 |  27.78% |  42.86% |
| 8    | Mewtwo-Mega-Y       |   34 |  26.98% |  44.12% |
| 9    | Slaking             |   32 |  25.40% |  50.00% |
| 10   | Slowbro-Mega        |   28 |  22.22% |  53.57% |
| 11   | Gengar-Mega         |   27 |  21.43% |  55.56% |
| 12   | Yveltal             |   19 |  15.08% |  26.32% |
| 13   | Gyarados-Mega       |   17 |  13.49% |  64.71% |
| 14   | Meloetta            |   15 |  11.90% |  40.00% |
| 15   | Pheromosa           |   12 |   9.52% |  66.67% |
| 16   | Muk-Alola           |   11 |   8.73% |  45.45% |
| 17   | Rayquaza-Mega       |   11 |   8.73% |  63.64% |
| 18   | Greninja-Ash        |   11 |   8.73% |  81.82% |
| 19   | Scizor-Mega         |   10 |   7.94% |  40.00% |
| 20   | Doublade            |    9 |   7.14% |  55.56% |
| 21   | Heatran             |    9 |   7.14% |  44.44% |
| 22   | Arceus              |    8 |   6.35% |  50.00% |
| 23   | Celesteela          |    8 |   6.35% |  25.00% |
| 24   | Diancie-Mega        |    8 |   6.35% |  37.50% |
| 25   | Ho-Oh               |    7 |   5.56% |  57.14% |
| 26   | Sableye-Mega        |    7 |   5.56% |  71.43% |
| 27   | Necrozma-Dawn-Wings |    6 |   4.76% |  33.33% |
| 28   | Deoxys-Attack       |    6 |   4.76% |  33.33% |
| 29   | Hoopa-Unbound       |    6 |   4.76% |  66.67% |
| 30   | Steelix-Mega        |    6 |   4.76% |  50.00% |
| 31   | Lopunny-Mega        |    5 |   3.97% |  40.00% |
| 32   | Kyogre-Primal       |    5 |   3.97% |  40.00% |
| 33   | Necrozma-Dusk-Mane  |    5 |   3.97% |  40.00% |
| 34   | Lunala              |    5 |   3.97% |  80.00% |
| 35   | Solgaleo            |    4 |   3.17% |  75.00% |
| 36   | Kyurem-White        |    4 |   3.17% |  50.00% |
| 37   | Marowak-Alola       |    4 |   3.17% |  25.00% |
| 38   | Ferrothorn          |    4 |   3.17% |  50.00% |
| 39   | Dialga              |    4 |   3.17% |  50.00% |
| 40   | Deoxys-Speed        |    4 |   3.17% |  25.00% |
| 41   | Regigigas           |    3 |   2.38% |  66.67% |
| 42   | Giratina-Origin     |    3 |   2.38% |  33.33% |
| 43   | Necrozma-Ultra      |    3 |   2.38% |   0.00% |
| 44   | Beedrill-Mega       |    3 |   2.38% |   0.00% |
| 45   | Gardevoir-Mega      |    2 |   1.59% |  50.00% |
| 46   | Guzzlord            |    2 |   1.59% |  50.00% |
| 47   | Zeraora             |    2 |   1.59% |   0.00% |
| 48   | Excadrill           |    2 |   1.59% | 100.00% |
| 49   | Metagross-Mega      |    2 |   1.59% |  50.00% |
| 50   | Articuno            |    2 |   1.59% |   0.00% |
| 51   | Kyurem-Black        |    2 |   1.59% |  50.00% |
| 52   | Swampert-Mega       |    2 |   1.59% |   0.00% |
| 53   | Heracross-Mega      |    2 |   1.59% |  50.00% |
| 54   | Xerneas             |    1 |   0.79% |   0.00% |
| 55   | Darmanitan-Zen      |    1 |   0.79% | 100.00% |
| 56   | Aggron-Mega         |    1 |   0.79% |   0.00% |
| 57   | Marshadow           |    1 |   0.79% | 100.00% |
| 58   | Froslass            |    1 |   0.79% |   0.00% |
| 59   | Landorus-Therian    |    1 |   0.79% | 100.00% |
| 60   | Oranguru            |    1 |   0.79% |   0.00% |
| 61   | Incineroar          |    1 |   0.79% |   0.00% |
| 62   | Tyranitar-Mega      |    1 |   0.79% |   0.00% |
| 63   | Aerodactyl-Mega     |    1 |   0.79% | 100.00% |
| 64   | Escavalier          |    1 |   0.79% | 100.00% |
| 65   | Stakataka           |    1 |   0.79% | 100.00% |
| 66   | Magearna            |    1 |   0.79% | 100.00% |

You can check out the HPL Usage Stats thread to see how they compare to the usage stats during our first Hackmons Premier League, a separate tournament that happened from late August to early October of last year.

Here are all the PHPL replays as well that I used to generate this: https://pastebin.com/NXmqymvF feel free to tell me if I got something wrong.

Secondly comes an accouncement.

I've been deleting a lot of one-liner posts as of recent so I want to remind you all that this thread is not to be treated like the Pure Hackmons room or Discord. casual one-liner posts and discussions can go in the room or the discord but the threads are meant for constructive posts that may add something meaningful to the overall discussion given in them. Please do not use this thread to post casual one-liners or unconstructive posts. It otherwise becomes disruptive to the overall quality of the thread. If you want to respond with a short one-liner post use the Pure Hackmons room or Discord to do so and feel free to tag who you're replying to (upon their permission). That is all. Have a good night.

