Venomoth Discussion

Boarbaque

Venomoth
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It may be outclassed by Yanmega in terms of being a sweeper, but with Sleep Powder, Quiver Dance and Baton Pass it can really help your sweepers destroy the opponent.

Smeargle is also capable of Sleep Powder, Quiver Dance and Baton pass but Venomoth has useful bug STAB, Tinted Lens and much better stats all around.

Base Stats:
HP: 70
ATK: 65
DEF: 60
SPATK: 90
SPDEF: 75
SPEED: 90

Abilities:
Shield Dust - Blocks the added effects of attacks taken. (Fake Out for example)
Tinted Lens - Doubles the power of "not very effective" moves. (Bug Buzz would be nuetral to Steels for example)
(DW) Wonder Skin - Halves the accuracy of status changing moves used against Venomoth. (Thunder Wave would have a 50% of paralysis for example)

Sets:
Baton Pass
Venomoth @ Leftovers
- Baton Pass
- Quiver Dance
- Sleep Powder
- Bug Buzz/Roost/Substitute
ability: Tinted Lens/Wonder Skin/Shield Dust
nature: Timid
evs: 252 HP / 4 SpA / 252 Spe

The EVs in Speed allow you to outspeed most foes and go for a Sleep Powder which then allows you to set up 1 or 2 Quiver Dances.

The EVs in HP allow you to survive any surprise wakeups by the opponent, so you can safely pass onto a special attacker to sweep.

Tinted lens allows you to get rid of pesky pokemon that are giving you trouble and may trick the opponent into thinking you are not a baton passer (its also useful if you got taunted after a quiver dance).

Shield Dust blocks the secondary effects of moves, like Fake Out.

Wonder Skin, the exact opposite of Shield Dust, halves the chance of status moves working on Venomoth but doesn't block the secondary effects of attacking moves.

A great partner for Venomoth is Sheer Force Life Orb Nidoking. Most people debate that the main problem of Nidoking is that its too slow, but after one quiver dance its ready to wreck havoc.

Sweeper
Venomoth @ Life Orb
- Quiver Dance
- Sleep Powder
- Bug Buzz
- Psychic/Hidden Power Ground
ability: Tinted Lens
nature: Timid
evs: 4 Def / 252 SpA / 252 Spe

Sleep Powder to set up Quiver Dances. Bug Buzz and Psychic give you almost completely nuetral cover with the aide of Tinted Lens.
 
If you want to go with the Baton Pass lead, you should use Shield Dust to block stuff like Fake Out from flinching you. Look out for taunt, though, especially if you use roost.
 
I guess we will have to wait until NU for Vena's Specs/Lense strategy.

But In terms of the current UU metagame, I have found Venamoth to be an okay sweeper and a great passer. (Although yes, Yanmega definitely outclasses it sweep-wise). The main advantage our moth has is that it does not require rs support. (Although it still helps)

Nice work on the sets!
 
I guess we will have to wait until NU for Vena's Specs/Lense strategy.

But In terms of the current UU metagame, I have found Venamoth to be an okay sweeper and a great passer. (Although yes, Yanmega definitely outclasses it sweep-wise). The main advantage our moth has is that it does not require rs support. (Although it still helps)

Nice work on the sets!
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Venomoth can also soak up Tspikes, which is very useful.

I actually think Baton Pass is than Psychic on the sweeper set. Crobat, Cobalion, Charizard and Moltres are the only things you're ever likely to see in UU that will 4x resist Bug Buzz, and you can outspeed and either sleep powder or pass your boosts on to a check/counter after a single QD.
 
houndoom is a great pertner, providing awesome synergy and can be passed qd boosts if an arcanine or what have you comes in to threaten
 
houndoom is a great pertner, providing awesome synergy and can be passed qd boosts if an arcanine or what have you comes in to threaten
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No. If you see an Arcanine, you'll be better off passing to an Arcanine. The defensive synergy between Houndoom and Moth is horrible and Arcanine using literally any move besides Flare Blitz will ruin your strategy (even if you are using Flare Blitz, the numbers for LO Espeed aren't pretty).

Blocking against Fire types has always been a problem with using Baton Pass Venomoth. Other than that, the best recipient you could even dream of is Nidoking. It has the best special movepool in the tier with the best ability to make use of it, and at +2, it's going to be GG if you don't have an Azumarril on your team, or unless it's weakened after the pass and you can get an Ice Sharder in. Sometimes, stall teams are GG'd at +1. It also resists Rock and does not care about Thunder Wave or Toxic if it fails to KO a target.

Venomoth really doesn't need any moves besides Bug Buzz to go to work, since it can just keep boosting and passing like a bitch as long as you can keep it alive. It can lategame sweep on its own as a last resort, but any attempt to use Venomoth purely as a sweeper is just a waste of potential, even when it isn't competing with Yanmega.

Also, about this stuff regarding Yanmega outclassing it: Yanmega getting speed every turn does not save it from walls. Registeel will block it all day and Milotic can do the same without a lick of Special Defense investment. Empoleon can easily take two HP Grounds and KO with Ice Beam or Scald. Speed Boost Yanmega kind of just sucks in general, especially when you've got Tinted Lens to compete with. And Tinted Lens does not get Quiver Dance. :(
 
Venomoth is so underrated it's insane. I use it in OU (see my RMT) to pass to Nidoking, and it comepletely wrecks house. Wonder Skin is by far the most useful ability I've found on BP Venomoth. I can't count how many times I've missed a Sleep Powder but then Wonder Skin blocks a Spore/Thunder Wave/Stun Spore/etc and allows me to Sleep Powder again next turn and successfully pull off the pass. It's great because it really only needs one Quiver Dance before Nidoking can sweep. I've also had a couple matches where Nidoking goes down to something stupid like getting a low damage roll and then taking a critical hit in the same turn, and after that happened, I actually used Venomoth as a backup sweeper.

I'm wondering if my team could be adjusted to be a UU team.. I think half the team already is UU, anyone down to work on a Venomoth-Nidoking team for UU with me? =)
 
Venomoth as a sweeper is not outclassed by Yanmega. The only thing that Yanmega has on Venomoth is Speed Boost and higher special attack and even then Venomoth can consistently boost that in conjunction with Sleep Powder

Bug Buzz + Psychic gives complete neutral coverage on all pokemon. Sludge Bomb works but the only thing that Venomoth can't hit is Cobalion (barring Shedinja ).
 
Kind of random but I'd just like to point out that at least in-game, Wonder Skin also halves the accuracy of Taunt and likely Encore too. This could allow you to escape fast Taunter and Sleep them or pull off the baton pass. I don't know if this is implemented in PO, however.
 
Pwnemon said:
might want to check page numbers, bro.
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There is currently only 1 page for this thread. (at the time of this post) unless your computer's formatting is somehow different I don't know why you'd have multiple pages.

Anyway, I feel Venomoth has become quite superb as a Quiver Dance Sweeper, and Sleep Powder is making it an extraordinarily a bitch to take down now. -.-
 
FastFlygon said:
Kind of random but I'd just like to point out that at least in-game, Wonder Skin also halves the accuracy of Taunt and likely Encore too. This could allow you to escape fast Taunter and Sleep them or pull off the baton pass. I don't know if this is implemented in PO, however.
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Unfortunately I am pretty sure that Wonder Skin is not legal outside of the Dream World tier with Venomoth. If it was that would make Venomoth even more of a bitch to deal with.
 
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