(Little) Things that annoy you in Pokémon

After all, it's called whaling for a reason. The few fishes that bait, often end up being extremely big because they literally cannot stop spending.

Yeah. You tend to think of them as terminally online shut-ins but there are whales in my group which has semi-frequent active meetups; one woman mentioned she spends £300 a month on the app - god knows how, frankly - but she's probably in the shallow end of the pool, I imagine there are people who put in far more than that.

I'm curious as to whether she still spends that much now that there's a remote raiding limit but tbf with the price increase I imagine you could still spend that amount even taking the limit into account (actually no, just calculated that and buying two packs of 3 raid passes per day would set you back just over £171; still, there's incubators and other items to push that number up).

Outside of RNG-dependent activities like raids and eggs being generally addictive ("one more and I might get a hundo/shiny/shiny hundo!", etc) it relies on FOMO to a great extent. Numerous Pokemon are only available during certain times of the year or in certain events, so it incentivises you to go harder during that short time. When I got back into the game in 2019 after a two-year break, it worked on me: I put resources into a fair few Pokemon thinking "I'll never get a better one than this!" before I realised that pretty much everything comes around again, and that everything initially gated behind a paywall will eventually be free*. Shifting to that mindset made the experience much more enjoyable.

There are a few other aspects of the app which are... sketchy, to put it mildly. A while ago they introduced a "gifting" feature that allows one to buy event tickets for other users. Given the ease with which you can make payments it strikes me that this is open to severe abuse. A friend's brother, for instance, is autistic and highly suggestible and I know for a fact he'd buy me a ticket if I asked him to.

(What actually happened was that someone in our group figured out that if he started an account on the Turkish version of Google Play, he could gift everyone tickets for pennies. That's since been patched though.)

But yeah, there are always going to be types of people who're more susceptible to certain things. Sadly that's not something that'll ever really change but what can change is how and to what extent the laws we put in place mitigate these factors.

Maybe my professional experience has helped in this but it's highly useful to try and think critically about your reaction to all this. I've had several moments of realising "oh, that marketing tactic works on me" over the years. Can't always guarantee it's made me better at resisting them but awareness is the first step.

Anyway. Now I really am getting off topic so I'll try to make this the last thing I say about this.


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*The most notable example probably being the decision to put Galarian Mr Mime behind a ticket costing £8 (or thereabouts)
 
Whales are definitely significantly bigger spenders than that woman.
Some games go after Dolphins and Minnows instead. "Cheaper" prices that add up but might entice someone who doesn't usually spend, to spend some X amount to get something because it's a "good deal" or they really want something in particular. That seems to be Go's MO, from my POV, especially since it has such a wide reach. Even if some aren't recurring spenders you're bound to get enough out of people to make it worth it.
 
Yes, also true. The last thing I believe I paid for on Go was the Galarian Yamask research quest they had during Halloween last year - cost about 79 pence, gave you 40 (iirc) Galarian Yamask, which meant pretty good odds for a shiny since it's a species with boosted odds. Pretty cheap for what that's worth. But I have four accounts so I said "yeah, screw it" and paid for all four. Even that's cheaper than a drink in London.

I'd have been unlikely to do that for several other species, but I like Runerigus (and the shiny specifically) but haven't ever used it since I didn't play SwSh. I didn't pay for, say, Keldeo when that was in a paid quest recently, or Galarian Mr Mime.

About 50% of people I know who play have a second account (easy to do if you have a tablet or a work phone, or you can just download the app twice) so if you assume that most of them thought along similar lines you're talking serious profit.
 
While we wait for a potential clarification, I will agree with this statement.

The main gripe with mtx-infested mobile games is that they are built in a way that is predatory, and manipolates the person to spend money without realizing it.
There's plenty of articles and videos around on explaining how these are made, from the spam of certain types of graphics to increase gratification, to "educating the player that money = saving time" executed by throwing you a ton of free-ish currency at start then suddently drying it out.

Fact is, not everyone who falls to mtx hell does it "because of their fault". Like with all drugs, some people are more vulnerable than others, and don't realize it until it's too late. And this does include kids.
After all, it's called whaling for a reason. The few fishes that bait, often end up being extremely big because they literally cannot stop spending.

While yes, a kid falling to mtx hell is ultimately their parents' fault for not educating them, that doesn't mean that designing such systems specifically targetted at them is fine

Oh its not right in anyway, for sure. I don’t see it as a specific problem with Pokemon though, considering how widespread it is amongst the mobile gaming industry.
 
