Pokémon Movepool Oddities & Explanations

A new oddity that, while not on specific moves, does have to do with Moves mechanics: Immunity.

Seems odd that physical Ghost/Poison/Electric/Psychic/Dragon moves don't do any damage to Normal/Steel/Ground & Rubber/Dark/Fairy. Like I understand them not receiving elemental damage, but they're still being physically hit. Couldn't they at least do half Power, typeless, & STABless damage?

Also wouldn't Flying-types still be hit by Bonemerang, Sand Tomb, Mud Bomb, Mud Shot, & Mud-Slap?
 
Another immunity-related mechanic I don't quite understand is how Normal status moves work. I don't get why Glare and other Normal status moves can affect Ghosts while Thunder Wave can't touch a Ground type. It just feels inconsistent.
 
Billy the Uncle said:
Another immunity-related mechanic I don't quite understand is how Normal status moves work. I don't get why Glare and other Normal status moves can affect Ghosts while Thunder Wave can't touch a Ground type. It just feels inconsistent.
Click to expand...

Context. Glare is just the Pokemon staring menacingly, no way to really block that. Meanwhile Thunder Wave hits the target with electricity, so if a Ground-type is immune to normal electrical attacks why would this be any different?
 
Pikachu31511 said:
A new oddity that, while not on specific moves, does have to do with Moves mechanics: Immunity.

Seems odd that physical Ghost/Poison/Electric/Psychic/Dragon moves don't do any damage to Normal/Steel/Ground & Rubber/Dark/Fairy. Like I understand them not receiving elemental damage, but they're still being physically hit. Couldn't they at least do half Power, typeless, & STABless damage?

Also wouldn't Flying-types still be hit by Bonemerang, Sand Tomb,
Mud Bomb, Mud Shot, & MudSlap?
Click to expand...

Now this, this is a true oddity. I thought about this for a while and couldn't think about any logical reason lol.

Might be because the physical portion of a move is just a vessel for the elemental power, and the Pokemon concentrates most of its power into the elemental side. Take thunderpunch for example. The punch is just a "taxi" for the thunder to ride on. 10% punch, 90% thunder. Idk just a weird theory I thought of.

For the flying type thing it might because those ground type move have limited range. In the anime, bonemerang is portrayed as a bone staff that the Pokemon uses to whack opponents so they probably can't reach flying types. For the mud/sand moves it's probably because the mud/sand drifts away in the wind before reaching the flying type.
 
And there's Ghost-moves being able to hit Fighting-types, but not Normals. Why only the latter has the "can't hit each other" peculiarity?

And speaking of types effectiveness Pikachu315111 , did you forget about your types effectiveness analysis, or were you busy? You were doing a great job, you should continue. Same for the one that mentioned type by type in this thread the moves with odd distribution, if he's still here.
 
Master nicfer: I'm glad you liked my analysis. Don't know why I stopped, I think I just got busy. Unfortunately I'm not sure if I have time to continue, but if you have a specific type relation you want to hear my thoughts about just ask.
 
Last edited:
I imagine this has come up before, but it is not in the last 5 pages so I'l bring it up again if it has:

kyurem-black.gif
<-has a litteral ice covered arm with a hand and finger-like a appendeges that could easily be clenched into a fist. It doesn't get ice punch though.

I understand that it is because
kyurem.gif
doesnt look like it could punch anything to save its life, but it is still pretty funny to think about when wondering what to put on Black Kyurem's moveset.

I know Kyurem is supposed to personify "lack of energy", but when it merges with Zekrom it has a massive generator in its tail yet it can't learn Thunder Wave. Perhaps if they gave White Kyurem another fire move, they could get away eith giving Black Kyurem moves that better suit its forme, but I don't think White Kyurem only being able to learn Fusion Flare and Black Kyurem only being able to learn Fusion Bolt was enough.
 
WreckDra said:
I imagine this has come up before, but it is not in the last 5 pages so I'l bring it up again if it has:

kyurem-black.gif
<-has a litteral ice covered arm with a hand and finger-like a appendeges that could easily be clenched into a fist. It doesn't get ice punch though.

I understand that it is because
kyurem.gif
doesnt look like it could punch anything to save its life, but it is still pretty funny to think about when wondering what to put on Black Kyurem's moveset.

I know Kyurem is supposed to personify "lack of energy", but when it merges with Zekrom it has a massive generator in its tail yet it can't learn Thunder Wave. Perhaps if they gave White Kyurem another fire move, they could get away eith giving Black Kyurem moves that better suit its forme, but I don't think White Kyurem only being able to learn Fusion Flare and Black Kyurem only being able to learn Fusion Bolt was enough.
Click to expand...

