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Most Generation PRNG Help / Information

I'm trying to hatch a Quiet shiny Shellos. When I try to verify my seed with Elm in Heart Gold, the search gives me different results than what I actually got. Am I doing it right or what?

Seed: D0100A35 (delay 2602)
Time: 12/15/11 16:00:28
elm calls (actual game) k,p,e,p,p,k,k,k,e
RNG versions: 9.81 AND 9.91
 
lucariojr said:
I'm trying to hatch a Quiet shiny Shellos. When I try to verify my seed with Elm in Heart Gold, the search gives me different results than what I actually got. Am I doing it right or what?

Seed: D0100A35 (delay 2602)
Time: 12/15/11 16:00:28
elm calls (actual game) k,p,e,p,p,k,k,k,e
RNG versions: 9.81 AND 9.91
Click to expand...

How different? Does Seed to Time find results for your calls? If so, the NPC is probably advancing by a couple of frames (usually only 1 - 2). So if you hit your seed, you might get E instead of K because the NPC advanced by 2 frames. Or maybe you get P if the NPC only advanced by 1.

Edit: Nvm, I just noticed that you said those calls are the ones you're getting in game. So I pasted the seed in RNG Reporter and opened Seed to Time and I entered the calls you said you got, and it said you hit delay 2509, which is odd (and your target is even). That might mean that you hit odd delays without a GBA game inserted, so try inserting one. If you do hit even delays without a GBA game inserted, then make sure nothing's inserted.
 
I meant like I search k,p,e,p,p,k,k,k,e and it gives the result e,k,p,e,p,p,k,k,k,e,p,k. Is this normal or am I going crazy? (also I'm INSIDE the daycare and I had a game inserted I think)
 
lucariojr said:
I meant like I search k,p,e,p,p,k,k,k,e and it gives the result e,k,p,e,p,p,k,k,k,e,p,k. Is this normal or am I going crazy? (also I'm INSIDE the daycare and I had a game inserted I think)
Click to expand...

Oh, that is weird. It skipped one frame even though there are no NPCs inside the DC. Idk why this happened, but Iirc, it has happened to me before. And as long as you got your shiny egg it shouldn't really matter :P
 
Princess of Johto said:
Oh, that is weird. It skipped one frame even though there are no NPCs inside the DC. Idk why this happened, but Iirc, it has happened to me before. And as long as you got your shiny egg it shouldn't really matter :P
Click to expand...

The game probably needed to determine some kind of value. Could be for some of the daily/weekly events, just resave on that date and you should be fine.
 
lucariojr said:
I meant like I search k,p,e,p,p,k,k,k,e and it gives the result e,k,p,e,p,p,k,k,k,e,p,k. Is this normal or am I going crazy? (also I'm INSIDE the daycare and I had a game inserted I think)
Click to expand...

This is a result of parents in the daycare already. One parent means you start on Frame 2 and 2 parents means you start on Frame 3. I've had this happen consistently.

-EDIT- I assume that the pokemon moving to the left may throw it off
 
My parent's aren't in the daycare yet, and I made sure I don't have any roamers. I STILL can't get my elm calls to match up. I switched to an easier to hit seed too: F3160269 .
 
lucariojr said:
My parent's aren't in the daycare yet, and I made sure I don't have any roamers. I STILL can't get my elm calls to match up. I switched to an easier to hit seed too: F3160269 .
Click to expand...

I assume this is related to the last post. If so, that kind of thing happens all the time. At least for myself and anyone I've helped. I don't know what the skipping ahead is caused by, but it really doesn't matter. Each response corresponds to a frame. You can easily find what that frame is just by seeing where you started in the sequence. Iirc, your current frame is the same as the the number of the last response you received. I may be off by one here since my memory is a little foggy.
 
Speaking of which are there some seeds you just CAN NOT hit?
For example, I tried to hit a seed a while back and I always got one above or one below. I tried for hours on end. I decided to switch to another seed w/o resaving and I hit it very easily. Is there a reason for this?
 