Oh its not right in anyway, for sure. I don’t see it as a specific problem with Pokemon though, considering how widespread it is amongst the mobile gaming industry.
Let's say the problem isnt "specific to pokemon", rather annoying that "Pokemon of all things doubledips on it".
Feels like every other month there's a new pokemon-based mobile game coming out...
 
Let's say the problem isnt "specific to pokemon", rather annoying that "Pokemon of all things doubledips on it".
Feels like every other month there's a new pokemon-based mobile game coming out...
you're not wrong there's a lot of these things, but the release dates on them are all over the palce
Shuffle - 2015 (technically EOS but you can still buy & play it and pay microtransactions)
Duel - 2016 (EOS 2019)
Go - 2016 (micros)
Magikarp Jump - 2017 (weird one, since it seems like a short game in aggregate and wasnt a real Live Service title, but does have mtx)
Quest - 2018 (China really seems to have loved this one considering it still gets updates there and there exclusively and I think is getting shorts made based on it)
Rumble Rush - 2019 (literally lasted barely a year)
Masters - 2019 (ongoing but had to get a relaunch because of how bad it was doing relative to what they wanted)
Smile - 2020 (no microtransactions)
Cafe - 2020 (ongoing but also had to get a relaunch)
Unite - 2021 (people said it was p2w but every person i know who's played this says that's vastly overblown and the actual scummy thing is the costume pricing. $40+ for a single costume when converte from the currency)
Sleep - 2023 (microtransactions unknown, but it's a lifestyle app like smile so it probably is more about harvesting your personal data. Still, could go either way)

Once they got a stable set of mobile games they just talk about their updates constantly, which probably inflates the presence of the walking graveyard of mobile games no one talks about, are dead, or are effectively dead.


iirc they thought mobile was the future and 3DS/Switch wouldn't take off so funny how this all worked out long term.
 
Unite - 2021 (people said it was p2w but every person i know who's played this says that's vastly overblown and the actual scummy thing is the costume pricing. $40+ for a single costume when converte from the currency)
From what I remind about Unite, it was basically p2w *at launch* as acquiring both pokemon and fully leveled items without paying would have taken absolutely hilarious amounts of time. Then that got nerfed later and made humanly possible also for F2P players.
(Actual players feel free to correct me there)

iirc they thought mobile was the future
What really saddens me is how many companies are thinking this lately... and probably aren't wrong with how huge mobile is in asia.
 
iirc they thought mobile was the future and 3DS/Switch wouldn't take off so funny how this all worked out long term.
We laugh at this now but considering how dire the Wii U years were I frankly don't blame them for wanting to prepare a backup plan. Even the 3DS, for as much as I love and treasure it as a system, was undeniably nowhere near as big of a seller as the original DS was. That plus the somehow-even-more-of-a-bomb PS Vita in conjunction with big mobile IPs like Angry Birds and Cut the Rope that were ascendant built a more credible case than ever that traditional handheld gaming was on its last legs.

It's fascinating how these things can change on a dime, isn't it? Fast-forward to today from that, and now we're looking at the virtual opposite, a handheld renaissance promoted by systems like the Steam Deck (and hopefully a potential Switch 2) achieving the most parity with the latest home consoles that we have ever seen in industry history all while retaining that trademark convenience and form factor. Can you imagine if in 1997 there was a Game Gear-like device that could play Final Fantasy 7 or Ocarina of Time? That's basically where we're at now.

I originally came here to post something more in line with the usual goings-on in this thread, but nah I'd rather contemplate change and how nothing is truly immovable or inevitable.
 
...systems like the Steam Deck (and hopefully a potential Switch 2) achieving the most parity with the latest home consoles that we have ever seen in industry history all while retaining that trademark convenience and form factor.
IMO ever since the Switch supplanted the 3DS, the primary handheld currently is one of the latest home consoles; we might not be approaching parity, but instead a singularity. How quickly we get to this particular singularity really depends on how much longer Sony and Microsoft make their consoles home-exclusive.
 
off topic to what everyone else is saying but i really hate the move swagger
I just had this pop on random suggested feed and it just reminded me of this post, so i had to share it
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The sprites from FRLG have aged so well as a group. Even now some of them remain the best in the series IMO. You get such a sense of personality from them that was very much so lost with the transition to the DS games. Not to mention that RSE outright botched many of the sprites for #1 - 251.

