Garchomp has a high Attack stat, as well as a fairly high Speed stat, which allow it to make good use of Flower Gift's 1.5 boost to Attack as well as Helping Hand's damage boost. It also learns good multi-target moves such as Earthquake and Rock Slide, which are very useful in doubles. These moves are normally weakened in doubles due to the fact that they hit more than 1 target (.75 multiplier), but this is combated by the aforementioned boosts to allow for a powerful attack that hits more than one Pokemon.
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MattJ's EXTREMELY Lucky, Skill-Devoid Nationals Warstory!!!
- Thread starter mattj
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Garchomp has a high Attack stat, as well as a fairly high Speed stat, which allow it to make good use of Flower Gift's 1.5 boost to Attack as well as Helping Hand's damage boost. It also learns good multi-target moves such as Earthquake and Rock Slide, which are very useful in doubles. These moves are normally weakened in doubles due to the fact that they hit more than 1 target (.75 multiplier), but this is combated by the aforementioned boosts to allow for a powerful attack that hits more than one Pokemon.
Yeah, that's a good team. The only major loss is a flinching lead, but that's been replaced by Garchomp anyway. Not 100% on Cherrim though. Dodgy stats, and Flower Gift only boosts physical attack and special defence. Only helps Garchomp, so it just feels like it could be used better.
It depends on what you want to beat, really. Aerodactyl beats follow me TR and is also great Vs. goodstuffs, but fails Vs. fake out TR while Crobat fails Vs. follow me TR but succeeds against fake out TR and does decently against goodstuffs but lacks the crucial chance of flinching. Depends on what you need, really. You can either brave it and use Aerodactyl, giving a better team overall which has an Achilles heel in fake out trick room, or use Crobat for a slightly worse team which doesn't have any major flaws. You could also reconsider the scarf on Heatran too, seeing as it seems a little tying.
It depends on what you want to beat, really. Aerodactyl beats follow me TR and is also great Vs. goodstuffs, but fails Vs. fake out TR while Crobat fails Vs. follow me TR but succeeds against fake out TR and does decently against goodstuffs but lacks the crucial chance of flinching. Depends on what you need, really. You can either brave it and use Aerodactyl, giving a better team overall which has an Achilles heel in fake out trick room, or use Crobat for a slightly worse team which doesn't have any major flaws. You could also reconsider the scarf on Heatran too, seeing as it seems a little tying.
Nice Sunnyday-Team but especially when you play Crobat special you should use Weavile instead of Infernape. You get a faster FakeOut, Night Slash for Latios, Azelf, Cresselia etc., Icy Wind to reduce Speed of Pokemon that are faster than Garchomp.
Of course a physical Crobat would do just fine against the other fast fragil sweeper.
Of course a physical Crobat would do just fine against the other fast fragil sweeper.
I do appreciate everyone's advice.
Isn't Chrerrim a bit of a gamble though? If I can't get SD off he seems to be dead weight? He does have grass coverage though, which takes care of Water/Grass/Rock...Hmmmm....
But then again, if Crobat can't flinch and can outspeed any taunters I know of, I guess SDs pretty much a given :D
Isn't Chrerrim a bit of a gamble though? If I can't get SD off he seems to be dead weight? He does have grass coverage though, which takes care of Water/Grass/Rock...Hmmmm....
But then again, if Crobat can't flinch and can outspeed any taunters I know of, I guess SDs pretty much a given :D
Well, i think its better to only get the flower gift boost than have nothing against fast sweeper that survive a Heatwave of Crobat (Lati@s as the mainproblem).
When you want to benefit more from the sun you could play Shiftry as FakeOuter instead of Infernape/Weavile. Shiftry could abuse FlowerGift too. The problem with Shiftry is that everybody will know what you're going to do so they will react accordingly.
If you were to use Garchomp, you might want to consider Fire Fang on it somewhere to take advantage of the Sun. Too bad it's got a good moveset already.
Just a crazy thought...
What about Sunflora?
1)It's Crazy slow to help with my TR problem, yet it has helping hand so it can be an asset in non TR environments
2)It's a grass type which helps even more with my water type problem
3)It also benefits from SD
4) It's UU or NU so people might not see it coming ^.6
Any huge flaws with this?
What about Sunflora?
