Dugtrio with Focus Sash.

rbygsc kid 251

yes, I know a Dugtrio without a band or life orb sounds dumb as shit, but just hear me out. Imagine your opponent having a Heracross or Infernape out and you having a Dugtrio on your team. You know that you have a kill in the bag, but unfortunetly you must sacrifice a member of your team to do so..... BUT, with my idea maybe you do not need to focus that team member. so here we go....

Dugtrio@Focus Sash

Jolly 252att/252speed/4who cares

EQ
Stone Edge/Rock Slide
Aerial Ace
Night Slash

First off, Jolly is necessary; otherwise, you can not outspeed Infernape, Raikou, or Starmie. Here are some damage calculations....

NOTE: These attacks are from a 259 Dugtrio and the defending pokemon all have min HP/min DEF, with a nature that is neutral in Defense(with the exception of Electivire).

Earthquake against Infernape: 108-127%
Earthquake against Heatran: 141-166%
Aerial Ace against Heracross: 81-96%
Earthquake against Tyranitar: 65-76%
Earthquake against Magnezone:152-179%
Earthquake against Raikou: 94-111%
Earthquake against Starmie: 52-61%
Earthquake against Electivire: 132-155%
Aerial Ace against Breloom: 89-105%

The idea is simple. Come in against one of these pokemon when situations are right, trap and kill. Because Pursuiters are on the rise, you pretty much can't switch out anyway, but with 1 hp Dugtrio "might" serve better use later in the match.

Stealth Rock, Spikes, and Hail ruin this. Make sure those things are taken care of.

I know it's crazy, but are there any comments?
 
That actually seems like a decent idea. It does limit Dugtrio's long-term durability - after it takes 1 hit, it's a lot less useful than any other Dugtrio. On the other hand, it can actually take 1 hit, which other Dugtrio's can't do.

Btw, you might want to give some defensive EV's on your damage calcs, as quite a few of those pokemon do run EV's in hp and def.
 
Oh, I apologize about that. I mentioned that ALL of these pokemon have MIN def/and MIN hp. My reasoning behind it was...

Electivire and Infernape....always working towards their attack, sp. attack, and speed... would not bother with hp/def

Tyanitar and Heracross.... CB versions typically go 252att/252 speed. The 4 hp would barely make any difference.

Magnezone and Heatran... I'm positive that they would have to almost max their HP AND def to survive an EQ. Also, note that if Magnezone makes a sub then he has already taken 25 percent of his precious life away. You kill the sub, he uses HP Ice and then you kill him. Raikou works in the same fashion; Raikou making a sub, helps this Dugrio so much.

I only picked those 8 for damage calculations because I assumed they would focus on their attacks and speed.
 
I was thinking of using the same thing, only with Azelf. Immune to spikes is a plus, and so is nasty plot. This seems like a good idea too.
 
Attack Tier analysis:

Earthquake:
OHKOs (average) Def. tier 108.22 and below.
Two-hit KO (average) Def. Tier 115.49 and below.

Approximate 2-hit KO or better with 0/0 List:
Ursaring
Raikou
Lanturn
Vigoroth
Skuntank
Phione
Nidoking

Typhlosion
Porygon-Z
Hitmontop
Octillery
Starmie
Ninetales
Blaziken

Rampardos
Infernape
DeoxysSpeed
Toxicroak
Tentacruel
Omanyte
Lucario
Electivire
Magmortar
Froslass
Ambipom
Medicham
Rapidash

Hitmonchan
Weavile
Gardevoir
Gallade
Floatzel

Jolteon
Flareon
Espeon

Raichu
Roserade

Hitmonlee

Alakazam
Dugtrio
Smeargle

----------
Choice Band allows him to OHKO Espeon and below on the above list. Obviously, Jolteon and Flareon are OHKOed anyway due to Earthquake weakness... the ones at the bottom of this list have a chance of two-hit KO w/o choice band.

