I do understand this but I think it should be considered at least for the simple changes moves like BP. After all is this really any different than carrying over movepools from za? We don't have any idea if those changes will be kept or not, it seems just as likely they will keep the buffs to moves as they will movepool changes (more likely in some cases, like obviously they're not keeping fissure on golurk) so I think it makes sense to carry over the buffs
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Pet Mod Legends Z-A OU
- Thread starter dhelmise
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I do understand this but I think it should be considered at least for the simple changes moves like BP. After all is this really any different than carrying over movepools from za? We don't have any idea if those changes will be kept or not, it seems just as likely they will keep the buffs to moves as they will movepool changes (more likely in some cases, like obviously they're not keeping fissure on golurk) so I think it makes sense to carry over the buffs
I think the "no" was quite explicit and that Runo and the rest of the council already got bombarded enough with system change requests that have been very clearly ruled out on several occasions.
Some Pokedex entries reference moves, like Dragonite referencing Extreme Speed with how fast it is.Base: Flame Body
Mega Heatran dex entry: its body is really really really hot! you can't approach it! it's really hot I swear! Ouchie if you touch it! oh and I guess it lives underground sometimes
Smogon: mmmmh yes, Earth Eater
Never change, never change
Plus, plenty of Electric and Psychic megas reference some Surge of Electric/Psychic powers. Yet none of them have Electric/Psychic Surge even in Gen 7 when they added those abilities.
Plus you can say Heatran’s own heat is melting the earth for it to eat as magma.
Filter is not nearly as valuable as Fur Coat or Ice Scales. Filter only reduces Super Effective hits by 25%. Fur Coat doubles your Def which halves all physical moves, while Ice Scales reduces all Special moves by half including Psyshock and Secret Sword.
Ice Scales may “technically” not count as doubling your stats, but Fur Coat definitely does since that’s what it does in the code. So it could be Ice Scale but it’s more than likely not and Fur Coat is off the table.
Oh well. I'm still going to give my argument for it anyways. If they don't choose to that's fine, my post will probably be ignored anyway lol still seems worth pointing out it logically makes sense to do
So, I know we were going against custom abilities...but Mega Raichu X is a rare Pokémon that does have an ability in Z-A. While it's not a stat changing one like Starmie's Huge Power, Mega Raichu X specifically gets +1 Attack after it uses Volt Tackle - no other Pokémon has this (even Raichu Y), and no other move does this to Raichu (like Thunder Punch). Maybe this could be worked into an exception for a custom ability? Like:
Mega Evolution: Mega Raichu X
New Ability: Supercharging Body
Ability Description (if it doesn't currently exist): Raises the user's Attack by +1 (or +2? I think the timing it stays up is similar to Swords Dance, rather than the +1 boosts) after it uses Volt Tackle.
Reasoning: It literally is a unique effect to Mega Raichu X in Z-A.
Mega Evolution: Mega Raichu X
New Ability: Supercharging Body
Ability Description (if it doesn't currently exist): Raises the user's Attack by +1 (or +2? I think the timing it stays up is similar to Swords Dance, rather than the +1 boosts) after it uses Volt Tackle.
Reasoning: It literally is a unique effect to Mega Raichu X in Z-A.
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X: I have nothing really new to add, Galvanize is pretty fine Y: On a similar cadence to many of the suggestions, Volt Absorb would be pretty funny on it, considering it only restores HP and doesn't offer a proper substantial buff like Motor Drive / Lightning Rod.
: Levitate. Nothing new, really.
Z: Very, VERY Volatile. but also, imagine a good Infiltrator mon. I'm suggesting Infiltrator.
: Reckless still makes sense but honestly, i think Intimidate would be cool too, as an offensive mega with a defensive ability helps it carve out this funky little niche.
Z: Can we just like, do normal things with this guy's ability? The Levitate talk fits well but i think there could be more.
Z: Ubers fella. Might as well give it some bullshit like Mega Launcher or, like, Magic Guard to spam with steel beam or whatever.: please, please for the love of GOD do not give this fucker earth eater. For ALL that is holy, don't give the 4x weak to ground mon EARTH EATER. Filter or Flame Body are fitting
: I don't have anything really new to say about possible MDarkrai abilities, i'll just be agreeing with the few already out there.
: Sheer Force. Or Weak Armor if you're feeling risky.
