I honestly believe if it weren't for the childish anime, Pokemon would be perceived as a standard RPG and be played by those of all ages. In my encounters with those who say Pokemon is childish they also bring up why Ash isn't good at battling or why he hasn't aged. I have tried to explain Competitive Battling and in the end they say it is bullshit (Or I have confused them to the point of ignorance.) and say they will own me with Pikachu or Charizard. All faults do to the anime. So, does the anime give Pokemon a bad reputation to Pokemon?
-
Welcome to Smogon! Take a moment to read the Introduction to Smogon for a run-down on everything Smogon, and make sure you take some time to read the global rules.
Does the anime give a bad reputation to Pokemon?
- Thread starter Shiny Magikarp
- Start date
Yes it does.
Our heroes are rather incompetent; How many times have you yelled at someone to let their pokemon evolve? There's hardly any consequences to a pokemon's evolution, unless your name is Paras. Pokemon hardly act like they would have in the games, for example Venusaur is usually portrayed as slow moving and we all know that isn't the case. I could mention pokedex entries but the games don't even show that either. Attack moves are usually have some white light indicating its a cool move or what not. And so on and so forth.
The only good thing about the series is really Sabrina who was smart enough to beat up Ash with her psychic powers and that was ages ago.
Our heroes are rather incompetent; How many times have you yelled at someone to let their pokemon evolve? There's hardly any consequences to a pokemon's evolution, unless your name is Paras. Pokemon hardly act like they would have in the games, for example Venusaur is usually portrayed as slow moving and we all know that isn't the case. I could mention pokedex entries but the games don't even show that either. Attack moves are usually have some white light indicating its a cool move or what not. And so on and so forth.
The only good thing about the series is really Sabrina who was smart enough to beat up Ash with her psychic powers and that was ages ago.
Completely agree. Although it's raised the popularity of Pokémon itself, it's just a complete embarrassment to the fanbase. Pokémon fans are called childish and immature all the time (including myself, at one point), and Ash isn't helping our cause. Many of the people who call Pokémon childish were introduced to it by the anime, and clearly thought it was stupid. Maybe if they started with the games, they might have enjoyed the franchise a lot more and understood it for what it really is.
Despite this, the cartoon used to have a fucking amazing theme song.
Despite this, the cartoon used to have a fucking amazing theme song.
Yes, I think the anime is probably the main source of the "kiddy" factor of pokemon. Let's face it, the anime is mostly marketed towards kids, and it gives the series a childish feeling overall. It doesn't really help that the anime is probably one of the largest aspects of the franchise and probably the one thing everyone in the world knows about. I actually know people who legitimately don't know whether TV show or the games came first; and for the most part games based on movies/TV shows are crummy overall.
So yes, I believe that the anime is to blame for a good deal of the hate the series gets for being childish, when it is in fact one of the most complex RPG's to ever exist.
So yes, I believe that the anime is to blame for a good deal of the hate the series gets for being childish, when it is in fact one of the most complex RPG's to ever exist.
Took the words off of my keyboard.
False Sense: Most people i know believe the anime came first.
It doesn't help that Ash looks like Red and has all of the starters. Not to mention that he travels with Gym Leaders.
it is really not that complex
HA! Does it ever? The anime, being a television series, will be portrayed as the center of Pokemon media (because people use television more then anything else). Since the anime is made for a younger audience and the fact that it is the most recognized aspect of the fanbase, people automatically mark Pokemon as a whole to be for younger kids when it is in no way for any projected age group (sorta). Finally, Since it's supposedly a product for young children it is immediately labeled as "uncool" or "lame" by those of an older age group. This is why I Hate the anime with a burning passion as does most everyone. Sadly, the damage is already done, and Pokemon will forever be marked as that "childhood game you used to play." It's a damn shame too...
I tried to give a broader explanation as to "why," hope it helps. ^^
I tried to give a broader explanation as to "why," hope it helps. ^^
No. I think it does not.
Really, I think a lot of your perceptions are twisted by either memories or current experiences of high/middle school and based on that experience. Once you get out of that incredibly judgmental environment a LOT of the stigma falls away. This is because, quite simply put, in adult society no one cares. And believe me when I say people of all ages DO play it. You just don't see it in middle/high school because no one in that environment wants to parade it around. You'll start seeing them come out of the woodwork once you get to college/university.
But I digress, that is not the sole reason for this. There IS some stigma and a pervading perception of Pokemon as a "kids" thing, particularly among teenagers and people who simply don't know much about the series. It is unfair, however, to blame this all on the show. For one, the quality of the show matters very little for the perception by those who are ignorant of the series. They've never watched the thing, so it wouldn't matter if it was something amazing and deep on the level of the Gargoyles animated series or something like that; all that they know is that kids watch it, and therefore it must be a kids thing.
