New and "creative" moveset/EV spread thread. Mk. 4

[wildfire393]

One I've been fiddling with:


Jirachi
@ Life Orb/Leftovers
Serene Grace
EVs: 252 HP/ 4 SpA/ 252 Spe
Timid

Move Set:
Cosmic Power
Rest
Charge Beam
Flash Cannon/Psychic

Comment: With Cosmic Power and Rest, Jirachi will last a verrrrry long time and has no problem getting multiple boosts. Thanks to Charge Beam, when Jirachi is happy being unkillable, the offense boosting can begin and will happen quickly.

Now, there's a lot of alternatives here. If you have a lot of paralysis support, you can max Special Attack instead of speed. Leftovers is almost overkill but it's nice to not have to rest as often, though with 6 CPs, it's pretty easy to get away with.

The strongest attack you'll have to watch for is a CB Mamo's EQ which rarely OHKOs after a boost (without absolute max attack), even with Stealth Rock while you can nail it with Flash Cannon for an easy OHKO, with Life Orb and no investments and Stealth Rock.

With two boosts, even ScarfTran's Fire Blast won't 2HKO, but Jirachi can't do much back.

This thing is possibly the best final pokemon to have as even Blissey will eventually fall thanks to SpD drops and immunity to status.

I don't know if the SubCM set can work better, but this one is far more defensive, capable of fending off Earthquakes (all but the strongest) and capable of outstalling everything thanks to Rest.

Some comments:

1) Charge Beam as your only coverage move leaves Jirachi in a tight spot against a lot of Pokemon.
2) You probably want to run at least 80 Special Attack EVs like the SubCM Jirachi, which allows you to take blissey better once you start boosting your attack.
3) Wish may be preferable to rest, as you can alternate wishes and boosting moves so that you waste less time asleep. You lose the ability to shrug off thunderwaves, but most blissey pack Toxic anyways.

 

[Raikaria]

With the revalations about the most common OU leads at the time, being Metagross, Azelf, and Swampert by a mile, I decided to try and make a lead that could combat all three, and come out on top.. Ironically, I ended up with a custom set for the current number 1 lead, Metagross.

Metagross @ Life Orb
Adamant Nature
EV's: 252 HP, 236 attack, 8 defence, 12 speed
Meteor Mash
Grass Knot
Earthquake
Stealth Rock/Bullet Punch/Explosion

The EV's look familiar? They are standard for Leadgross, at the cost of 1 point of defence, traded for 1 speed point. This allows Anti-Top3 Metagross to outrun standard Swampert leads, and OHKO with Grass Knot, outrun the standard Metagross leads and 2HKO with Earthquake. Azelf is delt with a Meteor Mash and Bullet Punch, although Metagross, being a steel, often is not exploded upon.

The last 3 moves are interchangeable, SR allows for... Stealth Rocking, and the EV's given keep the fact that Anti-top3 LeadMeta will take most attacks and lay the rocks. Bullet Punch is to finish off Azelf, score a 2HKO on Aerodactyl (OHKO is likly on non-sashed ones), and for utility later in the game. Explosion is powerful in it's own right, and with Life Orb, it is more than capable of OHKO'ing anything that is not a defensive Rock or Steel type, or is a Ghost.

Life Orb is needed to secure some important 2HKO's, like on opposing Metagrosses, which may be running more than the standard 252/12. The coverage from Earthquake and Meteor Mash is poor, but it deals with the top 3 leads ATM. Also, as Metagross is still a 'suicide' lead, it dosen't mind the damage it's taking, as it's primary role is to deal as much damage as possible, before it's demise.

 

[d2m]

With the revalations about the most common OU leads at the time, being Metagross, Azelf, and Swampert by a mile, I decided to try and make a lead that could combat all three, and come out on top.. Ironically, I ended up with a custom set for the current number 1 lead, Metagross.

Metagross @ Life Orb
Adamant Nature
EV's: 252 HP, 236 attack, 8 defence, 12 speed
Meteor Mash
Grass Knot
Earthquake
Stealth Rock/Bullet Punch/Explosion

The EV's look familiar? They are standard for Leadgross, at the cost of 1 point of defence, traded for 1 speed point. This allows Anti-Top3 Metagross to outrun standard Swampert leads, and OHKO with Grass Knot, outrun the standard Metagross leads and 2HKO with Earthquake. Azelf is delt with a Meteor Mash and Bullet Punch, although Metagross, being a steel, often is not exploded upon.

