Smogon Simple Questions Thread

TailGlowVM said:
https://www.smogon.com/dex/sm/pokemon/type-null/
https://www.smogon.com/dex/ss/pokemon/type-null/
Why is Type: Null considered Untiered in SM but NFE in SS? It's banned from the NFE metagame in both, and it didn't gain any new evolutions in Generation 8.
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NFE isn't a metagame. It's a listing of pokemon who aren't fully evolved and have no place in any of the tiers, but for one reason or another don't fulfill the requirements for LC (either because they're evolved or because they can't be obtained at level 5.
 
AztecCroc said:
NFE isn't a metagame. It's a listing of pokemon who aren't fully evolved and have no place in any of the tiers, but for one reason or another don't fulfill the requirements for LC (either because they're evolved or because they can't be obtained at level 5.
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Yes, I know being listed on the dex as NFE is not the same as the metagame, and that in Sw/Sh Type: Null is considered NFE due to not being legal in LC. My question was why Type: Null is listed as NFE in Sw/Sh but Untiered in SM?
 
TailGlowVM said:
Yes, I know being listed on the dex as NFE is not the same as the metagame, and that in Sw/Sh Type: Null is considered NFE due to not being legal in LC. My question was why Type: Null is listed as NFE in Sw/Sh but Untiered in SM?
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The Strategy Pokédex classifies ZU Pokémon as Untiered in gen 7, as Gen 7 ZU was never made an official metagame.
 
was gonna play some battle factory with my friend but then I remembered I don't know the server where the past gen battle factories are located. Can I get a link to that server? (if it exists) Also wondering if there's a doubles/VGC battle factory
 
musiquepkmn said:
was gonna play some battle factory with my friend but then I remembered I don't know the server where the past gen battle factories are located. Can I get a link to that server? (if it exists) Also wondering if there's a doubles/VGC battle factory
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Fairly sure you're thinking of the Random Other Metagame server hosted by UrKerab, that you can access here https://rom.psim.us/
 
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Here a suggestion: is it possible to make all posts in a thread anonymous to anyone that isn't a moderator? I think it could be interesting to experiment that with suspect tests threads, so people might focus more on the arguments brought rather than who brought the argument
 
Hi, podown (the Korean subsidiary of PS) has been removed for quite a while. Could we possibly have Korean as a language preference on Showdown so Koreans can have a platform to play all the available competitive aspects of Pokémon? Suggesting this because we have alot of other languages available in the settings! I’d be happy to devote my time helping translate anything that is necessary for this to happen, no matter the quantity. Thanks for listening!
 
Hello, I wanted to ask if anyone was considering a OuBl tier or a tier below Ubers? I feel like some pokemon are so good that others are made totally worthless in the tier. Pokemon like Zamazenta, Reshiram, and Lunala aren't very useful in Ubers, but are too strong for Ou. Same for mons banned from Ou like Cinderace and Kyurem.
 
HeroofRansei said:
Hello, I wanted to ask if anyone was considering a OuBl tier or a tier below Ubers? I feel like some pokemon are so good that others are made totally worthless in the tier. Pokemon like Zamazenta, Reshiram, and Lunala aren't very useful in Ubers, but are too strong for Ou. Same for mons banned from Ou like Cinderace and Kyurem.
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Gonna ignore your comment about Lunala not being good while it's sat in A tier in the VR forever now and just comment on the "UberBL" idea; what you are describing is often OU when a new generation has just dropped, where most things that are not cover legends are freed (see: Genesect, Landorus-I, Pheromosa, certain megas like Blaziken when those were around). However, one quickly comes to the conclusion that not only is playing such a tier not fun in the long term, it's also impossible to balance due to the variance that this threat overload provides. In turn, you cannot actually build a team that covers all of the metagame as there is always something that will beat you could not prepare for. If you start banning things, the tier quickly devolves into what OU looks like, give or take 3-4 Pokemon. This isn't even to mention how Ubers is now a fully fledged tier that is included in Grand Slam and there is no real following for this idea from players, so whoever is in charge of tiering has no reason to actually form said tier!