Poor Black Kyurem gets no Physical Ice-type moves aside from the it's Signature Freeze Shock which honestly isn't that good. Ice Punch, Icicle Crash, even Ice Shard or Ice Fang would have been nice for it to have! At least it gets Outrage.
 
Usernamesarestupid said:
I'm not sure if this is discussed but i find it odd that Growlithe can't learn Growl. Like I get that it gets Roar, but I feel it should get Growl as well.
Click to expand...

Well let's also remember Growlithe's Japanese name is "Gardie" and Growl's Japanese name is "Cry". But still it would still be appropriate in some way, just not as much as in English.
 
What makes Manectric able to use a bunch of different fire moves over other electric types? One of manectric's pokedex entries says that it's lightning sometimes ignites forest fires but can't most electric types do that? It's also not like there's a nearby forest anytime manectric uses overheat lol
 
sneaky. said:
What makes Manectric able to use a bunch of different fire moves over other electric types? One of manectric's pokedex entries says that it's lightning sometimes ignites forest fires but can't most electric types do that? It's also not like there's a nearby forest anytime manectric uses overheat lol
Click to expand...

manectric's special brand of electrical energy excites air molecules and causes them to ignite, ezpz
 
I think Pyroar would like a redo on what exactly does GF want it to do.

It has the stats of a Special Attacker.
Abilities of a Physical Attacker.
And movepool of a Mixed Attacker (though in the end it more focuses on Special Attacker and it never gets Flare Blitz).
 
I think GF didn't really have battling in mind when designing Pyroar. Their thought process was probably more along the lines of, "Hmm, we have a fire lion. What abilities could we give it?" "Well, lions are supposed to be really proud, right? How about Moxie? And Rivalry, since the line between male and female lions is so pronounced." "And it needs to have Hyper Voice, since lions roar." "Yeah, I'd imagine Pyroar hunting down prey by breathing fire instead of with teeth and claws. Let's make it a Special attacker."
 
Pikachu315111 said:
I think Pyroar would like a redo on what exactly does GF want it to do.

It has the stats of a Special Attacker.
Abilities of a Physical Attacker.
And movepool of a Mixed Attacker (though in the end it more focuses on Special Attacker and it never gets Flare Blitz).
Click to expand...
Well, it doesn't make much sense in isolation, but in comparison to Luxray it's clear they are opposites or reflections.

Luxray is a bulky (...well compared to Pyroar anyway) physical attacker with a reasonably mixed movepool leaning physical but with his best stab-moves (Wild Charge? Really? Come on GF) on the special side but with ablities to complement a physical side.

Pyroar is a speedy special attacker with a reasonably mixed movepool leaning physical but best stab's are special and his abilities complement a physical side. So it's suggested that these lions are meant to be equal opposites or foils, Pyroar has stat and move matches but no abilities, Luxray has stat and ability matching but no good moves.

But Mr. Stage7-4, then why did Gamefreak design two lion pokemon in roles that don't complement their stats? Err, ah um gee I think I'm needed back in the mystery thread. Gotta fly!
 
stage7_4:
Except Pyroar's movepool is poor. Sure it learns powerful Fire- and Normal-type attacks... but that's it. It doesn't really get any other type of move besides a few here and there (Crunch, Dig, Bulldoze, Wild Charge, Bounce, & Iron Tail works off its low Attack stat and Snarl has low Power).

Also why compound the error by making Pyroar as a foil equally bad as Luxray when they could instead improve Luxray and make sure they don't make the same mistake with Pyroar? This isn't them making the two lion Pokemon foils of each other, this is them messing up both times they made a lion Pokemon.
 
Pikachu315111 said:
stage7_4:
Except Pyroar's movepool is poor. Sure it learns powerful Fire- and Normal-type attacks... but that's it. It doesn't really get any other type of move besides a few here and there (Crunch, Dig, Bulldoze, Wild Charge, Bounce, & Iron Tail works off its low Attack stat and Snarl has low Power).

Also why compound the error by making Pyroar as a foil equally bad as Luxray when they could instead improve Luxray and make sure they don't make the same mistake with Pyroar? This isn't them making the two lion Pokemon foils of each other, this is them messing up both times they made a lion Pokemon.
Click to expand...
Yep, that's point. I guess I wasn't very clear in the beginning, I thought the joke at the end of the post was supposed to explain how two wrongs still don't make a right. Darn you Poe's law!