: Keep Soul Heart she deserves it honestly.
: Now for something completely different, Motor Drive!
: Chlorophyll is rather obvious of a choice. Doesn't mean its bad, but considering this is also a mega and manual sun kinda sucks, Grassy Surge, Speed Boost, and hell, maybe even Supreme Overlord are just neater in my eyes.
: Merciless / Toxic Debris, pretty good and flavorful.
: I was going to say Sharpness for both funny reasons and semi-serious reasons but i guess i'm dumb for assuming the mon with a SWORD would get atleast a FEW Slicing moves. The only one is Aerial Ace. AERIAL ACE??? NOT SLASH, NOT NIGHT SLASH, NOT EVEN AQUA CUTTER, PSYCHO CUT, WHATEVER. but ONLY AERIAL ACE?rant aside, Thermal Exchange makes pretty good sense. This mon is stupid though.
: there really are like 3 abilities that work on the mega. Something like Opportunist or Speed Boost seem pretty fine.I did forget about Crabominable but honestly all of the abilities suggested work.
Guard Dog Golisopod is peak.
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With just Volt Tackle? That does sounds like a signature Ability by the time it is in Champions.
If we go with strictly canon Abilities, Tough Claws, Moxie, Sheer Force or Reckless would be going well with the theme. Sheer Force might be stretching it due to allowing mixed sets but the other three are more physical.
Pretty simple question regarding Fur Coat (sorry if this is the wrong thread): Furfrou has Fur Coat as its only ability. Does it get a boost to its stats to compensate for the lack of abilities? If it does, then I agree that Fur Coat shouldn't be an option for Mega Crab. But if Furfrou doesn't get that stat bump, I think Fur Coat could be considered for Mega Crab. Just a thought.
It does not, poor Furfrou is walking around Lumiose with 60 defense
I’d also like to take some time to inform people that Mega Meganium got buffed pretty hard indirectly.
- Toxic, Toxic Spikes, and Glimmora
The addition of several new Pokemon means Badly Poison and regular Poison are much more abundant. With Flower Veil, Megamium is immune to all Status conditions. Allowing itself to switch into Toxic Spikes without worry and Toxic from different Pokemon. Glimmora would beat Mega Meganium in a 1v1 fight, but its Toxic Debris ability means Mega Meganium can help against Glimmora’s teammates, and Glimmora doesn’t want to switch into Mega Meganium either.
- Parting Shot and Rotom
Lesser know about Flower Veil is its ability to block Parting Shot, arguably the best pivoting move in the game.
ZA already gifted Pokemon Parting Shot such as Sableye and Scrafty. Now MD has gifted even more Pokemon this move with Rotom, Cofagrigus, Runerigus, and Liepard.
This makes Mega Meganium one of the best Rotom-Wash counters in the entire game, as well as solid counters to Cofag and Runer.
You block Parting Shot and Will-o-wisp/Thunder Wave, tank Hydro Pump/Thunderbolt/Hex extremely well, and your massive SpA along side utility moves like Knock Off and Dragon Tail mean you really threaten these Pokemon extremely well.
- Mega Match-ups
Mega Dimensions has added multiple new Megas which Mega Meganium can check or counter.
X & YYou beat pretty much every variant of both Raichu forms. You are a bulk Grass type with Earth Power. Mega Raichu Y being notable since it gets really good Spe, SpA, and gets Nasty Plot, so it’ll be meta relevant. Especially since Raichu also gets Surf and Grass Knot, so your only answers are gonna be bulky Grass types and pokemon with amazing Special bulk.
ZWhile Mega Garchomp Z gets Nasty Plot and Fire moves, Mega Meganium would win in a 1v1 since it can survive unboosted Fire Blasts, and otherwise prevent Mega Garchomp Z from coming. Not only does it not want to be hit by its Fairy STAB, but Parting Shot spam will be everywhere and works nicely with Mega Garchomp Z. So if Meganium is on the field first, it will beat Mega Garchomp Z.
*Mega Meganium’z match up against Mega Heatran largely depends on what ability Mega Heatran gets. If its Earth Eater, no chance. Anything else, and Mega Meganium can outspeed and KO Heatran with Earth Power.
Mega Meganium outspeed Mega Golurk and also resists its Ground STAB. It then KOs Mega Golurk with Giga Drain.