Assuming 0/0 spread.... Choice band allows you to two-hit the following pokemon:
Garchomp
Mew
Jirachi
Manaphy <--- Uber
Omastar

Snorlax <--- Lol, maybe he runs 252 Sp. Def 252 Atk :-/
Mewtwo <--- Ubers
Mamoswine

Glaceon
Kangaskhan
Armaldo
Quagsire
Hariyama
Azumarill
Marowak <--- 0/0 HP/Def spread possible if they were assuming +Speed from Ninjask
Tauros
Kingdra
Kabutops

Machamp
Venusaur
Spiritomb

Choice Band certainly lets you Two-Hit a lot more Pokemon, as well as OHKO quite a few... but I can see the Focus Sash set working later in the game. I should note, any pokemon with a 2x weakness is 2-hit KOed by Dugtrio's earthquake + Choice Band except Bold 252/252 Regirock and Steelix. So that includes the likes of T-Tar, Metagross, and so forth.

Without Choice Band, dugtrio doesn't exactly get that power... although T-Tar probably dies to non-CB Earthquake anyway... Not sure. I need a damage calculator for that one.
 
in no way is this a unique set I actually did this a few weeks ago only to replace him with Gliscor(I run an SS team at that time)it's basically a normal Dugtrio fitted with a Focus Sash. It will work ofcourse I tried it myself but still I prefer Duggy as a revenge killer thanks for posting this anyway
 
Passive_Observer said:
May seem a bit off topic, but I was wondering -- How could a Dugtrio use Aerial Ace while it's lower half is always submerged in dirt?
Click to expand...
this is like asking how togekiss does focus punch.

anyway, this thing can be useful, if used carefully. although, you lose the ability to kill defensive stuff, like blissey.
 
The_Rider said:
in no way is this a unique set I actually did this a few weeks ago only to replace him with Gliscor(I run an SS team at that time)it's basically a normal Dugtrio fitted with a Focus Sash. It will work ofcourse I tried it myself but still I prefer Duggy as a revenge killer thanks for posting this anyway
Click to expand...
I invented Mr. Mime.

The reason this set is "innovative" is that your standard Dugtrio is going to come in as a Revenge Killer, trap something, and then OHKO it with some kind of item that is either going to make it suicide bait for a counter or leave it to die on switching out via Pursuit. With Sash, Dugtrio not only gets the revenge kill (on some of the above; I believe your avg TTar is going to be packing some defensive EVS, as well a decent number of Heracross and RS Starmie), but then strike back when your opponent brings in a counter on the Revenge Kill. While the moveset is nothing new, the concept as well as required damage calculations are all helpful.

I think this is a solid alternative for Dugtrio.
 
This isn't very new, honestly.. Slapping a sash on a fragile pokemon isn't very innovative. But yeah, it's a pretty good set.
 
When I first read this, I thought that it was genius. I know I wouldn't think of it at least. Being able to instantly remove several worrying Pokemon is so good, it's almost broken.

Then I had a bit of time to think it over. I'm so used to Dugtrio packing a Choice Band, that I forgot he was a total wussy without it. 259 attack is really poor. It's barely more than a Swampert with no attack EV's.

In being able to instantly take down Heracross, Breloom and Infernape, you are losing the ability to defeat the likes of Blissey, Tyranitar and Metagross. I appreciate the usefulness of the Sash, but I'd rather be able to revenge kill the latter three from 100% health.

And at the risk of sounding obvious...make sure the Heracross isn't Scarf'd, and that the Breloom doesn't have Mach Punch before you try and make the switch. Obviously, a LOT of Heras/Brelooms take advantage of those.
 
I ran a sash trio for a little while on my special rush team. I used it mainly as a ttar/heatran counter, and for random scarf pokes when necessary. It did its job pretty well. Sure, it couldn't take out bliss, but I had other pokes for that.

@above poster: sash duggy kills TTar if it comes in on the DD (or after a sacrifice).
 
Lee said:
When I first read this, I thought that it was genius. I know I wouldn't think of it at least. Being able to instantly remove several worrying Pokemon is so good, it's almost broken.

Then I had a bit of time to think it over. I'm so used to Dugtrio packing a Choice Band, that I forgot he was a total wussy without it. 259 attack is really poor. It's barely more than a Swampert with no attack EV's.

