imo it'll only be good on trick room teams, if good in OU at all - it at least has STAB Earthquake over Aggron and lower speed to work in trick room, but I can't really see it being all that brilliant... shame, too, it's one of my favourite Mega designs and choices so far.
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Other ORAS Mega Speculation Thread (NO talk about potential bans NOR Aegislash)
- Thread starter Aragorn the King
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I actually thing Mega Steelix will be pretty good. It seems like a decent check to Mega Mence in the very least. It's going to be great in Sand. Sure it's slow, but with out a doubt, it will have plenty of nitches in OU. It has great defenses, and the only real problem is it's typing. Other than that, it looks great. I don't know, I certainly like it.
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Not the worst thing, but Beedrill is to frail to be trying to set up. It's really made to hit hard with out setting up. I guess this helps it deal with Mega Bro a little better, but it's such a small use that it's really not worth it, especially since you have to sacrifice a coverage move for SD.
252 Atk Adaptability Mega Beedrill U-turn vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Mega Slowbro: 156-188 (39.5 - 47.7%) -- guaranteed 3HKO
Really doesn't need or want a better way to take care of Mega Slowbro. U-turn still takes out a hefty chunk and you really wouldn't want to stay in for risk of a Scald burn.
0 SpA Mega Slowbro Scald vs. 0 HP / 0 SpD Mega Beedrill: 130-154 (47.9 - 56.8%) -- 89.1% chance to 2HKO
This too.
The thing with that is. . . Why not use Froslass? I will never understand why I see Glalie every so often in OU.
Exactly; I feel Froslass is of course a much better spiker - that said, Glalie does have offensive presence, so that sort of lets it be unique from Lass?
I suppose. But what's the point if you're just going to blow it up anyways? Froslass can create mind games with the opponent with taunt, and as long as it's played correctly can also take another mon out with DBond. It does what glalie tries to do, and doesn't take up a mega slot.
Makes very little sense to me.
Wholeheartedly agree; was just stating that Glalie is different from Froslass as a spiker in that sense, whether that difference is beneficial or not.
Mega Glalie has offensive presence, Froslass doesn't. Don't bother comparing them because outside of D-Bond and Explosion being suicide methods, they aren't really alike.
Can't we just agree that mGlalie is a bad mon, OU or otherwise? I never write off a mon before I at least try it because there is usually something it can do, in theory.
However, even on paper I'm drawing a blank.
- bad typing
- good ability hamstrung by horrible move pool
- unfocused mega stat fistribution gives it no clear role
- did I mention that abysmal movepool?
Even as a mega, glalie is still hopelessly outclassed by froslass.
There's a reason all anyone has come up with for it is "refrigerate explosion lol" and "some sorta lead spiker..."
It's bad and unviable. It looks weird, too.
However, even on paper I'm drawing a blank.
- bad typing
- good ability hamstrung by horrible move pool
- unfocused mega stat fistribution gives it no clear role
- did I mention that abysmal movepool?
Even as a mega, glalie is still hopelessly outclassed by froslass.
There's a reason all anyone has come up with for it is "refrigerate explosion lol" and "some sorta lead spiker..."
It's bad and unviable. It looks weird, too.
Return, Double-Edge, Body Slam and Explosion aren't enough for Refrigerate? It also gets EQ, Freeze-Dry, Ice Shard, Taunt, Spikes and Super Fang, I'd say it has enough to work with, even if it's no Lopunny in terms of choices. Icy Wind is also a notable move.
Yeah, you're right, devoting +40 to both offences and +20 to speed is really unfocused. So unfocused I honestly CAN'T tell what they were going for when the end result was something with 120 offences and 100 speed.
Wrong.
I wish people would stop shitting on Mega Glalie just because it's not some super powerful threat. Yes, it's definitely one of the lesser Megas we're getting, but it's REALLY not as horrible as everyone keeps making it out to be. Honestly the only one of you worth is listening to is AM, who seems to have actually tried it out and not just coming here bashing it on because "lol Explosion".
What more would Mega Glalie need in it's movepool? It already gets Return, Double-Edge and Explosion, and Earthquake or Bulldoze gives it a great complimentary attacking option to Ice STAB. It also gets Spikes, Taunt and Frost Breath. Sure it would probably like Rock Polish or something like that, but it's movepool isn't any worse than Beedrill or something like that.
It's stats aren't unfocused either, it's just limited because of an already low bst. Sharpedo is unfocused more than Glalie. It was supposed to be more offensive and it is. GF could have min-maxed the crap out of it like Beedrill, but really every Mega Evo shouldn't be like that.