 

[Eyeos]

Personal wg vr
Not ranked within tier

Why wonder guard vr instead of regular vr?

The regular vr as a lot more pokemon that I have no experience whatsoever so I don’t think I should make a vr for it rn (also I can’t decide where to put haft the pokemon).

I would like to preface that I’m mostly basing my opinion on latter experiences but I’ve played pretty much every notable player using serious teams also I wouldn’t really change much if I was exclusively playing against top talent (honestly I like running more goofy stuff vs serious competition but that’s just me). I’m also mostly balance/stall player who doesn’t use innards very often so if I’m wrong about some offensive stuff uh whoops.

A+
It’s audino they have the type combo with unique weaknesses so u can run it with everyone it’s sunsteel weak which does matter sometimes but it’s fine.
I think Meloetta is slightly better for offensive structures with 1 wg or 2 wg where one of them is offensive along with the rest of the team when compared to audino but audino is better at balance so in my opinion they don’t have a big enough gap for a tier difference.
A
This is mostly because nobody is running fighting moves on their moon sweepers so this is pretty good right now probably going to change it if fighting becomes more common.
It’s pretty good nothing special really it lets your mmx run all the moves that make you opponents cry, it has an ok offensive set and pursuit is pretty cool tech I guess.
Very cool pokemon but it has problems mostly in its item selection. Air ballon means you don’t lose to fissure instantly but it means nothing at all in some matches. Dark z means that trick moon users don’t force you to 50/50 between clicking recovery or killing what’s in front of you but you lose to spore moon users more often and ur fissure weak. Safety goggles mean you don’t lose to spore but you do lose to trick and fissure. Shed shell means you don’t lose to shadow tag as often but I think you get the point by now. Because moon users can break muk sometimes it means they will if you don’t have the right items and that’s the main thing holding muk back because it always has a lot more variance in its performance compared to its competitors but it still works most of the time.
Slowbro beats sunsteel and physical photon, sometimes it doesn’t, very cool pokemon (idk what to put here).
A-
Free spore immune is very nice. Being immune to t spikes is very nice. Slow pivot is very nice. Fire and fighting weak is not nice. It’s also not that bulky but it’s serviceable.
This is just mega gyarados but less versatile. Can do some cool tech but can also get pp stalled by zyguard and needs to run a billion coverage move. It still can just win games sometimes but that’s becoming more and more rare still good do.
YEA HEATRAN IS A- WHAT ABOUT IT. I’m probably biased but being once of the best sunsteel checks is very nice and Groudon losing means heatran keeps winning. It also beats harvest Slack pretty consistently if u run the right move and lava plume is also a really disgusting move
Ash greninja with a new coat of paint it does the same things as ash greninja, it has the same problems as ash greninja, it has more power but loses speed and that’s about it.
B+
I’m running out of ways of saying steel type wg good but this one is a flying type so that’s cool I guess
My problem with this mon is that it fits on very few teams so while it does give value on those teams it’s very rare
Scizor has the problem of being ferro but a little worse it functions fine enough I guess
It’s slowbro but it takes moon better and isn’t ghost weak I guess but usually loses to the same thing slowbro loses to and mmx now kills u which really sucks.
I don’t use this much but it has good results so I trust it being here
B
I hate this thing but it works fine as a nitch anti photon tech
regigigas too, idk what this has over arceus besides bluffing that you have a better set or using recycle which takes a billion years to sweep
Rocks weak really sucks but it’s still pretty ok as a pokemon beating moon and sunsteel decently
Can be run it has its nitch and I’ve seen it work occasionally but it’s still dies to a lot
C
there’s a couple better wg I left off this list but my sheer disappointment with this thing makes it on this list because it has so much potential but really it just loses 1v1 to steelix or Groudon because of waves or arrows so it’s just really not good.

I realized I didn’t rank guru it’s ugly that is all

 

[ItzEmanBoss]

Mewtwo-Mega-X @ Dread Plate

This is a post that has been around for a little bit now but I revised it because why not and I saw this, wowee! I took inspiration and used Dread plate MMX for a bit and realized. Isn’t spooky plate better? Because you don’t hit imp MMX for super effective or other MMX, Melo gets 2koed by HP Sunsteel which is decently common on MMX and Spooky plate already hits all the psychic and ghost types for super effective that dread plate also hits. I feel like the only reason you would use dread is to hit Melo switches and to chip innards blis.

 

[ZeldaFan1]

Aggron-Mega

Are people finally realizing that M-Aggron is kinda saucy? It has less weaknesses then M-Steelix, very similar bulk, and resists Ice and Sunsteel and Photon, unlike Zygarde. Obviously, Zygarde is much more bulky overall, but M-Aggron is kinda sick. Also, on that note, why is M-Steelix so constantly higher then M-Aggron in VRs? Ground Steel is just kinda worse then pure Steel the vast majority of the time, and the bulk is not that different between them.

