there's an entire type that fissure literally cannot damage and it happens to be one of the best typings in the game right now
seriously I don't agree with ian but that was the lowest hanging fruit you could've chosen
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Metagame SV OU Metagame Discussion v4
- Thread starter TPP
- Start date
seriously I don't agree with ian but that was the lowest hanging fruit you could've chosen
My thoughts exactly, sun not being super overbearing probably keeps it in line along with 4mss making it easy to out offense if you are running something like tusk which consistently beats it before it can set up 2 dragon dances.
My anti stored power tech also happened to be my anti stall tech, it was deoxys-d with cosmic power. You resist stored power and can boost up alongside them, then just pressure stall stored power, they won't break you. Night shade, knock off, recover, and tera poison gives you the matchup into stall. Pressure stalling attacks can give other team members breathing space to setup too, it's underutilised I feel.
It does. This gen if one deoxys form has a move, all deoxys forms can have it. I think this was different in past gens for some reason, idk if that is true but that is what I've heard.
Yeah but im not using it as a sweeper, it's a pressure staller, and night shade has more pp/ less relevant immunities
it does, but it can't hit dark-types because it doesn't get body press and its attacking stats are garbage. stored power deo-d is setup bait for every dark-type setup mon in the tier, and there's no shortage of those
the other problem is that you can kinda just use deo-s with taunt to stop setup and stallbreak better than deo-d can
Finally got reqs, and there's this one really funny Volc set that just completely fucks over the current main rain structure. Props to Akalli for dropping the heat in their reqs post (personally tried with fiery dance > bug buzz):
Volcarona @ Heavy-Duty Boots
Ability: Flame Body
Tera Type: Water
EVs: 252 SpA / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Quiver Dance
- Sunny Day
- Fiery Dance
- Morning Sun
Mono attack is kind of bad against most structures, but fully 6-0's the main rains, it might struggle a bit against Raging Bolt, but you usually win the 1v1. Basically the point is that once you get a QD up, you just Sunny Day and never let rain back up again lmao. Stuff like Archaludon and Barraskewda are entirely helpless if you deny their precious weather, making volc beat em both out, usually without even needing to expend Tera.
Sunny Day is really cool, because you're doing multiple things as once in the rain matchup:
1. Denying Electro Shot from Archa
2. Keeps you faster than Barraskewda
3. Boosts Fiery Dance's power
4. Reduces Water damage, making Aqua Jet Barra deal a max of 55% in sun (beware Tera Water!)
5. Making Peli, Zapdos's and Tornadus-T's Hurricanes not perfectly accurate
6. Boosts your Morning Sun recovery!
Volcarona @ Heavy-Duty Boots
Ability: Flame Body
Tera Type: Water
EVs: 252 SpA / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Quiver Dance
- Sunny Day
- Fiery Dance
- Morning Sun
Mono attack is kind of bad against most structures, but fully 6-0's the main rains, it might struggle a bit against Raging Bolt, but you usually win the 1v1. Basically the point is that once you get a QD up, you just Sunny Day and never let rain back up again lmao. Stuff like Archaludon and Barraskewda are entirely helpless if you deny their precious weather, making volc beat em both out, usually without even needing to expend Tera.
Sunny Day is really cool, because you're doing multiple things as once in the rain matchup:
1. Denying Electro Shot from Archa
2. Keeps you faster than Barraskewda
3. Boosts Fiery Dance's power
4. Reduces Water damage, making Aqua Jet Barra deal a max of 55% in sun (beware Tera Water!)
5. Making Peli, Zapdos's and Tornadus-T's Hurricanes not perfectly accurate
6. Boosts your Morning Sun recovery!
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if manually setting weather is ever viable then something has gone very, very wrong. we need archaludon out of the tier and we need it out nowFinally got reqs, and there's this one really funny Volc set that just completely fucks over the current main rain structure. Props to Akalli for dropping the heat in their reqs post (personally tried with fiery dance > bug buzz):
Volcarona @ Heavy-Duty Boots
Ability: Flame Body
Tera Type: Water
EVs: 252 SpA / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Quiver Dance
- Sunny Day
- Fiery Dance
- Morning Sun
Mono attack is kind of bad against most structures, but fully 6-0's the main rains, it might struggle a bit against Raging Bolt, but you usually win the 1v1. Basically the point is that once you get a QD up, you just Sunny Day and never let rain back up again lmao. Stuff like Archaludon and Barraskewda are entirely helpless if you deny their precious weather, making volc beat em both out, usually without even needing to expend Tera.
