Gen VII: Pokémon Sun and Moon (New info Post #5834)

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Okay, I understand just about every other point here, but the one I'm having a really hard time understanding - and this applies to a lot of people - is that somehow the Ghost Girl having no explanation is evidence?
Like... does no-one have an understanding of just being shown something and interpreting their own meaning and theory about it? That thing that many fictional works do? That thing that Pokémon itself has done a lot of times in the past?
Things in XY that need to be tied up like Zygarde and Floette are obvious; those are actual real forms in the game's coding some of which are being advertised to great lengths. The ghost girl is not one of those. It is not a focus of anything and is likely just something inserted as an easter egg to get people to theorize about. Why is it being treated as a thing that needs to have a conclusion as if it had a tangible story told to you attached to it to begin with?
With Floette's alternate form, there is a precedent that it will never actually see the light of day. Look at how the Azure Flute or the Lock Capsule was never released in Generation IV. True, in both cases, what they did in game was solved (Arceus was given a straight distribution and TM95 was available in Black 2 and White 2), but the point remains that the previous items was never used. Also, it wouldn't surprise me if Game Freak forgot about it. Or if it is a similar case to Mew in Generation I, except instead of Game Freak knowing about it and Nintendo not, only the programmer of it knows and the rest of Game Freak doesn't.
if the Sun is too bright the there is always the Villains salt mine

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The Sun is a fading light in the dark. Corrupt and arrogant, it must be punished! The Sun shall fall!
 
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So... you're suggesting that GameFreak just put the ghost girl in to troll the overanalytical portion of the fanbase? That would be... incredibly evil, but knowing TrollFreak, I can definitely see that as a possibility.
It's not really trolling. Again, it's just something implied to get you to think and draw your own conclusions from like many other things in the games.
 
With Floette's alternate form, there is a precedent that it will never actually see the light of day. Look at how the Azure Flute or the Lock Capsule was never released in Generation IV. True, in both cases, what they did in game was solved (Arceus was given a straight distribution and TM95 was available in Black 2 and White 2), but the point remains that the previous items was never used. Also, it wouldn't surprise me if Game Freak forgot about it. Or if it is a similar case to Mew in Generation I, except instead of Game Freak knowing about it and Nintendo not, only the programmer of it knows and the rest of Game Freak doesn't.

The Sun is a fading light in the dark. Corrupt and arrogant, it must be punished! The Sun shall fall!
the first three people had it coming at this point your just jumping into the the fire
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I'm not counting out Floette-E yet. I recall some quick comment regarding the future of Pokémon a year or so ago by a Nintendo employee. When asked about it, a hint was given. "Flowers". Now, unless they were bullshitting (which, to be fair, I'd believe), I instantly connect that with AZ's Floette. Given that Sun and Moon by themselves don't imply flowers, it could have been an in-game thing. Or a new mechanic. That second one is doubtful.

Or it could be something that was just scrapped.
 
Sidestepping the "what gen is this?" topic since I really don't care and I'm not one to speculate on forthcoming info (which is odd coming from the mystery thread guy but ehhhhh), I want to talk about the Gen1 to "new game" jump because man that's actually a bit impressive and I wonder how they are going to handle it. Because there are a lot of variables coming from Gen 1 that did not translate into Gen 3 (hence why they didn't connect. Plus GBA hardware limits).

For starters, in Gen 1:
-no genders (other than Nidoran lines and always "x")
-Special was one stat, no sp. attack/def.
-no abilities
-effort values were WEEIIIIIRRRRRDDDD.
-IV's were even WEEIIIIRRRRDDDDEEEEEERRR.

I'm actually really interested in how they will be handling this. Will it just be written in during the generation pokebank jump?
 
Sidestepping the "what gen is this?" topic since I really don't care and I'm not one to speculate on forthcoming info (which is odd coming from the mystery thread guy but ehhhhh), I want to talk about the Gen1 to "new game" jump because man that's actually a bit impressive and I wonder how they are going to handle it. Because there are a lot of variables coming from Gen 1 that did not translate into Gen 3 (hence why they didn't connect. Plus GBA hardware limits).

For starters, in Gen 1:
-no genders (other than Nidoran lines and always "x")
-Special was one stat, no sp. attack/def.
-no abilities
-effort values were WEEIIIIIRRRRRDDDD.
-IV's were even WEEIIIIRRRRDDDDEEEEEERRR.

I'm actually really interested in how they will be handling this. Will it just be written in during the generation pokebank jump?
Considering that Red, Green, Blue, and Yellow are mostly straight-forward ports (with the exception of the code needed to do wireless multiplayer), it will likely be generated somehow in Bank, may it be influenced by their Generation I information or not.
 
I would honestly be willing to bet that nothing but species, moves and level (and, uh, exp I guess) would be kept and that every other aspect including gender, ability and stats would just be randomized. Of course, it's just speculation, but it's difficult to see how it would be otherwise handled.
 
