In Game Tiers, Platinum Edition!!

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KD24 said:
In this case yes, I would actually group Bibarel and Bidoof differently because thats how they are. I didn't suggest that for any other Pokemon, don't try and pretend you are in my head. Bidoof is caught around level 3 or 4 and you can use it as a quick Rock Smash HM Slave. If you are taking the time to evolve it, then you are wasting your time, since Bibarel comes literally an hour or less afterwards. I think grouping Bibarel and Bidoof differently makes sense because even though they share an evolutionary line, I don't think many at all would bother actually trying to evolve bidoof -.-.

<+kd24> tangerine, are ingame tiers made with the mindset of speedruns?
<&Mekkah> kd24 i like to think of them of efficient playing
<&Mekkah> efficiency basically means you go through the game quickly and reliably
<+Tangerine> what mekkah said

Torterra takes time, to use effectively. Yes it is effective but we are trying to go through the game quickly and reliably as Mekkah said. (I only pulled Flamethrower out of my ass, Fire Blast which can be bought at the store and Flare Blitz/Flame Wheel are both still viable options). Speedrun wasn't the right word because that is more of a contest to do things the fastest. But if I want to play quickly, I am not going to waste time with Turtwig when I have Infernape there for me. Turtwig is a nice second choice for a starter but there is no way he could be classed with Chimchar or Starly.

For the last point of "Torterra does better against Leaders/E4", maybe so, but Infernape and the rest of your team will probably go by just as fast if not faster. It is not and has never been a 1 Pokemon solo run. Last time I checked, we have 6 Pokemon to use in a team. I would rather just be switching in my teammates and using Infernape than trying to slowly level Torterra who just isn't as strong, just so I could have a more reliable gym killer.
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I agree with you on the Bidoof/Bibarel argument, I often catch a Bidoof, never evolve it, then catch a seperate Bibarel, simply because Bidoof helps early on in the game, and you don't need a Bibarel until you can catch Bibarel.

I am still perplexed with your argument of Infernape > Torterra. Sure, you can move first, but, despite Torterra's low speed, it can often outspeed things as well(since it will most likely be atleast 5-10 levels above the other trainer's pokemon). I am not trying to persuade you that Torterra is the fastest, hardest hitting of the three-that would be ridiculous. However, many teams can play around with Torterra's defenses, and use faster pokemon like Jolteon, to make up for the speed issue. I beat my Platinum in ~14.5 hours using only Gyarados and Torterra, with the obvious HM slaves like Bibarel and Tropius. I had no problem at all, while I have also tried a run through with Infernape(and Empoleon, but I think everyone can agree he is the slowest as far as run-time is concerned) and Rotom-A, it just wasn't as effective. In short, I believe it comes down to personal opinion, but if you want to give Torterra an A-tier, go ahead, I will just have to eternally disagree with you.

As for "Torterra's moves coming later than others", this couldn't be more false. Turtwig obtains Razor Leaf at 13, meanwhile the comparatively powerful Flame Wheel is obtained by Monferno at 19. Starly gets Wing Attack earlier than both, but Turtwig isn't in last. Next, Staraptor obtains Close Combat(not STAB) at level 34(upon evolution), while Torterra learns Earthquake(similar coverage to Close Combat + STAB), and Infernape learns Close Combat(STAB) at 41. Finally, Infernape learns Flare Blitz at 57, Staraptor learns Brave Bird at 49, and Torterra learns Wood Hammer as early as 32, or Leaf Storm at 57 if you want to go that route. Either way, Torterra beats both in 2/3 of their typical moves.
 
lordkira said:
Gible: also another low tier as he cannot be accessed to until the very later part of the storyline. While Garchomp, his evolved form, is probably one of the best pokemons we have in the game (in uber and just everything). But yeah low tier for the guy since he can't be accessed in the earlier part of teh game.
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Actually, you can go right into the cave in the beginning. The removed the rocks.

Edit: Sneasel (A/S)- You can obtain a Sneasel at around level 32-34, before the 7th gym. With his dual stab of dark and ice, plus a great priority move, ice shard, along with brick break, and aerial ace, he can cover most weaknesses (brick break, ice punch, night slash = almost no resistence). Along with swords dance to boost his attack up the roof, if you can survive an attack, you'll be able to sweep most teams. Weavile comes a bit later in the game, right before the Elite 4, when you can obtain razor claw. I personally led with Weavile in the Elite 4, especially at Cynthia, where her spiritomb is a great setup bait. Boosting to a easy +6 on Spiritomb, you can say "Sayonara" to the rest of her team.

