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Sword & Shield **Official news only** DLC Crown Tundra 22nd October

Yeah, I'll agree that this is pretty much the industry standard now — the price of gaming has increased overall, even taking inflation into account. I buy fewer games now since I know most of them will get me to shell out additional money if I like them. :puff: What makes this particular deal tough to swallow for me is that pokemon's online is already a broken unintuitive mess that tanks the game's performance. At least smash has smooth online, my wild area drops to single digit FPS if I'm connected.

I'm at least hopeful that this means they'll have improved the GTS. I hope they'll finally get rid of impossible requests like female Dittos, let us see the nature and IVs of offered pokemon, and request specific pokemon+held item trades.
 
So why are trading and mystery gift exclusive to the phone version?
IMG_20200128_100443.jpg
 
My guess is "You can already trade and receive gifts in the games. Why would you use the Switch app for that?"
"You can receive Mystery Gifts in the mobile device version of Pokémon HOME! With this feature, you can receive Mystery Gifts for Pokémon Sword and Pokémon Shield as well as gifts specifically for Pokémon HOME. "
 
My guess is "You can already trade and receive gifts in the games. Why would you use the Switch app for that?"

Thats probably gamefraks reasoning but also if you are already in the app theres no good reason to lock it off. Especially if there's stuff exclusive to Home.


Love to juggle 2 different apps
 
Honestly... I'm more upset because I'm so exhausted. I know what's gonna happen, it's so fucking predictable: more bitching, more moaning, more bitching, more moaning, more crying, more anger, more hatred, and oh yeah more bitching.

I just want it all to stop...
This has been the case with the Pokémon fandom since as long as I can remember. 2006, probably even 2005. We have always been whining and complaining about every little thing, even the good things. Or maybe I should say: especially the good things.

As for me, I don't have much to say about the news on Home. I'm probably not going to get it, I am at the very least not going to get any of the longer subscription variants. I might give the monthly version a try once if I feel like it, but not more. Since I'm qutting being a hardcore Pokémon player and I have no real plans to do any serious breeding on Sword (the main thing I stored on Bank in Gen 6/7 was breeding fodder), I can't see any point in Home. I also don't think I'll transfer any Pokémon from previous generations to Gen 8. It is not even possible to transfer the majority of them at the moment, so there's no real point in it either. However, there is one big thing that really annoys me with Home that I need to whine about, and it is this (quoting Serebii):

"Pokémon HOME includes a full National Dex to check across all the games connected to the app"

...

This is something I am not happy about. What happened to the National Dex being a feature that was available in the actual Pokémon games? Why have they decided to only make it a feature in side-apps with a paid subscription? I really disliked how they removed the National Dex in Gen 7 and put it in Bank, now they are doing the same thing in Gen 8 with Home. Why couldn't they have kept the National Dex in the games, or maybe had it both in the games and on Bank/Home? I don't understand. Or maybe I do, but then I don't want to accept the reason for it.

This was my contribution to the daily whining of the Pokémon fandom. I'm out.
 
This is something I am not happy about. What happened to the National Dex being a feature that was available in the actual Pokémon games? Why have they decided to only make it a feature in side-apps with a paid subscription? I really disliked how they removed the National Dex in Gen 7 and put it in Bank, now they are doing the same thing in Gen 8 with Home. Why couldn't they have kept the National Dex in the games, or maybe had it both in the games and on Bank/Home? I don't understand. Or maybe I do, but then I don't want to accept the reason for it.
The reasoning is still the same: natDex is discouraging for new players who'd feel forced to buy previous games in order to complete it.

No more, no less.
 
Pokemon Home finally got the details announced.

It acts as Wonder Trade + Trade + GTS + Bank + IV judge + National Dex.
Also usable from phone.

A bit more pricey than I'd have wanted, but heh. I was expecting it to have same price of Bank (which is a separate sub btw)
3 bucks per month, with 16 for a entire year

ABOUT TIME!

So they're going to have a free Basic version and a Premium you have to pay 16 a year for (yikes, more than triple from Bank). Well it must have some good features to justify the price hike, so let's look at what they're offering:

  • Moving Pokemon From Bank: WHAT DO YOU MEAN THE BASIC VERSION DOESN'T ALLOW THAT?!
    FOR THE LOVE OF ARCEUS! That right there I feel is probably the scummiest part of all this. Increase the price and if you want to transfer your old Pokemon over pay up! NO! BAD GAMEFREAK! Transferring Pokemon should be a FREE service. It was free between Gen III and V, but then they decided for no reason (well, I guess we now know the reason) to cut the functionality from the games and made it a separate service. A service they're not only charging for but can be shut down anytime and close enough several generations from transferring to each other.

