How you would fix and/or balance the metagame for the next generation, and why?

Kira said:
Oh in that case it seems fine. I thought you meant every move.

Although what about Super Luck absol. It would spell doom to many bp teams.
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Well that was sort of the idea. As a second option to Hazing/Phazing, you could use High Crit moves to just plow through them regardless of their stat ups. The only issue is that they do nothing to stop offensive stat uppers. Protect/Detect/Sub was just an interesting idea. Right now there isn't anything useful to stop Proect/Detect, and dealing with Subs is either brute force breaking or Phazing.

Also gets rid of the god damn annoying crit hax -.-
 
skiddle said:
I think SR should be nerfed a lot... 1/2 damage is too good. I think that 4x weak should be 1/4, 2x weak should be 1/8, normal should be 1/16, and nothing resists it. (ie, minimum of 1/16 on everyone). Either that, or make it like Spikes that hits flying/levitators harder, but hits non flyers weaker.

Also, stop with the evolution things. Poor Magmar got seriously uglified. Couldn't they just up the stats of some pokemon?! Especially all those poor mediocre Hoenn pokemon; sharpedo, bannette, crawdaunt, shiftry, chimecho, tropius
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Sharpedo isn't really mediocre...
I wish Nintendo changes some types in some pokes(please,give another type to Aggron!!).Imagine a Fire/Dragon Dragonite with,logically,Levitate?The new #1 usage poke.
And the crit thing is dumb for me.Leave it like it's already is.

And just evolve EVERYTHING that's crap.Yes,all in one generation.
Give some pokes proper stab(Luxray with Volt Tackle,Blaziken with Close Combat,Flareon/Entei with Flare Blitz(or maybe even Sacred Fire for Flareon,which isn't a real sweeper without speed help))

Give some tanks a 50% recovery move(not Suicune,or it will overcentralize the metagame.But the Regi family would be cool to have it)

My
 
Try paying closer attention to where he said STAB—that makes all the difference in the world. Staraptor wouldn't be weak to Stealth Rock, would resist Fighting (to go with Bug and Grass still) and would only pick up relatively negligible Psychic and Flying weaknesses (to go with the Ice and Electric weaknesses still). It would be a very decent Heracross switch in with or without a bulky spread, but most importantly...would actually get STAB on that Close Combat, which would enable it to 2HKO Skarmory nearly every time.
 
I don't see much that needs changing. Pokemon is a fairly balanced game, and ubers were never designed for standard play.

The only thing i'd like to see is the Battle Tower AI be banned from using Double fucking Team and Protect. It wastes so much time...
 
But that's not STAB.


DEAR GAMEFREAK:

1. Change types please. You did it with Magnemite/ton, now make Luxray Electric/Dark or Flygon Bug/Dragon. Or maybe even YANMEGA. I mean really, it's a DRAGONFLY. Did that make too much sense or something?

2. PLEASE FOR THE LOVE OF GOD GIVE US MORE SPINNERS or make SR do half the damage it does normally. Like a 4x weak would only take 25-30%.

Better yet, change Stealth Rock to Ice. No more Garchomp and things like Regice and sometimes even Cloyster maybe are more usable as walls. It would somewhat nerf grass walls like Celebi and Cradily, maybe you can reduce the damage as well?

3. Change Sandstream and Snow Warning to not last all battle. Drought and Drizzle are fine.

4. Evolve these (please for the love of god don't make the designs terrible): Banette, Farfetch'd, Sunflora, Jynx, Relicanth (technically Pokemon don't evolve they metamorphosize so you can still keep the theme), Delibird, Pachirisu (Electric/Flying squirrel?), Eevee (DRACONEON) and Shedinja (2 HP!!!).

4. Entei, Banette, Flareon, Luxray, Manaphy, Blaziken, Typhlosion, Victreebel, and the Eeveelutions need better movepools.

5. Type chart: Poison needs to SE something good like Water, and more needs to resist Dragon. Possibly Normal. It could also be super effective! Then Slaking would be an even better Garchomp counter :DDD

6. There is a severe lack of good physical Poison moves (no Gunk Shot does not qualify as good). Special Normal moves have the same problem (not a lot of things can use Swift or learn Hyper Voice). While you're at it, make more things learn Aura Sphere and give us something better than Shadow Claw for that Banette evo. A more widely avaliable Crunch would be nice too.