The last 3 moves are interchangeable, SR allows for... Stealth Rocking, and the EV's given keep the fact that Anti-top3 LeadMeta will take most attacks and lay the rocks. Bullet Punch is to finish off Azelf, score a 2HKO on Aerodactyl (OHKO is likly on non-sashed ones), and for utility later in the game. Explosion is powerful in it's own right, and with Life Orb, it is more than capable of OHKO'ing anything that is not a defensive Rock or Steel type, or is a Ghost.

Life Orb is needed to secure some important 2HKO's, like on opposing Metagrosses, which may be running more than the standard 252/12. The coverage from Earthquake and Meteor Mash is poor, but it deals with the top 3 leads ATM. Also, as Metagross is still a 'suicide' lead, it dosen't mind the damage it's taking, as it's primary role is to deal as much damage as possible, before it's demise.

Even with LO, Grass Knot vs 252/0 (Even w/o def boosting nature) Swampert does (78.22% - 92.08%), never an OHKO. Bullet Punch after that does (12.36% - 14.56%) which is a decent chance of a 2HKO. Remember, this is the BEST possible scenario if there's no defensive investment whatsoever, if it does, BP might not even make the 2HKO.

0 Atk Swampert EQ vs that spread: (62.64% - 74.18%) 2HKO and anything faster can revenge it.

This set doesn't necessarily counter Swampert, you'd have to drop Atk EVs for SpA EVs to do that.

 

[Nitzleplick]

Here is a set for Gardevoir to give it a place in O/U on my team as support.

Gardevoir @ Light Clay
Calm
252hp/120s.def/136spd
Light Screen
Reflect
Healing Wish
Will-O-Wisp

Gardevoir has Dual Screens to provide much defensive support to the rest of the team, with Light Clay to make it last a neccesary 8 turns. Gardevoir takes hits from the Special spectrum while dropping Will-O-Wisp and Reflect stops any physical attackers from denting Gardevoir to make up for the poor Defense value Gardevoir has.

Gardevoir easily switches in on Heatran or Vaporeon who have Absorb or Immunity abilities that Gardevoir can Trace, and then become immune to their STABed attacks, which in the case of Heatran can force a switch out giving Gardevoir a free turn to set up screens. Trace is highly useful as she can even switch in on Blissey because of Natural Cure and set up with ease.

Gardevoir's only weakness is Taunting the Screener. Gardevoir switches out in the worst case scenario only to return later and use her Healing Wish on something like a Tyranitar or Salamance who may have swept prior in the fight but because severly damaged or status inflicted. Coming back essentially gives you another free Pokemon after Gardevoir has outlived her usefulness.

 

[EspyJoel]

Here is a set for Gardevoir to give it a place in O/U on my team as support.

Gardevoir @ Light Clay
Calm
252hp/120s.def/136spd
Light Screen
Reflect
Healing Wish
Will-O-Wisp

Gardevoir has Dual Screens to provide much defensive support to the rest of the team, with Light Clay to make it last a neccesary 8 turns. Gardevoir takes hits from the Special spectrum while dropping Will-O-Wisp and Reflect stops any physical attackers from denting Gardevoir to make up for the poor Defense value Gardevoir has.

Gardevoir easily switches in on Heatran or Vaporeon who have Absorb or Immunity abilities that Gardevoir can Trace, and then become immune to their STABed attacks, which in the case of Heatran can force a switch out giving Gardevoir a free turn to set up screens. Trace is highly useful as she can even switch in on Blissey because of Natural Cure and set up with ease.

Gardevoir's only weakness is Taunting the Screener. Gardevoir switches out in the worst case scenario only to return later and use her Healing Wish on something like a Tyranitar or Salamance who may have swept prior in the fight but because severly damaged or status inflicted. Coming back essentially gives you another free Pokemon after Gardevoir has outlived her usefulness.

Nice idea, in OU however this is outclassed by Cresselia who has better defenses to more easily set up screens and still access to lunar dance, dont know much about UU so dont know if it works well there.