tl;dr unbanning Ubers sounds fun but not feasible nor sustainable in the long term
 
Lasen said:
Gonna ignore your comment about Lunala not being good while it's sat in A tier in the VR forever now and just comment on the "UberBL" idea; what you are describing is often OU when a new generation has just dropped, where most things that are not cover legends are freed (see: Genesect, Landorus-I, Pheromosa, certain megas like Blaziken when those were around). However, one quickly comes to the conclusion that not only is playing such a tier not fun in the long term, it's also impossible to balance due to the variance that this threat overload provides. In turn, you cannot actually build a team that covers all of the metagame as there is always something that will beat you could not prepare for. If you start banning things, the tier quickly devolves into what OU looks like, give or take 3-4 Pokemon. This isn't even to mention how Ubers is now a fully fledged tier that is included in Grand Slam and there is no real following for this idea from players, so whoever is in charge of tiering has no reason to actually form said tier!

tl;dr unbanning Ubers sounds fun but not feasible nor sustainable in the long term
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That's fair. Maybe when gen 9 drops and like. Everything is broken would it be feasible.
 
HeroofRansei said:
That's fair. Maybe when gen 9 drops and like. Everything is broken would it be feasible.
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I should add that people actually played an (unofficial!) OUBL metagame a bit, by allowing everything that was below the usage cutoff in Ubers, and they even had a discord server. The main problem was just that there wasn't enough activity in this metagame, and it just eventually died out.

If you still really wants to play it you can just decide your own definition of OUBL with some friends and play with them. There is no problem with that, and you don't need anyone's permission to do that.
 
R8 said:
I should add that people actually played an (unofficial!) OUBL metagame a bit, by allowing everything that was below the usage cutoff in Ubers, and they even had a discord server. The main problem was just that there wasn't enough activity in this metagame, and it just eventually died out.

If you still really wants to play it you can just decide your own definition of OUBL with some friends and play with them. There is no problem with that, and you don't need anyone's permission to do that.
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Did they have a ladder? If yes, is it still playable?
 
I'm looking for the Move Legality table / database for Pokemon Showdown. I want to extract the data for a spreadsheet / database project that I'm working on. Are there any tools that I can use for this? Where would be a good starting place? If this isn't the forum that would be the best for this question, can you point me in the right direction?
Thanks so much!
 
linux user said:
The learnset data for Pokemon Showdown is available here: https://raw.githubusercontent.com/smogon/pokemon-showdown/master/data/learnsets.ts. It's just a very big JS object which should be pretty easy to work with in most programming languages.
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Awesome. Thank you so much! Is there a key anywhere that can explain the hard-coded constants in there? Like, for this snippet of code (commented by me):

"bulbasaur: { // Which Pokemon we're defining the learnset for
learnset: { // Opens the learnset object
amnesia: ["8M", "7E", "6E", "5E", "4E"], // Which move is learned; what are the "8M," "7E," etc.?
attract: ["8M", "7M", "7V", "6M", "5M", "4M", "3M"],

Most of my programing experience is in Python and Java, but not JavaScript.
 
Darwinist42 said:
Awesome. Thank you so much! Is there a key anywhere that can explain the hard-coded constants in there? Like, for this snippet of code (commented by me):

"bulbasaur: { // Which Pokemon we're defining the learnset for
learnset: { // Opens the learnset object
amnesia: ["8M", "7E", "6E", "5E", "4E"], // Which move is learned; what are the "8M," "7E," etc.?
attract: ["8M", "7M", "7V", "6M", "5M", "4M", "3M"],

Most of my programing experience is in Python and Java, but not JavaScript.
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The entires for each move are in the format of Generation LearnMethod
Generation will be what generation (1-8 for now) that move can be learned in
This is paired with a specific letter indicating how the move is learned:
  • L indicated the move is learned by level up, its followed by what level the move is learned at (8L5 means in generation 8, this pokemon learns this move at level 5).
  • M indicates the move is learned as a TM, TR, or HM (8M means learned via TM/TR in gen 8).
  • T indicates the move is learned through a tutor (8T means learned via move tutor in gen 8).
  • E indicates the move is an egg move (8E means the pokemon can obtain this move through breeding in gen 8).
  • V indicates the move can be obtained through a virtual console transfer (8V this pokemon can obtain this move in a virtual console game and then can be transfered to gen 8).
  • S indicates the move is learned through one of the events, see the eventData array for all events. The integer after S is the array index for the event in question. (8S10 means this pokemon learns this move through a special event/distribution, and the specific event details can be found in the eventData array for this pokemon at index 10).
  • R - R meaning Restrictive. This handles any special cases like the various Rotom forme's moves.
 
