Even setting aside my dislike of the Legends formula, I missed out on B2W2 the first time around and so would like a chance to experience what is considered one of the best classic games in the actual classic format. Let's wait for retro availability to catch up before we declare remakes obsolete.
-
Check out the relaunch of our general collection, with classic designs and new ones by our very own Pissog!
-
Welcome to Smogon! Take a moment to read the Introduction to Smogon for a run-down on everything Smogon, and make sure you take some time to read the global rules.
SPOILERS! Scarlet & Violet Leaks Thread - Data/Mechanics
- Thread starter DHR-107
- Start date
It's not like they'd make BW2 though, since ORAS their remakes have lacked any enhanced features, so a BW remake in this case would more than likely be Black and White 1
HG/SS will always remain the absolute top bar for any of their remake attempts, (including Legends tbh) but they've even stated quite a few times those games were packed with content and when you couple that with Masuda's answer about why the Battle Frontier/Level Difficulty wasn't in ORAS (and to an extent, XY) it's because GF believe that the attention spans of kids these days isn't the same as it was, so content like that wouldn't be appreciated (Which is a huge statement to make, that is probably incorrect)
So to expect that a potential remake would be Black and White 2, or would include features such as the PWT, would just be a let down. Of course their opinions could change over the last decade, as they've now seen their audience is far more than children. But given how BDSP turned out, with absolutely no Platinum features besides a few hints here and there, there's no reason to think that BW2 will be remade.
They could go for a curveball and create some form of Pokémon Legends x Black and White 3 hybrid but I doubt it.
Best bet for experiencing BW2 is to wait for the eventual Switch Online.
HG/SS will always remain the absolute top bar for any of their remake attempts, (including Legends tbh) but they've even stated quite a few times those games were packed with content and when you couple that with Masuda's answer about why the Battle Frontier/Level Difficulty wasn't in ORAS (and to an extent, XY) it's because GF believe that the attention spans of kids these days isn't the same as it was, so content like that wouldn't be appreciated (Which is a huge statement to make, that is probably incorrect)
So to expect that a potential remake would be Black and White 2, or would include features such as the PWT, would just be a let down. Of course their opinions could change over the last decade, as they've now seen their audience is far more than children. But given how BDSP turned out, with absolutely no Platinum features besides a few hints here and there, there's no reason to think that BW2 will be remade.
They could go for a curveball and create some form of Pokémon Legends x Black and White 3 hybrid but I doubt it.
Best bet for experiencing BW2 is to wait for the eventual Switch Online.
So never, then
e: To be less snide it has taken us 6 years to get GB & GBA on Switch Online and even assuming Gen 1-3 make it to NSO eventually they aren't even announced yet and Nintendo are kings of the drip feed.
Switch 2 will probably be out before they consider adding DS games, and by the time they add DS games they will drip feed it even more through the Gen 4 releases.
Last edited:
Also you always have to remember that DS games aren't as simple to have on a Virtual Console like the GB and GBA ones due to the 2nd screen.
Citra and similar PC emulators put the 2nd screen somewhere on your PC screen, but it isnt that simple when it comes to the Switch VC.
They do require an actual port / remake like what they are doing with Etrian Odyssey.
Citra and similar PC emulators put the 2nd screen somewhere on your PC screen, but it isnt that simple when it comes to the Switch VC.
They do require an actual port / remake like what they are doing with Etrian Odyssey.
I mean whilst all that is true, it probably is the only way the "retro" games (Pre 3DS era) will be made available to us.
They could of course release ported versions for the actual console, rather than relying on NSO. I've always wondered why that wasn't done as a 20th anniversary release, they would make a lot from it.
Sure there's the 2 screen situations, but they managed to find a workaround for BDSP, it's not completely out of the realm of possibility. NSO might be a reach but porting their retro games as a big collection wouldn't be.
They could of course release ported versions for the actual console, rather than relying on NSO. I've always wondered why that wasn't done as a 20th anniversary release, they would make a lot from it.
Sure there's the 2 screen situations, but they managed to find a workaround for BDSP, it's not completely out of the realm of possibility. NSO might be a reach but porting their retro games as a big collection wouldn't be.