It's not directly outclassed by Froslass. They do different things. Glalie is closer the Spikes Greninja than it is to Froslass. I'm starting to think no one actually knows what outclassed means, people just throw it around without thinking.
That sounds about right - CB Scizor deals almost exactly 50% to 252/252+ MegaBro with U-turn, and Jolly MegaBee's U-turns are a little bit weaker than CB Scizor's.
252+ Atk Choice Band Scizor U-turn vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Slowbro: 176-210 (44.6 - 53.2%) -- 28.1% chance to 2HKO
252 Atk Adaptability Beedrill U-turn vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Slowbro: 160-192 (40.6 - 48.7%) -- guaranteed 3HKO
Because you don't use Glalie only for spikes. Double Edge smashes even resists hard(Azu is 2HKOed) and you can also use body slams over Double Edge for less power, but having the ability to cripple switch-ins that can normally take one(only one though) Double Edge such as Keldeo and Greninja. IceSTAB+EQ coverage is extremely good too. Glalie also has access to priority which, although not being Refrigirate boosted, is still very helpful as all priority is and it is STAB nonetheless. Lastly, the Glalie's trademark Explosion is horrifyingly powerful.
252 Atk Life Orb Glalie Explosion vs. 0 HP / 0 Def Metagross: 175-207 (58.1 - 68.7%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
I calced that against MEGA Metagross that has 150 base Defense. People complain about it being too hard to bring in. You could say the same about Mega Medicham too, yet my most successful Mega Medicham team enables Mega Medicham to come in ample times with Lando-Wash VoltTurn, and all it takes is a simple double switch as well, a basic tactic for maintaining momentum. A well played Mega Glalie is very threatening as its immense power and STAB Refrigirate Explosion all most all ways ensures it will do more damage to the enemy team than it takes for it to go down.
I get that explosion is powerful, but what's the point in wasting your mega slot if the only decent move worth using is a move that kills your mega? Glalie is also slower than megagross, which, no one is going to switch in on a glalie anyways because EQ is a thing. Yes, it's the definition of a nuke, but there are pokes that do this better. It's just too slow to be decent and in my opinion a waste of a mega slot when things like mLop, megagross, and mPert exist (fuck mMence).
It's not like it's a difficult pokemon to play around.
That's quite the assumption. I actually tried using it. I never stated it was horrible. But as a spikes setter it's a waste of a mega slot. I am one to prefer longevity over power for obvious reasons. If I'm going to get one beautified Pokemon (a mega) I'm going to choose a good one, one that doesn't face competition from another non mega. I was clealry comparing the spike setter sets since offensive glalie is bottom of the barrel compared to the offensive megas we received this time around.
Point is, if you want to set spikes, why would you use a mega that's going to kill itself when you can use a faster mon to do the same while not using up a slot for a mega?
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Lmao how the fuck is its only move worth using Explosion. Double Edge severely maims anything that doesn't 4 times resist it, Body Slam still stings and has a good chance to cripple very prominent threats that switch into Mega Glalie such as Gren and Keld, EQ has great coverage with Ice STAB, it gets STAB priority, it can stallbreak with its immense power and Taunt. Spike stacking is great for Hyper Offensive teams. Not only that, but you only explode when you don't need Mega Glalie anymore, like sacking a Pokemon for offensive momentum except it's so powerful it does OHKOs ANYTHING that doesn't resist it, and not even resists take it well. Do you even know how to play hyper offense? Sacking pokemon is inevitable against a good player and why not do a FUCK TON of damage while doing it.
It is slower and more frail than Mega Metagross, but Mega Glalie has power over it(Refrigirate base 120 Atk Double Edge hits harder than Tough Claws base 145 Atk Meteor Mash), it actually hits harder than every single one of those MEvos you listed(mLop, Megagross, and mPert). The only frail physical nuke to which you compare it is Mega Medicham which is equally as fast, even more frail, doesn't have the ability to set up entry hazards, and can't stallbreak with taunt all at the cost of power.
This is a goddamn horrendous argument as this goes both ways. When you "play around" it you're having the sheer potentiality that it might come in oppress your decision making, for which the opponent can "play around" and freely actualize his momentum to punish you and that could easily cost you the game in many scenarios.
So what if it's overall not as good as other megas? No one is saying it's a top-tier mon, but it's definitely not a bad option.
The thing is, when you're choosing a mega, there is something it should be able to do, and do really well.
Salamence becomes a nearly unstoppable boosting sweeper
Slowbro becomes a nearly unstoppable tank
Medicham becomes a wallbreaker
Etc
What is it exactly that mega glalie is doing that is so good or unique that it warrants a mega slot?
