Sharpedo [QC 3/3]

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Foster

Sorry firecape :/

Sharpedoanimated.gif


http://www.serebii.net/pokedex-bw/319.shtml

QC- [3/3]
GP- [0/2]

Write-up is a work in progress.


[OVERVIEW]

<p>Since being introduced in the third generation, Sharpedo has always been outclassed by other offensive water types and was relegated to the lower tiers. In Black and White, Gamefreak blessed Sharpedo with Speed Boost via the Dream World. Now it poses as a legitimate threat to unprepared or weakened teams. Sharpedo uses its STAB moves complemented by coverage moves such as Earthquake, Ice Beam, and Hidden Power to tear through teams. However, the downside to using Sharpedo is its frailty. With 70/40/40 defenses, it is almost impossible for Sharpedo to switch in even on a resisted move without being severely weakened. Sharpedo is also easily revenged by priority from the likes of Hitmontop and Arcanine. Sharpedo must be played cautiously for it to be effective.</p>

[SET]
name: Physical Sweeper
move 1: Protect
move 2: Waterfall
move 3: Crunch
move 4: Earthquake
item: Life Orb
ability: Speed Boost
nature: Adamant
EVs: 176 HP / 252 Atk / 80 Spe

[SET COMMENTS]
- STABs have fairly good coverage in UU.
- Earthquake to hit Registeel and Empoleon hard.
- Protect to stall for speed boosts.
- EVs give maximum power and enough speed to outpace +nature scarfed base 100s after two speed boosts.
- Remaining EVs go to HP to attempt to give as much bulk as possible.
- Life Orb to maximize attacking power.

[ADDITIONAL COMMENTS]
- Has trouble breaking through bulky waters such as Milotic.
- Cannot 2HKO Chansey bar a crit.
- Easily revenged by Hitmontop's Mach Punch
- Aqua Jet can be used over Protect to gain a speed boost off a revenge kill, and to KO other weakened users of priority.
- Should really only been used late-game, as it has a hard time breaking through healthy teams.
- Greatly appreciates entry hazards as some 2HKOs become OHKOs with Stealth Rock and at least one layer of spikes.
- In particular, Roserade makes an excellent parter as it threatens bulky waters and sets up hazards.
- 148 speed EVs can be used to outspeed everything in the tier without a choice scarf after one boost
- Greatly appreciates rain support.

[SET]
name: Mixed Sweeper
move 1: Protect
move 2: Hydro Pump / Waterfall
move 3: Crunch / Dark Pulse
move 4: Earthquake / Hidden Power Grass
item: Life Orb
ability: Speed Boost
nature: Rash
EVs: 216 Atk / 212 SpA / 80 Spe

[SET COMMENTS]
- Aims to hit some of its common switch-ins harder using its decent special attack stat.
- Protect is still necessary so it can boost its speed.
- 80 speed EVs outspeed +nature scarfed base 100s after two boosts.
-Waterfall fails to OHKO Physically Defensive Arcanine at -1, while Hydro Pump always KOs
- Has a few options for the last move. Earthquake is used for Registeel and Empoleon. Hidden Power Grass is used for Quagsire and Gastrodon.
- EVs maximize your two attacking stats.
- Rash is to optimize Hydro Pump's power.

[ADDITIONAL COMMENTS]
- Still struggles with bulky waters such as Milotic and Blastiose.
- Still easily revenged by Hitmontop.
- Appreciates entry hazards.
- Partners well with grass types such as Roserade for the same reasons as the the physical set.
- Should be used late-game after its counter/checks have been weakened or KOed.
- Ice Beam can be used for a stronger hit on Altaria and Flygon.
- Greatly appreciates rain support.
- Some relevant calcs:
  • 252 Rash Sharpedo Crunch vs. 252/252 Bold Slowbro : 55.3% - 66%
  • 252 Rash Sharpedo Dark Pulse vs. 252/4 Bold Slowbro : 91.9% - 108.6%
  • 252 Rash Sharpedo Waterfall vs. 252/4 Adamant Hitmontop : 55.3% - 65.1%
  • 252 Rash Sharpedo Hydro Pump vs. 252/0 Adamant Hitmontop : 68.1% - 80.3%
[OTHER OPTIONS]

- A Choice Band set can be used in conjuntion with Aqua Jet for more power, but it is played very differently and hurts your ability to sweep at most times
- Toxic can be used to hinder bulky water's staying power
- Can use support such as Taunt and Torment, but offense is strongly advised

