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32 turns of stall in the Hail: Walrein

Specsmie also dies to the hail, and it is unable to switch attacks to rapid spin or recover.

Essentially, you're coming in on Walrein. Then I use subsitute, and you break the sub while I lay down a new sub. If you come in on the protect, I'm switching out to Frosslass because I can't risk rapid spin... (or if I can risk rapid spin, you're still not stopping the protect/substitute cycle)
 
You guys are delusional. This isn't going to do anything. Hail only negates their leftovers, like sandstorm, so what you're saying about magnezone is stupid. Also by assuming skarmory doesn't carry roost, you have lost all respect you may have obtained by trying to make a UU/BL poke work.
 
No, I'm saying I roar away Skarmory. I'm not assuming it doesn't carry Roost. If Magnezone is running leftovers, I can either hit it for a bit of damage with Surf, or I can roar it away.

EDIT: If you want, I'll face you on Shoddy with it.

EDIT2: I should note... my connection sucks. I keep getting DCed from Shoddy. Never on purpose (believe what you want however)
 
I am in a very small NSW town at the moment, recovering from last night while chilling on my mates laptop. He doesn't have shoddy, but when I get back in a week I'll take on your hail team fo sho nigga
 
Such a shame his connection is bad. That seemed like it was gonna be a good battle, dt... lol, discharge paralysis giving me the kill on Porygon-Z gave me a fighting chance.

And, thinking about that and the last post I made, I've a question for you: Do you ever find you're ending up with Wallrein as your last pokemon?
 
Seriously, I've used a team similar to DT's and I've lost about twice in thirty battles. As long as you

a) Have a way to take down weakened Cresselia's/Blissey's
b) Eliminate their spinner so that Toxic Spikes gets them (which I end up doing most battles)

Then you basically are very unlikely to lose...
 
I'd also like to battle this Walrein. I still can't see how it can beat a Starmie seeing how it can recover the damage off easily =/.
 
Dragontamer said:
That... is a good question. But the more important question is...

Does Mean Look go through substitute?

It does not. So in fact, you're safe if the sub/protect combo is up.

Just forcing this walrein to switch out doesn't help, because as soon as your wall comes in to absorb a hit... Walrein is coming back in.
Click to expand...

I know you'll see the point ;)
in the same way, do you know if the whirpool's trap effect (or fire spin, it's the same) pass through the sub ?
 
Having had the (dis)pleasure of facing this beast I have to say it is much more difficult to take down than it looks on paper, and it looks quite impressive on paper. It might be an overstatement to say it is the new CM 'Cune of this generation, and it certainly works in a different way than 'Cune, but the feelings of helplessness and annoyance when facing it are very reminiscent of advanced gen Suicune. Really only TTar can counter it once it get's a sub, and I dislike TTar so I guess I'm going to be stuck out-stalling it with Articuno or roaring it away with Suicune ;).
 
Dragontamer you said you used a subleech abomasnow as your lead right?

I thought it might be wiser to use an abomasnow who uses leech seed + protect. As it's your lead you can protect scout your first turn. And you can switch out without just throwing away a subsitute (this is situational however.
I might be missing a huge advantage to the subleech set but as I see it now leech seed + protect might work better.
 
Wow, this looks really awesome. I have a hail team at the moment so I'm going to test it out. Much better than the Cloyster that I have (I can sub that for Tentacruel). You think Froslass will be an essential for this team?
 
Froslass is immune to fighting and seeing as Fighting is a big problem for all Ice Teams, frosslass is pretty much needed.
 
Frosslass isn't needed, but I chose her because it's blizzard is stronger than anything Gengar can pull out (a combination of 120 base on Blizzard vs 80 base on Shadow Ball and the fact that Focus Blast (also 120 base) doesn't have any STAB on Gengar)

However, Gengar has a stronger T-Bolt and Shadow Ball and Levitate. Mismagus, Dusknoir, and so forth should all be considered for your team.

