Creative (and good) Movesets (READ THE OP FIRST)

Status
Not open for further replies.
NDenizen said:
That seems an awfully kneejerk and Gen4 centric view. Next you'll be saying Fling on Gliscor is useless because "it only works once".

With Evolution stones, Balloons and the like running around, or new powerful abilities requiring item support, a disruptive move like Trick suddenly sees new viability - especially it's damn near impossible to reverse the effects of, unlike with regular status. Even something as simple as taking Leftovers from a Magic Guard user is a boon.
Click to expand...

Oooor you could just use a different pokemon with Knock Off and be done with it.
 
NDenizen said:
That seems an awfully kneejerk and Gen4 centric view. Next you'll be saying Fling on Gliscor is useless because "it only works once".
Click to expand...

That's hardly an applicable comparison. Gliscor actually benefits from Toxic Orb, and flinging it gives him a more powerful Acrobat. Gengar has neither of these going for him, so BurningMan is correct in saying Black Sludge would be the better choice if you really wanted a Trick set (Toxic isn't even necessary). I'd still say that a choice item would be most effective (and genuinely beneficial before the trick), but that's not "creative" though.

tl;dr Toxic orb Gengar is bad.
 
Veedrock said:
That's hardly an applicable comparison. Gliscor actually benefits from Toxic Orb, and flinging it gives him a more powerful Acrobat. Gengar has neither of these going for him, so BurningMan is correct in saying Black Sludge would be the better choice if you really wanted a Trick set (Toxic isn't even necessary). I'd still say that a choice item would be most effective (and genuinely beneficial before the trick), but that's not "creative" though.

tl;dr Toxic orb Gengar is bad.
Click to expand...

Meh, you're mostly right, just seems "hurr use Toxic" isn't the best approach to things like this. A Toxic Orb can't be Heal Belled, and when you're stealing recovery it's even more of a bane.

That being said, any other item is good/better for disruptive purposes, and Toxic Orb might be odd on Gengar of all things; i'm intrigued by the idea of Black Sludge, though. It was always intended to be tricked, from what I can see (maybe not on a fragile sweeper), and that never came about, so maybe some viability is there - I tried out Sticky Barb Sableye for a bit and its results were surprisingly satisfying in adding extra layers of relentless damage to an otherwise bulky pokemon.
 
BurningMan said:
why don't you just use toxic it works more than one time and you can have an actually useful item. You could also use Black Sludge since it cripples even Poision types and often screws over Walls like Blissey.
Click to expand...
Toxic does (occasionally) miss, Trick wont'. I have to agree though, Black Sludge would work better. Thanks for the input.
 
I always went saw that gengar was a great lead with magic coat and disable.

Magic coat taunters or hazard starters,
If it rebounds a hazard disable it.
 
Mastermind221 said:
Hoping to get an actual answer this time. ^^;
Click to expand...
Icy Wind is a terrible move, so go with Psychic. HP Fire should be the first choice, as it gives Metagross perfect coverage with those attacks.

But, I wouldn't use it. Being that slow will really hurt it's ability to sweep, unless you decided to go with a Trick Room team.
 
This is a lead I'm testing and I like it.

Mew
252 HP/ 252 Spd/ 4Def - Jolly Nature
Leftovers (probably gonna change to lum)

Taunt
Stealth Rock
Will-o-wisp
Transform

Taunt to stop set up and hazards. SR for my own hazards. Will-o-wisp is great and if I WoW a phys attacker then I can transform and not wry about wasting a turn and taking to much damage. Nice surprise factor. Still needs more testing but I really like it so far.
 
Rhydon
adamant
@ evolution stone
252 hp, 252 special def
-sword dance
-rock polish
-earth quake
-stone edge

should be used in sandstorm


Or

Rhydon
+special defence -special attack nature
@ evolution stone
252hp, 252 special defence
-rest
-sleep talk
-rock slide
-roar
 
Breludicolo said:
Rhyperior outclasses Rhydon sorry

(actually both suck)

Neither set is very creative either
Click to expand...

Actually technically Rhydon takes a few percentage less damage with the Evo stone than Rhyperior with comparable stats although Rhydon does miss out on Leftover recovery. I suppose Rhydon could use Counter on strong things given that it survives non Swords Dance Landlos Earthquake in sand, Garchomp, Dragonite (even Surfing ones in Sand), Nattorei Power Whips, etc. Granted, Rhyperior can do much the same thing against the physcial moves but not as well against special moves. And Rhyperior would probably be better off Swords Dancing and stuff.
 