Likewise, Mega Meganium can outspeed and OHKO Mega Crabominable with its Dazzling Gleam. Though Mega Meganium can't easily switch into its Ice STAB.
Zeraora lacks any good coverage moves to hit Mega Meganium hard. Its best option is Iron Tail, which is inaccurate. Mega Meganium also resists Zeraora’s STAB and many of its coverage options like Close Combat and Grass Knot.
Mega Meganium resists Tatsugiri’s Water STAB, which now it gets Scald which also means Flower Veil helps prevent burns, and is immune to Tatsugiri’s Dragon STAB. You should watch out for Ice Beams.
- Non-Mega Match-ups
Mega Meganium resists both of Keldeo's STAB and Earth Power. Only thing Mega Meganium would have to worry about is Ice Beam, which if Keldeo is running Choice Specs can be avoided.
Like how it beats Mega Zeraora, Mega Meganium beats regular Zeraora, both forms will have niches due to their speed tiers.
Non-Mega Heatran can't do much against Mega Meganiam despite its type advantage. And unlike its Mega, which can have Earth Eater, Heatran has no luxuries and is also still slower than Mega Meganium.
Darkrai has access to Sludge Bomb and Ice Beam, however besides those 2 moves, Mega Meganium resists its main STAB and Fighting coverage. So Choice Specs/Scarf Darkrai can be checked by Mega Meganium like Keldeo.
Gonna make suggestions for a few of the mons since a couple already feel pretty decided on:
: Regenerator I feel makes sense on this mon. Water/Dragon is a really strong defensive typing, and Regenerator alongside Rapid Spin allows it to have good utility while still being a threatening offensive Nasty Plotter, similar to Hydrapple in role. Flavor-wise, it's said in the dex to be able to make copies of itself, and food is connected to healing so it could be using its sushi plate to heal.
: I think Wind Rider could genuinely be decent here. First of all, Staraptor learns Tailwind, allowing it to get an attack boost and double speed in one turn (did you know Staraptor gets 0 attack boosting moves?). It also provides it an immunity to plenty of moves it’s weak too like Hurricane, and Blizzard. It’d also let Staraptor be a good support for rest of the team.
: Regenerator I feel makes sense on this mon. Water/Dragon is a really strong defensive typing, and Regenerator alongside Rapid Spin allows it to have good utility while still being a threatening offensive Nasty Plotter, similar to Hydrapple in role. Flavor-wise, it's said in the dex to be able to make copies of itself, and food is connected to healing so it could be using its sushi plate to heal. : I think Wind Rider could genuinely be decent here. First of all, Staraptor learns Tailwind, allowing it to get an attack boost and double speed in one turn (did you know Staraptor gets 0 attack boosting moves?). It also provides it an immunity to plenty of moves it’s weak too like Hurricane, and Blizzard. It’d also let Staraptor be a good support for rest of the team.
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most the rest of this sounds about right, but i wanna point out even with max spatk modest, you don't really ohko either of these two, Golurk at 0/0 bulk is only 18% chance to kill with drain, though you do still beat it probably. Crab is the same, 0/0 18% chance for Gleam to kill, but Crab will always run max Atk max HP i imagine, with which it always lives Gleam even after rocks, and then blows you up, so you'd need more chip to beat it with Meganium.
Mega Meganium outspeed Mega Golurk and also resists its Ground STAB. It then KOs Mega Golurk with Giga Drain.
Likewise, Mega Meganium can outspeed and OHKO Mega Crabominable with its Dazzling Gleam. Though Mega Meganium can't easily switch into its Ice STAB.
Just curious, when might we see these new additions on Showdown? Once champions is out or a little before?
252 SpA Meganium-Mega Earth Power vs. 252 HP / 252+ SpD Filter Heatran-Mega: 180-213 (46.6 - 55.1%) -- 66% chance to 2HKO
Correct.
It’s about 66% chance Meganium 2HKOs Heatran, which favors the Meganium user.
If the Heatran is offensive
252 SpA Meganium-Mega Earth Power vs. 0 HP / 0 SpD Filter Heatran-Mega: 237-279 (73.3 - 86.3%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Stealth Rock
It’s fairly close to OHKOing and obviously OHKOs if Heatran doesn’t get Earth Eater or Filter.
Probably in a week or 2. The ZA megas got added fairly quickly
What was the point of this? All I said was Meganium can't guarantee a 2HKO against SpD Filter Heatran. It wasn't a rebuttal or anything, which is why your post wasn't quoted.