It's also a silly belief to think that most ignorant people believe that Pokemon is mainly a TV show. Simply put, the anime is not as popular among kids as it once was, due to rising amounts of competition from things like Bakumon or whatever other crap kids are watching these days; the GAMES are definitely the driving part of the series among kids now. Most people who know of Pokemon by now know that the games are a big deal. So saying that the anime is the only source of their impressions is unfair.
Then there's the simple fact that because we play the games so deeply we forget that on the surface the games looks like kids games. A cursory glance at the game would dispel no one's impression that the series is directed at kids, because the games are so colorful and kid friendly. The stories, even the more recent ones, are pretty simplistic and full of the type of cheesy moral lessons that people expect in kids shows. The Pokemon are all cute cuddly things or the sort of cool things little boys drool over like Haxorus. There's nothing in them that would leave a different impression.
Indeed, the games are largely marketed towards kids. And most people know this. However this doesn't necessarily give it a "bad reputation" to anyone who has graduated high school. Plenty of things aimed at kidshave gained more widespread acceptance in recent years; just look at things like Toy Story 3 and Harry Potter for examples. It's no longer the case that people see kids things as things only for kids.
Generally the only people who give a damn about it being kid friendly will be those dumbass teenagers in middle and high school. And believe me when I say that after you get out of that environment, those opinions matter about as much as the price of cheese on the moon. They only reject it in order to convince themselves and other's that they've grown up anyway (while simultaneously proving beyond a doubt that they have not grown up at all).
And that's not even mentioning all the GOOD things the anime has brought to the series. Believe me when I say we would not have Pokemon as we do today if not for the success of it. So really, stop putting down something that has ensured we still have Pokemon games coming out almost 15 years after the series first launched. This very site indirectly owes its existence to it.
Really, I think a lot of your perceptions are twisted by either memories or current experiences of high/middle school and based on that experience. Once you get out of that incredibly judgmental environment a LOT of the stigma falls away. This is because, quite simply put, in adult society no one cares. And believe me when I say people of all ages DO play it. You just don't see it in middle/high school because no one in that environment wants to parade it around. You'll start seeing them come out of the woodwork once you get to college/university.
But I digress, that is not the sole reason for this. There IS some stigma and a pervading perception of Pokemon as a "kids" thing, particularly among teenagers and people who simply don't know much about the series. It is unfair, however, to blame this all on the show. For one, the quality of the show matters very little for the perception by those who are ignorant of the series. They've never watched the thing, so it wouldn't matter if it was something amazing and deep on the level of the Gargoyles animated series or something like that; all that they know is that kids watch it, and therefore it must be a kids thing.
It's also a silly belief to think that most ignorant people believe that Pokemon is mainly a TV show. Simply put, the anime is not as popular among kids as it once was, due to rising amounts of competition from things like Bakumon or whatever other crap kids are watching these days; the GAMES are definitely the driving part of the series among kids now. Most people who know of Pokemon by now know that the games are a big deal. So saying that the anime is the only source of their impressions is unfair.
Then there's the simple fact that because we play the games so deeply we forget that on the surface the games looks like kids games. A cursory glance at the game would dispel no one's impression that the series is directed at kids, because the games are so colorful and kid friendly. The stories, even the more recent ones, are pretty simplistic and full of the type of cheesy moral lessons that people expect in kids shows. The Pokemon are all cute cuddly things or the sort of cool things little boys drool over like Haxorus. There's nothing in them that would leave a different impression.
Indeed, the games are largely marketed towards kids. And most people know this. However this doesn't necessarily give it a "bad reputation" to anyone who has graduated high school. Plenty of things aimed at kidshave gained more widespread acceptance in recent years; just look at things like Toy Story 3 and Harry Potter for examples. It's no longer the case that people see kids things as things only for kids.
Generally the only people who give a damn about it being kid friendly will be those dumbass teenagers in middle and high school. And believe me when I say that after you get out of that environment, those opinions matter about as much as the price of cheese on the moon. They only reject it in order to convince themselves and other's that they've grown up anyway (while simultaneously proving beyond a doubt that they have not grown up at all).
And that's not even mentioning all the GOOD things the anime has brought to the series. Believe me when I say we would not have Pokemon as we do today if not for the success of it. So really, stop putting down something that has ensured we still have Pokemon games coming out almost 15 years after the series first launched. This very site indirectly owes its existence to it.