While I still think Pyroar is a foil to Luxray (who also has a sparse movepool, just at least Pyroar gets some STAB's to work with in Hypervoice and Fire Blast), you are correct in that being foils of each other just translates the question from "What happened to Pyroar?" to "What happened to Luxray and why did they do this twice?"
 
lucariomaster2 said:
I think GF didn't really have battling in mind when designing Pyroar. Their thought process was probably more along the lines of, "Hmm, we have a fire lion. What abilities could we give it?" "Well, lions are supposed to be really proud, right? How about Moxie? And Rivalry, since the line between male and female lions is so pronounced." "And it needs to have Hyper Voice, since lions roar." "Yeah, I'd imagine Pyroar hunting down prey by breathing fire instead of with teeth and claws. Let's make it a Special attacker."
Click to expand...

I agree with this. Not all Pokémon are designed to be efficient in terms of movepool and abilities. Think Gyarados, who has a fantastic special movepool but hasn't the stats to back it up (post-Gen 1 anyway). Sure it has decent physical moves as well but nowhere as good as the special ones. They even waited for 4 and half generations before giving it Crunch.

Luxray suffers from the same problem as the other non-Zekrom physical Electrics, the lack of a good physical Electric move.

Also Pyroar's special movepool isn't that horrible. It gets Solarbeam if sun is your thing (most Fire types do but I digress) and Dark Pulse for a reason (although it doesn't hit much. Chandelure maybe?)
 
stage7_4 said:
Well, it doesn't make much sense in isolation, but in comparison to Luxray it's clear they are opposites or reflections.

Luxray is a bulky (...well compared to Pyroar anyway) physical attacker with a reasonably mixed movepool leaning physical but with his best stab-moves (Wild Charge? Really? Come on GF) on the special side but with ablities to complement a physical side.

Pyroar is a speedy special attacker with a reasonably mixed movepool leaning physical but best stab's are special and his abilities complement a physical side. So it's suggested that these lions are meant to be equal opposites or foils, Pyroar has stat and move matches but no abilities, Luxray has stat and ability matching but no good moves.

But Mr. Stage7-4, then why did Gamefreak design two lion pokemon in roles that don't complement their stats? Err, ah um gee I think I'm needed back in the mystery thread. Gotta fly!
Click to expand...
At least GF in Gen 4 were nice enough to give Luxray Intimidate. If Pyroar had intimidate it'd be a thousand times better.
 
So you know how HGSS has really odd Move Tutor choices? Well, one of them is String Shot, and for whatever reason I was looking at what could learn it the other day. Obviously it's mostly made up of Bug-types, but we have some outliers: Bulbasaur, Ivysaur, Venusaur, Remoraid, Octillery, Mantine, Lileep, Cradily, Shellos, and Gastrodon.

I can kind of see the Bulbasaur line getting it because of sticky plant sap. Or something? I dunno, but it doesn't seem as weird to me as it should.

For Remoraid and Octillery, I think it's tied to their weird projectile-based movepools and their gun/tank theme.

I can not for the life of me figure out why Mantine, Lileep, Cradily, Shellos, and Gastrodon get it, though.
 
Kurona said:
At least GF in Gen 4 were nice enough to give Luxray Intimidate. If Pyroar had intimidate it'd be a thousand times better.
Click to expand...
True, but I'll take usable stab moves over a great ability, and Fire/Dark/Normal is decent enough in-game. So I guess both lions have something to be jealous over.

Karxrida said:
So you know how HGSS has really odd Move Tutor choices? Well, one of them is String Shot, and for whatever reason I was looking at what could learn it the other day. Obviously it's mostly made up of Bug-types, but we have some outliers: Bulbasaur, Ivysaur, Venusaur, Remoraid, Octillery, Mantine, Lileep, Cradily, Shellos, and Gastrodon.

I can kind of see the Bulbasaur line getting it because of sticky plant sap. Or something? I dunno, but it doesn't seem as weird to me as it should.

For Remoraid and Octillery, I think it's tied to their weird projectile-based movepools and their gun/tank theme.

I can not for the life of me figure out why Mantine, Lileep, Cradily, Shellos, and Gastrodon get it, though.
Click to expand...
For Lileep, Cradily, Shellos, and Gastrodon might be a reference to the velvet worm, a relative of slugs, snails, and arthropods.

Either that or the more disgusting sea cucumber.

I've got nothing for Mantine though.
 
Looking at move tutors, I noticed that Lucario can't learn Iron Head. Not that weird, but a lot of things with smaller heads and/or not so metallic-looking gets it.
 
Billy the Uncle said:
Looking at move tutors, I noticed that Lucario can't learn Iron Head. Not that weird, but a lot of things with smaller heads and/or not so metallic-looking gets it.
Click to expand...
I think the oddity is that Lucario can't learn Iron Head but it CAN learn Iron Tail. I would have imagined Iron Head would fit its style more than Iron Tail
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top