Medicham (A/B)- Medicham is obtainable again right before the 7th gym. He has access to all the elemental punches, if you can get a heart scale, has a great dual stab of psychic, and fighting, two of the best types in the game, and if you can get zen headbutt (tutorable) or Psycho Cut (egg move, might be a pain), along with high jump kick/brick break (power or reliability), and two elemental punches/maybe bulk up to boost attack and defence, he'll be a great asset for your team, crushing teams along the way.

Gligar/Gliscor (A/B) - Gliscor can be a beast in this game. Along with having access to stab Earthquake, Aerial Ace, along with Stone Edge, X scissor, rock polish/swords dance, Night slash and U Turn, he'll run through Team Galactic, and gyms like no tomorrow. Earthquake in Platinum is obtainable early (however, if you get a gible along the way, you'll have to give it to one or hte other). Having the following moveset - Earthquake, Stone Edge, rock polish/swords dance, and aerial ace, will insure that you'll be able to hit almost anything for neutral or above. Unfortunately, you can only get razor fang at battle park, which is later in the game, so you might be stuck with gligar for a while (might bump him down to B because of this).
 
I'd like to talk about some Pokemon that haven't been brought up in all too much detail yet.

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Gligar - Gligar has a lot of things going for it throughout the game. It can be caught relatively early on in the game on Route 206 just after you get your second gym badge at Eterna city. Gligar has pretty good physical stats for in game - 75 base Atk, 105 base Def, and 85 Spe. It grows at the same speed as your starter, so it shouldn't slow down your overall team leveling up. While it has a problem in that it doesn't learn any notable STAB attacks by leveling up, it can quite easily be taught Aerial Ace and Dig, which can be found relatively early on and are strong enough to last you through the game. Aerial Ace importantly can be found before your gym battle with Maylene the Fighting leader, meaning Gligar can pretty much one shot that entire gym. Despite not learning STAB moves, it does learn some other very useful moves. Faint Attack at level 23 is pretty much just in time for the battle with Fantina the Ghost leader, and Gligar can be instrumental in that battle. It then goes on to be extremely useful in the battles against Byron and Volkner, and then when you're facing the Elite Four as well. By leveling up Gligar learns Slash and Swords Dance at level 31 and 34 respectively, both of which are helpful in game. A Razor Fang can be found on Route 214, and so Gligar can be evolved before your fourth Gym battle with the Maylene. Gligar can also learn False Swipe, which is also a very helpful move in-game.

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Scyther - Another excellent in-game choice. It has the stats of a fully evolved Pokemon and can last you the entire game as it is, but can also be evolved into a Scizor later on if you want the resistances etc over the speed. It gains experience faster than your starters, which is ridiculous considering how powerful it is. It also learns Wing Attack at level 21, which you will never ever have to replace if you managed to get a Technician Scyther; Fury Cutter at level 25, which is actually very useful for sweeping in-game trainers; and Slash at level 29. It also goes on to learn X-scissor and Swords Dance both by level up a bit later on too. Scyther can be found on Route 210, just after Solaceon Town en route to your gym battle with the Fighting gym leader, so if you manage to pick one up you can easily sweep the entire gym with it and get it to the same level as the rest of your pokes. Like Gligar it also learns False Swipe, and because of its naturally high Attack and Technician it will usually only have to use it once to help you catch most Pokemon.

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Meditite - Very powerful Pokemon, can be found early on outside Wayward Cave or that route to the east of Eterna City, and is very helpful against almost all the gyms. It levels up as fast as Scyther, and learns Force Palm at level 29 and then Hi Jump Kick at level 32. It evolves only one level after Infernape does at level 37. You can teach it the Drain Punch TM you get from Maylene to keep its health up in game without wasting money on medicine. If you manage to stockpile some shards, you can teach it Zen Headbutt and all the elemental Punches from the tutor near Pastoria city too. Medicham can sweep Wake if you teach it Thunderpunch, and then both Byron and Candice with its STAB Fighting move. A very helpful Pokemon in game.

I'd rate all three of these either S or A. They are what I use in game when I want to go through the game quickly and easily.
 
