Singles 3v3 Singles (BSS) Discussion

Hey y'all, I'm new to here and competitive Pokemon in general! I hopped into BSS for this first time and managed to hit max ball in two days, feeling pretty chuffed with my self!

One thing that was a constant headache for me was Rillaboom, I brought ferrothorn onto my line up in an attempt to secure a better match up into him. In most cases I just hoped I had screens up and/or they were paralyzed so that Togekiss or Cinderace could pick up the knockout. Anyone found a good remedy into him or just general tips, because right now I live in fear :s
Defensive Arcanine with wisp is a great switch in to cinderace and rillaboom. fully defensive p2 is also a good check
 

cant say

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I'm wondering what is the best choice of ability for P2? I dunno I must be doing something wrong, it's not performing well for me. Using the bold/max def/hp, recover/foul play,discharge/ice beam
Analytic is my choice on this set. A lot of mons will throw spare EVs into SpD just to mess with Download P2. It’s really only worth running Download on Trick Room sets.

Trace is pretty bad in this meta as there really aren’t any abilities P2 can make use of from the Pokémon it wants to switch into. I guess getting Serene Grace off Togekiss and Regenerator off Pex are it. Maybe when Lando is back we can resurrect Trace lol
 
Trace is pretty bad in this meta as there really aren’t any abilities P2 can make use of from the Pokémon it wants to switch into. I guess getting Serene Grace off Togekiss and Regenerator off Pex are it. Maybe when Lando is back we can resurrect Trace lol
I ran into a P2 earlier who ended up tracing my Gorilla Tactics. It was hilarious.

But yeah, Analytic would probably be the most consistently valuable ability on it.
 
I ran into a P2 earlier who ended up tracing my Gorilla Tactics. It was hilarious.

But yeah, Analytic would probably be the most consistently valuable ability on it.
A Bold Analytic Porygon2 with 252 HP/252 Def/4 SpA EVs can 2HKO Cinderace with Tri Attack; the non-Analytic version can’t. Porygon2 does need those 4 SpA EVs to do it too; Tri Attack does 50.3 - 60% damage here.
 
Gengar (Focus Sash)
252-Spe // 252-Sp.A // 4 Sp.D
Trick Room
Shadow Ball
Sludge Bomb
Destiny Bond

I've been using this with a lot of success as a lead. I almost always guarantee at least a trade with the move-set listed. It even helped my team get out of a sticky web situation that would have lost me the game. It does well countering Trick Room teams as well as I get 1 hit in while they Trick Room, and then I can set it right back to normal using my Focus Sash as protection. The High Sp. A and Speed on Gengar seems to outclass other Trick Room Counters and Destiny Bond users. Can you change my mind?
 
Hi everyone! I'm looking for some feedback with my team:

https://pokepast.es/01b2adb7a092c027

I've reached the top 20,000 in the master ball tier with this team going 18-8 so far. I've realized that Darm-G and Snorlax are a little awkward on this team and I'm looking for some replacement ideas. I also realize that my EV's are probably not optimized and that I could rearrange some on certain mons.

Let me explain my thought process below.

Rotom-Heat @ Sitrus Berry
Ability: Levitate
Level: 50
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Def / 4 SpD
Bold Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Will-O-Wisp
- Thunder Wave
- Overheat
- Volt Switch

I've found that Rotom-H is a great lead and it's my check to Cinderace, Togekiss and Rillaboom to an extent. Thunder wave is a great option against pokemon like Cinderace and Togekiss that want to be fast to sweep. This also opens up my own Cinderace to have a much better sweeping potential.

Cinderace-Gmax @ Life Orb
Ability: Libero
Level: 50
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Pyro Ball
- Bounce
- Sucker Punch
- High Jump Kick

This is the main sweeper of the team and the primary user of dynamax. I feel like Pyro Ball, Bounce, and HJK are needed and I prefer Sucker Punch to pick off weakened foes and mons that are weak to it, like Dragapult.

Rillaboom-Gmax @ Choice Band
Ability: Grassy Surge
Level: 50
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Adamant Nature
- Grassy Glide
- Wood Hammer
- U-turn
- Knock Off

I love Rillaboom in this meta. CB Grassy Glide is crazy strong and can OHKO most mons that do not resist it and can do well over half to most mons that do resist it. I also love to lead this against teams that have Hippowdown, Lapras, or just bulky and slow teams in general. What I'd like to know is if there is a better EV spread for this set. I'm thinking that I could invest more EV's in HP instead of Speed.