I decided to separate the sun and moon symbols from the logo:

PKMNSunLogo_zpsjilzvwiu.png
PKMNMoonLogo_zpscyahwznh.png


And while cutting these out, I suddenly realized something (and answered a question which always confused me):

star-wars-set.jpg

I knew the Empire symbol vaguely resembled a sun, but for some reason I couldn't figure out what the Rebel symbol was (I thought it was a circular starfighter). But just now it just hit me, it's suppose to be an upward facing moon, the opposite of the Empire's sun! (Though thinking about it its kind of odd that the Rebel's symbol is a moon considering the Empire's most powerful weapon was often compared to the size of a moon, was called the "Star Destroyed" (and the Sun is a star), and it even has a "beam" like thing shooting from it). So, yeah, anyway:

Sun = Empire
Moon = Rebels
 
Watch them pull a Black and White and have Lunatone in Pokemon Sun and Solrock in Pokemon Moon...

Anyhow, wow I don't really know what to say- it's good it's something special for the 20 year but leaving Kalos feel so....unfinished seems wrong somehow. Connected regions will definitely fix that but it still feels strage, don't get me wrong I'm all for change so good job on then.

Guess this means the anime/movies have a leg up/advantage on information about the Zygarde forms so right now technically there's more reason to watch them now.

As for Floette-E, part of me thinks maybe it was just a model for that famous XY scene. Besides Light of Ruin, were there changes to its actual natural movepool if it was a Floette? (Can't check right now)

But then the easter egg of Eternal Floette's flower near the Sootopolis tree bugs me then. Would be great if it all gets connected in Pokemon SM.

And then Gen 1 transfers? That's going to be interesting, just for the fact how odd the TMs were back then. A lot of Pokemon had Reflect. Teleporting Electrodes, Venomoths and Arcanines. Tri Attack Hypno and Closyer. Solar Beam Lapras. Bubblebeam Persian, Jynx and Articuno. Hydro Pump and Razor Wind Kabutops. Egg Bomb Mew. Body Slam Mega Kangaskhan (Twice the paralysis chance?)

Some interesting images.
 
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I decided to separate the sun and moon symbols from the logo:

PKMNSunLogo_zpsjilzvwiu.png
PKMNMoonLogo_zpscyahwznh.png


And while cutting these out, I suddenly realized something (and answered a question which always confused me):

star-wars-set.jpg

I knew the Empire symbol vaguely resembled a sun, but for some reason I couldn't figure out what the Rebel symbol was (I thought it was a circular starfighter). But just now it just hit me, it's suppose to be an upward facing moon, the opposite of the Empire's sun! (Though thinking about it its kind of odd that the Rebel's symbol is a moon considering the Empire's most powerful weapon was often compared to the size of a moon, was called the "Star Destroyed" (and the Sun is a star), and it even has a "beam" like thing shooting from it). So, yeah, anyway:

Sun = Empire
Moon = Rebels
The Rebel emblem is called the Starbird, which is more or less a space phoenix, symbolizing their goal of a New Republic, in essence, the resurrection of freedom and democracy.
As for Floette-E, part of me thinks maybe it was just a model for that famous XY scene. Besides Light of Ruin, were there changes to its actual natural movepool if it was a Floette? (Can't check right now)
Floette-E has different stats than regular Floette. Odd thing to do if was just for the model.
 
As for Floette-E, part of me thinks maybe it was just a model for that famous XY scene. Besides Light of Ruin, were there changes to its actual natural movepool if it was a Floette? (Can't check right now)
There were substantial stat changes that are well beyond even a Florges' capabilities, it couldn't evolve and hence it also could use Eviolite. I am now starting to wonder if it was just in there as an 'easter egg' for any hackers and maybe to troll us since GF actually seems to be getting more... ah... 'savvy' with that sort of thing (all the ORAS-exclusive stuff not being in XY's code, XY confusingly having mega latis, Sun/Moon seemingly making the Thousand moves seem redundant...) but I dunno. I'm guessing event.
 
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Guess this means the anime/movies have a leg up/advantage on information about the Zygarde forms so right now technically there's more reason to watch them now.

As for Floette-E, part of me thinks maybe it was just a model for that famous XY scene. Besides Light of Ruin, were there changes to its actual natural movepool if it was a Floette? (Can't check right now)

I'm beginning to wonder if the different Zygarde forms didn't start off as just an anime thing. I mean Ash-Greninja is, what if the Zygarde formes were too? I mean aside from it appearing in Pokemon Tretta, all references to Zygarde Forms is linked to the anime.

And AZ's Floette has different stats and a signature move.

The Rebel emblem is called the Starbird, which is more or less a space phoenix, symbolizing their goal of a New Republic, in essence, the resurrection of freedom and democracy.

Oh, well than I guess I extract my observation.
 
I'm beginning to wonder if the different Zygarde forms didn't start off as just an anime thing. I mean Ash-Greninja is, what if the Zygarde formes were too? I mean aside from it appearing in Pokemon Tretta, all references to Zygarde Forms is linked to the anime.
That...is an interesting, possible theory.
Oh, well than I guess I extract my observation.
It's okay. Not everyone has so much Star Wars information crammed into their heads. I mean, I am named Vader_the_White.
 
