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SPOILERS! Mysteries and Conspiracies of Pokemon
- Thread starter stage7_4
- Start date
I had a similar idea, but Pluck/Bug Bite/Teatime throw a spanner in the works (as does Gluttony, to a lesser extent)
Darn, I forgot about those.
Well, in that case I guess the berries are just effective all the time and genuinely only eaten in need. After all, the item is kept in-game until that point, and obviously can go unused if the holder is knocked out. The same goes for the type-resist berries - it's a slightly weird image for a Pokemon to see an incoming Ice Beam and quickly eat a Yache Berry in the 0.3 seconds before the move hits them, but that does seem to be how it works based on game mechanics. The Enigma Berry only restores health after being hit with a super-effective attack, too, which makes it rather disappointingly worthless since a super-effective attack is quite often likely to simply knock you out - and even if the attack only does 90% and you survive it, gaining back 25% isn't going to save you from the next hit.
I guess it's kind of like Popeye eating his spinach, but the issue is that that only works for some of the Berries and not others. You can see why a Pokemon would retain a potential Speed or Attack boost in reserve as a last resort. But a Defence or Special Defence boost is most useful when applied at the start of battle, not the end, since a +1 boost to your Defence isn't likely to save you when you've only got 10% of your HP left.
This is another one where the Adventures manga presents an interesting contrast. When Emerald's Sceptile fights Noland's Glalie, they grapple and Glalie steadily depletes Sceptile's HP - then the watching Frontier Brains notice that Sceptile is desperately cramming its mouth with Leftovers to try and regain health, which doesn't really fit the way that item is designed to work as far as I'm concerned. Leftovers is supposed to be a gradual, passive restoration, not an "oh crap I'm about to faint, better quickly heal myself up" item to be used in a pinch. One of the pinch berries would have been a much more apt choice in that scene.
(Side note: probably the wrong forum to ask, but what happened to Smogon's item analyses? Time was you could go to a page like https://www.smogon.com/dex/dp/items/ganlon-berry/ and there'd be a little section detailing how generally useful the item was, and what sort of strategies would utilise it. I liked those.)
That is why my family's farm is all natural grass fed cows.
And let me tell you: you can taste the difference. Nothing beats a steak from a grass fed cow. Unlike it is a Tauros filet mignon.
I'm all about Guernsey cream milk, that stuff is just phenomenal.
So there's absolutely no way these two didn't have bigger roles in an earlier draft of BW, right? You're not gonna convince me that characters this intricately designed and mystical-looking with original Japanese names of, I shit you not, Goddess of Love and Goddess of Peace were always intended to have 7 combined lines total across the entire duology with no battles. Assuming I'm right, what do you think the original plan was, and why was it cut down?
I imagine the original draft had significantly more detail planned for N's past rather than having it mostly at the end. A lot of the concept art, especially for N (shoutout to the brief time he was missing one of his mouth cheeks), was a lot more dark and serious. I imagine the pair would have showed up throughout the game to give insights to N; or at least show up alongside him during the back half of the game like the sages kinda did alongside Ghetsis.
So there's absolutely no way these two didn't have bigger roles in an earlier draft of BW, right? You're not gonna convince me that characters this intricately designed and mystical-looking with original Japanese names of, I shit you not, Goddess of Love and Goddess of Peace were always intended to have 7 combined lines total across the entire duology with no battles. Assuming I'm right, what do you think the original plan was, and why was it cut down?
Probably cut back over time for all kinds of reasons. Pacing, plot edits, juggling the rest of the cast, wanting to let N's past be a thing you sort of stumble upon and make you go "oh....", etc.
It's not a very exciting answer, but with how game development goes, sometimes characters you like and have plans for just slip through the cracks.
Where is this image from? Where did you find it?
I'm begging for a BW artbook right now.
It was from an old presentation, but we only have screenshots and i think brief transcript of the interview since it was put into a magazine
Adding my name to this
In the introduction to my guide for Pokemon Ruby and Sapphire, they describe abilities as "an extra power or ability that takes effect in battle, such as a shocking coat of electricity that can paralyse the foe if it hits the Pokemon, or a stubborn resistance to damage once the Pokemon has taken a hit."