Eraddd said:
@LR Isn't razor fang only available in battle park?
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In Platimun, you can get it right after or before the third gym. Glicsor is very good. I used TM 26 on him, but you don't have to. His nice movepool and great stats really help with the in-game stuff.
 
Ralts deserves a high rank, High B or Low A. Not easy to catch due to Teleport, but both Gardevoir and Gallade are strong enough to sweep through the game. Kirlia's frailty is a pain but you do get low level Psychic to sweep the majority of the game, whereas Gallade will quickly know Leaf Blade and Psycho Cut.
Houndour is also a great sweeper albeit again, not the easiest to catch. Houndoom's pure power however means its probably the best Fire type in the game except Infernape, so if you went Piplup or Turtwig, he's probably among the best to catch. At least B.
 
forgive me if my reasons aren't as well thought out as yours all (and I thank LegacyRaider for showing me some unused gems) but I want to see if any disagrees with this before tiering them

Shieldon - D - Has very little in the way of offense

Pachirisu - C - out classed by other electric pokemon, super fang comes too late, pickup means carrying it when you have a space in your party couldn't hurt when it has pick up

Bronzor - D - slow, hypnosis isn't good anymore, attacking stats leave much to be desired.

Spirtomb - D - When trying to get through the game fast, activating Spiritomb is too long of a side quest

Remoraid - C - Too slow, despite wide movepool, but better than some other water pokemon

Finneon - D - Out classed by many other water pokemon, gotten too late,

Uxie - C - Very good defenses and speed, but offenses are a little low and it requires TMs to have good attacking moves.

Mesprit - D - Runner is horrible when speeding through the game, good luck finding it

Manaphy - F - Not obtainable in game lol....

Duskull - B or C - Slow, but strong defenses. Heart scales can let you teach it elemental punches

Giratina - A or B, not sure - Helpful for the elite 4 when you get it late in the game, since you have to run into it, but isn't available till late game,
 
That looks pretty good RB. Though for Duskull I'd say C+ because of the need to get Heart Scales and Giratina it should be A because he's on the storyline and even though he comes late he comes on a level on par with the rest of your team unless you've been grinding.
 
Piplup for S/A. While its level-up isn't very impressive (nevermind I plowed through the entire game with Surf+Aqua Jet alone), remember that Water(/Steel) is a really fantastic typing. And you don't have to be fast when you resist about two-thirds of the game right? Can also act as a HM Slave of sorts, since it learns both Surf and Waterfall. (and Cut, Strenght and Rock Smash but they suck)

Riolu for D. You get him very late in the game and he requiers way too much babing to be good for anything.

Ralts for D if you evolve him into Gallade. Same reason as above and the first two forms have horrible stats (they get 2HKOed by just about anything, while doing little damage with Confusion). When you finally evolve Krilia into Gallade (you get dawn stone after beating Wake I think) you will have to spend a lots of Heart Scales, TMs and money to even make him useable in battles.

Ralts for C if you evolve him/her into Gardevoir. While fast evolution is nice, low speed combined with weak defence isn't. Outclassed by Kadabra/Alakazam in my opinion.




(sorry about the possible mistakes, but I really wanted to state my opinion on this)
 
Shieldon - D - Has very little in the way of offense

Pachirisu - C - out classed by other electric pokemon, super fang comes too late, pickup means carrying it when you have a space in your party couldn't hurt when it has pick up

Bronzor - D - slow, hypnosis isn't good anymore, attacking stats leave much to be desired.

Spirtomb - D - When trying to get through the game fast, activating Spiritomb is too long of a side quest

Remoraid - C - Too slow, despite wide movepool, but better than some other water pokemon

Finneon - D - Out classed by many other water pokemon, gotten too late,

Uxie - C - Very good defenses and speed, but offenses are a little low and it requires TMs to have good attacking moves.

Mesprit - D - Runner is horrible when speeding through the game, good luck finding it

Manaphy - F - Not obtainable in game lol....

Duskull - B or C - Slow, but strong defenses. Heart scales can let you teach it elemental punches

Giratina - A or B, not sure - Helpful for the elite 4 when you get it late in the game, since you have to run into it, but isn't available till late game,
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exactly how i would place all of them, however, i would say duskull is probably a C with Gastly and Drifloon available, Giratina is a B since it comes so late, and we discussed earlier on IRC, if you do obtain Manaphy, it gets Tail Glow at level 1 i think, which easily sweeps through the game. I would mention that if you get your hands on it, it is an A or S.
 
