On Friday. I want to give you guys time to think it over.
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CAP 2 Smogon "Create a Pokemon" Part Deux: Poll 4
- Thread starter Hyra
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On Friday. I want to give you guys time to think it over.
Didn't see your stat spread. I like it really, but then I like almost everyone's stat spread lol. That 100 sp. def will come in handy in one way or another.
I don't like the low sp.atk, at least 65 speed 90 sp.df and 75 sp.atk -.-. For a niche scarfer, XD.
When did that stat spread had 75 sp. atk, 65 speed, and 90 sp.def?
He means that he'd like to see the former two dropped to those values so that the special attack could be raised to the latter value.
Oh...well Rhykune's set still looks okay as it is to me though if he did then it would look like this: 95/110/90/75/90/65 which changes how he take hits abit.
Question: I know that during the first Create a Pokemon, Cooper listed the base spreads in a poll and then posted each creator's reasoning in the topic post. So, I have a few questions ...
1) Will the base spread be done in poll format, or will it be done with the bold posting format?
2) Is my long analysis of my spread too long for an analysis? I'd really like to see it used under my spread for reasoning.
1) Will the base spread be done in poll format, or will it be done with the bold posting format?
2) Is my long analysis of my spread too long for an analysis? I'd really like to see it used under my spread for reasoning.
You're actually starting to get on my nerves too. You have absolutely no reason to say this pokemon can't have balanced defenses. If you read Poll 3, you'd see that what people actually want is a balanced, physical pokemon. Which translates to having relatively even stats, but with a physical orientation. That means even defenses. If I recall, we're making a Swampert, not a Tangrowth.
Most of the spreads given beat Swampert defensively overall. Mine beats it physically at 83/118, but Swampert still has 100/90 vs. 83/85 SD on mine.
Rhykune's spread has 90/95 on defense and 90/100 on SD.
Most of these multiplications is where Dragontamer got his tiers from. A difference of 4,250 is about equivalent to STAB. Please correct me if I'm wrong DT.
Swampert: 404 * 306 Defenses and Overall = 123,624
Rhykune: 90/95/100
384 * 317 Defense = 121,728
384 * 328 SD = 125,952
Overall: 123,840
This is the most balanced spread, and barely edges out Swampert overall. It does however, beat Dusknoir handily in both defenses.
Looking at eric's spread 125/70/85 defenses spread:
Swampert: 404 * 306 = 123,624
eric the espeon: 125/70/85
454 * 262 Defense = 118,984
454 * 295 SD = 133,940
Overall: 126,462
It's defense is a bit worse than Swampert, but it takes special hits like nothing else. Overall it is superior to Swampert.
I mean really, what most of the spreads so far have is a physical attacking pokemon that takes special hits much more effectively than physical hits. And I'm not just talking in a Heracross kind of "both attacks can hit it fairly hard" kind of way, I'm talking about "this thing can take hits about as well as Swampert on defense and better than Swampert on special defense."
Here's futuresuperstars spread:
futuresuperstar: 90/90/110
384 * 306 Defense = 117,504
384 * 350 SD = 134,400
Overall: 125,952
This spread beats Swampert overall, is heading into Hariyama territory on defense, and blowing Swampert out of the water with SD.
AJC's defensive spread:
AJC: 105/95/95
414 * 317 Defenses + Overall: 131,238
This slaughters Swampert outright. The rest of the spread has 110 Attack, 55 SA, and 85 Speed. Since it's 535 BST and the rest are 525, it does have an edge, but even assuming you take it out of a defense, that drops a 105/90 down to 126,684 (overall 128,961) and if you drop HP to 95/95/95 you end up with 128,068.
In other words, this is a faster Swampert with better defenses and the same attack stat, + better resists.
King of Anime's spread:
KOA: 65/110/85
334 * 350 Defense = 116,900
334 * 295 SD = 98,530
Overall: 107,715.
This is the weakest defensively, but KOA's spread was much more sweeper oriented, with 120 Atk and 80 SA, it has 65 Speed. KOA's hits the hardest but only it's physical defense it high powered.
For fairness sake I'll do my defenses on 83/118/85 again:
Deck Knight: 83/118/86
370 * 368 = 136,130
370 * 298 = 110,260
Overall: 123,195
My spread is about the same as Swampert, and is about as far below it and Rhykune's is above it. (e.g. not much either way).
I grant you that mine does have the largest single defensive number in any category, but we voted on a balanced physical pokemon. Most of these spreads have gone down a Hitmonsuffix/Gallade road as far as distribution, which does have some justification, with the caveat that both the Hitmons and Gallade didn't hit above 70 Base HP.
Gallade is the superior of the two defensively, and it's numbers on 68/65/115:
Gallade:
340 * 251 = 85,340
340 * 361 = 122,740
Overall: 104,040
In other words, some of these spreads are approaching Gallade's special tolerance on their physical defense and are obliterating it in special defense. Which I guess makes sense considering Gallade falls just short of Swampert is special defense.
For better examples, lets look at Machamp, Hariyama, Dusknoir, and Drifblim:
Machamp: 90/80/85:
384 * 284 Defense = 109,056
384 * 295 SD = 113,280
Overall: 111,168
Hariyama: 144/60/60
492 * 240 Defenses + Overall: 118,080
Dusknoir: 45/135/135
294 * 405 Defenses + Overall: 119,070
Drifblim: 150/44/54
504 * 205 Defense = 103,320
504 * 227 SD = 114,408
Overall: 108,864.
