SPOILERS! Scarlet & Violet Leaks Thread - Data/Mechanics

RocketSurgery said:
-HOME transfer to SV will be 1 way again, despite the full gen8 compatibility
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So transfer from SwSh+PLA to SV is one-way, and any mon transferred to SV from Sword and Shield or Legends: Arceus cannot be transferred back.

I think this solidifies that "generations" as we see it are still a thing, and SV is very much a new generation of Pokemon by all hallmarks, being Gen 9, while PLA and SwSh are Gen 8. While GF doesn't technically number or name generations the same way we fans do, it's clear that SV is a new gen and a separate generation from PLA+SwSh, which despite the weirdness due to Dexit, the two games are still by all means technically the same gen as mons and be transferred to and fro SwSh and PLA and back between each other assuming the mon in question is in both games.

It's definitely in a similar vein to how Bank transfer between XY and ORAS, both being Gen 6, is two way between each other, but any mons transferred to SM or USUM (Gen 7) cannot be transferred back to a Gen 6 game, with the Alola games being a separate, newer generation from ORAS and XY.
 
Worldie said:
Yeh I see nothing unexpected as far as the "generational" thing.

As I expected, the whole "separate moveset" for PLA and BDST was just something to not have to deal with a constant "move deleting/relearning" everytime a pokemon would be moved around.
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HOME also has to remember the extra data structure that individual PLA mons have (effort values) that SwSh doesn't have, so it's more than just movesets. I think that because of that a lot of people expected that GF would just make PLA > SwSh a one-way transfer that loses that extra data, and when it turned out GF actually went through the effort of making the transfers work both ways many people got their hopes up that gen8 > gen9 would also have backwards compatibility.
 
Count Bleck said:
Return and frusteration were likely axed due to rental teams existing (i remember in gen 7 the happiness values didnt transfer over when using them) and no doubt Pursuit had something to do with Dynamax mechanics. If it doesnt xome back this gen then it may be something else, ive heard the move has been super quirky in the past.
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Return probably also had something to do with the fact it meant you couldn't receive certain battle ready mons in a trade or safely store them in Home, and it gave space for the gen 8 rework of the happiness system in general. I guess it also meant less weirdness like Luxury Balls being objectively the best ball to catch things in.

EDIT to avoid double post: if Giratina is in fact returning, Electric type Terastal on Giratina-O seems like a nice way to pull an Eelektross on something with actually decent defensive stats.
 
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Lemingue said:
Because tera lasts an entire match, I'm pretty sure there will be no issues about block/fake out etc interactions with it. I think it will be a very powerful mechanic, but I doubt it'll get banned. People seem to forget how massive dmax was for singles.

It'll be less of an issue in singles too. No extra hp, moves aren't as powerful which means you can still get your mon ganged up. There will be powerful tera users but I think this will be a more balanced mechanic than z moves and dmax

If this ages poorly uuuh kill me or something. Idk
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Not a chance that Tera remains, especially not if the "keep the OG stabs" thing is true. It leads to just WAY to many variables, which will make teambuilding essentially impossible. How do you build a competent team when Garchomp alone can constitute 19 different, adequately viable sweepers? Fairy, Water, Ice, Electric, Fire, etc etc. Thats just ONE Pokemon.

Even if they dont keep their original STABs... its a hard sell. Pokemon wasn't balanced for this mechanic and its very clear.
 
Alright then, here's a question for the jury: What leaked Pokemon are you most excited to see in full based on the bits of information about it that are out there?

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I mentioned this earlier but good lord am I desperate to see what they've cooked up for this guy. The idea of giving Bisharp an evolution is so wild and yet at the same time sounds insanely cool. Some of the best evolutions ever have been for Pokemon that didn't really "need" it but for which they nonetheless had a sick idea that made it all the worthwhile: Gallade, Magnezone and Ursaluna come to mind.

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My mind keeps gravitating to Black Knight as a benchmark for how badass and terrifying Bisharp2 could be. Ceruledge has proven that Paldea's roster can be raw as fuck when needed, so I avidly await the next step for this Unova icon. cape pls
 
chimp said:
Not a chance that Tera remains, especially not if the "keep the OG stabs" thing is true. It leads to just WAY to many variables, which will make teambuilding essentially impossible. How do you build a competent team when Garchomp alone can constitute 19 different, adequately viable sweepers? Fairy, Water, Ice, Electric, Fire, etc etc. Thats just ONE Pokemon.