 

[Yourself]

Are people finally realizing that M-Aggron is kinda saucy? It has less weaknesses then M-Steelix, very similar bulk, and resists Ice and Sunsteel and Photon, unlike Zygarde. Obviously, Zygarde is much more bulky overall, but M-Aggron is kinda sick. Also, on that note, why is M-Steelix so constantly higher then M-Aggron in VRs? Ground Steel is just kinda worse then pure Steel the vast majority of the time, and the bulk is not that different between them.

mlix gets t waves stab but it's worse at walling kart bc it's neutral to grass so maggron is better if ur not running t waves pretty much. where u rank them really just depends on how important u think t waves is and most people end up putting magg a full subrank below mlix, but i don't use t waves as often as other ppl so i ranked them closer.

 

[ZeldaFan1]

mlix gets t waves stab but it's worse at walling kart bc it's neutral to grass so maggron is better if ur not running t waves pretty much. where u rank them really just depends on how important u think t waves is and most people end up putting magg a full subrank below mlix, but i don't use t waves as often as other ppl so i ranked them closer.

But both M-Aggron and M-Steelix get STAB on Anchor Shot. So why not just use that on M-Aggron over using T-Waves on M-Steelix?

 

[Yourself]

But both M-Aggron and M-Steelix get STAB on Anchor Shot. So why not just use that on M-Aggron over using T-Waves on M-Steelix?

overall im pretty sure t waves just hits more and the stuff you are trying to wall harder (like kart) but i've never gave it that much thought

 

[AV Cosmoem]

No Guard ​

no guard needs proper representation. no guards get boxed into like 1 or 2 sets constantly, or 1 or 2 mons. this is not how you use no guard. no guard is best at taking unexpected KOs, and people need to learn how to build around that again


stop running me (Lopunny-Mega) @ Focus Sash
Ability: No Guard
EVs: 248 HP / 252 Def / 252 SpA / 252 SpD / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Sheer Cold
- Sing
- Gastro Acid
- Stealth Rock

people have got to stop running this set and thinking they're serving... does it work sometimes? yes. but is everyone going to expect it and play around it? yes. if you are expected, you are losing, full stop. this set gets dicked by a whole manner of popular offensive mons and moongeist immunity is the only thing keeping it alive in that mu. mmy and priority just own you, especially since you're weak to the two most common -ates. people who claim that mlop outspeeds 130s so it's good need to be serious. none of the 130s are running +spe right now. anything 115 and up has a sufficient speed tier for fast ng. if you win with this and think the set is good because of it, you need to stop and realize that everything with ng can win games


1100s teas (Deoxys-Speed) @ Focus Sash
Ability: No Guard
EVs: 248 HP / 252 Def / 252 SpA / 252 SpD / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Sheer Cold
- Sing
- Gastro Acid
- Stealth Rock

honestly i'd run this before mlop nowadays, it's better into offense bc you don't autolose to mmy. typing's really bad though, and it's just as obvious as mlop, so don't run this either

so who are good ngs? literally everything else.

Fast No Guards

see something you disagree with in there? a mon who you think is unviable as a no guard? you are in a box. none of these are unviable no guards. there are no unviable no guards in this game. you can lose to sheer cold mray and scream about how unviable it is in phcord; does that change the fact that you were taken by surprise, so the opponent got a free kill? this is how no guard is supposed to work. there are ngs that are worse than others, that's for sure, but thinking linearly in terms of viability is how you become a 1500 ladder balance hovercraft

Slow No Guards

anything unviable in this slot? nobody would ever use these as ngs, right? i'm sure something will stick out on this list that will make you go, "wtf, nobody would ever run that as a no guard when there are so many better sets! literally nobody runs that!" if you said that to any mon on this list, you are in a box. stop thinking that mons are "above" no guard. everything can run no guard, and everything can be good at running no guard, because the only thing that makes this ability good is surprise. the key is not speed, it is not power, it is not bulk. it's surprise. it's the opponent not expecting the ohko move

all of these as no guards are, in fact, "better" than mlop and deo-s, because think about it: if a doublade is in vs your mmx and you have a wg and a bouncer in the back, who are you switching to first? if you said wg, you're lying to yourself. all you're going to think about in that moment is prank wow, and then you're going to lose your bouncer, and that is exactly how you use ng: you lure threats that you don't want in this game, and you remove them. suddenly they're a mon down. perhaps you eliminated something that was walling your sweeper, or you took out their breaker that threatens your whole team, or you got rid of their speed control. either way, your opponent's "unviable" set that "nobody runs" just paved an extremely easy path for their victory. think pragmatically when building

 

[aidan amoongus]

But both M-Aggron and M-Steelix get STAB on Anchor Shot. So why not just use that on M-Aggron over using T-Waves on M-Steelix?

thousand waves stab is imo to just hit harder-anchor shot legit works the same
the only reason why you would use mega steelix over mega aggron for stab twaves is trying to get a cheeky ko onto an unsuspecting alolan muk or for big damage. this is why i run twaves on zygod a lot if i have a harvest slaking answer so i dont need to run core for the last slot
imo its not important because better players will not just switch a muk and let it sit in front of a zygod/msteelix/aggron, and if they do, im pretty sure twaves doesnt ko, and it just does a lot of damage, and they likely have shed shell

personally i like steelix over maggron but they do pretty much the same job-to wall hp kart
imo grass on kart is usually less rare? so thats not a concern for walling hp kart bc usually on mg and and ng kart run grass stab. i also feel like steelix walls physical attackers better in general but its an opinion. tho tbf putting steelix one rank entirely over maggron is dumb imo they do the same thing, and twaves stab costing 1 entire rank is dumb