Darmanitan-Galar @ Choice Scarf
Ability: Gorilla Tactics
Level: 50
EVs: 4 HP / 252 Atk / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Icicle Crash
- U-turn
- Flare Blitz
- Earthquake

I typically bring Darm if my opponent has a fast and offensive team. I like to lead it if my opponent has Togekiss and Dragapult. One thing that I think I could change is to add Superpower over U-Turn. This is one of the awkward mons on my team and I feel like there is a better option than Darm-G, but I do enjoy using it.

Togekiss @ Scope Lens
Ability: Super Luck
Level: 50
EVs: 4 HP / 252 SpA / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Nasty Plot
- Air Slash
- Fire Blast
- Dazzling Gleam

Togekiss is the other main dynamax sweeper if I do not bring Cinderace to the matchup. The set is very standard, the only thing that I consider changing is Scope Lens to Weakness Policy because I never get the 50% critical hit LOL.

Snorlax @ Assault Vest
Ability: Thick Fat
Level: 50
EVs: 252 Atk / 252 Def / 4 SpD
Adamant Nature
- Body Slam
- Earthquake
- Iron Head
- Thunder Punch

Snorlax is the last mon on the team and is another mon that does well against Togekiss and Dragapult (if special). I kinda stole this set from 1_TrickPhony a few months ago and I feel like it is somewhat viable as a special wall.

I feel like my team struggles with Cinderace (as does mostly every other team), Rillaboom, Dragapult, and Dracozolt. This is my first time posting in a smogon forum so please do not roast me for my formatting!
 

DragonWhale

It's not a misplay, it's RNG manipulation
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Hi everyone! I'm looking for some feedback with my team:

https://pokepast.es/01b2adb7a092c027

I've reached the top 20,000 in the master ball tier with this team going 18-8 so far. I've realized that Darm-G and Snorlax are a little awkward on this team and I'm looking for some replacement ideas. I also realize that my EV's are probably not optimized and that I could rearrange some on certain mons.

Let me explain my thought process below.

Rotom-Heat @ Sitrus Berry
Ability: Levitate
Level: 50
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Def / 4 SpD
Bold Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Will-O-Wisp
- Thunder Wave
- Overheat
- Volt Switch

I've found that Rotom-H is a great lead and it's my check to Cinderace, Togekiss and Rillaboom to an extent. Thunder wave is a great option against pokemon like Cinderace and Togekiss that want to be fast to sweep. This also opens up my own Cinderace to have a much better sweeping potential.

Cinderace-Gmax @ Life Orb
Ability: Libero
Level: 50
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Pyro Ball
- Bounce
- Sucker Punch
- High Jump Kick

This is the main sweeper of the team and the primary user of dynamax. I feel like Pyro Ball, Bounce, and HJK are needed and I prefer Sucker Punch to pick off weakened foes and mons that are weak to it, like Dragapult.

Rillaboom-Gmax @ Choice Band
Ability: Grassy Surge
Level: 50
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Adamant Nature
- Grassy Glide
- Wood Hammer
- U-turn
- Knock Off

I love Rillaboom in this meta. CB Grassy Glide is crazy strong and can OHKO most mons that do not resist it and can do well over half to most mons that do resist it. I also love to lead this against teams that have Hippowdown, Lapras, or just bulky and slow teams in general. What I'd like to know is if there is a better EV spread for this set. I'm thinking that I could invest more EV's in HP instead of Speed.

Darmanitan-Galar @ Choice Scarf
Ability: Gorilla Tactics
Level: 50
EVs: 4 HP / 252 Atk / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Icicle Crash
- U-turn
- Flare Blitz
- Earthquake

I typically bring Darm if my opponent has a fast and offensive team. I like to lead it if my opponent has Togekiss and Dragapult. One thing that I think I could change is to add Superpower over U-Turn. This is one of the awkward mons on my team and I feel like there is a better option than Darm-G, but I do enjoy using it.

Togekiss @ Scope Lens
Ability: Super Luck
Level: 50
EVs: 4 HP / 252 SpA / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Nasty Plot
- Air Slash
- Fire Blast
- Dazzling Gleam

Togekiss is the other main dynamax sweeper if I do not bring Cinderace to the matchup. The set is very standard, the only thing that I consider changing is Scope Lens to Weakness Policy because I never get the 50% critical hit LOL.