[CHECKS AND COUNTERS]
- Hitmontop has no problem revenging Sharpedo with Mach Punch and/or Fake Out
- Is revenged by most priority such as Quick Attack Scyther and Extremespeed Arcanine, especially if you have been weakened by Life Orb
- Bulky waters such as Milotic and Blastiose have nothing to fear at near max health
- Chansey is not 2HKOed by any of Sharpedo's moves bar Choice Band-boosted ones.
- For the mixed set, certain things wall you depending on your moves. If you are lacking Earthquake, Empoleon, Registeel, and Toxicroak can cause trouble. If you are lacking Hidden Power Grass, Quagsire and Gastrodon cause trouble. If you are lacking Ice Beam, Altaria can cause trouble
 
choice band shouldn't be a set probably. sure it lets it hit harder at first, but it mostly defeats the purpose of speed boost. also i know you probably will, but mention about how much hitmontop rapes sharpedo to the point of it being the reason why sharpedo isnt amazing in UU
 
premboy95 said:
choice band shouldn't be a set probably. sure it lets it hit harder at first, but it mostly defeats the purpose of speed boost. also i know you probably will, but mention about how much hitmontop rapes sharpedo to the point of it being the reason why sharpedo isnt amazing in UU
Click to expand...

Choice band gives Sharpedo that extra strength to put a late-game sweep together. Also, an adamant choice band crunch/waterfall can 2HKO Chansey, which is definately something I would want. I'm all ears to what you guys think on this, though.
 
Yeah but Speed Boost isn't usable if you just die the first turn, thats why protect is on every set. Choice Band isn't viable because you cannot use Protect. So what is the point of Speed Boost if you are just going to die before you get any Speed Boosts?
 
Because people would probably switch expecting the obvious Protect anyway.

Choice Band Sharpedo sounds interesting and I'll try it out.
 
So I was playing around with CB Sharpedo today, and it kinda sucks as you guys said. I am going to take it down unless someone has strong reasoning otherwise.
 
slash aqua jet on the physical set next to protect.

also since mixed sets are normally used as a lure, make the nature mild to boost his weaker special attack. kind of taken from the OU analysis, try this set
252 Atk/ 252spa/ 4spe
rash @ life orb
-protect
-hydro pump
-crunch
-ice beam

this lets you hit everything common besides empoleon in UU. even with 0 investment, after one turn youo outspeed base 100's so thats nice. protect lets you scout and stuff. crunch is reliable physical stab while hydro pump is used to ohko a lot of physically bulky mons, as they will normally switch into sharpedo.

and this makes me wonder, is speed investment necessary on the physical set, since you have protect you get one free turn of speed boosting which lets you outspeed almost all common, nonscarved mons. 252hp/ 252atk/ 4 spe might give you a chance to take a hit... but someone needs to test this to make sure
 
I can't really think of any notable differences between Mix and Physical, but you should stress them, whatever they are, and why you should use Mix instead of Physical. If they aren't that big then I don't think It should get its own set.

Waterfall does 84% - 99.2% to Physically defensive Arcanine, always KO'es after Stealth Rock damage.
Waterfall does 109.1% - 128.4% to 0HP Victini, and 92.1% - 108.4% to 252 HP Victini, KO'es on average.
Those were the reasons you posted for Hydro Pump > Waterfall, Stealth Rock damage makes up for that. You also get to use Max Speed instead of 252 Att/SpA.

Crunch does 59.9% - 71.6% to max HP/Def Slowbro, while Dark Pulse does 83.8% - 99%. That's an advantage, Slowbro only needs to be weakened to finish it off with Crunch. If you decide to leave it up, then put Crunch first because it does more damage to Slowbro.
 
premboy95 said:
slash aqua jet on the physical set next to protect.

also since mixed sets are normally used as a lure, make the nature mild to boost his weaker special attack. kind of taken from the OU analysis, try this set
252 Atk/ 252spa/ 4spe
rash @ life orb
-protect
-hydro pump
-crunch
-ice beam


this lets you hit everything common besides empoleon in UU. even with 0 investment, after one turn youo outspeed base 100's so thats nice. protect lets you scout and stuff. crunch is reliable physical stab while hydro pump is used to ohko a lot of physically bulky mons, as they will normally switch into sharpedo.


and this makes me wonder, is speed investment necessary on the physical set, since you have protect you get one free turn of speed boosting which lets you outspeed almost all common, nonscarved mons. 252hp/ 252atk/ 4 spe might give you a chance to take a hit... but someone needs to test this to make sure
Click to expand...


I figured having the speed would make it easier to outspeed scarfed pokemon. Also, what good does Aqua Jet do? If you can come up some important situation where it is worth having I'll add it. Also, with no way to boost his attack I am a little hesitant to not use a +Attack nature. Are there any specific reasons to use a +Special Attack? Other than that, the set you posted is very similar, so maybe I could just slash ice beam for the last option?





Mooo said:
I can't really think of any notable differences between Mix and Physical, but you should stress them, whatever they are, and why you should use Mix instead of Physical. If they aren't that big then I don't think It should get its own set.


Waterfall does 84% - 99.2% to Physically defensive Arcanine, always KO'es after Stealth Rock damage.
Waterfall does 109.1% - 128.4% to 0HP Victini, and 92.1% - 108.4% to 252 HP Victini, KO'es on average.
Those were the reasons you posted for Hydro Pump > Waterfall, Stealth Rock damage makes up for that. You also get to use Max Speed instead of 252 Att/SpA.