Sunny Day is really cool, because you're doing multiple things as once in the rain matchup:
1. Denying Electro Shot from Archa
2. Keeps you faster than Barraskewda
3. Boosts Fiery Dance's power
4. Reduces Water damage, making Aqua Jet Barra deal a max of 55% in sun (beware Tera Water!)
5. Making Peli, Zapdos's and Tornadus-T's Hurricanes not perfectly accurate
i'm sorry, there must be some glitch in the forums that's making me read this wrong, you run WHAT
Guys, stop talking about Rain. Triple Dino Death is still very broken. Look at what damage Walking Wake does under Sun even with Screens: https://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/gen9ou-2053495143
Dragonite @ Icy Rock
Ability: Multiscale
Tera Type: Ice
EVs: 4 Atk / 252 SpA / 252 Spe
Mild Nature
- Extreme Speed
- Blizzard
- Snowscape
- Agility
Mom, can we have baxcalibur.
Mom: We have baxcalibur at home
Baxcalibur at home:
Tyranitar @ Damp Rock
Ability: Sand Stream
Tera Type: Water
EVs: 252 HP / 4 Atk / 252 SpA
Quiet Nature
- Thunder
- Rain Dance
- Surf
- Knock Off
These are the gimmick sets that I have created for these mons, if I used these to try to climb ladder, I would be insane. I'm only a little crazy, not that crazy.
But... if you want rain tyranitar why not use unnerve?
So you don't reveal the set cause non sand tyranitar will instantly put them on edge. Plus, you can use the extra sp.Defense to tank a hit to get up rain for teamates.
iRoN bOuLdEr Is BrOkEn AnD sHoUlD bE bAnNeD: https://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/gen9ou-2053511577
I unironically run sandstorm (and some speed evs) on clodsire/gliscor simply to disrupt arch at this point
Is it good? no
Is it funny? hell yes
also using this ungodly set on my rillaboom team:
Hawlucha @ White Herb
Ability: Unburden
Tera Type: Ground
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Adamant Nature
- Mean Look
- Encore
- Close Combat
- Bulk Up
forfeit simulator, legitimately the funniest wins i've ever gotten, i take back everything I've ever said about tera
edit: it took me like 8 battles to find a rain team at 1000s for some reason https://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/gen9ou-2053521805
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I've run sandstorm on hoodra when I tried to create a stall team (I am bad at making stall teams) simply as a 'neutral' weather, since only excadrill and maybe some rock types benefit from it. This could help against weather teams by making them have to send in pelipper in more often, which if I can pressure it with passive damage, can eventually make sure that weather is gone, meaning the opposing team is severly weakened. But manual weather should always be a gimmick, that I think is a fair point.
Why the White Herb?
To proc unburden after the cc drop. I would probably use grassy seed over it, but that's probs the reason, in case you don't want to sweep yet you can just click set up moves/disruption moves to get in that position.
To activate Unburden, though why not Grassy Seed if this is with Rillaboom?
Yeah I was wondering why no Grassy Seed, and thought it was probably a typo, then figured it was a tech I didn't understand. That makes sense, I find it a tad stressful trying to manage terrain withiut activating seed. I had Icy Spinner on something for that.l, and that was clunky too.