 

[Revolution.Z]

Here's a surprisingly effective Wall-Breaking Azelf set that I've been using over at the CAP Server:

Azelf @ Leftovers
Naive
252 Att, 252 Spe, 6 Sp Att
~Substitute
~Zen Headbutt
~Fire Blast
~Ice Punch/Grass Knot

At CAP, the most commonly used defensive Pokemon are Arghonaut (Water/Fighting) , Revenankh (Fighting/Ghost), Fidgit (Ground/Poison), Skarmory, and Blissey. In case you don't know, Argo has the ability Unaware and Rev has access to STAB Shadow Sneak. The way this works is Substitute on something that will switch and take it from there. Often times the switch in is Blissey, who takes around 40% from Zen Headbutt. Azelf is safe from Toxic and Thunderwave and has to worry about taking Physical hits. This set makes taking out Blissey pretty easy without having to blow yourself up. So because of Zen Headbutt, the opponent thinks Physical set and sends in Skarm, who eats Fire Blast. Neither of the aforementioned Created Pokemon will like to take hits from Zen Headbutt, especially when Azelf is guaranteed at least two of them if he's sitting behind a Sub. Furthermore, Celebi takes approximately 55-60% dmage from Fire Blast and cannot harm Azelf with status, Leech Seed, or weak Psychics or Grass Knots.

As for the last slot, it's all dependent on whether Swampert proves a problem. If not, Ice Punch is great for dealing with the Dragons, all of which are outsped and are OHKOd (barring Latias who is 2HKOd, again, not a problem from behind a Sub, and Kingdra, who is altogether uncommon at CAP).

I wouldn't expect this set to be very handy outside of CAP, but as there is no New and Creative Moveset Thread in the CAP Subforum, posting here was most appropriate. Anyone who plays at CAP, I'd like to know what you think of this set. If you're not familiar with that metagame don't bother criticizing this as you can't possibly know how things are played there. Thanks.

Hmm Good set I use a similar one to this. I would suggest going full on sp.atk as zen headbutt sucks balls hard as it hasn't got perfect accucary and generally psychic is much better.

 

[Revolution.Z]

name: Rest+Talker
move 1: Meteor Mash
move 2: Ice Punch/Earthquake
move 3: Rest
move 4: Sleep Talk
item: Leftovers
nature: Impish
EVs: 252 HP / 88 Atk / 60 Def / 108 SpD



This set utilizes incredible typing, big defences and a nice moveset. This overall set allows it to combat some of the biggest metagame threats including, Lucario, Salamence and Gliscor. The EV spread is given so it can survive some potentially damaging

Lucario +2 Max Attack Close Combat LO. 79.40% - 93.41% After SR no OHKO
Salamence Max SpAtk Fire Blast LO. 72.53% - 85.16%
Gliscor 40 Atk Earthquake 42.86% - 50.27% Never a 2HKO
Magnezone Neutral 252 SpA T-Bolt 83.24% - 98.08%

As you can see these pokemon cant OHKO metagross and with selected moves, (Ice Punch and EQ) Meta can counter these well. With access to Rest+Sleep Talk it also gives good recovery to aid it's bulk and prolong it's survivability. Pokemon mentioned above also are taken out with ease by EQ/Ice punch

Meteor Mash is there as it provides good reliable STAB and also as meta has rest it will be there for quite a bit it also has a good chance of getting +1 attack another much welcomed boost to it's not heavy investment in atk. Earthquake/Ice Punch is a hard choice, choose on preferred coverage. Hammer Arm is also worth mention hitting again steels and tyranitar and bliss hard. Bullet Punch is generally not recommended because of metagross's little attack investment.

Metagross may look inferior to other sleep talkers such as machamp and rotom but there are some several props to having metagross as your sleep talker such as metagross has better bulk than machamp and rotom surviving super effective attacks with somewhat ease (More HP than Rotom and more invested bulk than Machamp). Also with big base attack stats it nearly reaches the power of machamp with less investment.

 

[wildfire393]

Hmm Good set I use a similar one to this. I would suggest going full on sp.atk as zen headbutt sucks balls hard as it hasn't got perfect accucary and generally psychic is much better.

If you paid attention, he said Zen Headbutt dealt 40% to Blissey. This means it 3HKOs and with the flinch chance can keep Blissey from healing and guarantee the KO eventually.