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Walking Wake and Koraidon look so much alike to the point I might believe they were counterparts if I didn't know what Suicune was. On one hand design consistency is great. OTOH all three "special" mons of the group being Dragon is yet another example of a trope which has, IMO, long outstayed its welcome at least IMO. I mean, seriously, tack this onto the fact that we have not gotten a non-dragon psuedo (Metagross) or box trio master tertiary legend (literally Ho-oh/Lugia and Lugia is still very draconic) in over 20 years.

Re: your second point I feel exactly the same word-for-word but with Electric. I don't mind Grass/Psychic but it does feel like quite a safe typing despite actually being quite rare (Exeggutor, Celebi, and then Calyrex many gens later.) Electric/Fighting might have also been an option keeping it in line with the actual Swords while giving a nod to the whole cybernetic gimmick. Of course we got a couple of those this generation already in Pawmot and Hands.
For the longest time I thought Zeraora was Electric/Fighting. Just feels right based on the design.
 
For the longest time I thought Zeraora was Electric/Fighting. Just feels right based on the design.

In a similar boat. I’m not one of those hardcore it should be Electric/Fighting people because, hey, they made it what they made it, but considering it’s signature is called Plasma Fists they should’ve just fully committed to what they were quite obviously going for and just made Zeraora slower if they were that concerned about having an extremely fast Electric/Fighting type (funny considering they had introduced just about the most broken mon possible that very same gen in Marshadow.)

On the subject of weird mythical design quirks can we talk about how absolutely botched the execution of Meloetta is from a battling standpoint? Holy hell Meloetta-Pirouette has to be up there with the biggest wastes of potential we’ve had in the entirety of the series.
 
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In a similar boat. I’m not one of those hardcore it should be Electric/Fighting people because, hey, they made it what they made it, but considering it’s signature is called Plasma Fists they should’ve just fully committed to what they were quite obviously going for and just made Zeraora slower if they were that concerned about having an extremely fast Electric/Fighting type (funny considering they had introduced just about the most broken mon possible that very same gen in Marshadow.)

On the subject of weird mythical design quirks can we talked about how absolutely botched the execution of Meloetta is from a battling standpoint? Holy hell Meloetta-Pirouette has to be up there with the biggest wastes of potential we’ve had in the entirety of the series.
OG Zen Mode Darmanitan (hey, same generation) is probably close. A defensive form change that only activates at 50% HP only really works when, like Zygarde, you get a massive HP boost to offset.
 
On the subject of weird mythical design quirks can we talked about how absolutely botched the execution of Meloetta is from a battling standpoint? Holy hell Meloetta-Pirouette has to be up there with the biggest wastes of potential we’ve had in the entirety of the series.
I don't even get why Pirouette is a strictly in-battle form change. Compared to things like Megas or Zygarde being "let's get dangerous" battle modes or something like Shaymin being for other purposes (in this case migration) that it can fight in, Pirouette is a form that I see little lore reason behind (no Dex entry talks about Meloetta as a Performer or Dancer, strictly its singing) yet is borderline impossible to use in battle.

So many things that would drastically improve the usefulness if you changed them
- It is literally impossible to start a battle in Pirouette form
- Reverting on switch-out when Meloetta is slow and can barely take a hit
- Relying on a pure-Special move that FORCES the change (we know Hybrid moves are doable in hindsight)
- The two have completely different playstyles so it's not even like it plays one way and then improves if it changes like Greninja or Zygarde.

Like it'd be a hinderance if Pirouette had to run Relic Song (assuming no hybrid change), but if it just had to have it rather than use a turn on it to change/start in the form (akin to Megas/Primals with an item slot or Rayquaza needing its Signature Move), it'd at least be less clunky since Normal/Fighting achieves decent coverage already outside Ghosts. If the two forms had some similarity in playstyle then Aria wouldn't be a sandbag on the other. Singing and Dancing are often thought of together in performing but they are very different skillsets to truly master and it's a very impressive performer who can do both simultaneously.