Yeah I agree. I was reading the Guinness World Record for longest anime-based tv series and Pokemon was excluded because of their incorrect assumption that the games were based on the Anime, not the other way around. It also dosn't help that the anime came out before the games in most parts of the world.
This is completely right, things have been seen as kid shows but people out of targeted age group love them anyway. Like My little pony: Friendship is magic, or the transformers tv series throughout the years. I, myself am a fan of the little blue engine Thomas the tank engine, Ever since I was a toddler. But if you ask me, the newer pokemon series is still able to save itself and be awesome.
Ehhh, I kinda have to agree with Jimera0 a bit here. The anime is often seen as childish, yes, but you cannot blame it for attempting to give the whole franchise a bad reputation.
True, the anime tends to be directed towards children with the sort of goofy stuff that happens on there, but in reality, all the anime surmounts to is an aside that can be used by the franchise to help boost sales of the games, imo. A gimmick with the intent of luring kids into playing the series in the hope that they will become attached & start buying future games, since I know & you all know that the Pokémon games are easy to become addicted to, & it works. The anime pretty much always has been & always will be a tool to increase exposure of the franchise, & if the games are continuing to pull in new players as well as potentially keeping veterans like me around, why stop making episodes for the anime?
Then again, haters are going to hate, no matter what. Just because that teenager from High School made fun of you for playing Pokémon, because that person thought it was a children's game because of the anime or some other abstract idea, does not mean that Pokémon is a children's game, period — that is their opinion, not yours. I personally think that Pokémon is a game for people of all ages. Young Children for the story side. Teenagers & Adults for the thrills & the competitive side. The anime has, well should have zero influence on whether the franchise is "childish" or not — People outside of the target audience will play the game regardless.
Basically, take what people think about Pokémon with a grain of salt. Do not others influence what you think of the franchise. The anime, while directed at kids, has been a brilliant marketing tool for the franchise, & without the exposure it brought to the series, Pokémon will not be where it is today. We should be thankful for what the anime has done, not shun it because it is aimed at kids.
True, the anime tends to be directed towards children with the sort of goofy stuff that happens on there, but in reality, all the anime surmounts to is an aside that can be used by the franchise to help boost sales of the games, imo. A gimmick with the intent of luring kids into playing the series in the hope that they will become attached & start buying future games, since I know & you all know that the Pokémon games are easy to become addicted to, & it works. The anime pretty much always has been & always will be a tool to increase exposure of the franchise, & if the games are continuing to pull in new players as well as potentially keeping veterans like me around, why stop making episodes for the anime?
Then again, haters are going to hate, no matter what. Just because that teenager from High School made fun of you for playing Pokémon, because that person thought it was a children's game because of the anime or some other abstract idea, does not mean that Pokémon is a children's game, period — that is their opinion, not yours. I personally think that Pokémon is a game for people of all ages. Young Children for the story side. Teenagers & Adults for the thrills & the competitive side. The anime has, well should have zero influence on whether the franchise is "childish" or not — People outside of the target audience will play the game regardless.
Basically, take what people think about Pokémon with a grain of salt. Do not others influence what you think of the franchise. The anime, while directed at kids, has been a brilliant marketing tool for the franchise, & without the exposure it brought to the series, Pokémon will not be where it is today. We should be thankful for what the anime has done, not shun it because it is aimed at kids.
This, I think to a strong extent. I'd guess that most of those deriding Pokemon as "kiddy" also deride Mario, Scribblenauts, and any other game without a big red 15 or 18 label on the box as kiddy.
Anyway Jimera0 has the right idea here.
Indeed I'd say Pokemon's behind-the-scenes complexity is about average. But it's one of the few RPGs where the complexity really matters because it's one of the few non-online RPGs to have good competitive multiplayer. Add the turn-based nature meaning there's no importance to fast keyboard and mouse work or quick decision making, and the tactics and strategy is all there is letting the hidden complexity shine through.
This is a bit of a negative thread, but it really does make a great point. When people at my school were more childish (like 10 or something) but still believed themselves too old for the series, while myself would stay playing it, they would come up to me and say "PIKACHU!!! IRON TAIL!!!" in a... idk.. offensive way? Once I bring up a wiki page showing the release dates of red and blue and the release date of the anime then they usually leave me alone for a month or 2, realizing how dickish (it should be a word) they had been. The problem is getting them in front of a computer screen.
I disagree completely with jimeraO, where are your sources for this? Mine are experience. And just because adults like it, it still turns off high schoolers and middle schoolers just as you said, so the final verdict is that even if the anime isn't the main source of knowledge of the franchise (which I am pretty sure it is despite what you think) it STILL has a negative effect on the franchise itself. And whoever said that the anime is like MLP better be trolling or I will flip the sh*t because it isn't even close.