Obviously, the shocking coat of electricity would seem to be a reference to Static, which several Pokemon in Hoenn (Pikachu, Voltorb, Electrike et al) possess. But there's no such ability in the game that matches the second descriptor, until Stamina's introduction in Gen VII.
The "stubborn resistance" descriptor may have just been generic, but there are a few other aspects of the book that point to material that was scrapped late in development (Cacophony is listed in the book as a possible ability, for instance) so it got me wondering if Stamina, or something similar in concept, was at one point planned for Gen III - and which Pokemon might have had that ability if so.
Obviously, the shocking coat of electricity would seem to be a reference to Static, which several Pokemon in Hoenn (Pikachu, Voltorb, Electrike et al) possess. But there's no such ability in the game that matches the second descriptor, until Stamina's introduction in Gen VII.
The "stubborn resistance" descriptor may have just been generic, but there are a few other aspects of the book that point to material that was scrapped late in development (Cacophony is listed in the book as a possible ability, for instance) so it got me wondering if Stamina, or something similar in concept, was at one point planned for Gen III - and which Pokemon might have had that ability if so.
My first thought was that it was Study, but Sturdy didn't protect against non-designated OHKOs until Gen 5, making the connection less solid. I suppose it could also refer to Battle Armor. Static, Battle Armor, and Sturdy all have really low index numbers, for what it's worth.
I think this is either bad translation or bad wording (the people who write the guides generally don't have much of a clue about Pokémon) because of the "resistance" word being included. I imagine they wanted it to refer to something like Thick Fat, where a Pokémon has resistances it wouldn't normally have (and Thick Fat was in Gen III), and just worded it in the most convoluted and inaccurate way possible. Going down the translation angle, it's possible immunity somehow turned into "stubborn resistance" and it refers to something like Wonder Guard or Flash Fire.
Honestly I don't think something like Stamina was planned back in Gen III, in no small part because there aren't really any Pokémon I can see it making sense for. It doesn't even make all that much sense on Mudsdale, in fairness, but I still think it's a very powerful ability by Gen III standards. In some ways Gen III had strong abilities, since many of them played with the type chart in a way we've rarely seen since, but this doesn't feel like Gen III's style.
This might be it. I also briefly thought of Flash Fire and similar abilities, which are very loosely similar in that they give a resistance to damage once hit (though in FF's case it's an immunity combined with a power boost).
Of note is that the introduction also refers to two nonexistent natures - "Aggressive Pokemon will have higher Attack, and Stubborn Pokemon will have higher Defence" - that roughly correspond with Adamant and Bold/Impish/Relaxed.
Well, it being such a powerful ability was my thinking as to why it was scrapped, if indeed it ever was planned. There were probably all sorts of early concepts that would seem unusual or ridiculous now; I've read that at one point they considered changing the number of moves a Pokemon could learn, for instance.
But it being too powerful doesn't necessarily mean that it couldn't have been intended for Gen III - abilities frequently get nerfed/altered between generations, even in the earlier gens, though it's more notable in later gens due to the overpowered nature of abilities such as Gale Wings and Parental Bond.
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It's probably not meant to be literal natures and more just...flavorful description/interpretation of natures as a whole
Guides tend to do that, even if it doesn't fully match what's going on.
Gotta consider the original terms.
In Japanese metamorphosis doesn't really work because it is glossed as either (1) henshin: a more temporary magical-girl style transformation or (2) hentai: insect metamorphosis (as well as worse stuff).
As for gender and sex; they are literally the same word in Japanese.
Hilariously, according to both the anime and Ruby's pokedex it makes perfect sense for Taillow
and c'mon, having a speedy fragile attacker have a defensive ability has Gamefreak written all over it
I always thought they were called genders because you can't say "sex" in a kids' game in English.
To my knowledge, the first three generation games never tell you which types are Physical and which ones are Special.
Not in the main story, not in the so-called Pokémon schools, and not even in the manuals!