Also this is a minor gripe but I also hate how despite the two forms being its whole gimmick, Meloetta learns exactly 2-3 moves that reference dancing (Teeter, Swords Dance, and Rain Dance by localization only) and 1 that might tie into the same skills (Acrobatics). Where's the flavor? How about a couple more dancing moves like Petal Dance or Quiver Dance (the latter would help Aria quite a bit), or dipping into Signature moves as they've done more as of late (Revelation Dance from Oricorio even if redundant Normal, Fiery Dance for some reliable Steel Coverage that Normal/Psychic desperately wants, Lunar Dance to add some support to this Mon's middling offense and non-existent Support build)? Back to my above point, have the forms actually benefit each other in options if not in actual battle. What about a Hidden Ability for Meloetta to make its Sound/Dance moves run off its higher stat?

I know the above gets a lot into wish-listing but I wanted to ramble about how many ways they could make this mon more flavorful if not more effective, and yet nothing has been done since Gen 5.
 
In spite of all the stupid shit BW introduced into the series IMO it also brought some all-time designs and concepts that, while clunky in their execution at the time, really set the foundation for some wonderful things the franchise has done since. I wasn't always the biggest fan of form changes in the earlier games but have to come to embrace them as an exciting and vital design element for old and new mons alike. That said:

I don't see how it has never occurred to GameFreak to make much needed QoL changes for Melo-P short of them simply forgetting it existed altogether. To me the obvious choices are:

a) just make them two standalone forms: if Meloetta-P is gauged as being too strong for out-of-battle changes a la Deoxys it could easily be, as you pointed out, either a held item change a la Giratina-O so it doesn't get an item slot, or a move change a la Mega Rayquaza that simply makes it so that Meloetta is always in Pirouette form if it knows Relic Song (thus giving it a constraint of effective 3MSS.)

I like this change the most as while Meloetta has a wide movepool it isn't a particularly strong movepool: beyond CC for STAB (with no reliable Normal STAB in Gen 9), your coverage options are the elemental punches, Stone Miss, Zen Headbutt, Play Rough, Shadow Claw, and U-Turn. If they for some reason were/are worried about releasing M-Lopunny lite into the game into the game it's mitigated by Relic Song + 3 constraining the user to have both a) significant gaps in their coverage, and b) have to worry about using either unreliable or fairly unimpressive coverage moves.

b) Simply make Relic Song worth using. A 10% sleep chance 75 BP special move coming from what is likely a -SpA Meloetta is not nearly enough compensation for giving up a turn especially when Meloetta-P reverts upon switchout (which will happen frequently because of 3MSS). I don't know what the hypothetical buff here should be, maybe +1/+1 or a non-negligible sleep chance coupled with undoing the senseless switchout reversion condition.

Also this is a minor gripe but I also hate how despite the two forms being its whole gimmick, Meloetta learns exactly 2-3 moves that reference dancing (Teeter, Swords Dance, and Rain Dance by localization only) and 1 that might tie into the same skills (Acrobatics). Where's the flavor? How about a couple more dancing moves like Petal Dance or Quiver Dance (the latter would help Aria quite a bit), or dipping into Signature moves as they've done more as of late (Revelation Dance from Oricorio even if redundant Normal, Fiery Dance for some reliable Steel Coverage that Normal/Psychic desperately wants, Lunar Dance to add some support to this Mon's middling offense and non-existent Support build)? Back to my above point, have the forms actually benefit each other in options if not in actual battle. What about a Hidden Ability for Meloetta to make its Sound/Dance moves run off its higher stat?

I know the above gets a lot into wish-listing but I wanted to ramble about how many ways they could make this mon more flavorful if not more effective, and yet nothing has been done since Gen 5.

It would never happen of course but Victory Dance makes too much sense here. Dancer fits perfectly as an HA for Pirouette forme that is neither completely useless nor overtly busted. Aria can get a signature version of Punk Rock or something.

Whatever balancing concerns they might've had about Pirouette when designing the mons for BW (serious lol here) surely can't apply in Gen IX. 128/128 is strong but it wouldn't at all be out of place in VGC or singles today.
 
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Not all (far from it) Pokemon are designed with competitive battling in mind.. and most of the ones that are are far more recent… and more designed with VGC in mind.

Sometimes people do seem to forget this is a non-competitive forum
 
Not all (far from it) Pokemon are designed with competitive battling in mind..

This is especially true for Mythicals, because they are banned from almost all official formats(Only allowed once at the end of Gen VII and again near the end of Gen VIII as a "last hurrah" of sorts for those games) and all battle facilities except for the Crystal and Sword/Shield Battle Towers, and the early ranks of the USUM version of the Battle Tree.
 