Ice/Ground physical coverage? Mamoswine does it better
Suicide lead with spikes?
Froslass does it way better
And yes its stats are unfocused.
120/120/100 stats with no way to boost them? With a mostly physical movepool 40 points in special attack seemed like a good idea? So then is it supposed to be mixed? But now you have to sacrifice attack or speed to boost your special attack all to use ice beam or blizzard or hidden power...
It's not like I want to hate glalie, what I'm saying is, I'm seeing nothing worth sacrificing a mega slot over. If it was a regular evolution then I wouldn't bag on it, because it doesn't have the pressure to fulfill the role of mega slot.
But as a mega, refrigerate return, body slam, and *gasp* super fang along with 120/120/100 unboostable offensive stats and a very rigid and limited movepool biased towards physical offense.... Come on.
Something has been missing from this discussion about M-Glalie, and that is its ability to deter hazard removal. M-Glalie has a bit of a niche in that it threatens most Defoggers that would want to come in to remove its spikes. The Latis are destroyed by D-Edge, as are other ice-weak defoggers like Zapdos, Mandibuzz, etc. Scizor is obvs excluded, but explosion means that 1) Scizor can't Defog because there's no target post-explosion, and 2) Scizor is p well damaged.
M-Glalie does OK against most rapid spinners as well; if it gets freeze-dry it'll be quite good against Starmie, but M-Glalie won't be able to stop Starmie from blowing away its spikes. In this way, it is somewhat similar to Froslass, which depends on its spinblocking Ghost type to keep its own hazards up.
M-Glalie does OK against most rapid spinners as well; if it gets freeze-dry it'll be quite good against Starmie, but M-Glalie won't be able to stop Starmie from blowing away its spikes. In this way, it is somewhat similar to Froslass, which depends on its spinblocking Ghost type to keep its own hazards up.
Nice tunnel vision. The point I was trying to make was there are Pokemon in the meta right now that hit like trucks and don't have to kill themselves to do so. Yes, body slam hurts, as does body slam from mAltaria and mMence. Difference is those two can set up to do more damage than that of glalie and don't have to explode in the process and have longevity and power. Glalie is not horrible, but in a meta where everything hits hard as shit and is fast as shit, glalie is just meh. It's a wasted mega slot in my opinion. There are so many better options out there and the biggest appeal it has is explosion, which is why it comes up everytime glalie is mentioned.
Of course it hits harder, its a higher base power move, what would you expect? However the speed is a big issue. Also, guess how relevant mega medi will be now that something that is bulkier and faster exists?
It can be played around, that doesn't make it bad, but if you're low on health, it's obvious what you're going to do. So, I switch in a sac, and bring in my cleaner/supporter or whatever is best fit against the opposing team.
I didn't say it's bad. I simply said there are better mons to use, which you just proved. it's not a top tier mon, and that's because of the things i expressed. I know how hyper offense works, which is why mLop is one of the best pokes to use on it because of healing wish. This started as me talking about mGlalie as a spike setter, but you took that as me talking about mGlalie as a whole.
i wasn't.
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IMO, Glalie is not pretty good in HazardSetting, but very good in Stallbreaking. A simple Set of Double Edge, Earthquake, Taunt and Freeze Dry/Explosion with 252 Atk+/ 4 SpA/ 252 Spe destroys Stall. Status&Co is crippled by Taunt and Skarm, Bro and co...