Even if they dont keep their original STABs... its a hard sell. Pokemon wasn't balanced for this mechanic and its very clear.
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Yeah it basically makes it so that any good dual typed Pokemon is almost Protean now and we all know how that turned out with Greninja and Cinderace. It's basically a Protean and Arceus ability combination. Same type tera makes a lot of Pokemon that were hanging on to OU with a pinky finger just borderline broken. Its still less stupid than Dynamax though.
 
Yung Dramps said:
Alright then, here's a question for the jury: What leaked Pokemon are you most excited to see in full based on the bits of information about it that are out there?
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Whatever the hell the dark quartet is shaping up to be. Very interesting type combos and a variety of animals that each of them is based on. Also wondering how the hell they're going to design an evil goldfish
 
AquaticPanic said:
Whatever the hell the dark quartet is shaping up to be. Very interesting type combos and a variety of animals that each of them is based on. Also wondering how the hell they're going to design an evil goldfish
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I mentioned the Coin pokemon before, but yeah the Perils are right behind them. Especially since it sounds like they're also based on some object that I imagine gets incorporated into their design. Not to mention they're likely meant to parallel the cloud legends, so there might be some extra lore bit to it which is fun.
 
Rarycaris said:
EDIT to avoid double post: if Giratina is in fact returning, Electric type Terastal on Giratina-O seems like a nice way to pull an Eelektross on something with actually decent defensive stats.
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I think gravitating to no weaknesses is understandably alluring, but personally I’m terrified of Poison or Steel-Tera Cresselia or Giratina-O more because of the Toxic immunity + no Ground weakness. It’s just your pick between only one weakness or multiple valuable resistances at that point, but Steel strikes me as harder to deal with personally.

edit: To be more on-topic, personally I cannot wait to see all the new bugs, particularly the bug/dark kamen rider. A bit of a tangent, I think this game’s marketing cycle went wayyy too hard on the memes and I really want to see all the more exciting, less silly new designs. Not that I don’t think fun and silly ‘mons don’t have a place, but it’s like they were scared to market this game with anything other than slightly-stale Twitter memes.
 
Just A Seaking said:
I think gravitating to no weaknesses is understandably alluring, but personally I’m terrified of Poison or Steel-Tera Cresselia or Giratina-O more because of the Toxic immunity + no Ground weakness. It’s just your pick between only one weakness or multiple valuable resistances at that point, but Steel strikes me as harder to deal with personally.

edit: To be more on-topic, personally I cannot wait to see all the new bugs, particularly the bug/dark kamen rider. A bit of a tangent, I think this game’s marketing cycle went wayyy too hard on the memes and I really want to see all the more exciting, less silly new designs. Not that I don’t think fun and silly ‘mons don’t have a place, but it’s like they were scared to market this game with anything other than slightly-stale Twitter memes.
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Beyond (the names of) Smoliv & Lechonk, and then I Bellibolt (since the whole tongue in cheek streamer aspect is there + its goofy) I don't think that's really true, though. The NA pokemon twitter account certainly had fun with Klawf stale memes but Klawf is also the first titan you meet so it kind of needed to be shown if they wanted to keep it close. I guess Farigiraf is a goofy design but honestly all the evolutions are probably goofy.
The ghost armors, Wiglett, Grafaiai, Fidough, Cetitan, Cyclizar are all played pretty straight even if they had fun with Grafaiai & Wiglett's reveals
 
Spyro said:
Yeah it basically makes it so that any good dual typed Pokemon is almost Protean now and we all know how that turned out with Greninja and Cinderace. It's basically a Protean and Arceus ability combination. Same type tera makes a lot of Pokemon that were hanging on to OU with a pinky finger just borderline broken. Its still less stupid than Dynamax though.
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Not really because it's a lot more limited defensively, but yeah, on offense, that's crazy.

It's hard to mess up coverage with STAB on 3 types. You'd actually need to go out of your way to have a mon that resists all of your STAB options and not have the 4th cover for it. Especially if Shedinja doesn't make it.
 
Just A Seaking said:
I think gravitating to no weaknesses is understandably alluring, but personally I’m terrified of Poison or Steel-Tera Cresselia or Giratina-O more because of the Toxic immunity + no Ground weakness. It’s just your pick between only one weakness or multiple valuable resistances at that point, but Steel strikes me as harder to deal with personally.

edit: To be more on-topic, personally I cannot wait to see all the new bugs, particularly the bug/dark kamen rider. A bit of a tangent, I think this game’s marketing cycle went wayyy too hard on the memes and I really want to see all the more exciting, less silly new designs. Not that I don’t think fun and silly ‘mons don’t have a place, but it’s like they were scared to market this game with anything other than slightly-stale Twitter memes.
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Hmm. Yeah, I think you might be right about Steel. It resists dragon in a tier that so far looks utterly saturated with 680bst dragons, makes you immune to a status that is otherwise a massive problem on a mon with no recovery options, leaves you only two type weaknesses, and it allows you to counterattack fairies effectively with Tera Blast (though I think Magearna will be the scariest fairy).