For the people who are putting Sneasel's rank down giving a reason of being unable to get a Razor Claw until Victory Road - you can get a Razor Claw in Cyrus's office (or in the small room to the right, I forget which) in Platinum using the Dowsing Machine, which allows you to evolve Sneasel before the trek up Mt. Coronet to the Spear Pillar.
 
And the plot thickens as I do 4 more!

Abra - B, as apparently you can't get Hidden Power until Veilstone where it costs 6000 coins. Once you do evolve Abra, Kadabra works pretty well, but takes a pain to evolve much later as he will require more EXP than other Pokemon. Kadabra does not boast any immunities as Gastly/Haunter does and is a really frail Pokemon. Kadabra's movepool is decent with Shock Wave, Psychic, and Shadow Ball. Abra is a pain to catch though, being able to Teleport. All in all, a B suits Abra fairly well.

Aipom - C, it requires Honey and some patience. However, Return is available right off the bat if you didn't already use it on Starly. Once Aipom evolves, you can have a very dangerous Pokemon on your hands. Pickup is pretty handy.

Hippopotas - D, it takes an extremely long time to catch and if you want the best odds to catch it, you have to catch all 26 forms of Unown. Has common weaknesses to Water, Grass, and Ice, and not the greatest attacker. Earthquake can be handy sometimes, but Hippopotas and his evolution are too slow to make great use of their movepool. Having "A Sandstorm is raging" come up every single turn is not going to make things quick, and instead will most likely drive you insane.

Azelf - A, comes late but is acceptable to use Master Ball on if having trouble (Mesprit is pretty useless, and you could always lose on purpose to it to make sure it keeps on the map but ends up in your dex). Azelf boasts Psychic and Nasty Plot, and you can by TMs Fire Blast and Thunder, or if rich/lucky enough, Flamethrower/Thunderbolt. Also has Explosion. Level 50 is on par with what you should have by the time you reach Azelf.

Azelf might be a B, but it really is a lifesaver against the E4 and can make your life a lot easier. I find A suits it fairly well.
 
Here are my opinions of some Pokemon I have personally used in D/P/Pt:

Carnivine - D - Horrible. I used it during my first Diamond playthrough and it was horrible. Other than Power Whip, its level up movepool is so bad. You're stuck with like Vine Whip/Bite/Spit Up for attacking moves until lvl 37 when it learns Crunch. Keep in mind it was horrible in Diamond, where it can at least be helpful with Bite against Fantina. In Platinum, you can't get Carnivine until after Fantina, and Tangrowth is pretty much a Carnivine on steroids that can be caught in the same area with much less Great Marsh trekking. But even then, Tangrowth is still only like C tier at best.

Scyther - A - Agree 100% with Legacy Raider, Scyther is a beast ingame. If you could get it just a bit earlier like Chimchar/Starly it would be S for sure, but man does it destroy everything with those stats + Technician Wing Attack. Scizor is obviously amazing too if you get it, but unless you Thief a Metal Coat from a wild Bronzor you won't be getting it until Iron Island.

Aipom - B or C - This may be a bit surprising, but Ambipom is a lot less useful ingame than one would think. The fact that you need to use a honey tree is one thing, but its level up movepool is also pretty lame and the only way to get a decent moveset on it is by using important TMs like Shadow Claw and U-Turn. Yeah, it does learn Double Hit pretty early at lvl 32, but I just found that move very underwhelming throughout the game. Also keep in mind that if you want Technician on your Ambipom, your Aipom must have Run Away, so you don't even get Pick Up to work with.

Houndour - C - Again, I found this Pokemon very underwhelming. Yeah, Houndour evolves into Houndoom pretty much as soon as you catch it, but it just has such a lame movepool. You have to rely on Bite/Faint Attack and Fire Blast until very late game, with the former having power problems and the latter having PP issues. Once you hit Victory Road though, you have access to the Dark Pulse TM, and Houndoom should be somewhere close to learning Flamethrower (lvl 48). That's when Houndoom actually gets decent, but imo it's just too little too late. Honestly, my Houndoom moveset for the E4 was Flamethrower/Fire Blast/Dark Pulse/Embargo :(
 
No offense but what does S stand for?
I though a was the highest. Also I would rate magnezone a b since you get it at a decent time and can sweep most of the 2nd half of the game especially cyrus.
 