 

[MetaNite]

Here is a set for Gardevoir to give it a place in O/U on my team as support.

Gardevoir @ Light Clay
Calm
252hp/120s.def/136spd
Light Screen
Reflect
Healing Wish
Will-O-Wisp

Gardevoir has Dual Screens to provide much defensive support to the rest of the team, with Light Clay to make it last a neccesary 8 turns. Gardevoir takes hits from the Special spectrum while dropping Will-O-Wisp and Reflect stops any physical attackers from denting Gardevoir to make up for the poor Defense value Gardevoir has.

Gardevoir easily switches in on Heatran or Vaporeon who have Absorb or Immunity abilities that Gardevoir can Trace, and then become immune to their STABed attacks, which in the case of Heatran can force a switch out giving Gardevoir a free turn to set up screens. Trace is highly useful as she can even switch in on Blissey because of Natural Cure and set up with ease.

Gardevoir's only weakness is Taunting the Screener. Gardevoir switches out in the worst case scenario only to return later and use her Healing Wish on something like a Tyranitar or Salamance who may have swept prior in the fight but because severly damaged or status inflicted. Coming back essentially gives you another free Pokemon after Gardevoir has outlived her usefulness.

http://www.smogon.com/dp/pokemon/gardevoir

@StrategyFocus: You can't counter any of those Pokemon, bar Lucario coming in on a Swords Dance. You are slower than all of them, meaing you'll easily be 2HKOed. You'll also rarely have a time to use Rest, since most attacks people will throw at you, will 2HKO you.

 

[Revolution.Z]

If you paid attention, he said Zen Headbutt dealt 40% to Blissey. This means it 3HKOs and with the flinch chance can keep Blissey from healing and guarantee the KO eventually.

Well a 3HKO relying on flinch isnt even worthy of mention I might add. And with recovery why would you have a move that cant potentially guarantee a successful 3HKO on your target, on your set?

 

[Revolution.Z]

http://www.smogon.com/dp/pokemon/gardevoir

@StrategyFocus: You can't counter any of those Pokemon, bar Lucario coming in on a Swords Dance. You are slower than all of them, meaing you'll easily be 2HKOed. You'll also rarely have a time to use Rest, since most attacks people will throw at you, will 2HKO you.

Those calcs were for a reason as if you read the description after depending on your choice of moveset you can OHKO or 2HKO the specific pokemon after taking the hit.

 

[blasphemy1]

Those calcs were for a reason as if you read the description after depending on your choice of moveset you can OHKO or 2HKO the specific pokemon after taking the hit.

He is saying that Rest is pretty much pointless, since after killing them something faster will just finish you off.

BTW, I really don't think Magnezone's Thunderbolt can do 98%, better check on that, especially since Salamence's Fire Blast does less, and has way higher base power.

 

[wildfire393]

He is saying that Rest is pretty much pointless, since after killing them something faster will just finish you off.

BTW, I really don't think Magnezone's Thunderbolt can do 98%, better check on that, especially since Salamence's Fire Blast does less, and has way higher base power.

Salamence's Fire Blast is base power 120. Magnezone's Thunderbolt is base power 95*1.5 = 142.5, factoring in STAB. Magnezone also has 20 base points of Special Attack on Salamence.

 

[Valantaro]

Salamence's Fire Blast is base power 120. Magnezone's Thunderbolt is base power 95*1.5 = 142.5, factoring in STAB. Magnezone also has 20 base points of Special Attack on Salamence.

Salamence used Fire Blast!
It's super effective!

Magnezone used Thunderbolt!
It's not super effective!


The real calc is 45.60% - 53.85%, assuming no boosting item. Choice Specs does 68.41% - 80.77%

 

[Xeorr]

Salamence used Fire Blast!
It's super effective!

Magnezone used Thunderbolt!
It's not super effective!
This here is an incorrect fact because magnezones tbolt gives neutral coverage against Dra/Fly

The real calc is 45.60% - 53.85%, assuming no boosting item. Choice Specs does 68.41% - 80.77%

 

[wildfire393]

Salamence used Fire Blast!
It's super effective!

Magnezone used Thunderbolt!
It's not super effective!


The real calc is 45.60% - 53.85%, assuming no boosting item. Choice Specs does 68.41% - 80.77%

I'm sorry, I got confused and thought he was talking about Gardevoir somehow. >_<. Yeah, Mence will always do more than Magnezone in this case.