Snorlax @ Assault Vest
Ability: Thick Fat
Level: 50
EVs: 252 Atk / 252 Def / 4 SpD
Adamant Nature
- Body Slam
- Earthquake
- Iron Head
- Thunder Punch

Snorlax is the last mon on the team and is another mon that does well against Togekiss and Dragapult (if special). I kinda stole this set from 1_TrickPhony a few months ago and I feel like it is somewhat viable as a special wall.

I feel like my team struggles with Cinderace (as does mostly every other team), Rillaboom, Dragapult, and Dracozolt. This is my first time posting in a smogon forum so please do not roast me for my formatting!
Hi and welcome to smogon!

Your team looks really solid overall. Main change I'd recommend is to change Snorlax to specially defensive P2, as it accomplishes more or less the same feat while providing more options against Dragapult, can potentially make things difficult for Cinderace, and scare away unboosted Gyarados (added benefit of scaring it in team preview) which otherwise looks like it can click DD given the opportunity and take 3 on the spot.

Regarding Darm, while I'm not sure what you feel awkward about it on your team, one option you can have in that slot is Urshifu-Rapid. It accomplishes the same feat of outspeeding and often OHKOing Cinderace with Scarf, or since you have the Sash option available you can use the Sash + Counter set that will help you immensely against Cinderace, Dracozolt, and Rillaboom.
 
Hi and welcome to smogon!

Your team looks really solid overall. Main change I'd recommend is to change Snorlax to specially defensive P2, as it accomplishes more or less the same feat while providing more options against Dragapult, can potentially make things difficult for Cinderace, and scare away unboosted Gyarados (added benefit of scaring it in team preview) which otherwise looks like it can click DD given the opportunity and take 3 on the spot.

Regarding Darm, while I'm not sure what you feel awkward about it on your team, one option you can have in that slot is Urshifu-Rapid. It accomplishes the same feat of outspeeding and often OHKOing Cinderace with Scarf, or since you have the Sash option available you can use the Sash + Counter set that will help you immensely against Cinderace, Dracozolt, and Rillaboom.
Thank you for your recommendations! I'll try out P2 for Lax. I actually just lost a game because Lax doesn't have recovery. The reason I felt Darm was kinda awkward was because I have so many physical threats to begin with and Cinderace outspeeds after an airstream. Now that I think about it, I wouldn't bring Darm if my opponent has Cinderace. It is nice as a lead if my opponent has Dragapult or to revenge a +1 Togekiss. I'll keep it for now and do more testing. Thank you for your response!
 
Hey everyone, I thought I'd share my team which made it to master ball today for August season.

View attachment 266757

Here's the team:

https://pokepast.es/cf6f9b3c95ac2801

Most times I lead off with Clefable and calm mind, with Excadrill (can switch into poison and steel) and Gyarados (the main dmax sweeper) waiting in the wings. Clefable only has to fear a few things, and often forces a switch, getting at least one calm mind for free. The kee berry helps against any strong physical attackers, while calm mind a couple of times provides a nice opportunity to go on the offensive with moonbeam or flamethrower. Excadrill can pressure defenders through horn drill, and has a nice moveset for coverage and pressuring Mimikyu. Focus sash lets you reliably get at least one hit, and Gyarados can often come in and sweep after weakening the opposing team (and via max airstream and moxie). One of the main draws to Gyarados is that she is pretty effective vs Cinderace, with only electroball being truly scary. The remaining pokes are basically there to come in handy in situations where the other three aren't very good. Porygon can be an effective crippler with Tri Attack, Dragapult is just strong and fast, and Dracozolt improves your coverage with electricity and is a solid scarfer.

Here's the rental code:

View attachment 266764
Small suggestion; you could run an Adamant nature on Dracozolt to get both some extra power and to still have the ability to outspeed Cinderace (and other base 120 Pokémon) with the Choice Scarf attached. Personally I would run Aerial Ace to have that Max Airstream capability on Dracozolt, but Low Kick and Earthquake certainly have their merits as well.