Depends if Miraidon is any good, I suppose, since a Fighting weakness could suddenly end up being a massive problem. If so, I think you'd go for Electric over Poison unless you expect to face a lot of stall.
 
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Yung Dramps said:
Alright then, here's a question for the jury: What leaked Pokemon are you most excited to see in full based on the bits of information about it that are out there?
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I am also eagerly looking forward to the Bisharp evolution, as well as the Primeape evolution. More former two-stage families becoming three stage families is always welcome.

As I said before, the Dragon/Ice pseudo legendary is also a mon I really want to see. I love pseudos and an Ice-type pseudo legendary is a mon I've wanted for a long time now.
 
R_N said:
Beyond (the names of) Smoliv & Lechonk, and then I Bellibolt (since the whole tongue in cheek streamer aspect is there + its goofy) I don't think that's really true, though. The NA pokemon twitter account certainly had fun with Klawf stale memes but Klawf is also the first titan you meet so it kind of needed to be shown if they wanted to keep it close. I guess Farigiraf is a goofy design but honestly all the evolutions are probably goofy.
The ghost armors, Wiglett, Grafaiai, Fidough, Cetitan, Cyclizar are all played pretty straight even if they had fun with Grafaiai & Wiglett's reveals
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For the examples you give, I was considering Wiglett and Fidough in the more joke-y category, just by virtue of being... well, Wiglett, and fido + dough. I probably should have been more clear that I don't think this is 100% the case since you provide plenty of counter-examples - personally I think the ghost armors look kinda ridiculous, but popular consensus shows that's not the common take so I wouldn't count them regardless.

With all that said, I will say 2 things: A. I don't think memes and less serious 'mons are a bad thing by any stretch, and that type of viral marketing is pretty damn effective all things considered so I can't fault them, and B. it's entirely possible that I'm getting caught up too much in leak hype when it might not match reality. Like, the Kamen Rider bug I'm looking forward might end up looking completely goofy and ridiculous, which for better or worse wouldn't match my current mental image. I just feel like compared to other gens' press cycles that there's much more of a focus on the meme aspect than before. But this is also a pretty nebulous and subjective thing to quantify, so I get it if you disagree - this is also the first generation with a trailer dedicated pretty much solely to new competitive items and moves, so they might just be trying different things and seeing what sticks.
 
Yung Dramps said:
Alright then, here's a question for the jury: What leaked Pokemon are you most excited to see in full based on the bits of information about it that are out there?
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Paradox Misdreavus is the mon I most want to see, and will not be able to resist looking it up when the datamine rolls around. I will probably also look at the rest of the paradoxes to help me decide which version to get*. In particular, I really want to see P-Volcarona (described as larvesta-like) versus F-Volcarona. I am also curious about the fully evolved coin mon, and I may look up that to see if it looks to be worth the grind to get in on an in-game team.

For non-ghosts, non-paradoxes, I will try to not look those up, but I have so far failed to do so every datamine season. From the descriptions, I am a bit curious about the dolphin, because I have no idea what sort of gimmick Khu has been hinting at with it. It 'evolves but doesn't evolve' suggests maybe a Silvally-type deal, or maybe a Scizor-type deal. I usually like to have a water-type on my team, and so far only the dolphin or maybe the 'sushi' titan sound interesting, though I am really hoping the 'sushi' descriptor is not so literal in design inspiration...
 
Rarycaris said:
I'm really curious to see the broken field effects that Kuraidon and Miraidon have been hinted to place upon entry. I usually play ubers and the strength of those two will likely define the meta.
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This wasn't really hinted anywhere that I'm aware of. Khu did a comparison to Groudon and Kyogre, followed up by "Drought Electric Surge". I really doubt these are new field effects at all - I'd sooner believe they straight up have Drought and Electric Surge rather than a new field effect, the comparison to Groudon and Kyogre being "one has a field effect that boosts a different type, one has a field effect that boosts STAB".

Would make sense as the Sun's 1.5x Sun boost gives Koraidon a new STAB and Electric Surge's 1.3x Electric Boost combined with STAB would bring Miraidon's Electric multiplyer to 1.95x (in other words, the legendaries use field setting abilities to simulare Terastal effects - Either gaining 1.5x damage on a new type or doubling your STAB power on one type)
 
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