0 SpA Mega Glalie Freeze-Dry vs. 252 HP / 4 SpD Mega Slowbro: 212-252 (53.8 - 63.9%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
252+ Atk Refrigerate Mega Glalie Double-Edge vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Skarmory: 151-178 (45.2 - 53.2%) -- 90.6% chance to 2HKO after Stealth Rock and Leftovers recovery
252+ Atk Mega Glalie Earthquake vs. 248 HP / 0 Def Heatran: 432-512 (112.2 - 132.9%) -- guaranteed OHKO
252+ Atk Refrigerate Mega Glalie Double-Edge vs. 4 HP / 252+ Def Eviolite Chansey: 349-412 (54.3 - 64.1%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Stealth Rock
252+ Atk Refrigerate Mega Glalie Double-Edge vs. 248 HP / 0 Def Charizard: 324-382 (90.2 - 106.4%) -- guaranteed OHKO after Stealth Rock
0 SpA Mega Glalie Freeze-Dry vs. 252 HP / 0 SpD Rotom-W: 168-198 (55.2 - 65.1%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Stealth Rock and Leftovers recovery
252+ Atk Refrigerate Mega Glalie Double-Edge vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Mega Audino: 162-192 (39.5 - 46.8%) -- 34% chance to 2HKO after Stealth Rock
252+ Atk Refrigerate Mega Glalie Double-Edge vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Mega Sableye: 163-193 (53.6 - 63.4%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Stealth Rock and Leftovers recovery
0 SpA Mega Glalie Freeze-Dry vs. 252 HP / 4 SpD Quagsire: 504-592 (127.9 - 150.2%) -- guaranteed OHKO
252+ Atk Refrigerate Mega Glalie Double-Edge vs. 232 HP / 0 Def Thick Fat Mega Venusaur: 222-264 (61.8 - 73.5%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Stealth Rock
HO can not switch in safely
252+ Atk Refrigerate Mega Glalie Double-Edge vs. 4 HP / 0 Def Greninja: 183-216 (63.9 - 75.5%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Stealth Rock
252+ Atk Refrigerate Mega Glalie Double-Edge vs. 0 HP / 0 Def Keldeo: 144-170 (44.5 - 52.6%) -- 82.4% chance to 2HKO after Stealth Rock
There are only a few things that counter this thing, MScizor is probably the best. With SR and Wishsupport, MGlalie is IMO pretty good, even if Mence, Gross and co. are a bit better. And srsly, the Movepool is not THAT bad, Freeze Dry, EQ, Double Edge/Return/Body Slam, Taunt, Explosion and probably Crunch is all you need (ok, Close Combat, Flare Blitz and Shell Smash wouldnt be bad, but srsly). I think MGlalie is going to be a pretty good UU Mega and a good Stallbreaker in OU.
0 SpA Mega Glalie Freeze-Dry vs. 252 HP / 4 SpD Mega Slowbro: 212-252 (53.8 - 63.9%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
252+ Atk Refrigerate Mega Glalie Double-Edge vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Skarmory: 151-178 (45.2 - 53.2%) -- 90.6% chance to 2HKO after Stealth Rock and Leftovers recovery
252+ Atk Mega Glalie Earthquake vs. 248 HP / 0 Def Heatran: 432-512 (112.2 - 132.9%) -- guaranteed OHKO
252+ Atk Refrigerate Mega Glalie Double-Edge vs. 4 HP / 252+ Def Eviolite Chansey: 349-412 (54.3 - 64.1%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Stealth Rock
252+ Atk Refrigerate Mega Glalie Double-Edge vs. 248 HP / 0 Def Charizard: 324-382 (90.2 - 106.4%) -- guaranteed OHKO after Stealth Rock
0 SpA Mega Glalie Freeze-Dry vs. 252 HP / 0 SpD Rotom-W: 168-198 (55.2 - 65.1%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Stealth Rock and Leftovers recovery
252+ Atk Refrigerate Mega Glalie Double-Edge vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Mega Audino: 162-192 (39.5 - 46.8%) -- 34% chance to 2HKO after Stealth Rock
252+ Atk Refrigerate Mega Glalie Double-Edge vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Mega Sableye: 163-193 (53.6 - 63.4%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Stealth Rock and Leftovers recovery
0 SpA Mega Glalie Freeze-Dry vs. 252 HP / 4 SpD Quagsire: 504-592 (127.9 - 150.2%) -- guaranteed OHKO
252+ Atk Refrigerate Mega Glalie Double-Edge vs. 232 HP / 0 Def Thick Fat Mega Venusaur: 222-264 (61.8 - 73.5%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Stealth Rock
HO can not switch in safely
252+ Atk Refrigerate Mega Glalie Double-Edge vs. 4 HP / 0 Def Greninja: 183-216 (63.9 - 75.5%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Stealth Rock
252+ Atk Refrigerate Mega Glalie Double-Edge vs. 0 HP / 0 Def Keldeo: 144-170 (44.5 - 52.6%) -- 82.4% chance to 2HKO after Stealth Rock
There are only a few things that counter this thing, MScizor is probably the best. With SR and Wishsupport, MGlalie is IMO pretty good, even if Mence, Gross and co. are a bit better. And srsly, the Movepool is not THAT bad, Freeze Dry, EQ, Double Edge/Return/Body Slam, Taunt, Explosion and probably Crunch is all you need (ok, Close Combat, Flare Blitz and Shell Smash wouldnt be bad, but srsly). I think MGlalie is going to be a pretty good UU Mega and a good Stallbreaker in OU.
mega Steelix is almost complete trash...but it still has niches.
The most obvious is that pair it in doubles with Hippo/TTar and then spam EQ. Although since this is OU, I guess that won't apply.