I don't think this would actually be that much of an issue; Wii U already solved this. It just stacks the screens...it didn't, like, put one screen on the TV and the other on the Gamepad.
Well...the Wii U did that, and with a much smaller screen.
So. I don't think that's a problem at all, actually.
This really, really is not an issue
I think one solution I've seen that could work for Pokemon is to do both screens, but not at a 50-50 ratio. You see this format applied in old Let's Play videos covering games on the DS and 3DS, where the "main" screen gets the lion share of the real estate and the secondary screen is in a smaller form off in the corner, so the information is present but not vying for attention unless you look toward it.
This format seems fine for most Pokemon games since the relevance of the two screens is almost never equal: the Poketch in Gen 4 had neat apps but never really needed to be the central attraction, same for turning on something like the Entralink in Gen 5. The biggest concerns would be stuff like Puzzle games or Mario & Luigi, where both screens are utilized in a battle for the display even if you only interact with one of them, but typically Pokemon games aren't fast-paced or structured in such a way that this will come up.
We are not seeing RBY again until the 30th anniversary. The main series never fucking rereleases anything. With every passing day I become more and more convinced that they genuinely think people will just emulate these games anyway and as such there's no point in bothering. It's gotta be either that or some incredibly obscure licensing issue that they are too cheap to resolve.
No matter what the answer is, the result is the same: When the return to Unova comes, we are either seeing nothing of BW1/2 or they'll drop another Faithful:tm: Remake:tm: of 1. If we are subjected to the latter we can only hope they listened to the BDSP feedback and make it a bit more competently.
No matter what the answer is, the result is the same: When the return to Unova comes, we are either seeing nothing of BW1/2 or they'll drop another Faithful:tm: Remake:tm: of 1. If we are subjected to the latter we can only hope they listened to the BDSP feedback and make it a bit more competently.
You know what I do have a correction to make on my own part, wherein I said that the DS Emulation just stacked them. Turns out they had multiple options:
-stack them but you have a Nintendo DS original model border
-Focus on top screen, bottom screen is made smaller and moved to upper right/lower left based on your primary handiness
-Focus on bottom screen, top screen is made smaller and moved to upper right/lower left based on your primary handiness
-Top screen on the TV, bottom screen on the Wii U gamepad (this one is obviously not applicable to Switch)
-Stack them but you can turn the gamepad on its side (there actually are Switch games that do this, including some of Nintendo's arcade titles)
-Side ways (like in Brain Age)
The screen size is not an issue (again i cannot stress enough that the Wii U gamepad's screen is very small). The double screen emulation situation is solved (& likely would see additional options for a Switch Release). It is not what is keeping DS games off switch online, that's purely just the Nintendo Classic Drip Feed (TM).
-stack them but you have a Nintendo DS original model border
-Focus on top screen, bottom screen is made smaller and moved to upper right/lower left based on your primary handiness
-Focus on bottom screen, top screen is made smaller and moved to upper right/lower left based on your primary handiness
-Top screen on the TV, bottom screen on the Wii U gamepad (this one is obviously not applicable to Switch)
-Stack them but you can turn the gamepad on its side (there actually are Switch games that do this, including some of Nintendo's arcade titles)
-Side ways (like in Brain Age)
The screen size is not an issue (again i cannot stress enough that the Wii U gamepad's screen is very small). The double screen emulation situation is solved (& likely would see additional options for a Switch Release). It is not what is keeping DS games off switch online, that's purely just the Nintendo Classic Drip Feed (TM).
Might be an unpopular take, but I think in the case of BW remaking the originals would be better than remaking the follow-up. BW is the one that has the more interesting plot and commits to the concept of the "soft-reboot", while BW2 was more of a return to status quo with some extra fanservice-y modes thrown in. If I had to pick between which sets of games I'd prefer new players to experience, I'd pick BW.
