Needs More Info Make ^ override GVoice on the room chat and userlist

[Irpachuza]

I was told that this behavior was intended, so i'm making it as a suggestion instead of a bug report.
Not much to add to the title. At the moment, when promoting a global voice to RPW their name just keeps having the + rank and the voice position on the roomlist. ^ only appears on their user card. The whole point of having RPW is for it to be seen, to be shown, as discussed on this thread. I get that roomstaff and gstaff can't have it shown because the staff rank overrides it, but it is already over + and * on the userlist, so it's only logical that GVoices get the + overriden by the ^ as with any other room rank superior to +.

 

[Cassiopeia]

I was asked about this. Here's why I'm not a fan.
[11:22:04] Mia: i mean its supposed to be just a token, global rank does kinda take precedence
[11:22:09] Mia: & it __is__ still on the usercard

 

[Estarossa]

This topic is quite relevant to us in UU room, (and i'd presume a lot of other competitive rooms, eg. ik this came up for PU with their tour nights a while back too). We tend to offer Room Prize Winner as a prize for stuff such as topping the monthly tour nights leaderboard, as well as some occasional projects should the hosts request it and it be a relevant reward such as UU ladder challenge. However, the reality a lot of the time is that the winner of these sort of events that offer the Role in Tier rooms will often be voiced already.

This essentially makes this prize kinda defunct to a lot of people who resort to getting it on one of their Alts instead, which does kind of go against the point of the role. Having this either override Voice, or preferably be something that could be shown alongside your rank so that staff could also display it while not losing their perms, would be fantastic, eg. ^#estarossa, ^@avarice, ^%bandkrook as examples for the UU staff.

 

[Irpachuza]

I was asked about this. Here's why I'm not a fan.
[11:22:04] Mia: i mean its supposed to be just a token, global rank does kinda take precedence
[11:22:09] Mia: & it __is__ still on the usercard

I understand where you are coming from, and the precedence of course should apply to global staff. But what does global voice mean for global voices?:
1. Being able to use !show in any public room and PMs
2. Having a rank in any public chatroom
3. Appearing over the regs on the userlist
There is no other benefit public roomchat-wise, besides being trusted.
Being RPW means:
1. Being able to use !show in some public rooms
2. Having a rank in the chatroom
3. Appears over the regs, the voices and the bots on the userlist

So, at the end of the day, and as Estarossa exemplifies quite clearly, having GVoice override RPW on a room where you could be RPW doesn't give you any advantages, and it takes away the fun of having the token to distinguish you from the rest. The only disvantage that RPW has against Voice perms is that in some rooms it may not have !show perms. GVoices dont even have that issue.

 

[i want a lamp]

I understand where you are coming from, and the precedence of course should apply to global staff. But what does global voice mean for global voices?:
1. Being able to use !show in any public room and PMs
2. Having a rank in any public chatroom
3. Appearing over the regs on the userlist
There is no other benefit public roomchat-wise, besides being trusted.
Being RPW means:
1. Being able to use !show in some public rooms
2. Having a rank in the chatroom
3. Appears over the regs, the voices and the bots on the userlist

So, at the end of the day, and as Estarossa exemplifies quite clearly, having GVoice override RPW on a room where you could be RPW doesn't give you any advantages, and it takes away the fun of having the token to distinguish you from the rest. The only disvantage that RPW has against Voice perms is that in some rooms it may not have !show perms. GVoices dont even have that issue.

i may be mistaken, but atm the role of RPWs are a little inconsistent as well. RPWs have practically the same advantages as a g+ in a room, but RPWs show above the bots in a room. G+/+ do not, but the g+ rank overrides the RPW role, which can be quite confusing to say the least

 

[Zarel]

This would be a pretty simple fix: just move Prize Winner above Voice in the config.

miapi do you actually object to that change? This thread definitely seems to show that most people agree that Prize Winner should override Voice in the list.

Although, for everyone else here, I think a big problem is that if Prize Winner does override voice, it means that voice prize winners would no longer be able to use broadcast commands (unless the room specifically allows prize winners to use broadcast commands, which apparently some do?). Would that be worth it?

 

[Zarel]

GVoices dont even have that issue.

To be clear, gvoices would have that issue if we made Prize Winner outrank Voice. But only in the room they're Prize Winner in.

 

[Irpachuza]

To be clear, gvoices would have that issue if we made Prize Winner outrank Voice. But only in the room they're Prize Winner in.

I dont have the information, but this heavily depends on the public room perms and neccesities. So maybe its something that can be shared and debated directly with all ROs, even with something as simple as a poll thread, since if the vast majority of the rooms give !show perms to ^, then it still will be a QoL change. I guess it can also be checked by an admin, but you know, maybe some rooms just dont care about the rank so they didnt touch its perms.

 

[HiZo]

I think a big problem is that if Prize Winner does override voice, it means that voice prize winners would no longer be able to use broadcast commands (unless the room specifically allows prize winners to use broadcast commands, which apparently some do?).

If anything, have global permissions override room permissions. This could be weird for hierarchy but it's probably the least complex solution conceptually.

 

[Zarel]

If anything, have global permissions override room permissions. This could be weird for hierarchy but it's probably the least complex solution conceptually.

That would make it so global voices wouldn't be able to be ROs, because their voice would override their RO status.

What we could do is to share permissions, so that either global or room status would be enough. Feel free to make a separate suggestion thread for that. It would require some changes to how permissions currently work but it should be doable.

 

[Zarel]

if the vast majority of the rooms give !show perms to ^, then it still will be a QoL change.

If the vast majority of rooms give !show perms to ^, I will be very annoyed, because I wanted that to be the default and a bunch of people were like "NO IT SHOULD BE EXACTLY THE SAME AS A REGULAR USER"

(This current problem is exactly why I wanted that to be the default, too.)