  • Number Of Pokemon Can Be Deposited: So one box for free and pretty much the same amount as Bank for premium. I guess that's fair for Wonder Box, GTS, and Room Trade... you know, services that SHOULD HAVE BEEN IN THE ACTUAL GAME (but we'll get to that). Though otherwise the free version is an insubstantial number that they might as well not have it but that would involve actually putting content you'd expect to be in a Pokemon game to be in the game. Though this would have maybe been notable if they had also allowed you to transfer Pokemon from Bank to SwSh with the Basic version...

  • Wonder Box: So you replaced Wonder Trade with Surprise Trade... only to then bring back Wonder Trade via HOME under the name Wonder Box. What? Why change the names if the service in HOME is going to reference the replaced mechanic instead of the new one? Anyway, nice to see it here and despite the name change something I would also expect... though I have question. Had they not put in Wonder Box & the GTS, would the price still have raised? Like is them putting in these trading services to justify you spending money on Premium or is them putting in these services the reason the price was increased? The former is fine, the latter is scummy.

  • GTS: ... So... is this why you removed GTS from the games? You needed a major feature to advertise HOME so that more than those who would just want it to store extra Pokemon would buy it to. However you didn't want to put in the extra work to do something like bring back the Dream World or maybe make a battle simulator so we can still battle with the Pokemon who are stuck in HOME limbo. No, instead you decided to CHOP A MAJOR FEATURE FROM THE GAMES and slapped it onto HOME. Fuck you. Fuck you Game Freak. Fuck you Pokemon Company. Fuck you Nintendo.
    Is this why you didn't bring up HOME before or along with the DLC Expansions? You perfectly knew what you were doing, that this was going to rightly upset everyone, and so you thought first to buy yourself some kudos by introducing the DLC you knew most of the fans would like. Coward! You scummy, weaselly, money-grubbing cowards!
    You know, one Gaming Youtuber I watch is Angry Joe and for a few weeks now he has been bringing up some of what's been happening with Pokemon. He reported on the DLC Expansions, then next week had to make some corrections (we'll get to that), and then on his "Top 2019 Controversies" list put "Dexit" I think in one of the Top 5 spots. Now, I like Joe, but he's not a major Pokemon fan. When they initially reported about the DLC expansion he did a rant even though he didn't have all the information which is why next week he needed to do some correction (but even then still didn't have all the information). Now, while it's good to hear the thoughts of a person from outside of the community, at the same time I think had he talked with some fans he would be more understanding why the (initial) DLC Expansions aren't really that rage inducing for Pokemon fans. However, something Joe did say that the Pokemon community has to watch out as this could be the start of GF starting to chopping content and charging them back, little at first but increasing over time, noting that's pretty much what happened with EA games. Well, things sure escalated quickly, didn't they?
    Now, I still stand behind that the preventing moving from Poke Bank into SwSd in the Basic package is the worst thing here (at least you can use the GTS for free, though honestly the Premium service only increasing the number of Pokemon you can trade at once to 3 is weak). However it's the GTS thing that now convinced me to never trust GF ever again. I'm tired of it. Every good thing they do there's something bad following. And worse is that they know it's a bad thing but go along with it anyway.
    Next generation I want the GTS back in the games (I've given up hoping they would put back a generation transfer system back in the games, at least without something drastic happening which makes them realize tying the transfer between generations to an online application only wasn't a good idea). Actually, no, they're doing the DLC now which is adding in old mechanics, I want the GTS patched back into Sword & Shield.

  • Room Trade: Okay, so from what I'm reading Room Trade is essentially Wonder Trade/Surprise Trade except people have to join in. What's the point? To trade Wonder Trade with friend? Why not make that an option in the Wonder Box or combine it with the below Friend Trade?

  • Friend Trade: Something to be expected.
    Also, interesting the avatars are the player overworld sprites from Gen III, IV, and V. So far it's only the ones from RS, DP, and BW though I imagine they'll also have the versions from Emerald, Platinum, and trainers from B2W2. Also maybe include all the other trainer overworld sprites cause just the player characters would get boring. Also would be nice if they maybe made custom sprites for Gen I, II, VI, VII, and VIII but I have a feeling they won't because HOME is beginning to feel like an asset re-using cash grab.