From the way they handled Gen V however, I do think there's a good possibility that they'll actually go for a "BW3" or Legends prequel than a straight up remake. Releasing a sequel instead of a third version was a crazy curveball back in the day, so I don't think its impossible that they'll go for it again. I'd go as far as to say that the so-called "Original Dragon" will finally make an appearance, given how GF expanded on the "lore" of past Legendary Pokemon in Gen VII.
Whatever the case, I hope they take as much time as possible to make sure the games are polished on release. I frankly don't want to see any new mainline game announcements until Early 2025. Although I guess that might be too much to ask for the more obsessed parts of the fanbase.
From the way they handled Gen V however, I do think there's a good possibility that they'll actually go for a "BW3" or Legends prequel than a straight up remake. Releasing a sequel instead of a third version was a crazy curveball back in the day, so I don't think its impossible that they'll go for it again. I'd go as far as to say that the so-called "Original Dragon" will finally make an appearance, given how GF expanded on the "lore" of past Legendary Pokemon in Gen VII.
Whatever the case, I hope they take as much time as possible to make sure the games are polished on release. I frankly don't want to see any new mainline game announcements until Early 2025. Although I guess that might be too much to ask for the more obsessed parts of the fanbase.
I think a brand new Unova project is a pretty safe bet. It's pretty apparent that Game Freak's appetite for bog-standard remakes isn't particularly high, and I don't see why they wouldn't wanna follow up an acclaimed title like Legends Arceus. BW3? Legends Unova? Something else entirely? Who knows...
People focusing on remakes of Ruby and Sapphire following Ruby and Sapphire and not Emerald (just like HGSS didn't follow Crystal, or FRLG didn't follow Yellow), and forgetting the fucking Delta Episode dealing with more Rayquaza lore than Emerald in its enterity.
But Eusine cameos were revolutionary or something...
No seriously, ORAS was very on point after HGSS and FRLG, but Johto games are as a rule so overrated that Hoenn games suffer from that.
Still, when Let's Go did more to modernize Yellow than BDSP, well, geez those were really lackluster. Then again, people keep asking for the old games, as if they had aged well...
Yeah HG/SS didn't follow Crystal but they weren't exactly faithful remakes of GS either, they had so much more content which allowed for them to set the bar very high and achieve a level of replay-value that Pokémon hasn't had really since Gen 5.
In all honesty, yes, I do forget about the Delta Episode quite often but even then it just expanded Rayquaza's lore, it doesn't add a lot to the mechanics/replay value of the game. The Battle Frontier would have done just that - the delta episode should've featured both, especially after they teased it in the actual game itself.
As a personal preference I do prefer RSE to GSC, Emerald is probably my fav Pokémon game which is why I had such a problem with its content. FRLG/HGSS did such a good job in expanding upon the original content but ORAS felt like it fell short despite a good post-game story.
Last edited:
To be honest, I do find the "so much more content" of HGSS kinda overstated. The high bar is not "go at 6 AM on Thursdays to an specific area to get a phone number, and call on an specific day to get a rematch against a gym leader". That's just convulted crap. Just like the Safari zone requiring specific decorations to get some stuff.
Oh, and Kanto got larger... and Sinnoh-like, because you needed even more HMs. You are supposed to fight Red with Rock Climb in your party FFS.
I played the fuck out of Gold back when it came out. Ruby was an improvement. HG was not an improvement over Platinum, and I wouldn't say I missed the stuff from HGSS going forward.
Oh, and Kanto got larger... and Sinnoh-like, because you needed even more HMs. You are supposed to fight Red with Rock Climb in your party FFS.
I played the fuck out of Gold back when it came out. Ruby was an improvement. HG was not an improvement over Platinum, and I wouldn't say I missed the stuff from HGSS going forward.
No Go postcard creates the Fancy or Pokeball patterns, it was likely just done to make sure you can still get the Fancy variety.
Riddler Khu corroborated the addendum to that one 4chan post. Funny collectable scrimblo game leaked switch 2 release window gg
A few things:
- Where does Khu imply that the Switch 2 leak is real?
- Where are the rumors about a second round of DLC coming from? The above leak just says "DLC2 in early 2024", which I take to mean The Indigo Disk, not some round of DLC after The Indigo Disk.