 

[Guysmash]

No Guard ​

no guard needs proper representation. no guards get boxed into like 1 or 2 sets constantly, or 1 or 2 mons. this is not how you use no guard. no guard is best at taking unexpected KOs, and people need to learn how to build around that again


stop running me (Lopunny-Mega) @ Focus Sash
Ability: No Guard
EVs: 248 HP / 252 Def / 252 SpA / 252 SpD / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Sheer Cold
- Sing
- Gastro Acid
- Stealth Rock

people have got to stop running this set and thinking they're serving... does it work sometimes? yes. but is everyone going to expect it and play around it? yes. if you are expected, you are losing, full stop. this set gets dicked by a whole manner of popular offensive mons and moongeist immunity is the only thing keeping it alive in that mu. mmy and priority just own you, especially since you're weak to the two most common -ates. people who claim that mlop outspeeds 130s so it's good need to be serious. none of the 130s are running +spe right now. anything 115 and up has a sufficient speed tier for fast ng. if you win with this and think the set is good because of it, you need to stop and realize that everything with ng can win games


1100s teas (Deoxys-Speed) @ Focus Sash
Ability: No Guard
EVs: 248 HP / 252 Def / 252 SpA / 252 SpD / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Sheer Cold
- Sing
- Gastro Acid
- Stealth Rock

honestly i'd run this before mlop nowadays, it's better into offense bc you don't autolose to mmy. typing's really bad though, and it's just as obvious as mlop, so don't run this either

so who are good ngs? literally everything else.

Fast No Guards

see something you disagree with in there? a mon who you think is unviable as a no guard? you are in a box. none of these are unviable no guards. there are no unviable no guards in this game. you can lose to sheer cold mray and scream about how unviable it is in phcord; does that change the fact that you were taken by surprise, so the opponent got a free kill? this is how no guard is supposed to work. there are ngs that are worse than others, that's for sure, but thinking linearly in terms of viability is how you become a 1500 ladder balance hovercraft

Slow No Guards

anything unviable in this slot? nobody would ever use these as ngs, right? i'm sure something will stick out on this list that will make you go, "wtf, nobody would ever run that as a no guard when there are so many better sets! literally nobody runs that!" if you said that to any mon on this list, you are in a box. stop thinking that mons are "above" no guard. everything can run no guard, and everything can be good at running no guard, because the only thing that makes this ability good is surprise. the key is not speed, it is not power, it is not bulk. it's surprise. it's the opponent not expecting the ohko move

all of these as no guards are, in fact, "better" than mlop and deo-s, because think about it: if a doublade is in vs your mmx and you have a wg and a bouncer in the back, who are you switching to first? if you said wg, you're lying to yourself. all you're going to think about in that moment is prank wow, and then you're going to lose your bouncer, and that is exactly how you use ng: you lure threats that you don't want in this game, and you remove them. suddenly they're a mon down. perhaps you eliminated something that was walling your sweeper, or you took out their breaker that threatens your whole team, or you got rid of their speed control. either way, your opponent's "unviable" set that "nobody runs" just paved an extremely easy path for their victory. think pragmatically when building

Because of such things I'm scared of NGuard Scarf melo, fake dumbguard (Pure fire/electric) with NGuard and many others

This post is absolutely right and the biggest strength of top players is their ability to win mindgame
Therefore surprising them with a random NGuard is always good : they lose a (probably) needed part of their team + they lose confidence which is very useful for later mindgames

(I will be scared of going on ladder without 4 WGs at least now)

 

[Mewtwo's Greatest Soldier]

No guard Kyurem-White did my taxes and paid for my mortgage, very cool set.

Anyways other than that I'd like to point out how MMX spam singlehandedly increased the gengar usage and how this is easily countered by the ultimate anti-pbond mghiest team, SLAKING SPAM

https://pokepast.es/0b1c0436978e7d45 (shoutout ANinjaDude)

This team is very consistent in beating pbond gengar because of the power of not caring whether or not it presses it's big STAB moves as it finds itself pursuit trapped, smashed around by coverage, and generally having a bad time. It also has a good matchup into hyper offenses that don't have psyspam because of the spam of fakespeed.

Aside from the slaking spam, pursuit huge power slaking has a legitimate niche on mmx spam for the 100% guarantee kill on pbond gengar if you simply read it or sack a mon.

This concludes the anti regigigas propaganda.

 

[splodge]

I ended up scrapping my personal VR, mainly because I lost my draft after writing about 15 mons, which was very demotivating. So instead, I'm just gonna share my opinions on every mon on the VR and some other thoughts.

Still the GOAT of PH. Could maybe be in S+ but I don't want to start an argument this early on.
Basically Chansey but a bit worse. If you're running Imp and you're not Eviolite it doesn't really matter which blob you choose, and on HO teams with no other improofing Blissey is a better Innards. Otherwise use Chansey.
(WG) Balance has definitely fallen off, but WG should still stay in S imo.

Wonder Guard Viability Rankings

First of all, I realized several days ago that it's now been over 1 year since USUM had its permaladder. First of all, happy belated 1st year anniversary to the Gen 7 Pure Hackmons permaladder. It's been a wonderful time so far with lots of new developments made. I hope this continues as we move forward.