"There are too many threats so we have to ban them all to restore our perfectly balanced metagame 
"
Or maybe the solution lies in accepting the massive powercreep this generation has brought, and reevaluate the standards of competitive play ? Like, idk, accepting Flutter Mane, Iron Bundle, Palafin and other "broken" pokemons which could have regulated the powercreep. Like in VGC ("it's not the same format", I know, but they face powercreep too).
People have been constantly warning you since the very beginning of this generation, and here we are, countless of bans later, problems still are not solved.
"Or maybe the solution lies in accepting the massive powercreep this generation has brought, and reevaluate the standards of competitive play ? Like, idk, accepting Flutter Mane, Iron Bundle, Palafin and other "broken" pokemons which could have regulated the powercreep. Like in VGC ("it's not the same format", I know, but they face powercreep too).
People have been constantly warning you since the very beginning of this generation, and here we are, countless of bans later, problems still are not solved.
Even with this many bans or numerous more, the power level is still far-and-away above any other generation. We are not going to accept a game that is a crapshoot just for the sake of allowing a few more Pokemon -- that goes against the whole model of tiered Pokemon and, if you do not like that, then there are dozens of other ways to play (including UUBL, which has half the things you mentioned, or Ubers, which has all the things you mentioned). We are going to keep adhering to the process the community wants (see: suspects, surveys, etc.) and, even if this means more bans, then the power level will still be historically high. It is not like there is some quota on bans or anything wrong with having more or less bans, so arguing as such is a misrepresentation of Smogon tiering."There are too many threats so we have to ban them all to restore our perfectly balanced metagame
Or maybe the solution lies in accepting the massive powercreep this generation has brought, and reevaluate the standards of competitive play ? Like, idk, accepting Flutter Mane, Iron Bundle, Palafin and other "broken" pokemons which could have regulated the powercreep. Like in VGC ("it's not the same format", I know, but they face powercreep too).
People have been constantly warning you since the very beginning of this generation, and here we are, countless of bans later, problems still are not solved.
VGC's comparison is basically a noob trap though: Doubles naturally has better ways to handle powercrept or broken threats just due to the nature of having two Pokemon to use in tandem with each other to dispatch of them. This is a historically bad false equivelancy.
I'm going to explain it politely and nicely as possible since I feel like your statement makes 'sense' in a vacuum but misses the whole picture."There are too many threats so we have to ban them all to restore our perfectly balanced metagame
Or maybe the solution lies in accepting the massive powercreep this generation has brought, and reevaluate the standards of competitive play ? Like, idk, accepting Flutter Mane, Iron Bundle, Palafin and other "broken" pokemons which could have regulated the powercreep. Like in VGC ("it's not the same format", I know, but they face powercreep too).
People have been constantly warning you since the very beginning of this generation, and here we are, countless of bans later, problems still are not solved.
The issue with letting such clearly overpowered/overtuned threats run amok is that they are effectively dictate the entire game through their presence alone. It becomes a game of "Do you have X? No Y? Alright, you lose on start up." Which has been an entire issue this generation. If we leave in Flutter Mane, then effectively anything that doesn't 2X resist it or has enough bulk to sustain it gets wiped off the map. This only nullifies further options as you NEED one of three options to deal with Flutter Mane or else you just lose.
This differs highly from "Oh I have a sand Team and the enemy has glowkin+5 waters" or similar. Since you will absolutely have a tough match up, but its still possible to win through superior skill or player error. Overpowered Pokemon like Iron Bundle effectively remove a lot of skill involved by being plug and play options that just bruteforce through so many healthy stables like say, Great Tusk, that it makes the meta game worse through the alpha predators weeding out all the healthy mons that are good for the ecosystem. (I.E. we let out Mane/Bundle, then Tusk becomes non existent. Which makes Ghold, Gambit, etc effectively thrice as insufferable more than they already are.)
If your house has a leaky pipe, the answer isn't to bust up every pipe surrounding it. Its to section off the areas which are leaking and then patch them up accordingly--You don't wanna live in a house full of leaky pipes right?
Edit: My english is real bad today but you get the gist