  • Judge Function: Why is this a Premium only function? Isn't this done freely in the game? Can it be used in the GTS or while trading with friends? Doesn't look like it, which would have been the only point of maybe charging for it (though still would be scummy). Heck, looking at the screenshots it's STILL not written in numbers but uses vague wording like "Decent" and "Pretty Good" (actually, looking at the example image closer it looks like they consider low IVs "Decent", WTF?!). NUMBERS GF, IF YOU'RE GOING TO CHARGE US FOR THIS SERVICE AT LEAST CUT THE TAUROS MULCH AND SHOW US THE INVISIBLE NUMBERS!

  • National Dex: Something to be expected.
    Cool that they did collect the Dex entries from various games for all the Pokemon... though that's something Bulbapedia has also done. And Bulbapedia has also done a LOT more like showing us base stats (in numbers), movepool from all generations, Egg Group, Body Style, Footprint, EV Yield, etc. etc.. Are you doing that too with HOME, GF? Or is it just going to be a glorified Pokedex Pro you have to pay 16 bucks for? Actually that's no fair to Pokedex Pro as at least that also came with additional features like how to pronounce Pokemon names and gave us models with several animations.

  • Mystery Gift: Something to be expected, though a question: If they have a code that's not a generated one, can we also claim the code in HOME or will HOME have its own exclusive Mystery Gifts codes?

  • Your Room: Oh goodie, we get to decorate our profile that no one will probably see or care about with stock art. That's totally on par with Secret Bases or decorating our Dream House in the Dream World... GF, if you don't care, at this point, not doing it is less insulting then giving us this half-hearted attempt.

  • HOME Points: So as you deposit more Pokemon the more points you can get that can then be turned into... why not just give us the BP instead? Like, we're not told it can be used for anything else, just for getting BP. At the very least you could have copied the rewards from the Poke Mile mechanic (obviously adjusting the prices (and adding in more things, notably TRs and Nature Mints) but still it's something more to offer).

  • Version Features: Wait, WHAT? Why can't we Trade Pokemon, receive Mystery Gifts, check Battle Data, and Check News on our Switch? That makes no sense! The point of the Mobile Version is that you can do things on the go, it's alright if its missing certain features. YOU DO NOT NEED TO MAKE FEATURES EXCLUSIVE FOR THE MOBILE VERSION THAT CAN BE (AND SHOULD BE) ON THE SWITCH VERSION! GF, HOW STUPID ARE YOU?!

  • Premium Prices: A month is 3 bucks, 3 months is 5 bucks (4 dollar savings), and a whole year is 16 bucks (20 dollar savings). Okay, something doesn't feel right here. First off, why this middle 3 month package? Shouldn't it be 6 months, you know, half a year? Also, the savings from yearly subscription is rather big. Like, yeah, usually a yearly subscription is lower than 12 individual months to entice people into buying the yearly, but its usually like 2-3 months free. However HOME's yearly subscription is essentially 6-7 months free for the price of 5-6 months, what? This is like they're admitting they're purposely overcharging for the individual month charges. WTF?!

This is horrible. This is BAD! Like, I already wasn't expecting much aside from a slightly better Bank for 5 (maybe 6 or 7 bucks depending on the features), but this just makes me sick reading it. The sheer audacity GF has on display by tripling the price, putting what should be standard features behind the paid wall, and offering us cut content as a selling point has me wondering maybe it's about time I quit Pokemon. Like I'm already turning into a casual fan but this right here, I would not blame anyone for deciding to fully quit Pokemon as it just shows the hubris of GF. This isn't them offering a service, this is them exploiting the years of goodwill they built with the fans that they already started to wither away. GF needs to make a HARD course correction because if they keep going down the road they're going Pokemon then I don't know if Pokemon has the lasting power they think it has, at least under GF's tenure.

EDIT: Adding responses to comments:

Honestly... I'm more upset because I'm so exhausted. I know what's gonna happen, it's so fucking predictable: more bitching, more moaning, more bitching, more moaning, more crying, more anger, more hatred, and oh yeah more bitching.

I just want it all to stop...

I do too, but that's all up to GF... and bad news, I don't think it's stopping anytime soon.

Considering the sales of SwSh, they probably should continue being disconnected then :P

You know, until fans finally become disillusioned and they start seeing drops in game sales. We'll just have to see with Gen VIII.

Now that I think of it, what if you purchase the Premium subscription, deposit more than 30 Pokémon, and then decide to not renew (or cancel) it?