I'm using this opportunity to create a new post I've had in mind since. I apologize for how messy this post is. I've been having my thoughts on it scattered around all week and struggled with trying to piece it all together.

Earlier I said I've already said I had nothing new to say about Mega Audino in the Gen 7 Pure Hackmons metagame but after reflecting on the VR changes made as of recent, some things have struck me. Here's what's possibly my final bout of me rambling about Mega Audino in Gen 7 Pure Hackmons. I believe I've already said everything else I needed to say, making future posts about it redundant.

Given my explanation over why I found Mega Audino to be the best Wonder Guard in the metagame, I'm here explain a core reason Mega Audino finds itself in the specific circumstance it's in and why Mega Audino can never truly fall off despite Sunsteel Strike, Searing Sunraze Smash, or other moves Mega Audino does not serve well against being present everywhere in the metagame.

Hardcounting Wonder Guard Mega Audino goes two ways.

1) You either spam Poison-type moves in the game and get walled by a bunch of different Pokémon, whether they're Steel-types, Zygarde-Complete, or other Wonder Guards, as Poison-type coverage only ever exists for Mega Audino and is not great against anything else ever. Even for Poison chip damage.
2) You go out of your way to spam high power Sunsteel Strike or Searing Sunraze Smash alongside coverage, making virtually no Wonder Guard a consistently suitable wall.

You cannot successfully hardcounter Mega Audino teams as much as possible without more than just Mega Audino being punished as a Wonder Guard.

Mega Audino should not be harshly punished for losing against Searing Sunraze Smash or Light That Burns The Sky attackers because

Calcs

252+ Atk Huge Power Mewtwo-Mega-X Searing Sunraze Smash vs. 252 HP / 252 Def Muk-Alola: 604-711 (145.8 - 171.7%) -- guaranteed OHKO
252+ Atk Huge Power Mewtwo-Mega-X Searing Sunraze Smash vs. 252 HP / 252 Def Meloetta: 595-700 (147.2 - 173.2%) -- guaranteed OHKO
252+ Atk Huge Power Mewtwo-Mega-X Searing Sunraze Smash vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Arceus: 405-477 (91.2 - 107.4%) -- 43.8% chance to OHKO
Neutrally effective Wonder Guard Pokémon do not survive +0 itemless Searing Sunraze Smash from Mega Mewtwo X

+2 252+ Atk Huge Power Mewtwo-Mega-X Light That Burns the Sky vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Slowbro-Mega: 447-527 (113.4 - 133.7%) -- guaranteed OHKO
+2 252+ Atk Huge Power Mewtwo-Mega-X Light That Burns the Sky vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Steelix-Mega: 367-432 (103.6 - 122%) -- guaranteed OHKO
Resisted Wonder Guard Pokémon do not survive Huge Power Light That Burns The Sky Mega Mewtwo X after 1 Shell Smash or Extreme Evoboost
+2 252+ Atk Huge Power Kartana Searing Sunraze Smash vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Slowbro-Mega: 432-508 (109.6 - 128.9%) -- guaranteed OHKO
+2 252+ Atk Huge Power Kartana Searing Sunraze Smash vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Steelix-Mega: 354-417 (100 - 117.7%) -- guaranteed OHKO
Resisted Wonder Guard Pokémon do not survive Searing Sunraze Smash Kartana after 1 Shell Smash or Extreme Evoboost

On top of the calcs above, the most heavy attackers in this game have a very small window of Pokémon being able to wall their move at all, allowing them to run specific coverage moves to target whatever opposing Wonder Guard would come closest to being able to overcome them.

If Kartana raises up in usage, Mega Audino should not be punished, because no Wonder Guard takes the best Kartana sets very well.
If Z-Moves rise up in usage, Mega Audino should not be punished, because no Wonder Guard handles Z-Move attackers very well and the few that could survive in particular circumstances can be overwhelmed by coverage that could easily fit into their set.


Mega Slowbro tends to be used as a wall for Mega Mewtwo X and Kartana, but there are plenty of Huge Power Mega Mewtwo X who run Bug-type moves and more Kartana as of late running Grass-type attacks. Additionally, Mega Slowbro's 5 weaknesses leave it vulnerable to Mega Mewtwo X running a large variety of coverage options for it.

Mega Audino's biggest weaknesses just happen to be the very moves designed to take down all Wonder Guards. When it's not this, it's moves that do nothing against any other Wonder Guard Pokémon, portraying a bigger opportunity cost than running other types of coverage. While Mega Audino is weak to Sunsteel Strike, the greatest Wonder Guard Pokémon who take the move neutrally do not switch into a Huge Power Sunsteel Strike. Otherwise, Mega Audino tends to be bulky enough to find chances of switching into non-Huge Power Sunsteel Strike off most attackers. In addition, Mega Audino's overall bulk is notably higher than every other great defensive Wonder Guard Pokémon in the metagame when Defense and Special Defense are factored, allowing it to take its weaknesses better than non-Sunsteel/Poison weak Wonder Guard Pokémon could take their own weaknesses. While Sunsteel Strike is everywhere, managing Sunsteel Strike isn't as overbearing as Alolan Muk managing Ground-type moves, Meloetta managing Dark-type or Bug-type moves, or Mega Slowbro managing many Grass, Bug, Electric, Ground, and Ghost-type moves. All of which are also very common.