7. ROCK/STEEL IS NOT A GOOD DEFENSIVE TYPE AND GARCHOMP DID NOT NEED SAND VEIL OKAY

Sincerely,

Smogon

feel free to add and sign guys i think we can change the pokemon world with this
 
Pokemon
type : Steel / Water
ability : levitate
Base stats : 105 hp / 70 atk / 135 defence / 90 satk / 90 sdef / 60 spd
- ice beam
- Recover
- discharge
- stealth rock

badda bing, badda boom a garchomp counter.

EDIT : sanjay ill sign that proposition except the SR ice. and the dragon eveeloution.
 
Mmm I really like everything sanjay120 said there *SIGN*. Dragon could use more types to resist it, and perhaps give Ice more resists (water, dragon perhaps?). Also, if 3 types resist/are immune to normal, why not give them a type to be super effective on?

An interesting new trait could be one to remove all evasion changes as long as its in play. No Double Team, no Sand Attack, no Sand Veil. Instant Sweet Scent, I guess. Sweet Aura anyone? I think it could make another grass type usable. Guess we'll have to see what happens in the new metagame in the possible 5th generation.
 
sanjay120 said:
But that's not STAB.


DEAR GAMEFREAK:

1. Change types please. You did it with Magnemite/ton, now make Luxray Electric/Dark or Flygon Bug/Dragon. Or maybe even YANMEGA. I mean really, it's a DRAGONFLY. Did that make too much sense or something?

But that would mess with Flygon being the sand spirit. Also dragonflys are not dragons... They are bugs. I agree with the Luxray thing though.

2. PLEASE FOR THE LOVE OF GOD GIVE US MORE SPINNERS or make SR do half the damage it does normally. Like a 4x weak would only take 25-30%.

Stealth Rock does 0x if you use spinners decently. But yes, more would be nice. Ah fuck it, I have Tentacruel...

Better yet, change Stealth Rock to Ice. No more Garchomp and things like Regice and sometimes even Cloyster maybe are more usable as walls. It would somewhat nerf grass walls like Celebi and Cradily, maybe you can reduce the damage as well?

Nah, thats not fair to the dragons, who would become useless. Also MANY things weak to rock are also weak to ice. Poor Hippowdon, Claydol, Tangrowth, and dragon, etc...

3. Change Sandstream and Snow Warning to not last all battle. Drought and Drizzle are fine.

All battle is cool! You need to deal with using a crappy Abomasnow, and TTar and Hippowdon are usually hurt by it. Or at least their teams are.

4. Evolve these (please for the love of god don't make the designs terrible): Banette, Farfetch'd, Sunflora, Jynx, Relicanth (technically Pokemon don't evolve they metamorphosize so you can still keep the theme), Delibird, Pachirisu (Electric/Flying squirrel?), Eevee (DRACONEON) and Shedinja (2 HP!!!).

Relicanth, Pachirisu, and to a lesser extent Jynx are all usable. The fuck would Jynx evolve into lol? Sheddy is cool enough!

4. Entei, Banette, Flareon, Luxray, Manaphy, Blaziken, Typhlosion, Victreebel, and the Eeveelutions need better movepools.

Agreed.

5. Type chart: Poison needs to SE something good like Water, and more needs to resist Dragon. Possibly Normal. It could also be super effective! Then Slaking would be an even better Garchomp counter :DDD

I always thought Sludge Bomb was a good move... Its not like people don't ever use Grass, and 30% poison ROCKS.

6. There is a severe lack of good physical Poison moves (no Gunk Shot does not qualify as good). Special Normal moves have the same problem (not a lot of things can use Swift or learn Hyper Voice). While you're at it, make more things learn Aura Sphere and give us something better than Shadow Claw for that Banette evo. A more widely avaliable Crunch would be nice too.

Sure.