V4Victini said:
Speaking of which are there some seeds you just CAN NOT hit?
For example, I tried to hit a seed a while back and I always got one above or one below. I tried for hours on end. I decided to switch to another seed w/o resaving and I hit it very easily. Is there a reason for this?
Click to expand...

I sort of know what you're talking about. I believe it's not so much that you cannot hit them as it is really, really difficult. Although, I wouldn't doubt that there's a few impossible ones out there depending on area.

I assume the NPC movement in 4th gen is the same as 5th. That being said, every movement pulls from the rng twice. That causes the appearance of frame skipping. I ran into this a lot when trying to hit frame 114 for a starter. Anyway, one of these calls picks a direction, and the second is used to reset the timer to either 16, 32, 48 or 64 delays. As you can imagine, 16 would result in a much smaller window of opportunity. Further, if you have 2 timers end simultaneously, the effect is of course stacked. It's easy to see how this would become unmanageable.

For these, your only hope is to try to switch the frame even/oddness and trick the NPCs into not stealing your desired seed.
 
Kafei- said:
ops... well... how i can calculate the frame i need for ID and SID? for example another ID and Sid i need is this: ID 15048 SID 39400 thanks. and sorry for my bad english.
Click to expand...
I checked again and you can find an ID/SID combo that serves the same purpose as the first one you were looking for on frame 34827. Looking for a frame requires that you know how to use Microsoft Excel.
 
I don't follow RNG news much is I was wondering has 3rd Gen RNGing been cracked so you use a cartridge to RNG or just the emulators still?
 
Snapback said:
I don't follow RNG news much is I was wondering has 3rd Gen RNGing been cracked so you use a cartridge to RNG or just the emulators still?
Click to expand...
You can do it with Emerald, and with Ruby/Sapphire if the cartridge's internal battery is dead. FR/LG is not possible as far as I know, but I could be wrong.
 
Silly question: do the seeds and PIDs not change between Gen III and Gen IV? I got a nonshiny seed + PID off of PokeRNG's Emerald version, punched the details into Pandora's Box (4th Gen), and put a resultant TID/SID combo in with the same details of the nonshiny seed (but shiny this time) and got a shiny seed for that same Pokemon. That all seems logical and it seems obvious that that is how it works, but I want to make absolutely certain before I try to get my TID/SID in Emerald. Thanks for your consideration.

Also, provided all that is true and I'm ready to start, what is the usual delay range for Emerald's new game scenes and when are the TID and SID determined?

EDIT: One more thing; is it possible for one to find out other useful Pokemon a TID/SID combination can get through some program or spreadsheet?
 
The TID cannot be RNG'd for, even on an emulator. It's set about when you hit OK on the name entry screen. The SID is done after the last line from Birch.
 
How does a person know he's hit the right SID without the TID present? I couldn't find any literature on the method to this. Is it only the SID that matters, or the TID too? If they both matter but the TID is random, how are people getting perfect shiny Pokemon from Gen III? (Or if it is just random, are their perfect shiny Pokemon not entirely RNG'd?)
 
The TID is determined separately before the SID. So using save states on an emulator you can determine what the TID is, then determine the SID required to make the spread shiny.

There is no way to do this on a retail cart. At all.
 
So, I guess it goes something like:

1) Complete the name creation stage.
2) Make savestate.
3) Continue past the rest of the dialogue and Birch's last comment.
4) Start game, find TID, turn game off without saving.
5) Put TID in Pandora's Box with PID to find a good SID.
6) Resume savestate. RNG the SID.
7) Confirm it's the right SID via somehow.

I've never used savestates so I don't completely understand them, but is that about how it's done?
 
Save states basically record the entire RAM of the game. When loaded the game resumes at the exact point where you made the state.

As for the SID the easiest way is to get the starter, do an in-game save, then load the save in Enciclopedia Pokemon to check the SID on the pokemon.
 
Cool, thanks for all your help. Is using a code that gives the SID immediately, in a place where the TID would be, looked down upon? Because I found a way to do that as soon as I get the starter.
 
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