Meloetta is weak to Dark-type moves and Bug-type moves. The latter has become very common as many of the top Wonder Guard Pokémon are weak to Bug. Dark-type attacks are not as common and Meloetta in particular is not a very strong presence in the metagame. However, if it ever becomes significantly problematic, there is little stopping teams from running the valuable Pursuit alongside Bug-type moves. This would stop Meloetta from being able to switch out, punish it significantly with Sunsteel Strike and Bug-type attacks, and render Meloetta significantly less effective as a Pokémon.


Alolan Muk is weak to Ground-type moves. Fissure is now what I'd argue to be the best OHKO move in the metagame due to its merits in hitting and defeating Alolan Muk teams over what Sheer Cold could otherwise do. Flying-type Pokémon are immune to Fissure, but can be counteracted by Zap Cannon and are otherwise not too great of Pokémon in USUM Pure Hackmons altogether. It is rare to see a Flying-type Pokémon serve high effectiveness in this game from what I've seen. Alolan Muk is forced to run Air Balloon in order to overcome Fissure, which is a liability of its own because it makes the Wonder Guard prone to Spore and prone to Shadow Tag Primal Groudon simultaneously. The Air Balloon is also not very difficult to pop in most games as many teams have either Moongeist Beam or Sunsteel Strike somewhere to hit Muk. Once Air Balloon is popped, Alolan Muk is vulnerable to Fissure from No Guard Pokémon and Thousand Waves from the best defensive Pokémon in the game. These combined liabilities are what Mega Audino does not have to go through. While Alolan Muk has the supposed advantage of not being weak to Sunsteel Strike, it hates getting hit by Sunsteel Strike despite this and cannot switch into its best users very effectively. I'd argue it hates Sunsteel Strike more than certain sets of Mega Audino even.


One major error I've seen personally is people trying to rank Wonder Guards based on their physical prowess; particularly, in terms of handling Mega Mewtwo X. Ranking Wonder Guards by how well they can take on Mega Mewtwo X is a fool's errand. If you try to do this, the best Wonder Guard of today would be the worst Wonder Guard by next Tuesday. Let's be real; this is Huge Power Mega Mewtwo X. If a Wonder Guard Pokémon just happens to tick it off a little bit more than the rest, Mega Mewtwo X will go through every coverage move in the book to ensure that Wonder Guard doesn't get a chance to breathe until it becomes less relevant. Mega Mewtwo X in high level gameplay can, will, and should run moves to take down any Wonder Guard they feel is a big enough threat to the team Mega Mewtwo X is in. Not doing so is either a skill issue on the builder or proves the Pokémon was not a great enough threat to concern Mega Mewtwo X in the first place.

Many less powerful Searing Sunraze Smash Pokémon, Light That Burn The Sky, Photon Geyser, and Sunsteel Strike Pokémon exist, which harm Mega Audino more than Wonder Guard Pokémon below it, but these Pokémon are more manageable by other walls in general until they run more extreme, more viable sets. Additionally, unlike any other Wonder Guard, Mega Audino can also pair very well with just about any other wall. I find one of the primary things that make Mega Audino a cut above the rest are its unique weaknesses and overall bulk. Mega Audino serves a better chance of sealing in wins as it can pair with many Pokémon who take Poison-type and Steel-type moves while also not being weak to anything extra, such as Bug-type pivoting moves, Dark-type utility moves, or the load of coverage options the likes of Mega Slowbro and Mega Gyarados can suddenly get nuked by.

There's a message I'm trying to convey in all of this, but I'm honestly not sure I made it understandable enough, so I'm cutting right to the chase here:

If Mega Audino falls off, all of Wonder Guard falls off. There is no specific way for Mega Audino alone to fall off as the very moves that target Mega Audino are the same moves that target all Wonder Guard Pokémon and no Wonder Guard Pokémon can be consistently relied upon to fight back against those moves without struggling due to brute coverage. Major non-Wonder Guard walls such as Zygarde-Complete, Mega Steelix, Doublade, and perhaps even Fur Coat Mega Slowbro are better at dealing with Photon Geyser, Sunsteel Strike, and their Z-Move counterparts than any Wonder Guard Pokémon is. Alongside this, Innards Out has shown to be a suitable replacement for Wonder Guard when given to Chansey or Blissey, making teams not need a Wonder Guard Pokémon in some cases. The best Wonder Guard Pokémon in this metagame should primarily focus on walling Moongeist Beam and to a more limited degree, special Photon Geyser. They should also focus on preventing their team from losing to OHKO moves as these moves hit everything except for Wonder Guard and Sturdy Pokémon. Walling these moves is their primary job and what they do best in the metagame. That being said, if you are running a Wonder Guard at all, it is usually best to run two Wonder Guard Pokémon. The dual-Wonder Guard archetype remains dominant enough in the metagame to still place Wonder Guard itself in S rank.

Tl;dr: The best moves that cause Mega Audino to fall off affect  every Wonder Guard simultaneously, making things worse for every Wonder Guard if more Pokémon run stronger moves to fight off Mega Audino.