 

[Valantaro]

@Xeorr, if you read the posts above me, you'd know I'm referring to Metagross. And it is right because Thunderbolt is not super effective against Steel, or "Dra/Fly" as you put it.

 

[lati0s]

Lucario +2 Max Attack Close Combat LO. 79.40% - 93.41% After SR no OHKO
Salamence Max SpAtk Fire Blast LO. 72.53% - 85.16%
Gliscor 40 Atk Earthquake 42.86% - 50.27% Never a 2HKO
Magnezone Neutral 252 SpA T-Bolt 83.24% - 98.08%

these calcs are wrong,there is no way he takes more from an unboosted magnezone t-bolt than from a LO fireblast from mence. i think you may have forgotten to uncheck the super effective box for that one.
also when i calced it i got it taking 94.23% - 111.26% from +2 LO lucario close combat

 

[Age of Kings]

Chernobyl (Skuntank) (F) @ Life Orb
Ability: Aftermath
EVs: 252 Atk/144 Spd/114 SAtk
Lonely nature (+Atk, -Def)
- Sucker Punch
- Toxic
- Fire Blast
- Explosion

Skuntank in standard. This is for Wi-Fi and the SpA IV is like 19, so it might do even better on Shoddy. I don't know. This is a very specialized set I've been using for the current Wi-Fi tournament, the monocolor one. Yes, I am sharing a member of my tournament team. :P The most significant banning is that of Tyranitar, so I figured Azelf and Gengar and priority using steels would be more commonplace, so I needed something that would function as a general safety net. Skuntank, with STAB priority and Explosion, as well as decent speed, fit this criteria.

Skuntank has excellent base 103 HP, so I can get in and Sucker Punch to OHKO Azelf and Gengar. The surprise is up when I do, but some opponents are bold enough to leave in their steels. Skuntank's Fire Blast OHKOs Scizor, 2HKOs standard 252 HP Metagross, and Jirachi must have 252 HP at the very least to avoid a 2HKO (194 Atk vs 236 Def & 404 HP (120 Base Power): 184 - 218 (45.54% - 53.96%)). This is all with a 19 SpA IV.

A Life Orbed Explosion is another "safety net" of sorts because I can explode late game on pretty much anything I want. It works in tandem with Skuntank's other moves, because things that are considered checks for Explosion are usually dead.

If that wasn't enough, Aftermath is a nice ability in which you can sacrifice a weakened Skuntank to deal a potentially game-breaking 25% on a physical sweeper. Lonely helps with this. Sadly, it doesn't activate for Earthquake.

Toxic is filler, but a few times I could predict a switch to a bulky water and poison them.

Skuntank has decent speed, the given EVs help it reach 240 Speed, which outspeeds neutral base 100s that for some reason carry no speed. It also outspeeds all neutral natured Metagross and all Scizor.

Skuntank has been working wonderfully for me, but keep in mind that Tyranitar is banned in the particular tournament I've tested this in. Heatran also causes this set problems. You could try this on the suspect ladder against Latios, which will always be OHKO'd.

I'm done, flame/post opinions. This set has worked wonderfully for me, so maybe someone can speak for it for Shoddy? I dunno.

 

[youknowwhoitis]

skutank is an awful poke lol bad idea.

 

[Age of Kings]

lol I just won yet another test battle with it a few minutes before I saw your great, insightful post. :)

 

[Legacy Raider]

That looks good Age of Kings. I just glanced at the Skuntank analysis and was surprised by "While he does have a little more Attack and a lot more HP, Skuntank is entirely outclassed by his Dark/Poison counterpart, Drapion. This is mostly due to his barren movepool, which is what seems to let him down most." Skuntank has a lot of things to differentiate itself from Drapion with, Explosion, Sucker Punch and Fire Blast being the major ones, and you seem to have come up with something that makes the most of these and looks pretty solid on paper.

 

[Radiant Divinity]

My first post, kudos to me! :)

Thank The Lucky Star:

Starmie @ Wide Lens
Ability: Natural Cure
Timid
252 Spd, 252 SpAtk, 6 HP
-Hydro Pump
-Blizzard
-Thunder
-Substitue

No, I'm not crazy. This set has saved me on Shoddy a countless number of times, though, by the name, one can infer that it does not always pull through. Still though, it comes through a majority of my matches, and can really turn a battle around if played well.