Honestly I don't think many people will use mega Steelix, as all the OP megas *cough* mence *cough* will be used until they are banned...
But I guess the best thing you can do with it so that it actually has a niche over mega Aggron is to run a Sand team supporter set. Somehow steelix doesn't get TWave and its ability is obviously worse than mega Aggron's without sand, so you need to find what you can do with it. I guess Steelix could be a bulky sand setter on sand teams alongside TTar, but with TTar+Exca+Steelix you're just asking to get run over by Conk not to mention a ton of weaknesses you stack. Still, Steelix can run something like SR/Sandstorm/Earthquake/Gyro Ball, or opt for something more team-supporting like Roar in the last slot. I personally wouldn't do that though, as you need both STAB moves to hit hard, as Sand Force is going to be what you use to hit harder than stuff like mega Aggron. Also, a bonus is that your pre-mega evo ability is Sturdy, allowing you guaranteed SR/Sandstorm if you really need it.
Lati@s stand out as pretty obvious partners as they can Defog and take on Zard-Y, non Ice Punch mega Swampert, Lando-I, Rotom-W and Keldeo, who are big problems for Steelix and sand. Meanwhile, mega Steelix trolls stuff like Bisharp, Weavile, fairies(mega Altaria), Scizor and mega Beedrill.
I still really can't see mega Steelix making the cut for OU tho...too many other good megas out there that give it tough competition
The most obvious is that pair it in doubles with Hippo/TTar and then spam EQ. Although since this is OU, I guess that won't apply.
Honestly I don't think many people will use mega Steelix, as all the OP megas *cough* mence *cough* will be used until they are banned...
But I guess the best thing you can do with it so that it actually has a niche over mega Aggron is to run a Sand team supporter set. Somehow steelix doesn't get TWave and its ability is obviously worse than mega Aggron's without sand, so you need to find what you can do with it. I guess Steelix could be a bulky sand setter on sand teams alongside TTar, but with TTar+Exca+Steelix you're just asking to get run over by Conk not to mention a ton of weaknesses you stack. Still, Steelix can run something like SR/Sandstorm/Earthquake/Gyro Ball, or opt for something more team-supporting like Roar in the last slot. I personally wouldn't do that though, as you need both STAB moves to hit hard, as Sand Force is going to be what you use to hit harder than stuff like mega Aggron. Also, a bonus is that your pre-mega evo ability is Sturdy, allowing you guaranteed SR/Sandstorm if you really need it.
Lati@s stand out as pretty obvious partners as they can Defog and take on Zard-Y, non Ice Punch mega Swampert, Lando-I, Rotom-W and Keldeo, who are big problems for Steelix and sand. Meanwhile, mega Steelix trolls stuff like Bisharp, Weavile, fairies(mega Altaria), Scizor and mega Beedrill.
I still really can't see mega Steelix making the cut for OU tho...too many other good megas out there that give it tough competition
LOL, the most relevant post removed.
Seriously though, it's one thing to argue about the merits/demerits of a Pokemon but we shouldn't wonder why people are using new Pokemon on a premature ladder invented to test out new Pokemon.
That's just the wrong way of couching an otherwise relevant argument. It almost falls under the no-talk-of-bans edict. It's the inverse. "X is uber" versus "you're dumb if you use X".
It should be obvious that a number of the new Megas may not receive enough usage to be OU once "shiny new syndrome" wears off.
MegaGlalie is slower than Frosslass and lacks some of the resistances of her unique typing but it is much more threatening attacker.
Of course, there is the fact that it competes for the Mega slot and there may be better choices for that (hard for an offensive Mega to top Salamence right now).
Yet everyone wants to discover for themselves whether the mon has a niche rather than swallow someone else's theorymon.
So usage is going to be skewed towards the new stuff for a while.
Seriously though, it's one thing to argue about the merits/demerits of a Pokemon but we shouldn't wonder why people are using new Pokemon on a premature ladder invented to test out new Pokemon.
That's just the wrong way of couching an otherwise relevant argument. It almost falls under the no-talk-of-bans edict. It's the inverse. "X is uber" versus "you're dumb if you use X".
It should be obvious that a number of the new Megas may not receive enough usage to be OU once "shiny new syndrome" wears off.
MegaGlalie is slower than Frosslass and lacks some of the resistances of her unique typing but it is much more threatening attacker.
Of course, there is the fact that it competes for the Mega slot and there may be better choices for that (hard for an offensive Mega to top Salamence right now).
Yet everyone wants to discover for themselves whether the mon has a niche rather than swallow someone else's theorymon.
So usage is going to be skewed towards the new stuff for a while.
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