Now because Mega Audino falling off cannot be done without Wonder Guard falling off as a whole imo, I see Mega Audino as a pure reflection of Wonder Guard itself in the Gen 7 Pure Hackmons metagame. This isn't something any other Pokémon could achieve so here's a quote I have prepped up for this:

"Mega Audino is the health of Wonder Guard. The weaker Mega Audino is, the weaker Wonder Guard is in the metagame."

but then you also have this quote from dramlamb
"Wonder Guard is the health of Hackmons. The weaker Wonder Guard is, the less competitive the metagame." -dramlamb

So you know what this means?

"Mega Audino is the health of Hackmons. The weaker Mega Audino is, the less competitive the metagame." -Ransei

This logic only applies to Gen 7 Pure Hackmons specifically and it's not exclusively tied to Mega Audino, but also some of the metagame's other great defensive units such as Chansey, Blissey, Zygarde-Complete, Doublade, and more. This exclusively ties to Mega Audino under Wonder Guard but multiple Pokémon outside Wonder Guard also glue this metagame together.

Despite Mega Audino being the health of Wonder Guard and a reflection of it, I can justify Mega Audino being on A+ as no Wonder Guard in this metagame is perfect. Mega Audino is still in need of partners to take on its weaknesses oftentimes and there are plenty enough Wonder Guard cores you could get away with without having Mega Audino involved. Mega Audino isn't extremely dominant in the metagame, which would otherwise consistently justify an "S" rank, but Wonder Guard as a presence is extremely dominant through the use of 2 per standard team in order to counteract No Guard.

I still agree with this.
Offensive sets have fallen off but are still decent for improofing on HO. Defensive sets are still pretty good imo.
idk i think i've only used cursed sets on this
One of the most overrated WGs for me, imo Fissure weakness (Fake Balloon is pretty much useless since many Fissure mons run Sunsteel or Moongeist) and mediocre physical bulk is crippling enough for it to drop a subrank or two.
idk
idk i've barely used it but good phyical wall ig
Offensive sets are super fake but defensive sets are good, mainly because Moongeisters often drop Aura Sphere/Secret Sword for coverage for MAud/Melo/Muk/maybe some other stuff I missed
Idk why but this feels like an absolute godsend on ladder, but not in high level play so it can probably stay where it is.
idk i haven't used non-meme sets since before most people agreed it fell off
Imo it hasn't really got any worse, but it kinda fell off because of how good other sets are.
Mostly worse Melo, idk where I would rank it though.
Arceus but trades special bulk for being able to pass Wishes, slightly slower pivoting (still not that slow) and a stat that barely matters. Wishpassing is the only reason I would keep this ranked.
idrk i think i only used it on that same team with the meme hoopa
Overrated, other abilites are better.
idk it's decent ig but i think i only used it on that no guard melo team
^ (except I haven't used it on a team with funni defensive mon and it can run offensive sets)
i think i only used it on that fullpass team but with delibird over monke because christmas so idrk but it's decent ig
When has anyone used this ever? Still can probably stay ranked though.
idk i think i've never used this
^
I used to think offensive sets were fake but I don't think that any more, and defensive sets are underrated. Can probably move up a subrank or two.
Arceus but frailer and Slaking but can't Wishpass. Shouldn't be ranked imo.
idk
I've used this like once and it's not great but still has a niche.
idk
psychic sweeper idk about #4
Has anyone ever used this outside of Cats and Rabbits? Idk why this is still ranked.
idk but it's weak to sheer cold so shouldn't be higher
Why is this ranked
I'm gonna get cancelled for talking about this
beats some mmx sets ig? fissure weakness sucks for a defensive wg though

Aggron with different typing ig? Idrk why this is ranked

I don't really have many opinions on this, still the best offensive mon though.
I don't really have many opinions on this, still the best defensive mon though.
Found this a bit fraudulent for quite a while as it hates Knock Off and walls basically zero special attackers, can probably drop a subrank or two.
Thank you, Akira, for discovering a set my whole RMT completely loses to. Anyway, it's very good, versatile and probably the best special attacker.
Fell off but idk whether I would drop it or not.
2nd best Huge Power, possibly the best No Guard, and great HO support. This is not biased.
Great Huge Power, Harvest sets destroy unprepared teams, and is the mascot of the best PHPL team (maybe biased).
probably drop it a subrank idk
There are three types of people in this world: those who think it should be ranked close to Steelix, those who think it should be ranked much lower, and those who don't know. I am the third type.
Haven't seen this very much in a while, it can probably drop.
The bunny has been receiving the same hate Deo used to, and I have thought it's around B+ for a while, but it's still the best standard No Guard, and maybe some other sets could work. I also can't really talk about it badly since I am in the bunny cult.
Does this really have a main set? (ok maybe protean.) Anyway, it's very versatile and can probably get away with running random stuff nobody has used before.
Mostly worse Slaking but still has a niche, can probably stay where it is on the VR.
idk
Kinda fraudulent. Solganium Z is the only reason to run it over Kartana (unless you're running a non-Huge Power set), and you'd probably rather run Solgaleo for better bulk and outspeeding Modest Scarf MGar at +2. Some other sets are still usable though.
idk i've barely used it but good phyical wall ig
Kartana but trades power, speed and Grass for bulk, not being weak to Fighting, having STAB Photon (which barely matters tbh) and being able to run Solganium Z. Pretty good.
That one Prankster set beats my RMT but I've barely seen or used it, and idk what else it really does.
Can probably raise a subrank imo, Psypam is MU fishy but it's still pretty good on non-Psyspam HO.
idk i haven't used this for ages
Innards is trash but Harvest is pretty good, idk if it should stay in B+ though.
I'm not gonna talk about Innards because i haven't used it much ~~and Ransei will cancel me~~ but it's decent at running other sets that bluff Innards.
Pretty much NDM but trades Solganium Z for outspeeding Scarf MGar at +2. Can probably drop a subrank or two.
STag has fallen off a bit but Mold and Triage are ok-ish so it can probably stay where it is.