But a ghost of one type is essential not only because of the fighting immunity, but because of _rapid spin_ immunity. A bolt/beam ghost like Frosslass hits the sweetspot IMO because of its ability to single-handedly demolish the most common spinners in the game. Donphan, Starmie, Claydoll... all are weak to BoltBeam. Hitmontop is an exception, and it can strike back with 80% accurate Stone Edge... which is then reduced by Snow Cloak.

I thought it might be wiser to use an abomasnow who uses leech seed + protect. As it's your lead you can protect scout your first turn. And you can switch out without just throwing away a subsitute (this is situational however.
I might be missing a huge advantage to the subleech set but as I see it now leech seed + protect might work better.
Click to expand...

Ah, another pokemon who needs 5 moves...

Because of the way Walrein works, the last pokemon remaining on the opponent's team after stalling are usually Cresselia, Blissey, and other walls like that. That is why sub/seed works well on them. However, I also need a way to handle with cleric blissey, and I do that with Sub Focus-Punch. Focus Punch also works well with Freeze Hacks.

So it is a matter of Protect vs Blizzard vs Focus Punch. Which combination is optimal.
 
Queen said:
Back during the ADV generation Trick would hit through Substitute. I haven't tested out in D/P, but I feel confident in saying that it still does.
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Trick going through Substitute was strictly a Netbattle bug. It didn't go through Subs in Advance, either.
 
This sounds funny and all but it seems that with a single ice-type on the other team it's rendered pretty much useless.
 
iruchii said:
Not always because I carry a Scarfed Heracross now, but it's just kinda annoying battling the same teams over and over.
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While it is hard to get Walrein into a Scarfed Heracross... it is just as hard to get a Scarf Heracross into this Walrein. Walrein only fears Close Combat, so playing conservative with Stone Edge will start the stalling cycle... even with a Choice Band. Thus options are limited to the following matrix.

1. Heracross either plays Close Combat or plays conservative.
2. Walrein switches out to Frosslass or stays in and uses substitute.

If heracross does Close Combat, Walrein loses, but Frosslass wins.
If Heracross plays conservative with Stone Edge, Walrein wins but Frosslass loses.
This sounds funny and all but it seems that with a single ice-type on the other team it's rendered pretty much useless.
Click to expand...

Roar.
 
Dragontamer said:
Roar.
Click to expand...
Ok, so Weavile (or mamoswine, or frosslass) comes in as you get your sub out. He brick breaks and your sub is gone. You spend that turn roaring, and now something else comes in and you have no sub.

If you're lucky, you take a hit and get a sub up again. Weavile comes in again easily enough. Eventually you're going to get worn down, or roar in something that can kill you or status you.
 
I have to say, people are seriously underesitmating Dragontamer's Walrein. I've battle Dragontamer multiple times now, and we've both had our fair share of wins/losses. The way I managed to win was just to not let him get his Toxic Spikes down. Walrein is still HARD to take down, even without Toxic Spikes down, and it can still take out 2 or more pokemon just by outstalling them in the hail.

Kudos to Dragontamer for making this set, and I hope everyone saying how easy it is to take down actually gets to battle him, and see for themselves what a monster this is.
 
Ok, so Weavile (or mamoswine, or frosslass) comes in as you get your sub out. He brick breaks and your sub is gone. You spend that turn roaring, and now something else comes in and you have no sub.

If you're lucky, you take a hit and get a sub up again. Weavile comes in again easily enough. Eventually you're going to get worn down, or roar in something that can kill you or status you.
Click to expand...

Wait... I was thinking Articuno... who avoids the toxic spikes. So this begs the question... Where the hell are the toxic spikes?

-----

Just like any other pokemon... this Walrein is part of a team. Specifically, it is the wall in a TSH team (yes, this is an allusion to the TSS teams of the past). This walrein is designed for that very specific situation where you got things down pat, and you just need to do nothing but stall for the rest of the game to win. And it does that job pretty damn well.

Kudos to Dragontamer for making this set, and I hope everyone saying how easy it is to take down actually gets to battle him, and see for themselves what a monster this is.
Click to expand...

Just don't bring a weather changer... because then you'll see how quickly it dies without hail. Lol.
 
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