HoeenHero said:
The entires for each move are in the format of Generation LearnMethod
Generation will be what generation (1-8 for now) that move can be learned in
This is paired with a specific letter indicating how the move is learned:
  • L indicated the move is learned by level up, its followed by what level the move is learned at (8L5 means in generation 8, this pokemon learns this move at level 5).
  • M indicates the move is learned as a TM, TR, or HM (8M means learned via TM/TR in gen 8).
  • T indicates the move is learned through a tutor (8T means learned via move tutor in gen 8).
  • E indicates the move is an egg move (8E means the pokemon can obtain this move through breeding in gen 8).
  • V indicates the move can be obtained through a virtual console transfer (8V this pokemon can obtain this move in a virtual console game and then can be transfered to gen 8).
  • S indicates the move is learned through one of the events, see the eventData array for all events. The integer after S is the array index for the event in question. (8S10 means this pokemon learns this move through a special event/distribution, and the specific event details can be found in the eventData array for this pokemon at index 10).
  • R - R meaning Restrictive. This handles any special cases like the various Rotom forme's moves.
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Awesome! Thanks! This is perfect for my project!
 
Trying to fix bad Starters!

Starters in definition are "the Pokémon the trainer chooses at the beginning of their Pokémon Journey and the main protagonists of the Pokémon Series of games".

Now being the Main Protagonists of the Game they're in makes you think that they are very strong, but even though some of them are incredibly strong to the point of Uber Level some of them are weaker than your average 3-Stage 400-500 BST Pokémon, So why do they suck well-.

The Problem

Now the reason for this is because of how a Pokémon Functions or their specific "Niche" some Pokémon have a niche they can fulfill, for example Wall Breakers, Defensive Pivot, Sweeper, Suicide Lead, Defogger, etc., having a role or multiple roles help develop a Pokémons Viability and justify using them on your team, but seeing this title will probably spoil the fact that Most Starters do not have a Niche in the OU tier and end up on lower tiers where they can actually find a purpose, which is kinda sad and depressing when you find out that your favorite Starter which the one you go on with your journey with is in NU, so I will try to fix them.

Fixing Process

Now when i fix a Starter I will mostly be aiming for it to be on the OU tier which is the the highest tier that regular Pokémon can be played at without stumbling at Box Art Legendaries.

My method of fixing these Pokémon will be by finding them a Niche that they can fulfill successfully this done by giving them new moves, abilities and shuffling there Base Stats, so without further ado let's get fixing shall we.

Meganium (PU) :Meganium:
HP: 80
Atk: 82
Def: 100
SpA: 83
SpD: 100
Spe: 80
BST: 525
Abilities: Leaf Guard, Overgrow

Meganium has only one role which is being a cleric (a role it already has high competition with Audino) by having Aromatherapy and the other notable moves it has is Dragon Tail, Giga Drain, Synthesis, Petal Blizzard, Leech Seed, Swords Dance, and Seed Bomb, this Pokémons moveset is just pathetic the first thing I'll add is Calm Mind as boosting move that pairs well with Giga Drain, the second thing I'll add is giving more coverage so things like Focus Blast, Power Gem, Ice Beam and Weather Ball which will pair great with it's new ability Chlorophyll now when I give abilities to Starters I want to give them ones the fit in thematically and this ability is very common for Grass Types why not give it that, but the problem with giving this ability to it is that it will face competition with Venusaur which is why I gave it a new move to give it a different niche than a Sun Sweeper and that is Solar Drain a 80 BP move that heals the user for 75% of tha damage they dealt this move will help it establish a Niche as a Bulky Sustainer paired with Leech Seed, and Calm Mind to not only heal more but also tank more special hits, now for the Base Stat changes I decided to buff it by 10 points to be the same BST as Typhlosion then added more points in HP, Def, SpDef and SpAtk to help it at its Niche More.