1)It's Crazy slow to help with my TR problem, yet it has helping hand so it can be an asset in non TR environments
2)It's a grass type which helps even more with my water type problem
3)It also benefits from SD
4) It's UU or NU so people might not see it coming ^.6
Any huge flaws with this?
Yea there is sorta. Sidd used it against me and it didn't work to well. It has bad coverage i think, and has no defence.
Oh yeah and another major point would be that Sunflora is useless if you don't pull off your sun. I lost in the London quarter finals because an untimely crit killed my rain dancer (who was a Dusknoir which I find pretty cool) in the opening turn. And with no rain, Gengar (also on 1HP because Dusknoir died, diverting the meteor mash which also boosted Metagross's attack to himself), specially based Kingdra and a Kabutops don't exactly stand much of a chance vs. goodstuffs.
Sidd used it on a TR/Sun Team, something similar. I was running TR so he didn't set up TR, just sun, while I set up TR. He used HH on his other poke with it, I used rock slide or EQ with marowak and killed it and flinched the HH pokemon.
Thank you, that's very helpful. I didn't realize how fragile sunflora could be :/
Turkoal anyone? Eruption (when in TR he might be able to pull it off without taking too much damage first with a spd of only 22) Heatwave, Earthquake, Rockslide (just as 2X options?) Can anybody tear that appart?
[edit] just checked and it looks like it could "underspeed" an un-braced Dusknoir and Bronzong (I know Dusknoir usually has shadowsneak:P)
Just use priority attacks instead of trying to outslow TR teams. It shouldn't be THAT important to beat TR teams, besides, when you aren't going against TR teams, then you'll go last anyways. Leafeon is probably better in almost every way compared to Sunflora (except for the fact that it has high speed), especially if you have Cherrim, as it can help make Leafeon a bulky Physical Sweeper, instead of a Physical Wall which can attack. Synthesis is also annoying :-P.
If you don't use Cherrim, then just put 252 EVs in Sp. Def (or something).
EDIT: You will probably need some EVs (like another 252) in HP. IMO, at least one of your Pokemon should have an ability that benefits from the sun.
If you don't use Cherrim, then just put 252 EVs in Sp. Def (or something).
EDIT: You will probably need some EVs (like another 252) in HP. IMO, at least one of your Pokemon should have an ability that benefits from the sun.
Excellent advice from each of you. I'm definitely considering, thanks!
Ummm, maybe I'm wrong, but I'm not really seing a scenario where I can't get SD up? Can anybody think of one I should watch out for?
If it's a goodstuffs I really haven't experienced any problems at all in the past with these teams, usually it ends up in 4/0, 4/1, or 4/2...Just do 2 speedy heatwaves or set up SD and keep on plowin' through...
If they bring out Kingdra and Lucario, I could Taunt Kingdra with Crobat and then put up SD next turn.
If they bring out Dusknoir and Smeargle I could set up SD and switch Heatran for Torkoal and maybe even get a good Eruption off at the start of the next turn.
Or am I missing something that would terribly throw all this off?
Ummm, maybe I'm wrong, but I'm not really seing a scenario where I can't get SD up? Can anybody think of one I should watch out for?
If it's a goodstuffs I really haven't experienced any problems at all in the past with these teams, usually it ends up in 4/0, 4/1, or 4/2...Just do 2 speedy heatwaves or set up SD and keep on plowin' through...
If they bring out Kingdra and Lucario, I could Taunt Kingdra with Crobat and then put up SD next turn.
If they bring out Dusknoir and Smeargle I could set up SD and switch Heatran for Torkoal and maybe even get a good Eruption off at the start of the next turn.
Or am I missing something that would terribly throw all this off?
Don't worry so much about TR! Or just use priority moves, I HIGHLY discourage using slow Pokemon just for TR.
Like everyone has been saying, don't try to out slow TR pokemon. You could run a very popular pokemon that is slower than most anyways, snorlax. It is bulky and can out slow stuff even.
Also, keep heatran. It is very good cause of its typing. Steel to resist many attacks including explosion. The best way to know what team you want to use is to play test vs many teams. If you can get in contact with people willing to battle, you should. I know a lot of us on #smogonwifi IRC battle VGC and we have weekly VGC tournaments.