The website does not say anything about it.

I would hope it would just mean you can't deposit anymore Pokemon but all the Pokemon you have will still be there.

Home isn't free for a month. What they are making free for a month is Bank, so that it won't cost that subscription fee as well to transfer stuff up for February.

Wait, do you still also have to pay for Bank?

"Scummy AAA" service would be emulating EA or Bethesda and start to wall content behind microtransactions.
Demanding money for online services and providing DLCs is nowhere "scummy", it's normal market.

And we can't have different levels of "scummy"?

Sure, this may not be as SUPER scummy as EA or Bethesda with micro-transactions or loot boxes, but it's still PLAIN scummy for them to lock the previously free gen transfer behind a paid wall (which they just now tripled in price) and chopping a major feature from previous games, the GTS, to use as a selling point for HOME.

It's still scummy. Maybe not on the same scale as EA or Bethesda but then again maybe that's what GF is hoping for, trying to grab some of that extra cash but if they don't do it as extreme as the other triple AAA companies they'll glide under most gaming culture radar.
 
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Wait people actually had bank for longer than the 1 month free period?

Anyways I don’t think any of Gamefreak’s corner cutting will reasonably affect sales, mainly because they’re well aware of what they can afford to cut and still make a massive profit. Casual Pokémon fans/children make up a massive (probably supermajority) chunk of the buyer base for these games, and I think Gamefreak knows that those buyers aren’t too attached to Battle Frontier/GTS/other hardcore postgame stuff, they probably just play the main game once, maybe twice and be done with it afterwards. As long as Gamefreak delivers a passable main game with the core gameplay loop buyers expect I can’t imagine their sales tanking. Basically, they’re not stupid, they’re smart in all the wrong ways
 
Yeah... Pokemon Home is terrible to say the least. I would go into more depth but it's already been covered by other people.

At least it makes it simple for me. If SwSh ever get the full dlc national dex treatment (including Megas and Z moves), then I will pay the 8 quid to transfer everything in one go (except my hidden power users, they are never leaving gen 7) and that is all they are getting from me. If SwSh are never completed then Sun/Moon will be the retirement home for all my old pokemon.

Same thing goes for the Dlc, either let me have access to everything or I won't give you another penny. I gave Sword a try and it was better then I thought it would be, but now it's completed I've lost interest, as I've ran out of teams and pokemon I want to experiment with. I don't mind the dlc concept, especially compared to the third version model. But the current dlc will only give me 3/4 of a fully satisfying pokemon game, and I just don't trust them to part with any more money until they promise to bring everything back. Fortunately I've never cared about the online trading/battle system or I would also be in outrage, but I do feel sorry for you other guys.
 
OK now I'm not typing on a phone I can complain in full

So first off, the pricing bites. It's 3x the sub of Pokemon Bank for a yearly subscription (actually a smidge more), to begin with. There are monthly & 3 month passes except the monthly pass is about half the total sub of Bank and the 3 month pass is the exact price. There is a free basic version but the differences between basic & premium are somehow both stark AND arbitrary. Like you go from 30 pokemon to 6000, the ability to use Bank is locked off entirely, you dont get to make your own trade rooms. Meanwhile you go from 1 GTS to ...3? And 3 pokemon in a wonder box to 10? You can't access the Judge feature at all? The basic feature is basically here solely to transfer a small pokemon between multiple games on the same system which, appreciated, but also kind of sucky when sitting next to the Premium. At the same time the premium additions to GTS & Wonder Box feel weirdly low, like is that really a commodity? And I have *no clue* why the Judge feature is locked behind it. What is that super intensive on the cloud network? C'mon.
People are probably quick to point out that there are more features than Bank, which is true, but those features do not to me account for the increase price. Trading as a whole is probably more intensive, which is why I did expect a price increase....but the increase to $16 is like...not what I thought at all. I figured about $8 or maybe $10. $10 would still be a lot and would probably get some complaints but it's definitely better than $10. And if you just REALLY wanted GTS, mobile trading and wonder trade that is, nicely, put into the free package in a more limited form factor.

And everything else is just...fluff. National Dex. The home stickers (which I bet are severely limited without Bank, incidentally). News, battle data, mystery gift, that's just stuff rolled in from what they'd offer elsewhere.