Don't suppose anyone could invert the color in the Sun logo to match that of the Moon's?
Suck at art...

Well if you have a paint program you can do it yourself. Usually you can just copy and paste the image into the paint program, select all, and if you right click they sometimes give an invert image option.
 
I'm honestly thinking that they will have the extra post-Gen 2 data "preset" within Pokemon Bank, such as abilities and natures. DVs to IVs is most likely going to be DV*2+1 or something similar, and genders/shininess either preset per species or based on Gen 2 mechanics. It seems to be the simplest way to do it, but blazes if I know.

I might be a nerd, but I only know how complicated programming can be, not really how easy or difficult going through with it is.
 
First of all, calm down on the memes. That's what we have Firebot for.


Second, after I watched the announcement trailer yesterday, I felt disappointed somehow. I couldn't exactly figure out why, but this morning it dawned on me: We haven't had a good post-game since BW2, and it's very likely that SuMo won't have it either.

BW2 was crammed with stuff to do after defeating the Elite Four. Join Avenue. Black Skyscraper/White Treehollow. The many Hidden Hollows. PokéStar Studios. Pokémon World Tournament. There were rare Pokémon to track down, a largely customize-able mall with venues to level up, there were battle facilities to overcome, movies to star in, Battle Points to gather and spend, and you could rematch the Elite Four (and also the Gym Leaders, if you count PWT). Plus, nearly one-third of the map was only accessible after the Elite Four were beaten.

By comparison, XY and ORAS are pitiful. One new location to visit post-Elite Four in each game, not counting the tiny and content-less Mirage Spots. There are some battle facilities, but the Maison is very generic, it's the same facility in both games, and the restaurants are repetitive and offer no reward but money. I had high hopes for Z to be a solid generation-ender, a polished and content-crammed game like Emerald, Platinum and BW2, but instead Game Freak seems to have thought "ORAS is good enough to last two years" and ended the generation with that downer. Oh well, at least the Elite Four can be rematched in ORAS, and you can hunt down all the legendaries and Mirage Spots and level up your base.

The lack of post-game content in XY is understandable, somehow. For one, Game Freak doesn't need it to sell the games; the improved graphics and new Pokémon/moves/region are very good selling points on their own. Also, they needed people to finish the game and still be hungry for more, so that we'd get extra excited for ORAS. Plus, they hold back some features (Battle Frontier, rematches, other facilities) to use as selling points for the next games. That has been a strategy since Emerald or thereabout.
The lack of post-game content in ORAS is less so. For one, it's a generation-ending game. No need to hold back anything. The next games will have selling points ORAS could never match anyway (a new region and a batch of new Pokémon), so they could build something the fans could enjoy for months or years after finishing the game. Considering how close ORAS was released after XY, and how long after ORAS we have to wait for SuMo, they would have had time to put in some extra content. I'd gladly have waited another few months for ORAS to be properly polished, it would even have shortened the wait time for SuMo. But then again, they'd have missed out on Christmas sales.

So yeah. Those extra fun places to visit. The extra battle facilities. Move tutors. Places to manage and level up. Side quests. A loot-fest à la BW2, where items were thrown at you around every corner once every day. I had expected something more for Gen VI, which will never come to pass after all. We might see a Kalos re-visit in SuMo, but I doubt they'll give it more content than they "have to", and some features will be held back to reduce development time and give the next game some selling points. We'll get a post-game as bare-bones as XY. The next, complete generation ender with a rich post-game might probably be SuMo's successor. And that's still a long time away.

Oh well, I guess I can go pick up ORAS again. Perhaps I'll appreciate its post-game more now, knowing that this was what Game Freak intended to end Gen VI with. But that disappointed feeling of not getting Z will probably remain in me for a while.
 
So I've watched the trailer, which gave precisely no information aside from the names of the new releases as 90% of the advert was footage from older games.

What information do we actually have?
 
Didn't they pretty much promise the battle frontier? There was lots of mention of it in ORAS if I remember correctly.

"Lots of mention" is stretching it. There was a model referencing that the Frontier would later be built on that same island. In an interview, one of the developers stated that they more or less didn't bother to make a Frontier, since so few people spent time with the post-game facilities anyway.
 
So I've watched the trailer, which gave precisely no information aside from the names of the new releases as 90% of the advert was footage from older games.

What information do we actually have?
The teaser artwork, screencap, and wireframe animation shown right before the names of the games appear.
 
"Lots of mention" is stretching it. There was a model referencing that the Frontier would later be built on that same island. In an interview, one of the developers stated that they more or less didn't bother to make a Frontier, since so few people spent time with the post-game facilities anyway.

Which is why in Gen VI they made a second Battle Frontier and in BW2 they made the Pokemon World Tournament & White Treehollow/Black Tower... if you can't tell I'm calling BS on that statement.

And even if that's true, there's still the problem that they didn't really replace it with anything else. Fine, you don't think a lot of people use the post game Facilities, give us something else. White Treehollow/Black Tower was simple to do and understand, have another one of those somewhere. Or break down and simplify the Battle Frontier areas if you don't think people are using them as they are now.
 
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