Sajak said:
Toxic does (occasionally) miss, Trick wont'. I have to agree though, Black Sludge would work better. Thanks for the input.
Click to expand...

Trick can miss.

Also, the set in question only bothered me because it Tricked my bulky CM Latias which just so happened to carry Refresh for such an occasion as a random Toxic. It's a cheap gimmick otherwise, since the distribution of Refresh and Heal Bell-esque moves isn't too common.
 
Trick has 100 accuracy I believe, while Toxic has 90, so the former will not miss unless there is some form of evasion/reduced accuracy in play.
 
My current favorite set of the generation:

JUMPLUFF (in the sun, of course)
252 HP/188 SpD/68 Spe (hits 600 in sun)
Leftovers
Timid
-Leech Seed
-Substitute
-Worry Seed
-Cotton Guard

This set actually works wonderfully. Leech Seed + Substitute allows for excellent stalling. However, Worry Seed and Cotton Guard are the highlights. With Cotton Guard, it's able to stall out pretty much every physical attacker in the game. And Worry Seed isn't a joke, either. Worry Seed cripples all the Pokemon that rely on their ability. Hitting Breloom/Gliscor with it is really funny, as well.

This Jumpluff is a monster. Has even killed a full health Heatran!
 
blarajan said:
My current favorite set of the generation:

JUMPLUFF (in the sun, of course)
252 HP/188 SpD/68 Spe (hits 600 in sun)
Leftovers
Timid
-Leech Seed
-Substitute
-Worry Seed
-Cotton Guard

This set actually works wonderfully. Leech Seed + Substitute allows for excellent stalling. However, Worry Seed and Cotton Guard are the highlights. With Cotton Guard, it's able to stall out pretty much every physical attacker in the game. And Worry Seed isn't a joke, either. Worry Seed cripples all the Pokemon that rely on their ability. Hitting Breloom/Gliscor with it is really funny, as well.

This Jumpluff is a monster. Has even killed a full health Heatran!
Click to expand...

E
ru
fuun
 
...
touche. I didn't think Erufuun learned Worry Seed, so I used Jumpluff. Now that I realized it did..I feel pretty silly xD. But that's okay; I now have a new member to replace..
 
I'd much rather use Jumpluff in the sun than Erufuun... At least Jumpluff learns Sleep Powder. Erufuun can do absolutely nothing to anything that resists leech seed besides Hurricane off of its nonexistent SpA.
 
The most creative I have gone was to:
~use Revenge on Hippowdon w/ Curse/Stockpile and Slackoff
~Rugged Helmet or EvoStone Stealth Rock Chansey with Defense Curl

I ended up eating a Darkrai Dark Pulse and surviving to ko it with Revenge. Defense Curl Chansey was just fun to use, even if it baited Roar-clone attacks and Trick and Heatran.

One other note: Choice Band Heatran or just a Heatran with physical focus. I did it on one of those Eruption Heatran only with a Scarf and switching out. Was fun to Earthquake opponents and crit hit with Iron Head flinches.
 
min min said:
Trick can miss.

Also, the set in question only bothered me because it Tricked my bulky CM Latias which just so happened to carry Refresh for such an occasion as a random Toxic. It's a cheap gimmick otherwise, since the distribution of Refresh and Heal Bell-esque moves isn't too common.
Click to expand...
As already mentioned, Trick doesn't miss without evasion or accuracy modifiers in play, and in the post you quoted, I said Black Sludge would work better, and it can't be undone unless it is traded back somehow.
 
Something I rain on my rain stall.

Metagross ~ choice scarf
252 attack, 252 speed. Adament
Trick
Agility
meteor mash
Earthquake.

Walled by skarmory among others , but I can trick it and ruin it's day.
Keep the scarf sometimes just for mind games and trick it on later in the game for trolling. Damage wise he's not the best dealer on the team but the trick is quite helpful and later on becoming a poormans agility gross helps out.
 
Sajak said:
As already mentioned, Trick doesn't miss without evasion or accuracy modifiers in play, and in the post you quoted, I said Black Sludge would work better, and it can't be undone unless it is traded back somehow.
Click to expand...

black sludge poisons u now??? i thought it only healed the hp of actual poison types....
 
It always poisoned none poison types, which is why Leftovers>Black Sludge even on Poison Pokemon(unless you have item clause) as trick users can trick it back to another team member of yours.
 
I thought Black Sludge healed 6% of Poison types health and damaged 6% of non-poison types. I don't ever recall it Poisoning when My Black Sludge got tricked off my Muk, then back onto my Lanturn =/
 
Status
Not open for further replies.
Back
Top