- Refresh my memory, did SV perform well (not just better, but well) on emulators on PCs with better specs than the Switch? If so, then a Switch 2 may actually be good for the game. But if not, then the rumored "graphics enhancement patch" wouldn't help the game's performance at all.
- We have one more source on the potential Switch 2 leak: https://arstechnica.com/gaming/2023...ing-information-about-nintendos-next-console/ ("Did the UK government just accidentally leak Nintendo’s Switch successor?")
- Summary: The UK Competition and Markets Authority published a document about the Microsoft/Activision acquisition, which included an appendix on Xbox Game Pass's competitors, which included the line "Nintendo Switch Online is only available on the Nintendo Switch device and [redacted]."
Someone in his replies asked him about it and all he said back was "Just focus on the Pokemon stuff" without explicitly confirming or denying. Pretty sus. Either way, he's giving the addendum his seal of approval, so...
You are correct. The rumors are just people misinterpreting that statement
I think so? The fact it never came up during the leak season gotta count for something
I thought they might have come up during leak season on emulators but people at the time would've ignored them because "surely the problems are with the emulator and won't show up on actual hardware". I may be misremembering all or part of this.
The confirmation of Special Tera Forms gives me a few questions:
A. How will they work? Will they be like Gigantamax forms or like Megas? (As in, will special moves to the forms or will there be a stat buff to them)
B. Who will get them?
C. How will you be able to obtain them?
D. How much would the Metagame change with them?
I'm guessing it'll still be something that leans into the typing aspect.
Just throwing out an idea on that front we'll use Ogrepon, who seems to display its special tera form in the key art: Let's just say it's a pure grass type. If it Special Terastalyzes, it might turn into a terastalyzed X/Grass type. So it maintains all the privledges of same-type tera as well as picking up a new type.
Alternatively, maybe Special Tera will just attribute a specific second type regardless. Maybe Ogrepon is pure grass, but when it special teras it will always pick up the Dark tera type as a secondary tera type to whatever else it teras. Or going in a different direction for that idea, maybe the actual terastal bonus is the same but now it secretly picks up the Dark type for stab purposes
IE:
Ogrepon -> Special Terastalyzes into a Water type -> Terastal Water/Grass (gains the Grass tera bonus)
Ogrepon -> Special Terastalyzes into Water -> Terastal Water/Dark (Maintains the Grass stab as normal)
Ogrepon -> Special Terastalyzes into Water -> Terastal Water (but internally is now a Grass/Dark form, and gains normal Dark stab alongside its Grass stab)
In the dual tera scenarios I imagine Terablast would just pick up the primary typing.
I figure this will either be something permanently innate to specific Pokemon whenevr they terastal (ie: every ogrepon can do this) or it'll be a special quirk being tracked and added on ala GMax.
Just throwing out an idea on that front we'll use Ogrepon, who seems to display its special tera form in the key art: Let's just say it's a pure grass type. If it Special Terastalyzes, it might turn into a terastalyzed X/Grass type. So it maintains all the privledges of same-type tera as well as picking up a new type.
Alternatively, maybe Special Tera will just attribute a specific second type regardless. Maybe Ogrepon is pure grass, but when it special teras it will always pick up the Dark tera type as a secondary tera type to whatever else it teras. Or going in a different direction for that idea, maybe the actual terastal bonus is the same but now it secretly picks up the Dark type for stab purposes
IE:
Ogrepon -> Special Terastalyzes into a Water type -> Terastal Water/Grass (gains the Grass tera bonus)
Ogrepon -> Special Terastalyzes into Water -> Terastal Water/Dark (Maintains the Grass stab as normal)
Ogrepon -> Special Terastalyzes into Water -> Terastal Water (but internally is now a Grass/Dark form, and gains normal Dark stab alongside its Grass stab)
In the dual tera scenarios I imagine Terablast would just pick up the primary typing.
I figure this will either be something permanently innate to specific Pokemon whenevr they terastal (ie: every ogrepon can do this) or it'll be a special quirk being tracked and added on ala GMax.