I thought you were implying that Mega Heatran with Filter would beat Mega Meganium. My bad.
Warning that this isn't me making the argument that we should consider custom abilities again, the council have made their feelings that it's impractical clear and I respect that. But a lot of people seem to be under the impression that only "important" mega mons of some variety have a chance of officially getting a signature ability, and it occured to me today that's just not how gamefreak has done things since gen 8. Case in point almost every new mon/form released in a side game or dlc have had a unique move and/or ability.
Sword and Shield:
Urshifus- signature moves and ability.
Galarian Slowbro- signature move and ability
Galarian Slowking- signature move and share access with chilly reception with regular Slowking
Caly riders- signature moves and abilities
Regieleki- signature move and ability
Regidraco- signature move and ability
Galarian Bird trio- signature moves
Zarude- Siganture move
Legends Arceus:
Hisuian Deciduye- signature move
Hisuian Typhlosion- ssignature move
Hisuian Samurott- signature move
Kleavor- signature move
Hisuian Braviary- signature move
Hisuian Avalugg- signature move
HIsuian Zoroark- signature move
Overquill- signature move
Hisuian goodra- Signature move, tho one nerfed to just be a reskined iron defense
Ursaluna- he first mon to have neither a signature ability or move........Only to then immediately get Ursalune bloodmoon as an alternate form which has both and overpowered ones at that!
Basculegion- has neither a signature move or ability, but it did come to share last respects with Houndstone
Hisuian Arcanine- shares raging fury with infernape.
Sneasler- Signature move
Wyrdeer- Signature move
Enamaourus- signature move and also caused the rest of its legendary group to also get signature moves
Dialga and Palkia- Got new forms, but they require an item slot, but also did not get new abilities or moves. Ironically becoming some of the least blessed mons in the form of uniqueness despite being 'important' cover legends.
Scarlet and Violet:
Parado legendary beasts and swords: signature Moves
Ogerpon: signature move and unique interaction with tera, along with its multiple form changes
Sinistcha: signature move and ability
Diplin- signature ability. and when it gained its evolution in the next dlc Hydrapple would keep the signature ability and also gain a signature move
Loyal three- shared ability for the three.
Archaludon- Signature move.
Terapagos- a signature abilty and signature move, both of which change after terastilizing.
Pecheraunt- Signature ability and signature move.
So under the weight of all this recent evidence, and the fact that Raichu X has a unique in game interaction to get an attack boost after volt tackle, and the fact that none of the mons that got mega's got new siganture moves, I would say the most likely outcome is that MOST of the new mega's are getting some manner of signature ability in the official game.
Now will all these signature abilities be GOOD? almost certainly not There's a reason why everyone remembers the specific really strong signatures from overpowered mons, while forgetting that nearly every mon was getting something unique to them. A lot of them will likely be bad quite simply, and because of that there's not a reasonable way to predict what they'll get. But believing that only the 'special' mons could possibly be getting a signature ability is just ignoring how gamefreak has done things recently, which is a thought I wanted to share.
Sword and Shield:
Urshifus- signature moves and ability.
Galarian Slowbro- signature move and ability
Galarian Slowking- signature move and share access with chilly reception with regular Slowking
Caly riders- signature moves and abilities
Regieleki- signature move and ability
Regidraco- signature move and ability
Galarian Bird trio- signature moves
Zarude- Siganture move
Legends Arceus:
Hisuian Deciduye- signature move
Hisuian Typhlosion- ssignature move
Hisuian Samurott- signature move
Kleavor- signature move
Hisuian Braviary- signature move
Hisuian Avalugg- signature move
HIsuian Zoroark- signature move
Overquill- signature move
Hisuian goodra- Signature move, tho one nerfed to just be a reskined iron defense
Ursaluna- he first mon to have neither a signature ability or move........Only to then immediately get Ursalune bloodmoon as an alternate form which has both and overpowered ones at that!
Basculegion- has neither a signature move or ability, but it did come to share last respects with Houndstone
Hisuian Arcanine- shares raging fury with infernape.
Sneasler- Signature move
Wyrdeer- Signature move
Enamaourus- signature move and also caused the rest of its legendary group to also get signature moves
Dialga and Palkia- Got new forms, but they require an item slot, but also did not get new abilities or moves. Ironically becoming some of the least blessed mons in the form of uniqueness despite being 'important' cover legends.