Probably the main thing I have a decent chance of getting cancelled for, so I'm making this a button.

Such a fraud. Its 26% winrate in PHPL is a bit like Solgaleo in HPL: people using terrible sets. Offensive sets are either worse MGyara/Ashgren (which still aren't great), or deal zero damage and are just bad. Some defensive and Magic Guard support sets are decent though, so it can still stay above C rank.

Best Psyspam lead but Psyspam is MU fishy and has fallen off, and there's basically no reason to run it over MMY/Deo-A if you're not Psysurge, so it can probably stay where it is.
The fact it has to run Band to OHKO MMX is a bit problematic, but at least your opponent can't use Innards to KO it if you click your STAB.
No Guard only really works as a HO lead and is otherwise bad, but other sets like Comatose and Mold Breaker are good enough for it to stay where it is imo.
Basically MMX but worse in every way, except it gets STAB FImp which is great for revenge killing with Huge Power, and STag is probably usable. Sadly the iconic PBond Heracross sucks.
Basically a slightly stronger Lunala if you don't want to run or bluff Innards, but it has the same problems as NDM. Idk where I would rank this.
Basically a worse MMX that can run Ultranecrozium Z. STag and Harvest are probably usable though.
I think only Ransei and Beast Mode Pikachu has really used this (I did once but it wasn't the best team, and I didn't use it very much), so idrk how good this is.
MHera but trades power and bulk for lots of speed (and the ability to run mixed sets ig). Can probably rise.
I haven't seen this for so long, and I don't really know how good it is since it only really works on stall, which I never use.
Basically HarvSlak but trades power and being able to safely KO some Innards mons for special bulk and Type: Null but fast and can run a different item. Normalise exists too. I have barely seen or used this though.
Imo it's best on HO/Offense as a reliable No Guard answer/improof, but it's pretty bad if your opponent doesn't have a standard No Guard or Imp.
Slower and weaker MMY with Fairy STAB ig? I haven't seen this very much, but it's still probably decent.
Another fraud, it barely does its job a lot of the time and its typing is bad for an Innards. There aren't many cases where you would rather run this over a blob.
i'm getting tired even though it's 11am so i'm gonna start saying idk for ones idk about again
what does this guy do
Probably better than MBane because it can hit hard without having to run Band, and while Shadow Sneak doesn't OHKO MMX, Fake Out can solve this issue.
I used to praise No Guard Lizard, and STag sets exist, but sadly both seem to have been overhyped.
idk
idk
idk
idk
mold is really funny but other than that, idk
idk

Other thoughts:
These 3 were used quite a bit in PHPL and other people have explained why they should be ranked. I will not explain because I'm getting tired.
I think this can probably be ranked, it's kinda like Deo-S but it has decent bulk and defensive typing, and STAB Zap Cannon with decentish SpA for No Guard.
i think this is my 4th time making a forum post saying it's nothing more than a noobtrap and will never be viable in any way and should be blacklisted even though it "tEcHnIcAlLy HaS a TiNy NiChE"

 

[Guysmash]

idk

If you don’t know just read my thousand posts about this dude and you will understand it’s underrated af (or just use it in a proper team)

 

[aidan amoongus]

MMY Setpedia (personal)​

Hello, I'm a person who doesn't use MMY a lot. Mostly its because I have no idea what ability to run, so I made this compilation of MMY sets that I've seen. If you have any advice, feel free to let me know.

Here it is: https://pokepast.es/1104ed94cc082991

Edit 1: to those of you receiving a notification that i posted something in the old gens thread i am terribly sorry i posted this there by accident

 

[Guysmash]

MMY Setpedia (personal)​

Hello, I'm a person who doesn't use MMY a lot. Mostly its because I have no idea what ability to run, so I made this compilation of MMY sets that I've seen. If you have any advice, feel free to let me know.

Here it is: https://pokepast.es/f02f1cb8ca0474f4

Edit 1: to those of you receiving a notification that i posted something in the old gens thread i am terribly sorry i posted this there by accident

Imo for the offensive Innards (even if I've never seen the set) you could set clanging scales (the dragon offensive move) to hit Zyg and lower MMY’s Def
For the MGuard set, it looks correct but imo DeoA is better because it can run physical photon to kill Innards blob and losing only 1 stat is SpA

 

[aidan amoongus]

Imo for the offensive Innards (even if I've never seen the set) you could set clanging scales (the dragon offensive move) to hit Zyg and lower MMY’s Def
For the MGuard set, it looks correct but imo DeoA is better because it can run physical photon to kill Innards blob and losing only 1 stat is SpA

Deoxys-Attack is another user for Magic Guard, I'm aware, yet IMO, MMY's better bulk makes it more outstanding

also in order for me not to shitpost for like 10 times, I'll put edits in my original post