S is often used in a videogame as the highest rank for something, even above A. It might actually mean something like Super, but I don't know.

Having "A Sandstorm is raging" come up every single turn is not going to make things quick, and instead will most likely drive you insane.
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If this counts, then Gyarados' Intimidate should too, though it doesn't occur as often, and also reduces wild encounters...
 
reducing wild encounters can sometimes be a good thing or a bad thing so i won't comment. My problem with Sandstream though is that, unlike Intimidate, the moment Hippo joins the match, its there for good unless another weather comes up. So if it is a long match or an e4 match or a rival match and Hippo comes in early, i could be potentially adding maybe 3-4 minutes to the game? intimidate activates only once upon switch-in and unlike hippo, gyara or raptor can probably stay in the entire time and win the match.

I see where you are coming from with the intimidate message but gyara and star both make up for it with their strength, while hippo has a somewhat limited movepool until it evolves, and even then, is too slow to really back it up.
 
Phiddlesticks said:
Houndour - C - Again, I found this Pokemon very underwhelming. Yeah, Houndour evolves into Houndoom pretty much as soon as you catch it, but it just has such a lame movepool. You have to rely on Bite/Faint Attack and Fire Blast until very late game, with the former having power problems and the latter having PP issues. Once you hit Victory Road though, you have access to the Dark Pulse TM, and Houndoom should be somewhere close to learning Flamethrower (lvl 48). That's when Houndoom actually gets decent, but imo it's just too little too late. Honestly, my Houndoom moveset for the E4 was Flamethrower/Fire Blast/Dark Pulse/Embargo :(
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One thing about Houndour is that if you can get your mitts on a Flamethrower TM, then that is all you need along with a Dark attack. You can also Heart Scale it to get Thunder Fang.
 
Just one:

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B - Psyduck is a Pokemon that can be obtained very early on in the game, at the Ravaged path. In fact, it's the first wild water Pokemon you'll encounter. He is a great service to those who are using Chimcar. He can take down your rival's Ponyta early on, hurt Roselia with Confusion, and resist 2/3 of Prinlup's attacks. Confusion/Zen Headbutt are useful for taking on the legions of Zubats, Gastlys, and other Poisons as well.

When he evolves to Golduck, he can use both physical and special attacks, and has decent speed (82/95/85).. allowing you to catch pretty much 'whatever nature'. He works as a decent TM Slave later on, for Waterfall, Surf, Strength, Rock Climb, and Rock Smash.
 
Chimchar - S - If you're willing to SR for Chimchar, it's ridiculous. Specially Offensive Infernape is GODLY. It wipes out every single gym in the game with the eception of Roark, who can be slapped into the ground with a Budew or by temporarily using Mach Punch to kill those Rock-types.

Budew - B - Budew is a good option as your Grass-type if you didn't chose Tutrtwig. It has a wide variety of status moves (when it evolves) and a nasty special attacking punch. Unfortunately, it evolves through happiness.

Buizel - A - Buizel is ridiculously fast, with great coverage provided by Crunch / Waterfall / Ice Fang, along with a powerful STAB Aqua Jet. If you didn't pick Piplup, Buizel is a great fighter, and can be an effective HM user with Surf and Waterfall, allowing it to do a psuedo-wallbreaking role.

Shinx - C - Shinx has a bit of a lacklustre movepool, but with a surprising amount of punch and quick evolving, it makes a decent choice for your Electric-type. Although that's not saying much - your only other options are Electabuzz - who comes up late in the game - and Pachirisu.

Starly - B - Starly is just another bird Pokemon. It gets Close Combat and Brave Bird, allowing it to do a lot of damage, but you'll most likely use it to fly you around. My personal favourite moveset for it is Aerial Ace / Close Combat / Fly / and either Defog or Return, depending on whether you want offense or convenience.

Bidoof - S - Best HM slave ever. hands down. I don't think I need to elaborate on that.
 
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Shellos / Gastrodon for A or B.
  • Arrives at a reasonable level when you first come across it (9-12, and 30-31 for Gastrodon)
  • Water Pulse is a good early-game move (better than Water Gun / Aqua Jet / etc.), and gets Surf for mid-late game
  • Reasonable offensive stats
  • Bulky
  • Learns Hidden Power at Lvl. 16, which (if you're lucky) can be extremely useful
  • Doesn't need many TMs to be useful (Ice Beam comes late-game, but you'll usually have enough money to buy the TM from the Game Corner earlier on)
  • Learns Surf, Waterfall, Rock Smash and Strength, so you can even use it as a HM Slave if you are so inclined
  • Learns Recover at Lvl. 54, which is great late-game
Yeah, it's slow, but I feel that the pros far outweigh the cons.
 