This team looks pretty good; I look forward to trying it out sometime
 
https://pokepast.es/eb64cc9ff0f2c0f8

Can I get a critique of this team? I was struggling with Amoonguss teams previously, so I added in P2 who has the added benefit of matching up decently vs CinderBoom. I am a really big fan of this Rillaboom set. I typically lead with it. I also am a fan of Bulk Up Cinderace, but I am open to other options. (These are my exact Rillaboom/Cinderace sets I took to Masterball a season ago. And the Milotic is the exact same, but has Flip Turn instead of Mirror Coat)
 

marilli

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https://pokepast.es/eb64cc9ff0f2c0f8

Can I get a critique of this team? I was struggling with Amoonguss teams previously, so I added in P2 who has the added benefit of matching up decently vs CinderBoom. I am a really big fan of this Rillaboom set. I typically lead with it. I also am a fan of Bulk Up Cinderace, but I am open to other options. (These are my exact Rillaboom/Cinderace sets I took to Masterball a season ago. And the Milotic is the exact same, but has Flip Turn instead of Mirror Coat)
If you were seeking help vs Amoonguss, I don't see how or why that Porygon2 set is going to help? If that Porygon2 wants to beat Amoonguss, you're gonna need Substitute on it.

As for problem Pokemon beyond Amoonguss, just simply looking through the top of the VR / Usage List you're also Rillaboom and Dracozolt weak. 3 Pokemon basically can't touch both, Porygon2 can't switch in to either, might beat 1 of them in a 1v1. And Cinderace doesn't even have a Fire-type move or a Flying move for the Grass-types. I don't see what makes you so insistent on not using Bounce OR Pyro Ball on Cinderace, which would at least alleviate the Rillaboom and Amoonguss problem. Your Dracozolt matchup is also pretty hideous, which makes the problem worse - a lot of Dracozolt-checking Ground types are Rillaboom food, and Rillaboom-checking Pokemon like Togekiss are also Dracozolt food. In an attempt to change as few Pokemon as possible, Dragapult stands out as a reasonable offensive check to both. Would probably take out the Grimmsnarl for it, and give P2 bulk for Dragapult.
 
As I said, that was a C/P of my previous Cinderace. It was before GMAX was an option. The set functioned under the pretense that either Rillaboom or Milotic would slow the things that Cinderace needed the speed to overcome and I ran into a lot of fairies on that climb. I will reconsider my Cinderace options and the role he fills on my team. (I do really like having the Max Guard option and I can often get free Bulk Ups when opponents predict a move that I am not carrying) The P2 wasn't meant as a hard check to Amoonguss, just something that can switch in and fight it. I will try out your suggestions! Thanks for your input! :D
 
I'm just getting back into singles after playing VGC for a good portion of the year, what's a good P2 spread for checking Dragapult and other threats? There's no spread on the analysis page currently. :[
 
I'm just getting back into singles after playing VGC for a good portion of the year, what's a good P2 spread for checking Dragapult and other threats? There's no spread on the analysis page currently. :[
This offensive spread could work for you:

Porygon2 w/ Evolite
Ability: Analytic
EVs: 252 SpA, 244 HP, 12 Spe
Modest nature
- Tri Attack / Shadow Ball
- Ice Beam
- Discharge
- Recover

This spread is still quite bulky, even without a defense/special defense raising nature. With these EVs, Porygon2 can nearly OHKO non bulky Dragapult without Dynamax with Ice Beam (around 98% minimum damage), it can OHKO 4 HP/0 SpD Togekiss with Max Hailstorm/Max Lightning, it can OHKO 4 HP/0 SpD Dracozolt with Ice Beam, it can nearly OHKO 4 HP/0 SpD Rillaboom with Ice Beam (96.5% minimum damage), and it does well against other things like Gyarados and Corviknight. If Porygon2 runs Shadow Ball, it can even do well against Mimikyu (Mimikyu can otherwise normally set up against it otherwise)

Also, I would make sure to mold Porygon2 to what your team really needs. If your team struggles a bit to deal with boosted physical threats (like if a Gyarados or Dragapult gets a Dragon Dance boost) then you may want to consider giving Porygon2 a Bold nature with Max HP and Max defense EVs. I would try out some different sets and see what works for you.

Also, Rillaboom doesn’t have an updated BSS analysis either lol. I’m sure that since Porygon2 and Rillaboom are both S rank Pokémon that they will get analyses soon enough.
 