In being able to instantly take down Heracross, Breloom and Infernape, you are losing the ability to defeat the likes of Blissey, Tyranitar and Metagross. I appreciate the usefulness of the Sash, but I'd rather be able to revenge kill the latter three from 100% health.

And at the risk of sounding obvious...make sure the Heracross isn't Scarf'd, and that the Breloom doesn't have Mach Punch before you try and make the switch. Obviously, a LOT of Heras/Brelooms take advantage of those.
Click to expand...

Yes, 259 attack is garbage. That's why I didn't even put a Blissey calculation it's something like 26-32 percent.

Priority moves are garbage and I wouldn't EVER want to play with a Metagross on account of Bullet Punch.

I actually thought of this set while I was at a scholarship meeting because Infernape RUNS ABSOLUTELY WILD on my team so that is what the whole idea was directed at; of course, it has it's usefulness against other poke's.
 
This set is useful only if you can already counter Blissey, Metagross, Tyranitar and other pokemon whom CBTrio could OHKO, but this can't. This set is made purely for countering more frail pokemon.
 
I would use this with Hippowdon / Tyranitar to make sure you KO Breloom and Heracross after Sandstorm damage is factored in. It also ensures that they won't have a Focus Sash of their own / use Endure + Salac.
 
gmax said:
This set is useful only if you can already counter Blissey, Metagross, Tyranitar and other pokemon whom CBTrio could OHKO, but this can't. This set is made purely for countering more frail pokemon.
Click to expand...
CBTrio can't OHKO most Metagross anyway, and is killed by just about any attack except Thunderpunch. However, SashTrio will 2HKO all but the most defensive of Metagross with Focus Sash guaranteeing survival. The only move to watch out for is Bullet Punch, but that applies to the CB set too.

The same argument applies to T-tar, especially Boah variants that run max HP or close to it.

The best part however is if you can still OHKO something and fool the opponent into thinking you are Choice Banded, so that they bring in a Pursuit revenge killer that resists your last attack. CBTrio would be screwed, but SashTrio would have a chance to at least put a large dent in them and possibly even kill.
 
Open your mind cornflake, it can and should be used for different things besides "2hkoing blissey". it is very worth mentioning that if adamant, you will do 87-103% to Weavile with stone edge, which is even better when you consider what Obi said about using it with Sandstream. weavile is of course the revenge kiler who cannot be revenge killed, since Pursuit is NVE against it and Dugtrio is always going to be slower than it, so giving Dugtrio a Focus Sash to take out arguably the most annoyingly persistent revenge killer isn't a bad idea.

i would therefore propose this set to anyone who wants to get rid of particular trouble pokemon:

Dugtrio@Focus Sash
Ability: Arena Trap
EVs: 4HP / 252 Atk / 252 Speed
Nature: Adamant
- Aerial Ace
- Earthquake
- Stone Edge
- Sucker Punch

Getting rid of Weavile and all Heracross if your Sash is intact is appealing. And while Azelf is free to switch out of Dugtrio, Sucker Punch, doing up to 75% with Sucker Punch is nice especially if you don't want to risk the whole Pursuit thing...and if your Sash is intact, you can fire away twice.

Dealing with Starmie is even more fun, since Sucker Punch will do 52-61% to Starmie, and you can keep spamming that as it uses Recover or whatever, as it may think you're CBed. Obviously much of this is contingent on keeping that sash intact, but that's true of any sasher and being immune to sand stream is not to be taken for granted on a Sasher.
 
Sorry jumpman. I just thought dugtrio's should be able to destroy bliss quickly.

But looking at your set, I realize that in a sandstorm team, this could be highly plausible. I was just turned off from the loss of attack.
 
Not being able to OHKO Hera isn't necessarily that bad, especially given that Dugtrio can still put a huge dent in many other Pokemon.
 
IMO seems like you're making a really huge effort to keep all those spikes off the ground for just one kill....

Personally, if my team was weak to something that Dugtrio can take care of, I sacrifice the thing I no longer need, and then bring out a Dugtrio, as opposed to switching Dugtrio into random things to let it be at 1%.
 
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