7. ROCK/STEEL IS NOT A GOOD DEFENSIVE TYPE AND GARCHOMP DID NOT NEED SAND VEIL OKAY

I was amazed when an Aggron survived my Forretress's EQ, but I guess i'm underestimating 180 base defense with 252 / 252 defensive EVs.

Sand Veil is ok. Its not like people never use Stone Edge (80%). Just use a Hail / Rain / Sun team.

Sincerely,

Smogon

feel free to add and sign guys i think we can change the pokemon world with this
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I may add more ideas to the thread later; I'm too tired to think of many good ones. One thing I'd like to see, although not metagame related, is Day-Care hatched Pokemon, when released into the wild, would seek out their native habitat in the game (or closest equivalent), and retain their egg moves and TMs, while proceeding to an appropriate native level, possibly lowering the rates of other Pokemon in the area.

Regarding the metagame, I'd say:
- Sableye, Luvdisc, Castform and Farfetch'd evos are in order.
- As are Tropius, Skarmory and Scyther pre-evos.
- More and stronger physical Fire moves. Heck, more Fire move diversity in general.
- More Water special moves. I mean, Water Pulse, Surf, and Hydro Pump aren't cutting it for me. I'd like a bit more options there...
- More spinners. Or, even cooler, how about different-typed Rapid Spins? Or adding it as an effect to certain moves, like Whirlpool?
- More Poison weaknesses.
- If we get anything Rock / Steel with high defenses, let's let it Levitate so people can complain about it... never mind.
- Multitype Kecleon.
- Pressure Legendaries having a second ability option, like Flash Fire Moltres... from events, if not catchable.

Also, some more not-quite-metagame thoughts:

- More Metal Coat evolving Pokemon. Heck, more trade item evos in general. Trade items while having a certain move evos... Like something holding Metronome that knows the move Metronome, or something.
 
Frost Pulse
Ice Type Move
Base Power 80

Chilling attack that never misses.

Bye Garchomp. Heh, maybe I'm fantasizing a bit too much but it would be awesome. I also would like to see some sort of boost for Flareon and Entie, as they really should get something cool. ='(
 
There are so many little things that could balance the game further like giving Pokemon moves they deserve (Ampharos - Tail Glow, Flareon - Flare Blitz, etc...) and I would also increase the base stats of really weak Pokemon when they hit a certain level. Example: Once Butterfree would hit Lv 50 its Speed and Sp Def base would raise making it actually usable in OU. That way almost everything would be usable in OU. Uber legendaries would stay broken as hell though. You gotta do that for flavor purposes.
 
I pretty much agree with all Lord Alchemy said except for the crit thingy, and some other stuff:

1 - More creative/interesting dual types that can save the metagame without cracking it

2 - MORE rapid spin or at least diminish the SR damage

and people, please stop whining about Garchomp...
 
Give flareon flare blitz

Give entei flare Blitz


Evolve Pinsir.

I am good.

Also more defensive pokes to the mix. That are not Ghost/steel/rock
 
Right now passive damage is too overwhelming in my opinion. It would be good if there were a way to deal with them better, especially weather.

Pokemon that had abilities that "absorbed" spikes/rocks or turned weather "off" (and not just while they're in play like Golduck) would be nice, especially if they were attached to something with decent defenses.

Gastrodon would be a great choice for a spike-absorbing ability IMO. In real life many seaslugs/madusa like Gastrodon eat the stinging spines or tentacles of other species, and actually can encorporate that poison into their own defense.
 
1. Rapid Spin needs a non-normal counterpart. Like ground, ghost or whatever. A Pokémon whose ability is to remove entry-hazards upon entering would be nice as well, as said above, or an item with that effect.

2. Tyranitar is overpowered with sandstream. With it, Tyranitar automatically bumps up to 650 base stats along with taking damage on the majority of types each turn. I already think that his stats are unjustified, and although I'd like redistrubute them, I'd like to see a change of his typing that does not benefit from Sandstream, e.g. Dark/Ground. Removing the 50% sp. def bonus for Rock Pokémon by sandstream isn't that fair as Rock Pokémon usually have a terrible sp. def which can be remedied with sandstream.