Can we talk about how bad Flying Press is? Hawlucha doesn't need a buff, no, but it'd be nice if it's signature move was usable. 100(or 80 when it was introduced) STAB move with a cool gimmick sounds great. And people have been asking for dual-typed moves for a while. But the two types they chose are awful together. Fighting/Flying is actually good coverage, hitting a LOT SE and being walled by only a handful of niche mons. But on a single move, every single Ghost is immune, and plenty of other stuff resists it. Unless you're fueling a super move with it, Flying Press isn't worth teaching even in-game.
 
This is especially true for Mythicals, because they are banned from almost all official formats(Only allowed once at the end of Gen VII and again near the end of Gen VIII as a "last hurrah" of sorts for those games) and all battle facilities except for the Crystal and Sword/Shield Battle Towers, and the early ranks of the USUM version of the Battle Tree.


Is it?

Jirachi/Deoxys
Manaphy/Darkrai/Shaymin/Arceus
Victini/Keldeo/Meloetta/Genesect
Diancie/Hoopa/Volcanion
Magearna/Marshadow/Zeraora/Melmetal
Zarude

maybe im wrong here but these pretty firmly run the gamut from good but unremarkable to busted to ???. Sure they often aren't playable in official formats but I don't see the evidence that Mythicals have historically been designed with no eye at all on being functional. Soul Heart? Spectral Thief? Be real.

add in urshifu and calyrex-s/-i which yeah techncially aren't mythicals but effectively are the second and third mythicals of gen 8 and if anything the trend has been for them to be more supercharged over time.


Not all (far from it) Pokemon are designed with competitive battling in mind.. and most of the ones that are are far more recent… and more designed with VGC in mind.

Sometimes people do seem to forget this is a non-competitive forum


100%. I just think the specific way in which Meloetta is bad is dumb and arbitrary especially because all caution was thrown to the wind with mon design in Gen V. You already made the second form strong. Why impose such a weird restriction on it?
 
b) Simply make Relic Song worth using. A 10% sleep chance 75 BP special move coming from what is likely a -SpA Meloetta is not nearly enough compensation for giving up a turn especially when Meloetta-P reverts upon switchout (which will happen frequently because of 3MSS). I don't know what the hypothetical buff here should be, maybe +1/+1 or a non-negligible sleep chance coupled with undoing the senseless switchout reversion condition.
Minor nitpick; both forms of Meloetta have Serene Grace, meaning that Relic Song functionally haa a 20% chance of inflicting Sleep. Still not much, but it's something.
 
Minor nitpick; both forms of Meloetta have Serene Grace, meaning that Relic Song functionally has a 20% chance of inflicting Sleep. Still not much, but it's something.
Really all the sleep chance does is mess with Sleep Clause on cart, as it's one of the very few things you can bring that you could legitimately want to click on that can put an oppt to sleep where sleep is not the main benefit.
 
not a fan of the new trend of making regional forms then leaving the original ones in the dust. like hisuian samurott, that guy is cool, they did a good job on the design. but then you look at unovan samurott and you just ask, why does this mon exist in comparison? why is it even here? why doesn't it even get sharpness?

this doesn't even apply for all of them. i think unovan lilligant is cool and meaningfully distinct from the hisui form. same for decidueye. some of the others though just need some attention. even if hisuian typhlosion's fire/ghost is certainly more flashy than johto typhlosion's pure fire, pure fire is still an interesting typing on its own; mons like torkoal and entei made it work fine.
 
Can we talk about how bad Flying Press is? Hawlucha doesn't need a buff, no, but it'd be nice if it's signature move was usable. 100(or 80 when it was introduced) STAB move with a cool gimmick sounds great. And people have been asking for dual-typed moves for a while. But the two types they chose are awful together. Fighting/Flying is actually good coverage, hitting a LOT SE and being walled by only a handful of niche mons. But on a single move, every single Ghost is immune, and plenty of other stuff resists it. Unless you're fueling a super move with it, Flying Press isn't worth teaching even in-game.
I'd like to post the move's type effectiveness chart to help visualize how awful it is.
Flying Press type chart.png

You lose out coverage against Steel to make Abomasnow's life bad sometimes. That's the only functional benefit here. The only other Pokémon I can think of that the move nukes are Weavile and Shiftry, who were going to die to a stiff breeze anyway with their defensive stats. Reminder that Mega Venusaur was a super relevant Flying-weak Pokémon in Gen VI, but oops you can't hit it super effectively with your gimmick move since it's part Poison so it walls you.
 
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