And of course the thing almost everyone would want to use it for more than antyhing, Bank, is of course put behind 2 paywalls, my worst fear realized. You have to pay for Bank in addition to Home; the cheapest version is $3 for that first month since Bank will get a free month but after that it is ideally $8. Problem is that once your susbcription runs out the pokemon are now stuck in Home which gets exponentially worse depending onw hat kind of collector yo uwere and what games you have because hey! Let's not forget that ~200 pokemon will be locked away to Home until who knows when. We can assume you'll be able to pull them down but iirc Bank can and will delete your POkemon after a grace period is over so you'll probably need to reup the sub anyway. Frankly, Premium should just come with a Bank sub. At least that would slightly offset the price.


But let's put aside the pricing for a bit and talk about how Home just...straight up has features that should be in SWSH?:
  1. GTS
  2. The ability to have a friends list
  3. The abiltiy to make a room
  4. The ability to just trade with a friend without needing a 4 digit code
Like there's no reason to lock these away into the App even if some of these are available in a limited fashion on the free version. I would really hope that these are added, for free, at some point down the line.

And also....the arbitrary restrictions between the Switch & Mobile versions of the app. The app, and only the app, can:
  1. User Mystery Gift. Considering some of these only give a code and others are specifically only available through Home it's just bizarre.
  2. Use the special National Dex functions like viewing abilities and moves and searching by them. Why? No really, why? What psosible reason is there to shortchange the Switch Home like this?
  3. All trade functionality can only be done through the Mobile version. This means if you ever want to use GTS you'd have to make sure you put it into the Switch App, pull out the phone, initiate the trade, check on it later, then pull it out of the switch app. This is so needlessly extended. And it was already annoying that you have to go to a separate app to GTS at all. Much less use Trading That Isn't Trash.
  4. In ability to check Battle Data & News.

Just in general, if I'm pulling up the Switch version of the app why can I not also participate in the other functionality. Like I already have it booted up, why not let me check some battle data? Why not grab a Mystery Gift? If I have NSO let me use the GTS. No seriously why is the cool national dex search options locked to mobile?


And despite all this I'll have to put up with it because I would really like my Pokemon on hand rather than trapped a generation behind and in the future. It's frustrating.





cute that all the renders mimic the official artwork tho. thanks art team.
 
This may have already been answered, but what happens if you buy a subscription and let it lapse? Are your Pokemon deleted after a while?
 
Do we still not know when in February Home is coming out? It's starting on Saturday.

I'm also quite curious about its reference functions. Will movepools include legacy moves from earlier gens (assuming they don't somehow disable them in SwSh with an update)? What about event moves? Will we have to actually get a shiny or Gigantamax form Pokemon in order to register it?
 
Do we still not know when in February Home is coming out? It's starting on Saturday.
They weirdly still dont say anything other than "February 2020"
Kurona did notice that one of the example gifts, a free Pikachu just for using Home, starts distribution on the 7th so that could be the release date but honestly who can say for sure. Could have just been a dummy gift or who knows it could even launch before then.

I'm also quite curious about its reference functions. Will movepools include legacy moves from earlier gens (assuming they don't somehow disable them in SwSh with an update)?
I was thinking about that earlier too. Will it show based on the dex entry you have selected, will it show EVERY generation's learn set as an option...could we see full update movesets for the entire cast ahead of time?
Will we have to actually get a shiny or Gigantamax form Pokemon in order to register it?
The way it's phrased, if you just send over a Pokemon it will show you all of their Mega or G-Max forms. We're not sure on shininess. G-Max forms make me think "no" because unlike every other Pokemon they're not models posed like official art they just are official art (incidentally this means we're going to get high quality official art of all g-max forms before they properly reveal every pokemon on their website....)
p06_05.jpg
 
could we see full update movesets for the entire cast ahead of time?

It'd be interesting (and a useful reference source for NatDex), but I doubt it. I imagine those are still being worked on, and new learnsets will likely include DLC tutor moves that they won't want to spoil.

I also won't be surprised if they wait until the official reveal for art for things like G-Max Melmetal.
 
It'd be interesting (and a useful reference source for NatDex), but I doubt it. I imagine those are still being worked on, and new learnsets will likely include DLC tutor moves that they won't want to spoil.

I also won't be surprised if they wait until the official reveal for art for things like G-Max Melmetal.
Yeah with the new moves/move tutors I guess it makes sense to just not display movesets until they're "official".

It's possible G-Max Toxtricity & G-Max Melmetal's artwork are in the app just hidden until release, but fair enough I did forget about them. I wonder if G-Max Memetal might coincide with Home getting Go compatability
 
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