Scarlet and Violet:
Parado legendary beasts and swords: signature Moves
Ogerpon: signature move and unique interaction with tera, along with its multiple form changes
Sinistcha: signature move and ability
Diplin- signature ability. and when it gained its evolution in the next dlc Hydrapple would keep the signature ability and also gain a signature move
Loyal three- shared ability for the three.
Archaludon- Signature move.
Terapagos- a signature abilty and signature move, both of which change after terastilizing.
Pecheraunt- Signature ability and signature move.
So under the weight of all this recent evidence, and the fact that Raichu X has a unique in game interaction to get an attack boost after volt tackle, and the fact that none of the mons that got mega's got new siganture moves, I would say the most likely outcome is that MOST of the new mega's are getting some manner of signature ability in the official game.
Now will all these signature abilities be GOOD? almost certainly not There's a reason why everyone remembers the specific really strong signatures from overpowered mons, while forgetting that nearly every mon was getting something unique to them. A lot of them will likely be bad quite simply, and because of that there's not a reasonable way to predict what they'll get. But believing that only the 'special' mons could possibly be getting a signature ability is just ignoring how gamefreak has done things recently, which is a thought I wanted to share.
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Mega Raichu X should obviously have an ability to make it gain +1 when it does Volt Tackle since thats clearly shown in game and will then 100% be its ability in the real game or something similar involving Volt Tackle. But since thats weak alone, I say give it a mix of that and Levitate since it flies in the game.
welcome back mega eelektross
please give it wind rider, it would actually make it really unique as it can easily setup a tail wind, and either fast pivot with uturn or threaten something with CC or BB. It would also mean it can seperate itself from Mega Skarm and Mega Hawlucha, as Mega Skarm is a setup sweeper and hawlucha... well depends on ability. levitate will be fine i initially thought Golurk would be hopeless and the best it could get is analytic, but i realized that Steam Engine is actually insanely good here, given Coalossal's history and being only 30 base speed
im really hoping for tinted lens because i think a bug/steel lokix would greatly improve the tier given the one billion good dark types running around, but i can also see regenerator happening
for the love of god stop suggesting psychic surge, its got 124 base speed and 143 special attack, i dont wanna have to deal with a mon who constantly threatens to setup psychic terrain, block my priority and then hit me with a FULL POWER expanding force. keep in mind that, as a spread move, in singles it doesnt suffer the -25% damage cut spread moves have, so thats 1.5 (unique boost it gets on psychic terrain) x1.3 (psychic terrain boost) x 1.5 (user is psychic type) if my calculations are correct thats a 234 base power move... all for just switching in. Give it something like Shield Dust or something defensive. i thought this guy was hopeless until i saw Contrary and saw it have Leaf Storm and Overheat, so it might actually go kinda crazy. Speed Boost is also another option that would greatly help it. I also want to preface that this guy has Grassy Glide so if anything gets Grassy Surge, it might not be so bad as a diet rillaboom surely Merciless or at least Toxic Debris right yeah idk, maybe Beserk? i got a feeling that it wont be happy to take a burn being so absurdly slow, so i think Thermal Exchange would actually go a long way here
(z) this is like 99% chance gonna be broken, could probably get away with Pressure or something, but i want this to be at least somewhat interesting, so give it Forewarn. Even something like Sniper would make it too obnoxious because it could randomly oneshot your bulkiest wall for no reason. (z) this guy needs no offensive bossting abilities. i wanna make it clear that its totally viable to just run a physical set on this guy and only use the mega for the extra speed, Garchomp is NOT lacking in physical power here. And thats not even addressing the fact that it got Nasty Plot. Ive seen Levitate thrown around a lot but i dont think its that dire. However I do think its dire enough to warrent requiring some risk to use it, even if its only for the speed boost. Therefore, geniunely give it Hustle
(z) i can MAYBE see garchomp and absol staying if given the right ability, not Lucario here. But because i want to watch the world burn, give it Battle Bond so that we can ban it quicker. please not earth eater, just give us Filter or keep Flash Fire and we'll be happyidc enough about the raichu megas, i guess X can get Galvanize and Y can get mold breaker or infiltrator, idk dude. anything else not here is probably getting banned anyway