I just wanted to point this out that while the spreads are in the spirit of a physical balanced pokemon if your first thought is Swampert, a lot of these spreads beat Swampert defensively, in some cases brutally. As far as other fighters and ghosts, most don't even come close. Even eric the espeon's spread comes into Dusknoir territory on it's physical defense, and wins in a landslide on SD.
Just wanted to post a kind of reality check on what the spreads are looking like defensively relative to the Swampert model.
Considering you wern't jumping on the "lets give this high defenses both physically and specially" bandwagon, I'd consider it a compliment.
Yours at least stayed true to the overriding nature of Ghost types and Fighters, to a certain extent. The Defense seems a little higher than normally goes with that HP, but at least that makes it unique.
Seeing has 500-525 max is probably gonna win unless 526-540 gets a massive late landslide
i'm gonna make a revised spread for this BST limit
104/116/90/40/90/85
revised yet again because i forgot all about this thing having 85 max base speed ( seriously people this base stat total suck for anything that isn't a sweeper
basicly a swampert with more HP attack and more speed traded for the lost of use of special moves effectively
i'm gonna make a revised spread for this BST limit
104/116/90/40/90/85
revised yet again because i forgot all about this thing having 85 max base speed ( seriously people this base stat total suck for anything that isn't a sweeper
basicly a swampert with more HP attack and more speed traded for the lost of use of special moves effectively
40 sp. attack seams forced, not many decently powerful fully evolved pokemon have <55 on their weaker attack.
99 speed is higher than it should be, its speed was described in the first post of this thread as being 60-85.
the attack is a bit high and the defences a bit low, but thats good for varity. the 116 base attack will make it hard to do damage calcs, i dont think any poemon have 116 base attack, but thats not too bad.
Thats what Ominous Wind is for...
Just use Banette, it has 115 Base Attack. The difference will only be 2 or 3 points of actual damage. If you need a number for Fighting STAB, just use Attack level 1, or switch over to Hariyama or Blaziken and just use 212 Atk EVs instead of 252.
This is how I am doing the next two polls: (And yes you can have an uber long analysis if you feel like it)
This does present a problem, especially since Swampert's only notable resist is Rock. I'm not exactly sure how you guys can remedy this though, maybe take 10 points from somewhere and give it 75-80 SAtk, or maybe pump up the speed.
i know its not much of a problam, it was last on my first post. also doeset banette have 130 base attack?
@ Eric: I should have said Physical resist. Although Fire and Electric can be Physical, the prime candidates for both, Electivire and Infernape, use almost solely Special STAB moves. I was going to say Steel, but Metagross is much less of a threat now than in ADV. Finally, Poison types don't use Poison moves, they hope they have a secondary STAB or go STABless.
125/110/65/70/75/80 total 525
ok, i will explain my spread
125 HP so it can take hits on both quite easily. ghosts sometimes have high hp, like driftblim.
110 attack, so its a tank not a wall, their are some tanks that have high attack, donphan has base 120. if t was much higher it would start to look broken to me with wonderful unresisted STAB and great defencive typeing.
65 defence is good enough with 125 base HP, but low enough to still be hurt by powerful nutral phy. attacks
70 sp.attack is not to be used, but with a 4x efective HP it could just about hurt some things.
75 sp. def so it can absorb non super efective attacks quite easily, but still be hurt by the more powerful of them.
80 speed alows it to beat the base 70 group and heatran, and alows it to be used as a sweeper if you invest masivly in speed. also could be used with a novelty scarf set.
can deck knight calculate this pokemons defencive level?
also i think a run down of each pokemons defencive and ofencive abilitys all done by the same person would ba a good idea to put in the OP of the next poll.
Edit:
ok, but its good sp. resists can alow it to work well as a mixed wall, what sp. resists does this thing have? not that much.
ok, i will explain my spread
125 HP so it can take hits on both quite easily. ghosts sometimes have high hp, like driftblim.
110 attack, so its a tank not a wall, their are some tanks that have high attack, donphan has base 120. if t was much higher it would start to look broken to me with wonderful unresisted STAB and great defencive typeing.
65 defence is good enough with 125 base HP, but low enough to still be hurt by powerful nutral phy. attacks
70 sp.attack is not to be used, but with a 4x efective HP it could just about hurt some things.
75 sp. def so it can absorb non super efective attacks quite easily, but still be hurt by the more powerful of them.
80 speed alows it to beat the base 70 group and heatran, and alows it to be used as a sweeper if you invest masivly in speed. also could be used with a novelty scarf set.
can deck knight calculate this pokemons defencive level?
also i think a run down of each pokemons defencive and ofencive abilitys all done by the same person would ba a good idea to put in the OP of the next poll.
Edit:
ok, but its good sp. resists can alow it to work well as a mixed wall, what sp. resists does this thing have? not that much.
More work for me. Hm... Does Dragontamer have a tiers calculator, or will I have do to that stuff by hand/calculator?
Not that I know, but it's not that difficult ("To calculate this on your computer, open up windows calculator, and do HP * Defense (or Sp. Def), hit the "log" button, and then divide by the magic number 0.041392685").
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