Sgt_Woodsy said:
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Shellos / Gastrodon for A or B.
  • Arrives at a reasonable level when you first come across it (9-12, and 30-31 for Gastrodon)
  • Water Pulse is a good early-game move (better than Water Gun / Aqua Jet / etc.), and gets Surf for mid-late game
  • Reasonable offensive stats
  • Bulky
  • Learns Hidden Power at Lvl. 16, which (if you're lucky) can be extremely useful
  • Doesn't need many TMs to be useful (Ice Beam comes late-game, but you'll usually have enough money to buy the TM from the Game Corner earlier on)
  • Learns Surf, Waterfall, Rock Smash and Strength, so you can even use it as a HM Slave if you are so inclined
  • Learns Recover at Lvl. 54, which is great late-game
Yeah, it's slow, but I feel that the pros far outweigh the cons.
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Shellos has crappy stats until you can get it to a gastrodon. I caught one, got it to level 20, ditched it, and went with a gyarados.

Oh and for lulz, you can teach gyarados surf if you don't have a surf slave. I found that for physical walls that are weak against water, surf will usually 1hko as opposed to 2hkos from waterfall (this was before I had access to stone edge)
 
We've discussed this on #stark, but I believe Manaphy should be an A. It would be an S because it can get Tail Glow ridiculously early (as soon as it hatches) and can even be attained before the first or second gym I think. Base 100 stats all round would seal the deal, but the one knock against Manaphy is that you need Pokemon Ranger to get it. Therefore, I think it's fair that Manaphy is given an "A" rating. F is just ridiculous lol.
 
I'll agree with Shellos for A or B. it's really solid overall, and it's very easy to SR for a good hidden power. It's definitely worth using.

I would put Shinx higher, into B or perhaps even A tier. Its movepool isn't GREAT but if you don't want to slave your HMs it uses Strength well, and Rock Smash becomes an option as well (along with Spark and Crunch). It can also pick up Superpower from the move tutor.

Mid-lategame pickups aren't as useful but you guys are still forgetting the god of ingame pokemon from EVERY generation: (Kad)Abra. You can pick up Abra VERY early, or catch wild Kadabra in the mid-20s. Both are valid options - Kadabra happens to eat just about every pokemon in every gym in the game save Byron's. Teach it Focus Blast and it can OHKO every single one of those, too. As for the Elite Four, Lucien could give you a bit of trouble, but you have five other pokemon to deal with him - or signal beam from the move tutor. Shadow Ball is a more expensive but still valid option. He's easily good enough for a solo run.

I would consider putting Piplup up to S tier and Turtwig down to A or B - Turtwig's evolved forms aren't that great, they don't have the offensive stats to really mulch things, and flying attacks are EVERYWHERE. Piplup only has trouble with two gyms, and one of those is questionable (Volkner) simply due to your ability to earthquake your way to victory.

Also, almost every pokemon in the Elite Four has a move to really slap Torterra around. He's useless against Aaron and Flint, Bertha's admittedly got mostly nothing, Lucien's got signal beams out the arse, and Cynthia's Milotic, the one pokemon it can really do anything against on her team, can ohko it with ice beam. I've run it, it slows the game down a LOT.

If I were speed running Platinum, this would be my plan:
- Choose Chimchar as starter; evolve at earliest points (flamethrower and nasty plot aren't worth it)
- Don't catch starly - there is really nothing you need it to kill that chimchar can't.

Now there are a few options for wrecking roarke - my last attempt used Psyduck to do the deed, which worked quite nicely and can be caught in Ravaged Path. If you feel like grinding, Kadabra is an option, or Gyarados, but those aren't really worth considering. Bidoof also evolves at 15 and picks up Water Gun. On the physical side, Geodude with Magnitude and Machop with Karate Chop will also get the job done.