I'm just getting back into singles after playing VGC for a good portion of the year, what's a good P2 spread for checking Dragapult and other threats? There's no spread on the analysis page currently. :[
There's a lot of flexibility in terms of what you can do with Porygon2. Specially defensive P2 have been most common for me this season (usually paired with a strong physically defensive wall like Hippo) and many top teams from last month used SpDef P2. Something like 244 HP/ 12 Def/ 252 SDef+ would work well. Physically defensive P2 (244 HP / 252 Def + / 12 SDef) is very strong as well and it ultimately depends on what type of role you want P2 to fulfill. You can try out a mixed spread as well, but you would need to do some calcs to see what you want to survive. I don't believe there is a consensus here. In terms of moveset, Tri Attack, Discharge, Ice Beam, Foul Play are all good options depending on what you need. Marilli mentioned Substitute as an option. It helps stall Dynamax and can win P2 v P2 matchups. Thunder Wave and Eerie Impulse are cute options you can try out as well.

There was a good offensive P2 spread posted above by AwesomeDave as well that is a great option. It is not uncommon to see Hyper Beam on offensive P2 as well since you get an extremely strong Max Strike. You can go more bulky as well if you feel the need to, but once again you should calc to see what you want to accomplish with P2. For instance you might want to KO Cinderace with Max Strike in which case you need at least 124 EVs in SAtk.

124+ SpA Analytic Porygon2 Max Strike (130 BP) vs. 4 HP / 0 SpD Cinderace-Gmax: 156-184 (100 - 117.9%) -- guaranteed OHKO (100.00% after accuracy)

Any option you pick should easily check Dragapult. LO Darts does not 2HKO 244 HP P2 so they need to commit to their Dynamax. You will really only get into trouble if you set off a Weakness Policy, which you can avoid by Recover stalling.
 
No I dont think so. I was wondering, w/ so few mons released, meaning no Mence, Landog, or Chomp, is Ice Beam really all that good on p2? Could Shadow Ball be better?

EDIT: 43% of Mimikyu run Drain Punch so p2 isn't that great vs it
 

marilli

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Mimikyu does use Drain Punch. 48% of Mimikyu use Kee Berry, most of which are also using Drain Punch (43%). The percentages are similar because there's a heavy overlap. Trick Room sets or SD sets will not have room for Drain Punch.

Ice Beam still hits Dracozolt, Hippowdon, and Rillaboom, 3 very relevant Pokemon in the metagame, in addition to also hitting Dragapult and Togekiss, granted Shadow Ball and Thunderbolt are alternative coverage options for them. A coverage that hits 5 of the 10 top usage Pokemon isn't "bad." Depending on the team you could afford to not use it (72% usage) but there's a reason why it's the most common attacking move on Porygon2.
 
Yeah this isn't a joke. Sorry if the annoucement tag isn't kosher, but this is pretty crazy and important news.

The page for Series 6 of Battle Stadium Singles was found, and here it is https://battle.pokemon-home.com/regulation/000000251/en

This means the following Pokemon are going to be banned for 2 months:

* Cinderace
* Rillaboom
* Porygon2
* Togekiss
* Dragapult
* Mimikyu
* Hippowdon
* Excadrill
* Indeedee
* Venusaur
* Tyranitar
* Torkoal
* Gyarados
* Whimsicott
* Magnezone
* Incineroar


This is a MASSIVE shake up, like as big as the DLC shake up. I think it's really stupid gamefreak is causing yet another huge shake up before this metagame has even settled, but it is what it is.

Series 6 starts next month, so September, and lasts until November. Good chance this means it lasts until Crown Tundra.
Does this apply to VGC as well?
 
Last edited by a moderator:
Yeah this isn't a joke. Sorry if the annoucement tag isn't kosher, but this is pretty crazy and important news.

The page for Series 6 of Battle Stadium Singles was found, and here it is https://battle.pokemon-home.com/regulation/000000251/en

This means the following Pokemon are going to be banned for 2 months:

* Cinderace
* Rillaboom
* Porygon2
* Togekiss
* Dragapult
* Mimikyu
* Hippowdon
* Excadrill
* Indeedee
* Venusaur
* Tyranitar
* Torkoal
* Gyarados
* Whimsicott
* Magnezone
* Incineroar


This is a MASSIVE shake up, like as big as the DLC shake up. I think it's really stupid gamefreak is causing yet another huge shake up before this metagame has even settled, but it is what it is.

Series 6 starts next month, so September, and lasts until November. Good chance this means it lasts until Crown Tundra.
I don't mind this even with the scattershot implementation here, or even if it invalidates the rest of the Isle of Armor meta until Crown Turnda rolls around — that is, if this series indeed lasts the full two months smart money seems to suggest it does. The only way this would have been more interesting is if they had removed G/D-max while they were at it.
 
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