3. I'd like to see evolutions/raised base stats for Pokémon that are rather "useless" in any tier that's BL and up. It'd be nice to see that all Pokémon could at least play in BL and fight somewhat fairly against experienced OU players. Like someone stated earlier, it'd create more variety in teams. If I try looking for Wifi battles on youtube, 90% of the battles look almost identical.

4. Why did strong Pokémon get a boost in this generation? Because they really needed it or what? Tyranitar got Sandstream, bumping his sp. def to 150. Metagross got Bullet Punch, which is stabbed on his 135 base ATK. Outrage is, to say the least, outrageous. As if it isn't enough that this type is only walled by one single type that, by the way, there aren't a lot of, its power was raised to 120. Draco Meteor is another ludicrously high-powered move that is stabbed by one of the highest base-stat Pokémon in OU. One of my opponents accused me of hacking because my Pokémon wasn't OHKO:d by it. I just find it slightly odd when people don't find anything wrong in moves that instantly kills almost any Pokémon.

I've already proposed a solution for Tyranitar. Metagross is a slightly harder case, removing it from him might be too harsh. Outrage's power need to be lowered.

5. I agree with a previous poster that IV breeding should be made easier. It's very odd that there's barely any inclination in the game of the existence of either IVs or EVs (except extremely subtle and unspecific statements). I like that idea of that every Pokémon has at least one stat that's 31 and that the baby will always inherit a stat from a parent's if it's higher. I don't think there's anything "cheap" about this; IV breeding doesn't really involve much skill and it's an extremely tedious job. It'd be okay if you had to do the process once but here the process is just repeating itself.

6. Also as stated previously, there's need to be more than one type that resists dragon. Either implement the resistance on an already existing type or create a new type with that resistance. Preferably, there should be one or more types that hits dragon and steel effectively as well.

7. Pokémon whose ability is to create weather shouldn't have infinte weather. 5 or 8 turns should be enough. In addition, there needs to be Pokémon except Kyogre and Groudon with Drought/Drizzle.
 
Lee said:
I'd like it if eternal weather abilites ended when Tyranitar etc switched out, or at least within 5 turns of Tyranitar etc switching out. Endless weather is a bit illogical and incredibly annoying for both players (unless their team is designed around it, in which case...they're boring).
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Hmm...I find this idea delicious.
 
only add the chance to crit ( unless they have a high change to crit) if they have a defense boost to the attacking type

some sort of 3 evo pure dragon

more things should get rapid spin

make poison a better typing (maybe SE to ground?)

mabye make SR change with the weather:
sand = rock ( it still be rock)
rain = water
sunny day = fire
hail = ice
 
New evos: Sunflora, Qwilfish, Chatot, Stantler, Delibird, Farfetch'd, etc.
New better stats: Poliwrath, Ampharos, Raichu, Pidgeot, Fearow, Xatu, Girafarig, etc.
New worse stats: Tyranitar, Blissey, Garchomp, Salamence, Metagross, Lati@s, Heatran, Cresselia, etc.
New attacks: Articuno, Arcanine, Victreebel, Vileplume, Magnezone, Meganium, Thyplosion, Venusaur, Flareon, Glaceon, Entei, Registeel, Regice, Regirock (recover), etc.
 
JAG said:
This isn't really metagame related, but I'd like to see some improved CPU AI. If the opponents ingame would play at least halfway intelligently (the average trainers, not just the Elite 4), then they wouldn't need to have moves like Double Team which only help the CPU win b/c they can get greater % from those moves. It would also be kinda nice to get some intelligence from the CPU so that battling them takes some thought instead of being completely auto-pilot.

In terms of metagaming, I'd say a new type might be good but would be really hard to implement and probably wouldn't help all that much until at least the next generation (we didn't have a lot of really good Steel/Dark pokemon until ADV). I'd like to see some new type combinations, like a Grass/Fire, just to see how they might pan out. Also, since I'm a fan of Eevee, I'd like to see an evolution of Eevee for every type, so that we can make Eevee teams that actually have some options. A Fighting-type physical sweeper (Karateon?) could be interesting.

-JM
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Are you insane? There was Skarmory and Houndoom to name a few >:[
 
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