After Results

New Meganium :Meganium:
HP: 100
Atk: 75
Def: 100
SpA: 105
SpD: 100
Spe: 55
BST: 535
Ability: Chlorophyll
New Moves: Calm Mind, Solar Drain, Power Gem, Focus Blast, Ice Beam, Weather Ball

So is it capable of having a Niche in OU? Do you have anything you want to add? I'll be happy to read your replies and hopefully make my skills at fixing Pokémon better since I do plan on making more of these.
 
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CJ Flava said:
Trying to fix bad Starters!

Starters in definition are "the Pokémon the trainer chooses at the beginning of their Pokémon Journey and the main protagonists of the Pokémon Series of games".

Now being the Main Protagonists of the Game they're in makes you think that they are very strong, but even though some of them are incredibly strong to the point of Uber Level some of them are weaker than your average 3-Stage 400-500 BST Pokémon, So why do they suck well-.

The Problem

Now the reason for this is because of how a Pokémon Functions or their specific "Niche" some Pokémon have a niche they can fulfill, for example Wall Breakers, Defensive Pivot, Sweeper, Suicide Lead, Defogger, etc., having a role or multiple roles help develop a Pokémons Viability and justify using them on your team, but seeing this title will probably spoil the fact that Most Starters do not have a Niche in the OU tier and end up on lower tiers where they can actually find a purpose, which is kinda sad and depressing when you find out that your favorite Starter which the one you go on with your journey with is in NU, so I will try to fix them.

Fixing Process

Now when i fix a Starter I will mostly be aiming for it to be on the OU tier which is the the highest tier that regular Pokémon can be played at without stumbling at Box Art Legendaries.

My method of fixing these Pokémon will be by finding them a Niche that they can fulfill successfully this done by giving them new moves, abilities and shuffling there Base Stats, so without further ado let's get fixing shall we.

Meganium (PU) :Meganium:
HP: 80
Atk: 82
Def: 100
SpA: 83
SpD: 100
Spe: 80
BST: 525
Abilities: Leaf Guard, Overgrow

Meganium has only one role which is being a cleric (a role it already has high competition with Audino) by having Aromatherapy and the other notable moves it has is Dragon Tail, Giga Drain, Synthesis, Petal Blizzard, Leech Seed, Swords Dance, and Seed Bomb, this Pokémons moveset is just pathetic the first thing I'll add is Calm Mind as boosting move that pairs well with Giga Drain, the second thing I'll add is giving more coverage so things like Focus Blast, Power Gem, Ice Beam and Weather Ball which will pair great with it's new ability Chlorophyll now when I give abilities to Starters I want to give them ones the fit in thematically and this ability is very common for Grass Types why not give it that, but the problem with giving this ability to it is that it will face competition with Venusaur which is why I gave it a new move to give it a different niche than a Sun Sweeper and that is Solar Drain a 80 BP move that heals the user for 75% of tha damage they dealt this move will help it establish a Niche as a Bulky Sustainer paired with Leech Seed, and Calm Mind to not only heal more but also tank more special hits, now for the Base Stat changes I decided to buff it by 10 points to be the same BST as Typhlosion then added more points in HP, Def, SpDef and SpAtk to help it at its Niche More.

After Results

New Meganium :Meganium:
HP: 100
Atk: 75
Def: 100
SpA: 105
SpD: 100
Spe: 55
BST: 535
Ability: Chlorophyll
New Moves: Calm Mind, Solar Drain, Power Gem, Focus Blast, Ice Beam, Weather Ball

So is it capable of having a Niche in OU? Do you have anything you want to add? I'll be happy to read your replies and hopefully make my skills at fixing Pokémon better since I do plan on making more of these.
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I like what you're trying to do, but I think you should give it a nice secondary typing. Maybe grass dragon would be cool? I feel like this would be, outclassed by Venu even with Solar Drain.
 
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