The anime has a bad influence on the fans too. When you try to use Thundershock on a Rhyhorn just because you saw Ash do it doesn't mean it's right. And the legion of people who use Charizard expecting it to be of Uber quality disappoints me as well.
Anyways I have personally told people I still play Pokemon and they hardly care in Middle/High School. They may say ''Why don't you play CoD?'' or something like that and I simply say that shit is simply not popular enough. (Pokemon is the second best selling Video game Franchise and Mario is the first.)
And like Basileus said above, whoever compared Pokemon to that MLP shit should be ashamed of themselves.
Anyways I have personally told people I still play Pokemon and they hardly care in Middle/High School. They may say ''Why don't you play CoD?'' or something like that and I simply say that shit is simply not popular enough. (Pokemon is the second best selling Video game Franchise and Mario is the first.)
And like Basileus said above, whoever compared Pokemon to that MLP shit should be ashamed of themselves.
Well, I mean, it's not like the majority of high schoolers (right now) that play Pokèmon started during high school...most older players I've seen tend to have played since they were little kids. They got older and kept playing, which seems to usually be the case. The show is geared towards younger audiences because that's the general group of people watching cartoons during the day. If you want more mature shows, you need to start watching Adult Swim or something.
And what bad reputation are we even discussing? Pokèmon has always been a "kiddie game," with or without the anime. It's not a bad anime, even, also speaking from personal experience. If anything, it makes me want to play the game more, with awesome episodes like Ash vs. Paul when Infernape goes ballistic.
Last time I checked Pokemon was the third best-selling nintendo franchise, behind LoZ. I don't know if it changed recently, but you may want to check that.
Edit for below: Hmm.. I guess times change.
Wikipedia has Pokemon as second, behind Mario, http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_best-selling_video_game_franchises . Zelda's some way down the list and not even the third-highest Nintendo franchise, that's the Wii games.
I do watch adult swim. In fact, family guy and bleach are 2 of my favorite shows. I am trying to bring up the point that the anime is a huge turn off for older viewers and takes up a LARGE chunk of the fanbase. It is dragging in new young members, but in a sense of competitive battlers, are numbers are dwindling and the anime isn't helping.
Really now? And where are YOUR sources for making such a claim? As far as I can tell, the number of competitive battlers is higher than ever thanks to things like the GBU. They're just not all on our simulators anymore because its no longer the only way to do online competitive battling. The anime has and still is increasing the number of competitive battlers by increasing the number of people playing Pokemon. Plain and simple.
I don't see where you can get away with calling me down for not having sources beyond my experience and reason where yours are only based around experience yourself. Please, before you set up a straw man argument make sure you aren't setting yourself up as well.
Anyway, as for the claim that the anime mis-educates people about the series....
1) That doesn't count as a "reputation" it's a different problem
2) From what I've heard they've gotten MUCH better about that in recent years in the anime, and honestly, you learn more GOOD information than bad from the anime anyway.
3) And assuming that ANYONE who comes to competitive battling won't be ignorant of something big is a bit silly. Don't you remember how huge of a learning curve it was for YOU to get into this? And how many of those people are still, y'know kids? Of course they're going to think dumb crap, they don't know any better yet. The anime has nothing to do with it.
Anyway, my point is that it doesn't give a "bad reputation" to anyone that matters. Seriously, as IAR said, don't let some dumbass 15 year old tell you what you can and cannot play. If you're sooooo worried about being shunned in high school, just don't play it where they can see it or talk about it where they can hear it. And really, the opinion of anyone who judges you on something so incredibly shallow really shouldn't bother you, since they're making it abundantly clear THEY are the ones that haven't grown up. And in the long term what they think will mean absolutely nothing at all; once you get out of high school all that nonsense tends to evaporate pretty quickly.
So yes, maybe it does contribute to a bad reputation (but not by itself remember, the games are kid centric too)... but only among the people who should matter the very least in your life. They're behaving like children and their opinions on your interests should matter to you about as much as a child's would. To everyone else, no one cares, and the practical benefit the anime has are far to valuable to even consider dropping it to attempt to solve such a minor problem (and it wouldn't even solve the problem anyway).
TL;DR, it is Saturday. I don't have time for this argument, you win, I'm wrong. Congratulations...
Jeez, don't start an argument if you just want to flake out on it. It's fairly disrespectful, especially rage quitting when you lose.
It's like when someone crits your sweeper after some defensive boosts, you can still win but you basically just have the points to your opponent (not that arguments have points :3).
I am not chickening out, I stated a point and he attacked it so I decided to step down. You think he won? How? because he spoke last?