Honestly, the only pokemon of that bunch you want to keep are Kadabra and Gyarados, but those require a LOT of time spent. Psyduck requires a bit of a detour, so do the others; I might try to just beat it down with Monferno's mach punch next time, since he's neutral to rock. For a pure speed run you probably should stick with Monferno here, and only have Bidoof for HMs (catching bibarel when available)

Second gym is a breeze with monferno, if you come by on a Friday you can pick up a Drifloon on the way, which is somewhat worth using especially if you want to SR your Rotom later for a better breeder. Not necessary though, Monferno and your chosen HM slave is all you need so far (I'd use a bidoof). DON'T give Monferno your grass knot TM. I know it seems like the obvious thing to do to beat Crasher Wake, but we have a better plan.

One thing that MAY be worth trying is to go get a gible now. It's a big time sink, though - but it does make Fantina's gym easier immediately.

Third gym is Fantina and her spooky friends. Monferno's neutral to ghost and is going to get hammered a lot by confusion. Thankfully you're faster and you can OHKO a LOT with flame wheel given how high your level is. It might be annoying, but I'd stick with Monferno/Infernape - you'll probably evolve not too far from here. Oh, and you get an Eevee now if you want it; if you have a thunderstone, and you can't get 6 blue shards by Pastoria (not sure yet), take it and evolve it into Jolteon.

Next step is to use the second of those yummy pokeballs and catch a Kadabra. This guy packs some serious punch to help your team out, and is just what the doctor ordered for the next gym: Veilstone, and Maylene. This is a piece of cake - Kadabra should psybeam the mooks to gain experience, throw Infernape at anything else. Flame Wheel should OHKO or at worst 2HKO Lucario. Next!

Nothing to catch. Gyarados is annoying, but you have a secret weapon - the Pastoria Move Tutor and his awesome THUNDERPUNCH! I'm pretty sure there's a way to get six blue shards by this point. If not, ignore that and use Jolteon. Oh, and teach Kadabra your Grass Knot TM, to take out water/grounds throughout. Psybeam any croagunks. Don't work too hard catching a Tropius for Fly - it wastes too much time from the run. Discard Jolteon if you used it.

Next you run around chasing Team Galactic a bunch and end up at the next gym - Byron's easy if you've got Infernape, and we do. So much fighting weakness!

Mt. Coronet next, and up to Snowpoint. Still easy. Medicham is worth catching but you don't NEED it here. Still, Pure Power and Hi Jump Kick go well together. Sneasel is another attractive choice, giving you another ice move - you should take ONE of the two as you'll want something fast with Ice Punch for something obvious at the end of the game...

The rest is honestly cake. The last two gyms are nothing for Infernape and Kadabra. You don't need a ground type for the electric gym at all.

Elite Four.

Aaron: Infernape OHKOs every pokemon he has except POSSIBLY Drapion.
Bertha: Kadabra. Grass Knot. 'nuff said.
Flint: The problem fight. You have an utter lack of water AND ground moves. Most of his pokemon have weak defences, and few attacks that can touch Infernape - abuse it. Nothing here really likes STAB close combats anyway.
Lucien: This is one of two reasons I said get and level (reasonably) Weavile or (less so) Medicham. Weavile can outspeed and OHKO most of his team; Gallade can be simply overpowered with neutral hits. Bronzong is cake, I'm pretty sure it's ALWAYS Levitate so kill it with Infernape.

Cynthia: Here's where it gets hard...ish...maybe. Okay no.

This is where Weavile is large and in charge. Spiritomb. Cannot. Hurt. You. For. Crap. Silver Wind will do SOME damage, but not much. Swords dance in its face! Three times! Heal up with an item if you need to.

Hey look...you have five pokemon left to kill, and none of them can take Ice Punch, or [insert fighting move here that could even be Rock Smash] for crap! You should outspeed everything, just kill it all. Night Slash should be your last move to kill Milotic.

Don't have Weavile? If you took Medicham: Screw setting up attack. You hit like a busload of nukes, but you have to be careful - Garchomp can WRECK YOU. The good news: you can ohko him if you use a focus sash, otherwise you need to damage chomp with infernape then hope Kadabra's psychic can finish the job. If he giga impacts, use Medicham to revenge kill. Medicham beats everything else on her team.

Neither? Well, this means it's Infernape, Kadabra, and possibly Jolteon vs the world. You're going to be really high levelled, so you'll be outspeeding chomp with Kadabra and Infernape. Psychic + Close Combat will KO it. Infernape kills the rest save Milotic, which loses to Kadabra barring good luck. Items will help mitigate that. :)

Go get 'em and let's try to refine my speedrun guide!
 
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