You had one job!
Pokémon Stadium 2 does mention them, however. Seriously, Earl's Academy is fucking awesome.
Not in the main story, not in the so-called Pokémon schools, and not even in the manuals!
Pokémon Stadium 2 does mention them, however. Seriously, Earl's Academy is fucking awesome.
More like they did. Nowadays they've severely overcorrected.
Such as?
Alright, weird personal gripe: who fought who in the Kalos War?
Was it a civil war?
Was it Kalos versus Kanto/Johto/Hoenn/Sinnoh or Unova?
Was it Kalos versus Alola, Galar, or Paldea?
Was it Kalos versus another region that is never referred to for absolutely no reason?
Was it Kalos versus aliens?
Is Kalos a neutral nation somehow?
Another example: the war in the past in the Lucario film.
WHO. FOUGHT. WHO? AND WHY?
How can I care for a plot-relevant war if you don't know who fought and why they fought!?
The 2-hour tutorials and endless handholding
The lengthy tutorial wouldn't be a problem if they actually explained a good amount of things.
It's a 2-hour tutorial... for "This place can be used to buy items and heal your Pokémon", "Damage the wild Pokémon to catch it", and the generational gimmick. It's a dreadful tutorial because it barely gives information.
That's a matter for another thread, though.
The real world has a "French and Indian War" where the French and indigenous Americans were (mostly) on the same side, so there's definitely precedent.Such as?
Alright, weird personal gripe: who fought who in the Kalos War?
Was it a civil war?
Was it Kalos versus Kanto/Johto/Hoenn/Sinnoh or Unova?
Was it Kalos versus Alola, Galar, or Paldea?
Was it Kalos versus another region that is never referred to for absolutely no reason?
Was it Kalos versus aliens?
Is Kalos a neutral nation somehow?
Another example: the war in the past in the Lucario film.
<-- This one.
WHO. FOUGHT. WHO? AND WHY?
How can I care for a plot-relevant war if you don't know who fought and why they fought!?
Such as?
Alright, weird personal gripe: who fought who in the Kalos War?
Was it a civil war?
Was it Kalos versus Kanto/Johto/Hoenn/Sinnoh or Unova?
Was it Kalos versus Alola, Galar, or Paldea?
Was it Kalos versus another region that is never referred to for absolutely no reason?
Was it Kalos versus aliens?
Is Kalos a neutral nation somehow?
Another example: the war in the past in the Lucario film.
<-- This one.
WHO. FOUGHT. WHO? AND WHY?
How can I care for a plot-relevant war if you don't know who fought and why they fought!?
The real answer is likely that they didn't want to elaborate too much on a war in a children's game beyond the bare essentials, but I'd also imagine the geopolitical scope of the Pokemon world is pretty different in the modern day than it was during a conflict from 3000 years ago, which is an massive amount of time all things considered. I think the most common headcanon is that it was with Galar, but it's entirely possible that it was all with civilizations located in modern Kalos, for example.
Going by the research notes in Lysandre’s lab in X & Y, I think we can conclude that Kalos definitely wasn’t a neutral party:
> “The king couldn’t escape war with those who targeted a wealthy Kalos. The war grew so violent and ugly, the king was forced to send his own beloved Pokémon into battle.”
Kalos itself was the target of the conflict. As for the participants, I think the research notes also imply that it was a civil war (of sorts), between Kalos (led by AZ), and an insurrectionist group led by AZ’s brother:
> “AZ had a younger brother. It’s said he led a legion of greedy souls who wanted to seize the Kalos region. His dark intention was to make it his own. But when he saw how Kalos had been ravaged by the war, he took the weapon his brother had created, and buried that weapon deep underground.”
In keeping with the overall themes of X & Y, it looks to have been a war over resources. AZ brought prosperity to the Kalos region, his brother grew jealous of that, conflict emerged which brought ruin to the nation, and ultimately AZ abandoned his throne after Floette left him, while his brother saw the horror of what his rebellion had caused and buried the ultimate weapon out of regret.