Also, keep heatran. It is very good cause of its typing. Steel to resist many attacks including explosion. The best way to know what team you want to use is to play test vs many teams. If you can get in contact with people willing to battle, you should. I know a lot of us on #smogonwifi IRC battle VGC and we have weekly VGC tournaments.
Oh yeah, I wasn't planning on taking OUT Heatran completely, just switching him out if I saw they were going to set up TR. I totally get what y'all are saying, but I'm going to breed one right now and try it out for a week or so and if it sux it's gone, if it seems to work ok, it stays.
I had SuckerPunch on my Orbed Dugtrio, and admitedly even orbed Dugtrio is weak, but it just didn't do much of anything to the 1 TR guy who mopped the floor with me at Nationals. That's why I'm so scared of TR. Obviously, that guy was good and very practiced and whatever, but I didn't have a CHANCE against him, so I've gotta get this worked out. Goodstuffs didn't bother me, not even Latios/Garchomp/Azelf/Mamoswine were a problem, but when TR comes into play all my speedy sweepers are CRAP! :(
I definitely will get on IRC and Battle Now and whatever once I've got these few ideas bred/trained/leveled up. Thanks again for all the critiques. You all are soooo very helpful!
Last update till worlds! :D
Whew. Finally finished!
Just thought I'd post one last time on this thread to let y'all know where I'm at.
I tested my team (as mentioned in the above post) like 2 weeks ago with some slapped together pokes that had "meh" IVs/EVs and just knew the main moves they needed to know to follow my overall strategy I wanted to test. They tested quite well so I decided to go with all 6 of them.
Two weeks later, I re-bred for "near" perfect IVs/HPs and put a couple of better moves on them and now I'm finally ready to test them once again for worlds.
Here's what I will be looking for in case you somehow don't already know...
Some people have been confused by "Best of 3" before so here's what I mean by that...
Say for example... You win the first battle. We both go back to our boxes and pick new pokes/items combinations from the 6 we chose first and then meet back up on wifi and battle again. If you win again...Great job, you won best of 3. But say I win that time. We go back to our boxes and re-arrange our pokes/items to try to counter each other and meet back up on wifi and battle for a 3rd time to determine the "overall" winner.
Why would I want to play it that way? Because that's how the first 5 "rounds" of Worlds will be played and it would be good practice for me. Plus it eliminates losing because of poor type matchups and overall "Hax and luck". It really gives me a better idea of how my team matches up to yours by eliminating Critical Hits and Flinches and stuff.
I can't end without saying thank you to all the people who posted great Constructive Criticism on this thread. Each of you really helped me along.
Thanks
Matthew Carter
PS see y'all in SanDiego! ^.6
Whew. Finally finished!
Just thought I'd post one last time on this thread to let y'all know where I'm at.
I tested my team (as mentioned in the above post) like 2 weeks ago with some slapped together pokes that had "meh" IVs/EVs and just knew the main moves they needed to know to follow my overall strategy I wanted to test. They tested quite well so I decided to go with all 6 of them.
Two weeks later, I re-bred for "near" perfect IVs/HPs and put a couple of better moves on them and now I'm finally ready to test them once again for worlds.
Here's what I will be looking for in case you somehow don't already know...
- L 50 doubles
- Have 6 pokes ready but only use 4 per match
- Have 6 items ready but only use 4 per match
- Item Clause
- Pokemon Clause
- Uubers Clause
- Best of 3
- Please use my Platinum FC 4554 7405 8445
Some people have been confused by "Best of 3" before so here's what I mean by that...
Say for example... You win the first battle. We both go back to our boxes and pick new pokes/items combinations from the 6 we chose first and then meet back up on wifi and battle again. If you win again...Great job, you won best of 3. But say I win that time. We go back to our boxes and re-arrange our pokes/items to try to counter each other and meet back up on wifi and battle for a 3rd time to determine the "overall" winner.
Why would I want to play it that way? Because that's how the first 5 "rounds" of Worlds will be played and it would be good practice for me. Plus it eliminates losing because of poor type matchups and overall "Hax and luck". It really gives me a better idea of how my team matches up to yours by eliminating Critical Hits and Flinches and stuff.
I can't end without saying thank you to all the people who posted great Constructive Criticism on this thread. Each of you really helped me along.
Thanks
Matthew Carter
PS see y'all in SanDiego! ^.6