The strategy is rather simple: Pull Starmie in to something that you can expect a switch from, for example, a Choice Scarf Heatran that has just used Fire Blast. Set up a Substitute on the switch. The Pokemon that your opponent pulls in will, no doubt, be a Pokemon ready to slaughter a Starmie. However with Starmie's arsenal of powerful attacks, one of them has gotta be able to put a decent dent into your opponent.

Unless your opponent is equipped with a Scarf, this will probably be a likely scenario.
-Starmie, a relatively fast Pokemon, strikes first behind the substitute, almost always chunking off a decent amount of your opponent's HP (count on more than half).
-The newly switched in Pokemon obviously is equipped with a move to dispatch a normal Starmie. The enemy obliges, and breaks Starmie's sub.'
-The speedy Starmie goes in for a quick kill.

In terms of team support, a Wish-user on your team will do wonders. Aside from a Wisher to present Starmie with HP recovery, it would just come down to having a knack for prediction.

 

[wildfire393]

My first post, kudos to me! :)

Thank The Lucky Star:

Starmie @ Wide Lens
Ability: Natural Cure
Timid
252 Spd, 252 SpAtk, 6 HP
-Hydro Pump
-Blizzard
-Thunder
-Substitue

No, I'm not crazy. This set has saved me on Shoddy a countless number of times, though, by the name, one can infer that it does not always pull through. Still though, it comes through a majority of my matches, and can really turn a battle around if played well.

The strategy is rather simple: Pull Starmie in to something that you can expect a switch from, for example, a Choice Scarf Heatran that has just used Fire Blast. Set up a Substitute on the switch. The Pokemon that your opponent pulls in will, no doubt, be a Pokemon ready to slaughter a Starmie. However with Starmie's arsenal of powerful attacks, one of them has gotta be able to put a decent dent into your opponent.

Unless your opponent is equipped with a Scarf, this will probably be a likely scenario.
-Starmie, a relatively fast Pokemon, strikes first behind the substitute, almost always chunking off a decent amount of your opponent's HP (count on more than half).
-The newly switched in Pokemon obviously is equipped with a move to dispatch a normal Starmie. The enemy obliges, and breaks Starmie's sub.'
-The speedy Starmie goes in for a quick kill.

In terms of team support, a Wish-user on your team will do wonders. Aside from a Wisher to present Starmie with HP recovery, it would just come down to having a knack for prediction.

The problem with this is that the average power of a Wide Lens Hydro Pump/Thunder/Blizzard is less than the average power of a LO Surf/Tbolt/Ice Beam.

Surf/Tbolt/Ice Beam = 1.00 x 95 x 1.3 = 123.5 (100 accuracy times 95 base power with a 30% boost from LO)
Hydro Pump = .80 x 1.1 x 120 = 105.6 (80 Accuracy times the 10% accuracy boost from Wide Lens times 120 base power)
Thunder/Blizzard = .70 x 1.1 x 120 = 92.4 (70 accuracy times the 10% boost from Wide lens time 120 base power)

Heck, even without taking accuracy into account, a LO-Boosted Surf/Tbolt/Blizzard has higher base power than a unboosted Pump/Thunder/Blizzard. This means you're sacrificing both power and accuracy to use an item that doesn't take away HP so you can use Sub more easily.
Then you say that you need wish support to make it good, when Starmie already has access to Recover...

 

[Age of Kings]

That looks good Age of Kings. I just glanced at the Skuntank analysis and was surprised by "While he does have a little more Attack and a lot more HP, Skuntank is entirely outclassed by his Dark/Poison counterpart, Drapion. This is mostly due to his barren movepool, which is what seems to let him down most." Skuntank has a lot of things to differentiate itself from Drapion with, Explosion, Sucker Punch and Fire Blast being the major ones, and you seem to have come up with something that makes the most of these and looks pretty solid on paper.

Thanks for providing me a comment with substance. It's not just on paper, I've been using it extensively, and as I mentioned, I am currently using it in a tournament. I would vouch for its effectiveness, and honestly, I prefer Skuntank over Drapion for the niches that it offers.