Crunch does 59.9% - 71.6% to max HP/Def Slowbro, while Dark Pulse does 83.8% - 99%. That's an advantage, Slowbro only needs to be weakened to finish it off with Crunch. If you decide to leave it up, then put Crunch first because it does more damage to Slowbro.
Click to expand...


Mooo, I think you are forgetting Intimidate on Arcanine. At -1 Atk, Waterfall does 55.6% - 66.1%, not a KO after Stealth Rock.

purplefingers said:
- Aims to hit some of its common switch-ins harder using its decent special attack stat
Click to expand...

Sharpedo can hit switch ins that would otherwise wall sharpedo with some of its special attacks, such as hp grass for quag/gastro, ice beam for altaria, and dark pulse for slowbro. Therefore I believe it should have its own set.

As far as slowbro goes, it will almost always come in at close to max health due to regenerator. If it comes in after a KO, it can hurt sharpedo before it can 2HKO.


Thanks for the opinions guys, keep 'em comin.
 
Yeah but Speed Boost isn't usable if you just die the first turn, thats why protect is on every set. Choice Band isn't viable because you cannot use Protect. So what is the point of Speed Boost if you are just going to die before you get any Speed Boosts?
Click to expand...

Choice Band is not unviable at all. You just can't play it the same way you play Protect. For starters, with Choice Band, you can use Aqua Jet as well for helping with some revenging so that helps a bit.

But the idea with any speed booster lacking protect is to revenge kill or revenge-threaten something already slower than you. That way, you attack and your boost kicks in at the end of the turn. That is all that is needed to set up. You don't ALWAYS have to run Protect with Speed Boost. It's mainly there for convenience. I wouldn't dismiss Choice Band Sharpedo so quickly. Not taking Life Orb Damage is always a plus, especially when something that resists most priority still fucking dies from it so easily
 
Added checks and counters and other options.

RaikouLover said:
Choice Band is not unviable at all. You just can't play it the same way you play Protect. For starters, with Choice Band, you can use Aqua Jet as well for helping with some revenging so that helps a bit.

But the idea with any speed booster lacking protect is to revenge kill or revenge-threaten something already slower than you. That way, you attack and your boost kicks in at the end of the turn. That is all that is needed to set up. You don't ALWAYS have to run Protect with Speed Boost. It's mainly there for convenience. I wouldn't dismiss Choice Band Sharpedo so quickly. Not taking Life Orb Damage is always a plus, especially when something that resists most priority still fucking dies from it so easily
Click to expand...

I put choice band in other options, as it was ok but really lacked the ability to get the job done as an effective sweeper.

After reading what you said about protect, I was thinking substitue may be an option in place of it. Basically, you just sub against something you will force out. This way, you still get your speed boosts and are not weak to priority. Thoughts?
 
Ok so I spoke with a guy named Pokemanic Bill on PO about the analysis. Basically, he had suggestions that would clean up the ubiquitous slashes in the mixed set and he suggested a few general comments to add as well. After some changes dark pulse and ice beam have been moved to AC, hydro pump replaced waterfall, and the nature was changed to rash. Thanks a lot for the advice man.

I'll get some some important calcs in there later, but for now I'd appreciate advice/checks from some QC members. Also I don't mean to double post but this has fallen to the second page and seems to have looked over.
 
aqua jet is useful on the physical set, so it can kill effing hitmontop when its weakened. it goes alround all priority bar extremespeed which makes it useful against mons u know have priority
 
I made a few changes. On the physical set, I tweaked the EVs to allow slightly more bulk. On the mixed set, I re-slashed Dark Pulse and provided some calcs which are helpful to know when playing with Sharpedo.
 
Pray tell why Sharpedo actually needs HP EVs in the physical Speed Boost set. If anything, they should be invested in speed so Sharpedo can potentially outrun some +1 threats after a Speed boost. Since Sharpedo is so, SO frail anyways, I feel HP investment is useless.
 
is a substitute set viable? it would play similarly to LO, only with sub instead of protect (and leftovers to help make more subs).

Sharpedo @leftovers
Adamant/ speed boost
252 att/12 hp/ 240 speed
Waterfall/ Earthquake/ Crunch/ substitute.

it protects sharpedo from priority and can help him accumulate speed boosts. 12 hp lets him get up more subs (but the EVs can be fiddled with as desired.) just a thought after seeing how badly subspeed boost yanmega has been f'in me up
 
Make sure to mention that the ability being used is Speed Boost. I know it is obvious, but just for clarification purposes. Also, I think that the Mixed set is more potent than the physical set, due to its wall breaking potential.
 
Nice, I was starting to think this was dead (thanks for reminding me Oglemi). I added the changes you guys suggested. I should have this written up soon.
 
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